Activism and Politics > Discrimination

Society's reaction: MTF vs. FTM

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Lilly G:

--- Quote from: IdontEven on September 23, 2015, 10:35:33 am ---I think there are two things going on. The first occurs when someone applies the current level of societal sexism to someone with basically no knowledge of what trans people are about. For them mtf's are basically wolves in sheep's clothing, and ftm's are sheep in wolves' clothing. One is a threat and trying to be sneaky about it, the other is trying to make themselves look like a threat but there's no way they ever could be.

Then there is the ever so slightly more evolved thing going on, where they do have some understanding of trans issues but the sexism thing is still big. "Aww you poor little mtf, do you need a hug and a tissue and maybe some aroma therapy candles?" Contrasted with "Ftm huh...well that sucks*. Rub some dirt in it and walk it off, bro."

* - referring to whatever grievance is being aired

That sort of sexism runs deep and I don't see it changing any time soon. Trans acceptance and protection will happen way before women and men are seen or treated as equals I think.

--- End quote ---
Do you have the candles? because I would love the candles. I have actually seen a lot of the sexism around me, but its the opposite way around in my area. its "aww you poor confused ftm, go play with your dolls and stop pretending." or what I get which is "mtf? what the <screw> are you doing you creep, stop trying to get near my family pervert." like, what is the point of insulting someone for being themselves? and what kind of twisted mind would one have to have to use transgender as a way to be a pervert?

SallyChoasAura:
Well people tend to be more excepting of girls acting like men as they tend to see the as hot and badass because they're tough rather than a boy behaving girly as they see that as low and a lack of toughness. They also tend to see them as 'gay.'
Honestly though, society needs to get the frick over it and let people be themselves. 😑😒

SallyChoasAura:
@Lilly G
I love your profile pic.💟

mac1:

--- Quote from: Sleepydf on July 13, 2018, 11:18:27 pm --- At my work I actually overheard someone when they found out about me transitioning say that at least it wasn't a "dude" going to a "chick"

--- End quote ---
I always thought there was less negative reaction to an FTM than to an MTF, and that transition was less obvious for the FTM.

BrightWindow:
In my opinion, the FTM transition is far easier than the MTF transition. T is an extremely powerful hormone with all sorts of prominent and permanent effects, many of which are difficult or impossible to reverse (e.g. bigger feet cannot be reversed, facial hair requires laser/electrolysis to get rid of for good). So when you are MTF even once T is gone you are having a hard time fighting against all sorts of things it has done (unless you are very lucky and get to transition before puberty,) whereas for FTM you can take T and look male much easier. E is a powerful hormone too, but its effects are not quite as noticeable, and afaik the only ones which stay throughout FTM HRT are breasts (requires invasive surgery, but can be reversed) and changes to the shape and width of the pelvis (irreversible).

Consequently I would say that passing as male is a lot easier than passing as female, which means FTMs are more likely to be treated just the same way as any cis man whereas MTFs are more open to being clocked and then facing discrimination for being transgender.

Even if they are clocked, I would say transmen are probably considered more acceptable by society than transwomen. Society is generally more open to masculinity in women than femininity in men, so, although I fully respect transmen as men and transwomen as women, they see "a woman wanting to become a man" as more acceptable than "a man wanting to become a woman." I also feel that there's a whole social stereotype that everyone wants to be a man, and there are some ways in which I agree cis men have privilege over cis women, but this idea can be harmful to everyone. I also agree with the point on sexuality, that same-gender relationships are often more accepted in women than men, and there are stereotypes between sexuality and gender identity that transmen may be seen as lesbians and transwomen as gay men, which I do not agree with, but means that transmen may have an easier time.

Toilets seem to be easier for transmen as transwomen are often wrongly accused of being "predators" when almost all of us aren't.

I may agree that transwomen get more attention than transmen. I'm not the most knowledgeable about the media and all so I couldn't say for certain but if this is true than I could agree that this is harmful to FTMs.

Also I feel that society values women's physical appearances more than men's. Which means that an MTF who chose not to transition medically, or who still does not look exactly like a cis woman, is more likely to be discriminated for her appearance, than an FTM who chooses not to transition medically or who still does not look exactly like a cis man. I also feel that this makes people more likely to clock a transwoman than a transman since society is more critical of women's physical appearance.

That isn't to say transitioning isn't hard for dudes as well. Both can be very very difficult for many reasons. But in general I would say that transmen do not have quite as many difficulties transitioning as transwomen.

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