Author Topic: Beliefs and shame  (Read 6089 times)

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Offline HoneyStrums

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2014, 06:33:32 pm »
Well A lot of people don't believe in fairies (tinkerbell type) is because the tooth fairy is not real. so a person saying they believe in fairies is perceived to still be believing that the tooth fairy is real.

Hence the your crazy. reaction

oh and btw.
That helps a lot, ButterflyVickster. Thanks. It reminds me of something I saw the other day.
"There is no security in following the call to adventure. You enter the forest at the darkest point where there is no path. Where is already a path, is someone else's path. Your adventure is forging your own path."
I like that. It's what I want. I want to be able to accept that that is what I want.


You already accept its what you want, It look like what you need is somebody who wont judge you crazy for doing so :p

What you need is a way of explaining how you can believe something that others don't, even if you are the only one that believes it? Ask them what their thinking. and then tell them you don't believe it, because they cant prove it. "I just told" you might be the answer, then say I don't know that, people lie. So prove to me its what you where thinking. They cant prove it. No more or no less then you can prove your beliefs. Like I said I did have those dreams, and after praying. But I cant prove it, no matter how much I know its true.

I wonder, about all sorts of mythological beings. I like those ideas. A whole world of undiscoverable creatures existing in a shifted state. Out of sync here and yet not here. At the same time. I often fall distant from reality and find my self walking a different way home through to some compulsion I cant explain. Each time I discover something, because I was looking for something? Because I believe I Choose this path due to some external force? Well how Am I suppose to prove or disprove it was fairy type guardian of the flower I notice had a traffic cone thrown on it. On a the spiritual protector of animals when I see a bird with a trapped wing?

I cant. But Its how I feel, for me these walks are a divine guidance. But what I do not know. GOD? a fairy? why not. There is definitely something "spiritual" about these experiences. Even if it be the inter spiritual and undistinguishable cry for help from a species not my own. I know it not, but what it is,  it is definitely something. A spiritual calling? I can not say anything, except for reasons I do not understand I choose those paths and helped those things, and "believe" it was what I supposed to do.


Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2014, 06:45:04 pm »
I probably should have known all of that. I really need to get more in touch with heritage. Huh?
I wouldn't worry about it. I barely ever meet anyone else who knows of these types of beings. Or anyone else who actually reads folklore for that matter.

Well A lot of people don't believe in fairies (tinkerbell type) is because the tooth fairy is not real. so a person saying they believe in fairies is perceived to still be believing that the tooth fairy is real.

Hence the your crazy. reaction
Not exactly. I quite vocally despise the Tinkerbell "fairies." He also explicitly told me he would do the same thing to Christians who actually believe in God. Not only that, but there are way more symptoms that need to be present to diagnose psychosis than just believing in things that aren't real. I don't have them and never have. So even if he did get confused about what I meant, there was still no reason to misdiagnose me.

You already accept its what you want, It look like what you need is somebody who wont judge you crazy for doing so :p
Not exactly. I need to stop judging myself as crazy and being terrified of what people will do to me if they judge me as crazy.

Offline HoneyStrums

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #22 on: June 20, 2014, 06:56:27 pm »
Oh well from what I can make out from how you think, is that your not crazy.
If your smart enough to know people will think your crazy, it means you understand why. Meaning that in some way you can understand their perspective, and if understanding their perspective you still believe there must be a reason why :).

Its not craziness, it means you understand other peoples perspective on this subject. You understand for the most part they wont or cant understand you? If you understand both them and yourself, and they can only understand themselves who is, more intellectual?

Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #23 on: June 20, 2014, 07:05:19 pm »
Yes, I understand why. Believing in things that can't exist is stupid and delusional. I understand that makes me crazy and I understand that, because of it, people will try to hurt me and I won't be able to stop them because everyone will take their side.

Offline HoneyStrums

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #24 on: June 20, 2014, 07:22:30 pm »
Yes, I understand why. Believing in things that can't exist is stupid and delusional. I understand that makes me crazy and I understand that, because of it, people will try to hurt me and I won't be able to stop them because everyone will take their side.
Believing in things that CANT exist?

Or believing in things that you CANT PROOVE.

Yes without proof those that NEED it will say it doesn't exist until proven. But for those that don't need proof they will ask you why you believe in them :) and spark a conversation. You understand this. That makes you smart :).





Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #25 on: June 20, 2014, 07:27:52 pm »
Hmm. Good point. Thanks. I feel a lot better about it now.

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2014, 09:31:11 am »
Yes, I understand why. Believing in things that can't exist is stupid and delusional. I understand that makes me crazy and I understand that, because of it, people will try to hurt me and I won't be able to stop them because everyone will take their side.

Believing in things that supposedly don't or can't exist really is not stupid and delusional Edge. Actually it is way more common than what you think. Take me for instance. I have and still do investigate paranormal occurances. A lot of people don't believe that "ghosts" exist. Back when I was 22 a friend thought I was crazy and so on. He was big and bad an nothing scared him. I took him on an investigation with us one night in a house that supposedly had a lot of activity. This house was well over a hundred years old, the stairway was so narrow that a person's shoulders would almost be touching the walls. The stairs themselves, my foot would barely fit and most everyone else had to step sideways up the stairs. Yeah it was a creepy place and the guy that lived there contacted me to see what if anything we may catch. A door shut behind friend and he lost it. I didn't seem quite so crazy to him after that and I could not get him to go back inside so he sat in the car all night while we kept investigating. We didn't catch anything else and I really can't say for sure what caused the door to close on it's own but personally I doubt it was anything paranormal. But it scared the <poo> out of my friend though.

Not exactly. I quite vocally despise the Tinkerbell "fairies." He also explicitly told me he would do the same thing to Christians who actually believe in God. Not only that, but there are way more symptoms that need to be present to diagnose psychosis than just believing in things that aren't real. I don't have them and never have. So even if he did get confused about what I meant, there was still no reason to misdiagnose me.

Wow, really? How does this person keep practicing psychiatry? So this quack would put 60-70% of the population on antipsychotics?

Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2014, 10:28:05 am »
Wow, really? How does this person keep practicing psychiatry? So this quack would put 60-70% of the population on antipsychotics?
If he started seeing them when they were under eighteen and were naive enough to fall for it (like most teenagers), then yes. It seemed far fetched when he told me that, but then I heard from some of his other former patients. He keeps practicing psychiatry because no one would believe patients over a psychiatrist.

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2014, 11:48:23 am »
If he started seeing them when they were under eighteen and were naive enough to fall for it (like most teenagers), then yes. It seemed far fetched when he told me that, but then I heard from some of his other former patients. He keeps practicing psychiatry because no one would believe patients over a psychiatrist.

You know there are some psychiatrists out there that make me look like a normal functioning human being. :o I have always been interested in psychology and actually went for a degree in it but dropped it because I fgured I knew enough about it to be more of a parapsycholgist, which really isn't anything more than crazy people like me investigating the paranormal and trying to tie it to how the mind works. Sort of like the theories of poltergiest. The main theory is that it is usually tied to a person that is usually going through puberty and all the emotions and hormonal imbalances and such this person is possibly subconsciously causing the activity. This goes either way because I have spent multiple nights where the person in question was present and strange occurances happened. When I have taken that person out of the equation then all is quiet. But it has went the other way in which it was some sort of mischevous energy that seemed intellegent even without the younger person there.

As for you Edge. I would really suggest you look into some historical data on paganism and christianity especially around the time the Roman Empire integrated christianity into its culture.  They changed and mixed a lot of pagan rituals in to the original teachings of Christianity. Winged figures like angels? sounds a lot like Faeries. The christmas tree? pagans worshiped nature and what is a symbol of nature other than an evergreen tree that stays green even in the winter. It is more or less historically accepted that Christ was born in the spring time due to a lot of indicators in the bible with the shepards in the fields during this event and that happened becase of the birthing season of the sheep and the sheperds kept the predators at bay while the sheep gave birth and util the lambs were big enough on their own and that would have been springtime. The winter solstice is a pagan holiday in which people would give gifts because that was the end of the previous year and the biginning of the new year. So why the <poo> do we celebrate Christ's birth so close to the winter solstice when the historical data supports a spring birth of Christ? Funny how the Roman god Pan resembles the image of Satan.

I have read, done a lot of research, looked into many belief systems and have come to the conclusion that no one belif system is right or wrong and the main reason why I never claim one that is true over the others. Like I said Hon, Spirtuality is a uniquely personal thing that usually comes to us in according to life experiences and so on. How we may percieve an all knowing Creator or Creators of the Universe. I see that Creator's or Creators' fingerprints in nature, in us, in a spider and other creatures some mythical some supernatural and some that are physically here on this planet now.

I myself identify as Gnostic, not agnostic but Gnostic. Gnosticism is the closest form of Christianity which does not even resemble mainstream Christianity as it is today. It was pretty much wiped away when the Roman Empire adopted Christianity. There are Thirteen more books and Gospels that never made it into the bible because it contains and hints to more of early Chritianity as a mystic type of belief. Funny the Church left these out because they were supposedly irrelevent to the message. Maybe to thier message that would take control away from the supposed priests and laid our Spirituality as being our own independant of society and cultural beliefs. These text hint that Mary Magdeline was not a harlot but a rich widow that indeed was Christ's closest apostle and hinted at being Christ's lover, girlfriend or wife even. It hints that Judas did exactly what Christ wanted him to do and that was to supposedly betray him.

I wrote all of this for a reason Edge. According to my insights what would that same psychiatrist think about me? I can only imagine. Straight jacket and rubber room maybe? ;) I have been shamed and I have been shunned and I have been told that I am never going to see the gates of Heaven because of these beliefs. I have even been told by a priest that if I ever had children they would not be able to go to Heaven because of the way I belive and I would have to convert. To me that is worst extortion than the Mafia could ever do. At least the Mafia don't threaten your children or other family members.

I let you in on me and what I hold near and dear in my heart when it comes to beliefs, 'cause you let me in on a little bit of yours. It is all about perceptions. Unfortunatly though people have lost thier lives, been persecuted, shunned, shamed and tortured over perceptions of possibly the same message.

Edge, don't sell yourself short. The strongest people are the ones that go against the grain or the flow or the common mainstream ideals of the rest of society. And I am about as far as you can get away from mainstream religion or Sprituality but it is extrememly personal to me.( I am about as far from mainstream society even as you can get.) Just like yours is to you and overcome that shame that one idiot made you feel. Are you familiar with the Motley Crue song Shout at the Devil? That song wasn't about Satan or Lucifer but any adversary (greek meaning for devil) on anyone or anything that adversely effects your life, even our own thoughts sometimes so "Stand strong and shout at the devil". I love that song by the way.

So anyway Hon, if you are crazy, then we'll meet up in the asylum and throw one helluva party. ;D And really I am thankful that I have a good psychiatrist that does acknowledge I may know a little bit more about the whole psycholgical thing than she does. She even asks me a lot about parapsychology and even asked me to do an investigation at her house in her pasture because she thought she saw a "ghost horse" when she owns no horses at all. So I get a few free sessions. How is that for Ironic?

I really hope this post makes you feel better and more comfortable and less shame about your beliefs. I think you are a good person and you don't deserve to feel that way. But now you probably think I am crazy. Hell I'll own it. ;) 'Cause I just don't really care what people think of me, I am just me, no apologies for that.

Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2014, 12:45:43 pm »
Actually, I am aware of the fact that Christianity took stuff from other religions.  :) I've always thought the snake in the garden was a little like Prometheus. Pagan religions also took stuff from each other.
(As a side note, no angels do not sound like faeries. Not the ones from folklore anyway.)

According to my insights what would that same psychiatrist think about me? I can only imagine. Straight jacket and rubber room maybe?
No, but probably drugs. He's a big of fan of drugs.

Are you familiar with the Motley Crue song Shout at the Devil? That song wasn't about Satan or Lucifer but any adversary (greek meaning for devil) on anyone or anything that adversely effects your life, even our own thoughts sometimes so "Stand strong and shout at the devil". I love that song by the way.
I like that song too. lol Satan does mean "adversary," so either way, it fits.

So anyway Hon, if you are crazy, then we'll meet up in the asylum and throw one helluva party. ;D

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #30 on: June 21, 2014, 01:29:38 pm »
You didn't rename me Scotty Mac did you? Some of what you quoted from me comes up Scotty Mac. I am so hurt. ;) Don't really know what happened there. You ain't ashamed of me are ya' ???

Yeah Motley Crue's Shout at the Devil is probably the ultimate album from them. Theatre or Pain would be the next and anything after, well.... I ain't gonna say. But Mick's riffs in the beginnning just can't be beat. Girls Girls Girls was pretty good but Dr. Feelgood? Maybe a couple of songs I like on that then the acoustic guitar and the freakin' ballads started comin'. Without You? really? Motley Crue? If I wanted to listen to sappy love songs I would go over to country.

Edge that song is a little too tame for a party, my style. I don't know how to add a youtube video here, but look up the song Redneck by Lamb of God. That my dear is the epitome of a party. Yeah I am a little wild. Yeah right, I am way wild.

The only question I got is why with heavy, dark metal bands and the bald heads especially with the front man? Jill told me why Kerry King has a bald head but one of our local metal bands got in touch with me a couple days ago and asked me to play lead for them. First I am older by twenty years :o. Two they really need a name change. :P Three, I have the longest hair of them all. >:-) Four, their guitarist really isn't that good. ::) And definatley five, the front man shaves his head. >:( They really got screwed by their manager on many different levels. Kind of thinkin' about and jammed with them last night, but my freakin' god. I just don't know. They really want to go more into a classical type metal sound. I just think maybe too much work for me.

Definately check out Redneck by Lamb of God. That is me to the 'T' or 'E'. I can still be bada$$ and female? Or female at least internally?

Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #31 on: June 21, 2014, 01:41:55 pm »
You didn't rename me Scotty Mac did you? Some of what you quoted from me comes up Scotty Mac. I am so hurt. ;) Don't really know what happened there. You ain't ashamed of me are ya' ???
<I don't understand>? I didn't even notice it did that. Give me a sec and I'll fix it.

Yeah Motley Crue's Shout at the Devil is probably the ultimate album from them. Theatre or Pain would be the next and anything after, well.... I ain't gonna say. But Mick's riffs in the beginnning just can't be beat. Girls Girls Girls was pretty good but Dr. Feelgood? Maybe a couple of songs I like on that then the acoustic guitar and the freakin' ballads started comin'. Without You? really? Motley Crue? If I wanted to listen to sappy love songs I would go over to country.
I'm a bigger fan of folk metal myself, but listen to a range of music.

Edge that song is a little too tame for a party, my style. I don't know how to add a youtube video here, but look up the song Redneck by Lamb of God. That my dear is the epitome of a party. Yeah I am a little wild. Yeah right, I am way wild.
The subject matter, Jess. Party at an asylum -> House Party at Arkham Asylum. :)
Funnily enough, I find Lamb of God far too relaxing for a party. I don't know what it is about them, but they chill me right out to the point where I've fallen asleep at one of their concerts. Yes, I know. Shame on me. I do like Redneck and many of their other songs though. Just not for a party.

The only question I got is why with heavy, dark metal bands and the bald heads especially with the front man? Jill told me why Kerry King has a bald head but one of our local metal bands got in touch with me a couple days ago and asked me to play lead for them. First I am older by twenty years :o. Two they really need a name change. :P Three, I have the longest hair of them all. >:-) Four, their guitarist really isn't that good. ::) And definatley five, the front man shaves his head. >:( They really got screwed by their manager on many different levels. Kind of thinkin' about and jammed with them last night, but my freakin' god. I just don't know. They really want to go more into a classical type metal sound. I just think maybe too much work for me.
Most bands I listen to, the front man has plenty of hair, so I can't answer that first question. Man, I'd love to play in a metal band, but my musical skills are pretty much zilch and attempts to get along with people usually end up in flames.

I can still be bada$$ and female? Or female at least internally?
You're asking someone who despises gender roles. Of course I am going to answer heck yeah!

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #32 on: June 21, 2014, 02:13:26 pm »
<I don't understand>? I didn't even notice it did that. Give me a sec and I'll fix it.
I'm a bigger fan of folk metal myself, but listen to a range of music.
The subject matter, Jess. Party at an asylum -> House Party at Arkham Asylum. :)
Funnily enough, I find Lamb of God far too relaxing for a party. I don't know what it is about them, but they chill me right out to the point where I've fallen asleep at one of their concerts. Yes, I know. Shame on me. I do like Redneck and many of their other songs though. Just not for a party.
Most bands I listen to, the front man has plenty of hair, so I can't answer that first question. Man, I'd love to play in a metal band, but my musical skills are pretty much zilch and attempts to get along with people usually end up in flames.
You're asking someone who despises gender roles. Of course I am going to answer heck yeah!

Oh well, I'll just dry my tears cause I thought you may be replacing me with someone you thought was cooler. ;)

How can you fall asleep with Lamb of God? Just kidding though. What chills us out is something that is as personal as beliefs. Zeppelin used to chill me out, of course it also could have been all the Alchemy involved ;). that was the early to mid eighties after all.

Hell Hon. I am self taught on the guitar. I can read tablature and yeah it is slow going until I get it down pat but rhythme is extrememly easy. I ain't no musical prodogy but neither was Angus Young, Tony Iommi, Dickey Betts and Jimmi Hendrix. I have my own style and it is a mix sort of between Angus Young and Tony Iommi. Most peoople that are musical prodogies teach music and don't fill stadiums. But I really don't either so... I will almost put money with a bookie that we could get along fine. But a little conflict ain't never hurt any band until the point they get like Guns and Roses or Poison and it gets too much and they break up. As a matter of fact, my musical skills are about as basic as they come and one of the reasons that metal band contacted me. Me and the bassist had talked before and now they are looking to go a different direction. God, the questions. What do you think? Should we do this? Should we do that? How should we look? What should we do? God, I ain't no den mother but maybe a couple more jam sessions and natural flows. It may work. ???

That last part Edge, you rock hon and thanx.

Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #33 on: June 21, 2014, 03:35:33 pm »
How can you fall asleep with Lamb of God? Just kidding though. What chills us out is something that is as personal as beliefs. Zeppelin used to chill me out, of course it also could have been all the Alchemy involved ;). that was the early to mid eighties after all.
Well, at the time of the concert, I was on a kind of medication that made me constantly exhausted. Otherwise, I'm not entire sure. I have a lot of anger/restless energy in me and listening to Lamb of God seems to drain it right out. Sometimes, their lyrics are comforting (ex: "Walk With Me In Hell") and sometimes it just seems to be the overall sound of the music.
That's still cool that you play the guitar. I tried guitar and bass, but my fingers are too stubby. I used to sing, but then my voice started changing on T. ;D
lol Maybe they need to stop being so hesitant and start suggesting ideas instead of asking for them.
Thanks. You rock too. (Pun intended.) \m/ >:-) \m/

Well. When I wrote the first post, I was thinking I wanted to start formally honouring people like being a real pagan or something. Now I'm randomly back to wanting to be mostly independent of anyone, but still paganish. Oh well. Considering the deity I'd be more likely to follow if I followed anyone would be Loki, ambiguity is not exactly surprising.

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #34 on: June 21, 2014, 09:06:08 pm »
Well, at the time of the concert, I was on a kind of medication that made me constantly exhausted. Otherwise, I'm not entire sure. I have a lot of anger/restless energy in me and listening to Lamb of God seems to drain it right out. Sometimes, their lyrics are comforting (ex: "Walk With Me In Hell") and sometimes it just seems to be the overall sound of the music.
That's still cool that you play the guitar. I tried guitar and bass, but my fingers are too stubby. I used to sing, but then my voice started changing on T. ;D
lol Maybe they need to stop being so hesitant and start suggesting ideas instead of asking for them.
Thanks. You rock too. (Pun intended.) \m/ >:-) \m/

Well. When I wrote the first post, I was thinking I wanted to start formally honouring people like being a real pagan or something. Now I'm randomly back to wanting to be mostly independent of anyone, but still paganish. Oh well. Considering the deity I'd be more likely to follow if I followed anyone would be Loki, ambiguity is not exactly surprising.

Infreakindependence. That hold the key to you and all that you may experience. I am a totally independent person. I won't say it is the best way, but definatley the best way for me. Sometimes I really don't even identify with the human race. What Race? I really don't know.

Whatever works Hon to soothe your soul. No matter what.

OK, so how does your voice sound? T or not? I am trying to put together my own people and really need a singer that sounds on the edge of insanity.

But yeah. I really don't think they are going to go anywhere. Just came from a jam session and it was really nothing but head butting with the other gutarist. I have one idea and he has another. The rest of the band think I should be in the lead, so really who knows? Sabbath did it with one guitarist. The only problem is he is one of original founders. But name changes and such can work wonders. But again, I would be the oldest in age and in no way do I want to be the "den mother" when I want to get wild myself. I definately am not the responsible one and don;t want to be.

Thank you Edge. That is so sweet of you of you to say. Oh yeah I do rock but musically. But I have never been told that I rock otherwise.
 

Offline Edge

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #35 on: June 21, 2014, 09:29:57 pm »
Infreakindependence. That hold the key to you and all that you may experience. I am a totally independent person. I won't say it is the best way, but definitely the best way for me. Sometimes I really don't even identify with the human race. What Race? I really don't know.
Totally. Me too sort of. I'm as independent as a person in modern society can be, but still sometimes wish to belong to something. Then I realize that I don't really. I mean, I want to be accepted by people, but as a separate, odd entity. If that makes sense. Kind of having it both ways I guess. I'm rambling. Anyway, that depends on other people and I can't control them.
Although, oddly enough, my Asatru friend came up to me this evening and told me that he considers me like kindred. That was nice though more than a little awkward. For some reason, after talking with him, I'm now back to wondering if I should be a Norse pagan. Can't quite be Asatru though because I also respect jötnar a great deal. (Although if any heathens complain about that, I could always ask them to name one of Æsir who is not related to at least one jötunn and/or has at least one kid with one.) It may be partially to have similar beliefs as my friend, but as he pointed out, we already have similar beliefs. Mostly, it's because I'm already leaning that way anyway. Or maybe I can just keep leaning.
I never feel like I identify with the human race, but that's a whole other kettle of fish and is probably insanity.

Whatever works Hon to soothe your soul. No matter what.
Indeed.

OK, so how does your voice sound? T or not? I am trying to put together my own people and really need a singer that sounds on the edge of insanity.
It used to sound really high pitched. It's lower now and it still sometimes cracks, so I think it might change some more. If I ever figure out how to record it and share it, I'll share a sample since I don't know how to describe it. I want to learn how to do the growly thing, but I'm not quite sure how. As for insanity, I'm on the edge of insanity. ;D (For non-belief related stuff although that might be insanity too.)

But yeah. I really don't think they are going to go anywhere. Just came from a jam session and it was really nothing but head butting with the other gutarist. I have one idea and he has another. The rest of the band think I should be in the lead, so really who knows? Sabbath did it with one guitarist. The only problem is he is one of original founders. But name changes and such can work wonders. But again, I would be the oldest in age and in no way do I want to be the "den mother" when I want to get wild myself. I definately am not the responsible one and don't want to be.
Yeah that would suck.

Thank you Edge. That is so sweet of you of you to say. Oh yeah I do rock but musically. But I have never been told that I rock otherwise.
Never? I've been enjoying this conversation. Beliefs, craziness, and metal are some of my favourite topics. Not to mention I think it's pretty cool that you're Gnostic. I had heard that some people are, but have never talked to one before.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2014, 12:48:44 pm by Edge »

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #36 on: June 23, 2014, 07:29:33 am »
Believe me Edge. I have never belonged, Never really wanted to either. People are strange becuase the less you want to belong or identify with them, the more it seeems they want to invite you in. I guess I always just went my own way.

Ihe growling gutteral sounds, I have no clue. But it sounds like it could be a little painful after a while. The "Edge of Insanity". I think that is the one thing that kept Ozzy so popular even after Black Sabbath fired him and once his wife got him of the drugs. He just had that edge in his voice, even in his looks and the way he would move on stage. He difinately wasn't a sex symbol but the song Mr Crowley was perfect for him. And now God is Dead?.

Yesterday I spent all day talking with them, made up some riffs with them to see what kind of mprove and sponteniety we may have. Tried writing afew lyrics with them Nill on the chemistry. The bassists actually wants to leave and come over to the darkside with me. He is good. The drummer also mentioned something about it too and there is definately some synchronization between the three of us. But the guitarist and the singer, just I really don't know what to say about 'em.

Gnostisim is extremely rare. It is Christian in nature since it is about Christ but more of a mystic element involved. I have never met anyone else that claimed it either. But Yeah I love talking about this kind of stuff. Most people just can't talk about beliefs without arguments, I have never understood that.

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #37 on: June 23, 2014, 12:09:03 pm »
Believe me Edge. I have never belonged, Never really wanted to either. People are strange becuase the less you want to belong or identify with them, the more it seeems they want to invite you in. I guess I always just went my own way.
Let's drop that subject because that opens a can of worms you really don't want to hear about. No offence is meant to you. It's just a sore spot with me.

The growling gutteral sounds, I have no clue. But it sounds like it could be a little painful after a while.
According to someone I know who does voice training, the growls are actually perfectly fine on the vocal chords. It's the screams that wreck them.

Yesterday I spent all day talking with them, made up some riffs with them to see what kind of mprove and sponteniety we may have. Tried writing afew lyrics with them Nill on the chemistry. The bassists actually wants to leave and come over to the darkside with me. He is good. The drummer also mentioned something about it too and there is definately some synchronization between the three of us. But the guitarist and the singer, just I really don't know what to say about 'em.
Maybe the three of you should go off and do your own thing then.

Gnostisim is extremely rare. It is Christian in nature since it is about Christ but more of a mystic element involved. I have never met anyone else that claimed it either. But Yeah I love talking about this kind of stuff. Most people just can't talk about beliefs without arguments, I have never understood that.
I guess it's because it's really personal for people and something they are passionate about. I try not to get into arguments, but I've got to admit, there are some things that get under my skin. I get pretty tetchy when people refer to faeries as those Tinkerbell disgraces since I think they're insulting. I don't try to argue with them because there is really no point, but some people in heathen religions are convinced that Loki is evil and killed Baldr when, in the older stories of Baldr's death (i.e. not obviously Christinized), Loki isn't even mentioned. A lot of people think jötnar are also evil and enemies of the gods, but this makes no sense if one actually looks at the stories since most of the people in Asgard are at least part jötunn and/or have at least one kid with at least one jötunn (yes, even Thor for whom both apply). From what I can tell (and in simplistic views), the Æsir are mostly the gods of culture, civilization, and order; the Vanir are gods of agriculture, fishing, and that sort of stuff; and the Jötnar are of nature and chaos. Neither nature nor chaos is evil. Then again, in modern times people seem to keep thinking chaos equals destruction, but that's ridiculous. Destruction is only one possibility (and one that can lead to rebuilding something better anyway). Chaos is endless possibility. Anyway, it was the Christians who turned that into some good vs evil thing, so I don't get why some heathens adhere to Christian influence so tightly.
I'm rambling. Sorry.

Jess42

Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #38 on: June 23, 2014, 02:04:47 pm »
The three of us could but still leaves me without a singer and another guitarist and I already know a bassist and possible drummer. Back to square one, I guess I could go it alone but a single guitarist, I would just rather there were two of us.

I can see, cause those growls sound like they actually come from deeper. The screams on the other hand.

Actually Edge you make a good point about Chaos not being destructive. Chaos can also be creative. This planet and our solar system is a good example of that. Sort of like with me seeing good and evil are relative and dependant upon one another. Without Evil, there would be no Good and vice versa. I believe in one main Creator which most people relate to God but what about the Elohim? What about Lillith, Adam's first wife or lover before Eve? I tend to really irritate really religious people because I see the Devil, Lucifer, Satan or whatever anyone calls that aspect not as much as evil as a temptation or something to overcome. That entity was created by the same Devine power that created us and both aspects are inside us. And therefore why we know the difference between good and evil. So from a Spiritual standpoint the Devil is not a bad entity because if we do resist the evil aspects of ourselves we overcome the adversity.

A lot of times stories, writings and ancient texts are not there for nothing. Behind every mythe there is some truth. Just like the thirteen gospels that were left out of the Bible which most people call the Gnostic books. These writings or what is left of them paint Christ in a totally different light than the new testiment does. More like a teacher with tremendous insight that actually sealed his own fate. It points to our own destiny and "salvation" as being in our own hands and no establisment's or organization's or heads of them. If anything they bring up more questions than answers and way more mysterious than the ones that made it into the New Testiment.

I just think there is more to everything than what is commonly accepted. I could be wrong but I think a lot of things are discounted as fantastical folklore, mysticism, or just so called tales to scare children at night. But its there. The stories, the tales, the texts and quite a few things fit together like pieces of a puzzle. I used to spend a lot of time in the western states and talked to a Shoshone elder in Nevada for a couple of hours and some of the stuff he told me about the endtimes in their legends kind of blew my mind because I could make connections and he agreed with me but he told me it wasn't as much about the end as a time of change. Now look who's rambling. ;)

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Re: Beliefs and shame
« Reply #39 on: June 24, 2014, 08:08:09 pm »
Ah I see. Yeah, that could be a problem.

Yeah. I can't remember what she said exactly, but it sounded painful.

So from a Spiritual standpoint the Devil is not a bad entity because if we do resist the evil aspects of ourselves we overcome the adversity.
...
If anything they bring up more questions than answers and way more mysterious than the ones that made it into the New Testiment.
I like that. It's not for me, mind you, but I think it's a much healthier attitude to have than blaming someone else for faults and wanting to be given answers instead of finding them for oneself.

I used to spend a lot of time in the western states and talked to a Shoshone elder in Nevada for a couple of hours and some of the stuff he told me about the endtimes in their legends kind of blew my mind because I could make connections and he agreed with me but he told me it wasn't as much about the end as a time of change. Now look who's rambling. ;)
Ragnarok is like that too. The first version I read of it included Baldr and Hod returning to rebuild anew although I have no idea how much of the Ragnarok stories are influenced by Christianity.

I'll readily admit I'm a huge fan of chaos. Every time my life gets topsy turvy, I always come out of it with more experiences and, therefore, more knowledge. I almost always come out of it stronger than before and closer to being who I feel I am meant to be which is a fantastic feeling. Even though things tend to be destroyed, the almost always needed to be. I thrive in chaos.
I also have a thing for the wild. It's like... civilization is more convenient to live in (and has internet), but the wild is what feels like home. And I sound sappy. Sorry.

Speaking of religion, while being heathen/Asatru does seem to be pretty much where I'm headed to the point where my Asatru friend seems to be under the impression that I have the same beliefs as him, I realized today that there is one big thing that keeps me from just being heathen. To be honest, there are many heathens who accept LGBT people, many who don't care if people honour Loki, and I already keep mostly quiet about my connection with jötnar although I wish I could be more open about that. But their values place great importance on family and that's something I can't do. This is such a big thing for me that just remembering this switched me from thinking "yeah this is definitely for me" and feeling happy about it to rejecting it and feeling confused and lost.
I know I don't have to have a pre-established religion. I guess my feelings on it are complicated though.

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