Author Topic: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*  (Read 10689 times)

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Offline MadelineB

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Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« on: November 22, 2013, 01:54:49 am »
I read a lovely post today by a man who was clearly an admirer of, and physically attracted to, transgender women. In particular, he mentioned being turned on by non-op and pre-op transgender women, but also admiring and attracted to all transgender women.

It's funny how my thinking about this subject has evolved over the last couple of years.

When I first came out as trans*, and began my own male to female transition, I was excruciatingly dysphoric about my body and in particular my genitalia. In fact, before my amnesia I was one of those trans kids who does harm to her own body to try to rid herself of parts that don't feel like they belong; after my amnesia lifted and I remembered all of my gender feelings (and childhood experiences), I almost died from self-inflicted injury along the same lines, just before I could start HRT, and therapy, and be on a fast track to full transition.

During that time, thinking about men who would be attracted to my "male" parts made me sick to my stomach; though not just men, to be honest, my female spouse's attachment to my attachment was just as disturbing to me.

At that time, my dysphoria was too intense, and my positive sexual experience as a woman too limited, to distinguish between being desired in my present embodiment "as a man", which I found terribly triggering, and being desired in my present embodiment "as a woman", which I had never experienced.

I have since been fortunate enough, to have had affirming experiences of having been desired, and made love to, as a woman, by both women and men (or one of each, I'm not a kiss and tell kind of girl!). And I can tell you, that the feeling is completely different than it was when I was male presenting. When someone, man or woman, is attracted to me in my current body, including loving this woman's penis, it is a completely different feeling, than being with someone who is attracted to a man's. If my own personal dysphoria wasn't so long standing and so profound, I would totally reconsider GCS/SRS, because of the wonderful realization that there are plenty of people who can be attracted to and enjoy a woman with a penis. Of the people I've been in bed with, I'm the one with the problem. Not them.

So my thinking has turned around 180 degrees about trans* admirers (be they women or men).
Since somewhere between 75% and 95% of trans women never have GCS/SRS, and the numbers even higher for trans men and bottom surgery, it would be incredibly insensitive (and self-centered) of me to want to belittle or drive away the amazing men and women who are oriented in an affirming way for all of my sisters and brothers who will go there whole lives as non-op or pre-op. Just because I have problems with my parts doesn't mean there is anything wrong with someone else who likes or loves them. You go, guys. You go, girls. Just don't reduce me or anyone else to an object, keep us persons, women, who happen to be built exactly in the way that makes you want to spend the rest of your life with us.

I can tell you, it is an amazing experience, even for someone as body-dysphoric as I am, to be loved and wanted as a woman as I am today (with all of my parts), and how much incredibly better that feels than to be with someone who only tolerates my body and its current configuration, or who is disgusted by it but "loves me enough" to put up with it, and me.

I have enough dysphoria, I don't need anyone projecting someone else's distaste for my kind of body onto me.

I am so glad, on behalf of all my sisters and brothers who will never get to (or need to) have bottom surgery, that there are plenty of wonderful men and women who will find them perfectly attractive as the gender they are, in the body they have now.

Unlike two years ago, I would never say today that admirers are more likely than say, average cisgender straight guys, to be after sex only. Anyone who thinks that doesn't know enough average cisgender straight guys! I haven't seen any studies done, but I think there are just as many admirers who are looking for a LTR as non-admirers.
And of course, if you are non-op, do you really want to subject yourself to someone who "settles" for someone like you, instead of being delighted by you? Personally, I want to delight my significant other, and/or any partners I have along the way, just as I want to be delighted with, and not just settle for, them in their spirit, body, and mind.

Just my thoughts. I totally understand being triggered, and being afraid... as a rape survivor and survivor of a lot of other traumatic stuff, I understand if someone who was hurt by a cis-guy, fears or hates them.
But IMHO it's the perp who perped, not whatever group he or she might have also been a member of. The ONLY group I chose to hate and distrust and fear, is the group called "perpetrators", and I can attest, they come in all sexes and all genders and bodies and backgrounds. Better to heal yourself than to keep being afraid and distrusting of every girl or guy that loves a woman who is endowed with a penis.
If only I could love myself the same way, I would gladly settle down with an admirer just the way I am.

History, despite its wrenching pain, cannot be unlived, but if faced with courage, need not be lived again.
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Ashey

Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2013, 02:52:01 am »
Ehh, I don't necessarily disagree with your post overall, even though this stuff still makes me uneasy. But I do want to emphasize one thing you said.
Just don't reduce me or anyone else to an object, keep us persons, women, who happen to be built exactly in the way that makes you want to spend the rest of your life with us.
But then there's this part:
And of course, if you are non-op, do you really want to subject yourself to someone who "settles" for someone like you, instead of being delighted by you? Personally, I want to delight my significant other, and/or any partners I have along the way, just as I want to be delighted with, and not just settle for, them in their spirit, body, and mind.
I'm not sure I totally agree with this. I don't want to be someone's fetish. I mean, I try to empower myself by considering myself a transsexual over strictly being a woman, but that doesn't mean I want to be treated differently. So what's the difference? The man parts. And if I'm with someone who's into me for that, then they aren't seeing me as or treating me like how I see myself or how I want to be seen. They're seeing me as something exotic, and interesting, and they're not aroused by me, they're aroused by a concept and a certain part of me. I don't know about someone 'settling' for me because I'm transsexual, but I'd certainly prefer someone who likes me despite my penis rather than because I have one.

Offline MadelineB

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2013, 03:05:55 am »
Ehh, I don't necessarily disagree with your post overall, even though this stuff still makes me uneasy. But I do want to emphasize one thing you said.But then there's this part:I'm not sure I totally agree with this. I don't want to be someone's fetish. I mean, I try to empower myself by considering myself a transsexual over strictly being a woman, but that doesn't mean I want to be treated differently. So what's the difference? The man parts. And if I'm with someone who's into me for that, then they aren't seeing me as or treating me like how I see myself or how I want to be seen. They're seeing me as something exotic, and interesting, and they're not aroused by me, they're aroused by a concept and a certain part of me. I don't know about someone 'settling' for me because I'm transsexual, but I'd certainly prefer someone who likes me despite my penis rather than because I have one.
Hi Ashey, thank you for your comment.
I can totally relate. your point resonates with mine, however, yours seems to be the perspective of someone, like myself, who is genital-dysphoric. If you can take one step back, and think about all your sisters who are cisgender female, or post-op mtf women: do they, who have bodies that fully match their internal body map, vagina and all, want to be with people who like them DESPITE having a vagina, or do they want to be with people in that way, who WANT a vagina? I posit that everyone who has a choice, AND is in the body they feel comfortable in, WANTS their partner to want them as they are (not despite how they are). So those of us who are in body transition down there, are the exception, not the rule, and I try to keep that in mind. Both the post ops and non-ops are happiest with someone who wants them with the body like they are, much more affirming then mere toleration or settling.
Not to belittle yours and my experience in any way Ashey, but for those whose final destination does not include having a gender-typical genital area, it is a wonderful thing that the same Mother Nature who created us, also created individuals who would find each variation of us absolutely marvelously perfect and attractive.
It also makes excellent sense that nature would be that way, and that the variations in which we come would be balanced out by the variations in which our potential partners come (excuse my pun!).
One more point to make: we shouldn't assume that things are either-or. Just like I am a person who can be attracted to a man or a woman (though most days its women who rock my world), it can be expected that there are plenty of people who can be attracted to a woman with a penis and to the same woman without one. In which case, would I want to exclude that person just because they can take delight in my body now AND when it is the way I need it to become? No. They would be my perfect partner in that regard. Adore me now and don't you ever stop, please.
And yes, there must be some that would only want me now, not later. In which case, I would need to decide if now is enough, or if I want to avoid them and hold out for someone else.
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Offline FrancisAnn

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2013, 08:19:13 am »
I posted on Tsdating website & have had numerous men say they really wanted a TS woman, pre or post op. I was trying to just find a "straight" man that liked women. So I guess some men have interest. I have not followed thru just kinda lonley for a man since it's been a long time.

Just fyi girl friends.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving

Ashey

Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2013, 11:28:09 am »
I guess I just don't want to think that I should be with an 'admirer' because they might 'appreciate' me more. I just figure whoever I end up with is just going to be pansexual or just not care what I have down there either way. *shrugs *

Offline MadelineB

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Re: Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2013, 11:35:38 am »
I guess I just don't want to think that I should be with an 'admirer' because they might 'appreciate' me more. I just figure whoever I end up with is just going to be pansexual or just not care what I have down there either way. *shrugs *
That's pretty much me as well.
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Offline suzifrommd

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2013, 11:46:12 am »
I don't want to be someone's fetish.

I totally get your point about now want to be thought of simply by your body parts. But really, every physical relationship that involves sexual attraction is going to have some objectification. I mean if my partner doesn't regard me as an object of desire and fulfillment, there will be something missing. Of course a relationship needs far more than that, but that comes over time - any two human beings have the potential for deciding they complement each other.

As for a fetish, isn't all sexual desire a fetish? I mean the desire to put one body part inside another is, at the face of it, kind of a ridiculous pursuit, and would be considered a fetish if only a small segment of the population were dying to do it. I suppose there are people who attracted to the person and don't prefer any particular body sex, body type, sex act, etc., but most human beings have things they like (often for reasons they can't articulate) and things they don't.
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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2013, 02:02:34 pm »
I am probably guilty of misusing "fetish" in that earlier post by CaliforniaAdmirer.

I looked up the clinical definition in the Merriam-Webster Medical Dictionary:

Fetish: an object or bodily part whose real or fantasized presence is psychologically necessary for sexual gratification and that is an object of fixation to the extent that it may interfere with complete sexual expression

And here, from MedicineNet.com:

Fetishism: Fetishism is a problem in which a person has sexual urges associated with non-living objects. The person becomes sexually aroused by wearing or touching the object. For example, the object of a fetish could be an article of clothing, such as underwear, rubber clothing, women's shoes, or women's underwear or lingerie. The fetish may replace sexual activity with a partner or may be integrated into sexual activity with a willing partner. When the fetish becomes the sole object of sexual desire, sexual relationships often are avoided. A related disorder, called partialism, involves becoming sexually aroused by a body part, such as the feet, breasts or buttocks.

Ashey

Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2013, 03:13:55 pm »
I'm just afraid of being with someone who seeks out transsexuals for specific reasons, like finding them sexually arousing from watching them in porn. They're not into me for my personality, they're not even into me because they find me attractive, they're into me because they're attracted to a concept or ideal that I may or may not happen to fit (at least in their mind). And what I dread is having some guy be with me, constantly looking me up and down, saying things like "Wow I can't believe you used to be a guy, you look just like a real woman!" >.< Yeah, some may consider that flattery, I consider it mildly insulting. 

I haven't had much experience with men when it comes to relationships, and even less with men such as this, so take my opinions with a grain or two of salt. Maybe I'm just being paranoid.

Offline FrancisAnn

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2013, 06:00:04 pm »
Men are not animals, they all want & need sex it seems. I've been with straight & not so straight men. Most told me up front that a MtF really excited them. That was good for me because I was excited about them.

It seems no man is perfect however so many of us are alone & being alone in life is certainly not much fun. So if a man is not just perfect so what. None of us are perfect either I do not think.

My .02$ worth & all of my comments.

Good luck girl friends, it's a tricky complicated situation for sure.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving

Offline Nicolette

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2013, 07:44:55 am »
And what I dread is having some guy be with me, constantly looking me up and down, saying things like "Wow I can't believe you used to be a guy, you look just like a real woman!" >.< Yeah, some may consider that flattery, I consider it mildly insulting. 

Unless you're stealth with a guy, you'll get this reaction with a chaser and even more so with a non-chaser, for obvious reasons.

When I started my transition, I was quite naive about the existence of chasers. When I discovered them, I was astonished by the idea that a guy could find my 'repulsive' body configuration somehow alluring.

When I was running the gauntlet of London's gay and trans friendly social scene in the 90s early in transition, I met many chasers (they were unavoidable, lol). I soon learned quickly how to tell the benign ones from the more 'maligned'. I never really dated any of these guys, but did agree to dinner on occasion. My one condition was never touch, as I was very uncomfortable with anyone going near this part of my body. It gave me the opportunity to have long discussions with these guys.

Maybe I was lucky, but most of these guys were intelligent, witty, gentle and caring men. One thing I was struck by was that most of them seemed to be trans in varying degrees. Many were crossdressers or were in the past. Some admitted that if they were younger that they would have transitioned. That kind of gives a different spin on things, doesn't it? I believe that these guys in fact were reliving their transition fantasies vicariously through transitioning and transitioned M2F. I wouldn't say all of them, but many of the ones I gave time to seemed to fit this model.

Anyway. That's my past experience and I suspect a unique one too.  :P
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 11:37:26 am by Nicolette »

Offline MadelineB

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2013, 01:54:47 pm »
Thank you everyone for your insightful comments and personal perspectives.

Nicolette, I too have found that many of the men (and lesbian women) who are drawn to MTF women, are themselves dealing with strong gender dysphoria or are people who just need permission to be non-binary or otherwise non-conforming.

I had a fiancee who transitioned from an androgynous identity and lesbian presentation to full male identity and male presentation while he was with me, and have helped several folks I dated find the happy place in their own crossdressing, genderqueer, or MTF journeys.

I do think that authentically being yourself, and being at ease about gender differences, is contagious (and attractive) in a good way.

I myself discovered a strong attraction for MTF women more than a year before I came to grips that I was one myself, though I was in a monogamous relationship at the time so I never explored that attraction while I was male-presenting.

I personally am bi- or pansexual, so I understand very well that a person can be attracted to a person and to that person's body too, and it does not mean that they are seeing that person as anything but the gender that they are.

I would love to meet someone who thinks I am the sexiest person alive, and who is also a great fit for me in other ways. In other words, I am looking for someone who identifies as their authentic self, is confident in who they are, is smart and funny and kind, and who is strongly maddiesexual in their tendencies.
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Offline JordanBlue

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2013, 11:00:00 pm »
I have since been fortunate enough, to have had affirming experiences of having been desired, and made love to, as a woman, by both women and men (or one of each, I'm not a kiss and tell kind of girl!). And I can tell you, that the feeling is completely different than it was when I was male presenting. When someone, man or woman, is attracted to me in my current body, including loving this woman's penis, it is a completely different feeling, than being with someone who is attracted to a man's. If my own personal dysphoria wasn't so long standing and so profound, I would totally reconsider GCS/SRS, because of the wonderful realization that there are plenty of people who can be attracted to and enjoy a woman with a penis. Of the people I've been in bed with, I'm the one with the problem. Not them.

This makes me feel like I'm just so incredibly late to this whole "T" ballgame.  This deal is more complicated than I ever imagined.  I'm  so old and out of touch... :P
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Offline musicofthenight

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2013, 12:22:46 am »
Perhaps as a bit of reflection from the other side of the looking glass...

So, I like women.  Set aside that stereotype that men only care physical attractiveness; either it's not true or I'm not that manly or most likely quite a bit of both.  I notice intelligence and personality first.  Really, honestly.

One of the ways I've grown most from Susans is learning that guys write like guys and gals write like gals, which sounds obvious when put that way - but it means as far as my own sense of romantic compatibility is concerned trans is totally real, yo. 

This realization made me sit myself down at a hypothetical table and ask some serious hypothetical questions.  Like "could you be okay with a sex partner's penis?" and the answer is a pretty clear "if I like her enough to get over my usual asexual hang-ups mere anatomy seems kinda silly - her dysphoria might be aaakward - oh and also *details of sex logistics and connotations therewith redacted for polite company*"

Part of that might just be a desire to be accepted myself.  (As much as I hate the shallowness of gender issues in Disney's Mulan, I'm gonna go ahead and make this reference.)  I fear that "a girl who's got a brain, who always speaks her mind" is tall enough of an order; adding "and is at least bi enough to want my tomboy side" makes finding a soulmate impossible.

I kinda think other people might have similar doubts.  Sometimes.  ::)
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Offline MadelineB

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2013, 02:11:43 am »
This makes me feel like I'm just so incredibly late to this whole "T" ballgame.  This deal is more complicated than I ever imagined.  I'm  so old and out of touch... :P
Hey Blue, love you avatar by the way.

I used to think I was terribly too late to everything, so I can relate. I will tell you the same thing I would tell a teen daughter who was lamenting that it was too late and her puberty would never come: we all come of age at different times, and whenever it is will be the right time for you. When it happens, keep your heart and mind open and enjoy the experience. Until then, be kind to yourself and live your life with all the zest you can.

If I had to guess, you are a year before you start your female puberty, in which case, I'd say you are younger than me. :) Of course, when you decide, if you decide, it can be blazingly fast from then on if that's what you want. Or slow as you want to make it.

Plenty of people have successful transitions in their 70s, and gazillions of people in their 20s get stuck or turn back. There's no age limit for being yourself. Start now, and keep going for as long as you live, and keep learning more about yourself every single day. We all start out on that journey at exactly the same age: whatever our age is when we decide to "damn the transpedos, full speed ahead!".

The main complication in relationships when you are trans* is the same with the rest of life: we are each unique and precious. Start matching us one by one, and you get an infinity of combinations real quick. But once you realize that original point, that we are each unique, then each relationship we have with any person on earth is also going to be unique, and it simplifies again. There is only one you, only one me, and the us is whatever we chose to make it together. Simple! Once the assumptions go out the window and we start learning from ourselves and each other: who we really are, what we really like, what matters, what is hot/not. Etc etc. Then infinity disappears, and their is just two authentic people saying "hi" and working out the rest together.

Whatever you discover about yourself Blue, I hope you will remember this: love and accept yourself. However you are, and however you need to be. Then be it. Life IS TOO SHORT to carry on with harassing ourselves and crushing our own spirits, once the day dawns that we know we are human too and deserve the same chances at happiness as anyone else does. So we begin, and let our hearts guide the rest. Whether that means you become a content cross-dresser, a daring genderqueer person, a creative gender extender, a femme MTF or a butch MTF, androgynous, agender, asexual.... they are all just labels for understanding what that heart might be telling us.
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Offline MadelineB

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2013, 02:44:47 am »
Perhaps as a bit of reflection from the other side of the looking glass...

So, I like women.  Set aside that stereotype that men only care physical attractiveness; either it's not true or I'm not that manly or most likely quite a bit of both.  I notice intelligence and personality first.  Really, honestly.

One of the ways I've grown most from Susans is learning that guys write like guys and gals write like gals, which sounds obvious when put that way - but it means as far as my own sense of romantic compatibility is concerned trans is totally real, yo. 

This realization made me sit myself down at a hypothetical table and ask some serious hypothetical questions.  Like "could you be okay with a sex partner's penis?" and the answer is a pretty clear "if I like her enough to get over my usual asexual hang-ups mere anatomy seems kinda silly - her dysphoria might be aaakward - oh and also *details of sex logistics and connotations therewith redacted for polite company*"

Part of that might just be a desire to be accepted myself.  (As much as I hate the shallowness of gender issues in Disney's Mulan, I'm gonna go ahead and make this reference.)  I fear that "a girl who's got a brain, who always speaks her mind" is tall enough of an order; adding "and is at least bi enough to want my tomboy side" makes finding a soulmate impossible.

I kinda think other people might have similar doubts.  Sometimes.  ::)
Hi musicofthenight. Thank you so much for posting. Some of my favorite people self-identify as genderqueer, or as asexual, or both.
I know my opinion isn't important to anyone but me; every person has a right to be themselves and express themselves however they need and want to, regardless of what Maddie might think. That said, here's what I believe:

1. Genderqueer people are absolutely awesome. I tend to regard genderqueer folks with the kind of awe that my cis friends and family regard me: you are so courageous, such an inspiration, to be yourself, even when it means you can't hide and there are going to be idiots and baddies who will hassle you about it. Genderqueer people, living in that space where they need to explain themselves to almost every person they deal with, or else develop thick skins with regard to people making gender-based assumptions that don't fit them, are just amazing. Every time that I open my mouth to explain about gender non-conformity and or transsexuality, I try to make sure that what I am saying makes sense also in the context of my genderqueer friends. Because if I am just replacing cisnormativity with binary-conforming-transnormativity, I am still missing the boat.

2. Friendship/platonic relationship/bestfriendism is a wonderful, essential, and neglected part of life. When I think about this, in some ways I understand where asexual people are coming from, because if I had a hierarchy of needs in which I had to place fraternal/sororal love, friend love, romantic love, and sexual love in a hiearchy of essentialness for me, it would probably be in that order. If I have one true sister I can survive without friends. If I have one true friend I can survive without a romantic bond. If I have one good romantic bond, I can survive without sex. So, there are asexual people who need fraternal/sororal love, and friend love, and romantic love, but not sex (they might think its icky, or just have no desire for it either way). And there are asexual people who don't care about romance either. And their are asexual people who don't need friends, just a true sister or brother. There could be people who just don't need any human companionship outside of transactions and services. None of those paths is better than another, its just a question of what fits each person. And what fits can vary over a lifetime.
People assume that asexual people will get around to getting it on, but when I pay attention it seems that most often in life its people moving from being sexual towards being asexual.

3. If you feel that asexuality for you is a 'hangup' and not your naturally most comfortable state when you are healthy healed and whole, then I wish you healing and discovery of your underlying sexuality or lack thereof. However, I have to point out that there is nothing unhealthy about being asexual in itself. For some people, it isn't about trauma or fears or haven't met the right girl or anything else, it's just the way their heads and hearts are wired and they are happy with being asexual (except for the hassles they get from others).

4.
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"a girl who's got a brain, who always speaks her mind" is tall enough of an order; adding "and is at least bi enough to want my tomboy side" makes finding a soulmate impossible.
Well all I can say is it isn't impossible. For example, I'm a girl, I've got a brilliant brain, I always speak my mind (except when it would be cruel to do so), I am bi, but more important, I am attracted to non-binary people (so I am the type of bisexual that these days often calls themselves 'pansexual' to distinguish from those who are bisexual but only attracted to people who fit the gender binary) and I am dually non-binary attracted.

And its good that you would be willing to explore attraction to people whose bodies aren't 100% gender-congruent, like myself and most of the people on Susans, but I will say something that some folks may reasonably disagree with: I do not believe that attraction, whether it is romantic, sexual, or platonic, is wholly or even substantially under our conscious control. Who we want and what we want in our relationships may evolve throughout our lifetime, but it is rarely something we can consciously direct, except to let go of our preconceptions and to try to be open to discovering how we feel. Some of it is based on our experience, as we go through life coming to understand our own needs, and learn and try different ways of getting those needs met through our interpersonal relationships. But I would never judge you if you found you could not be romantically (or sexually) attracted to me because of my body. Why should my genitals get a free pass, when everything else is fair game for being a subject of attraction? My brains, my heart, my ethics, my skills, my hair, my voice, my laugh... I could name ten thousand things that can be part of our attraction or dysattraction to another person.
History, despite its wrenching pain, cannot be unlived, but if faced with courage, need not be lived again.
~Maya Angelou

Personal Blog: Madeline's B-Hive

Offline Cindy

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2013, 02:54:52 am »
Well all I can contribute is personal experience.

My BF I met in my gym, he was there during my transition, he approached me after I went FT. Obviously he was attracted to me for some reason.

I was very willing to be intimate before he was. He says he isn't gay, just as well because I'm not, he says he isn't into TG women. But he was fascinated by me, and attracted to me as a person. He said I was a clock ticking in his brain, should I explore why his clock was ticking?

Or just accept a man was interested in me for some reason and made a move. It was my choice to take it further, as it should be.

Do I reject him for being attracted to a tranny? Or do I accept him for being attracted to me?

My choice has been clear; was that desperation of having a guy like me, or me thinking I like him?

I like him and he loves me.
I don't really worry why we got together, that he loves and respects me is all I need.

Men are visual. It is how they react to their environment. They have fantasies and dreams. They usually mean nothing to them at a personal or relationship level.

If you want to explore this give your man a porn magazine and tell him to satisfy himself to the pic of his dreams, even offer to help (cold shower needed); the penis doesn't lie.

A good relationship is in my mind one that covers all the boundaries. Don't set the boundaries before you understand them. Even if they are not understandable :laugh:

Just my thoughts

Cindy
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Offline Ms Grace

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2013, 03:06:41 am »
Thanks for the great post Madeline.
I was thinking just this morning about women who might like trans* women, I hear a lot about men who do - often in fairly disparaging terms, deserved or not - but very little about women. Years ago, not long after I had abandoned my first attempt at transition, if I told women I'd had a trans* history they generally treated me as gay and gave me a wide berth. One woman however really hit on me, told me she really liked "effeminate men" for some reason that really grossed me out and I turned her down without even knowing why. Your post has given me some insight into that - I think I was disgusted she was attracted to me as a "man", effeminate or otherwise. And I realise now I've pretty much felt that way whenever any woman has made advances. Something to mull over!
Grace
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Transition 1.0 (Julie): HRT 1989-91
Self-denial: 1991-2013
Transition 2.0 (Grace): HRT June 24 2013
Full-time: March 24, 2014 :D

Offline FrancisAnn

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2013, 04:39:27 am »
My electrolysis lady friend has a nice male friend that is attracted to MtF women. She has already told him some about myself & he would like to meet or go out on a date with me. At first I told my girl friend that maybe now was not the right time because of my electrolysis however maybe it is, why not? I'll see her Saturday morning & find out more about this man that is attracted to MtF women.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving

Offline JordanBlue

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Re: Thoughts about men who are attracted to women who are trans*
« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2013, 10:15:37 am »
Hey Blue, love your avatar by the way.
Thanks!
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If I had to guess, you are a year before you start your female puberty, in which case, I'd say you are younger than me. :) Of course, when you decide, if you decide, it can be blazingly fast from then on if that's what you want. Or slow as you want to make it.
I think I may have about 15 yrs. on you.  I'm so new into this, that my first appt. with a GT is next Tues.   Yeah, I'm scared to death.  Where it will go from there? I have a feeling in my heart where it will go, but who really knows?   Trust me, even making that call to make that first appt. was a monumental step for me.
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Plenty of people have successful transitions in their 70s, and gazillions of people in their 20s get stuck or turn back. There's no age limit for being yourself. Start now, and keep going for as long as you live, and keep learning more about yourself every single day. We all start out on that journey at exactly the same age: whatever our age is when we decide to "damn the transpedos, full speed ahead!".
It's totally mind blowing to me.  Especially when I see all these before/after and avatar pics (yours is a perfect example, Maddy).  I'm thinking omg, this is like "Beauty and the Beast" and I'm the Beast, there's absolutely no way I can ever begin to look this femme. 
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Then be it. Life IS TOO SHORT to carry on with harassing ourselves and crushing our own spirits
In my case, over forty years of that is quite enough, I think.

Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, it became a butterfly...

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