Author Topic: Conflicted and questioning  (Read 805 times)

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Offline charizard

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Conflicted and questioning
« on: July 08, 2018, 05:23:48 am »
Hey there,

I've been questioning my gender for about 4 years after an "AHA" moment watching an FTM character in a tv show. I'm still unsure, but the descriptor that works best for me at the moment is transmasculine nonbinary. I'm not out to anyone except anonymously online.

I feel very stuck. As a kid all my gender expression choices were met with "you don't want to look like a boy do you?!" or, when I got a bit older, "do you want to look like a lesbian?!". Feeling shot down in my preferred expression I would always settle for the least-worst-'acceptable' option chosen for me.

Sometimes I would reply "yes" to be met with "no you don't." Or repetitive "why's".
So I feel like a default avatar. I barely know how to dress myself. I can count on one hand how many shirts I've bought for myself, and on the other hand how many pairs of pants. Yet I'm 28 years old. I no longer live with my parents, but within the last month I dared to wear something as simple as a backwards baseball cap when out with them and got the exact same comments from mum.

For the most part I am terrified of wearing what I want to wear. In case of judgement. In case of being accused of "wanting to be a boy" or "looking like a lesbian". And most of all in case it just looks so revoltingly wrong and not how I've imagined it to be, because the body within it isn't masculine. I have wanted to get a short hair cut for four years, have even told people to hold myself accountable to doing it, have even got to a hairdresser with the intent, yet remained paralysed from doing it and backed out. I recently put on some weight and my hopes of appearing male seem even more hopeless.

Despite wanting the physique of a man, there are things about being a man that I do not want to experience, both physical characteristics and societal. For one, as a girl I was never bullied and could easily diffuse anyone who tried. As a boy, I wouldn't have had the same luxury.

However the biggest thing is that, being cis-female-passing, I am afforded a great deal of privilege. My career is in an industry which is currently subject to 'positive sexism' towards women. There is no conversation outside of the binary. Giving up my cis-female status would be career suicide. I feel disgusting saying this, but being seen as a female is like 'special status' in this environment. And I don't know if I can give that up to either be seen just as another one of the guys, or become something so far off the radar. Hell, people accuse NB's of wanting to be special snowflakes - if being special was what they wanted they could just be 'special women' in this damn industry.

I'm so choked on the inner conflict I can barely breathe.

Thank you for reading. I don't know what if anything there is to reply to here, but I suppose at least it's out there now.

Offline Dani

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2018, 06:04:20 am »
Hell, people accuse NB's of wanting to be special snowflakes...

Science tells us that all snowflakes are different from each other and no two are alike.

So, I guess, we are all special snowflakes in some sort of way.

Seriously, transition of any sort, involves some sacrifice. Employment is just one of many issues.

As a non-binary, you have flexibility in your presentation that other traditional TG people do not.

Good luck with your decisions on how you want to live your life.



Online Alaskan Danielle

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2018, 08:31:29 am »
@charizard
    Hello Charizard,  Thank you for your very first posting.
PLEASE KNOW that I am not trying to hijack your thread but I see that you had just become a member of Susan's Place.  Please allow me to give you my Official Welcome.

I am glad that you have become a member of Susan's Place and that you have shared your first thoughts with other members that may read your posting.
I am thinking that you may lots more questions and concerns, this is the right place for you to be to find out what others have done that may have been in your circumstances.
 
Be aware that there are a lot of members here that can identify with what you may be going through.
 
WELCOME you to Susan's Place.  You will find this a safe and friendly place to share with others  and to read about others similar trials, tribulations, and successes.
It is nice that you had signed up so you can share with others and involve yourself with some give and take with other members.
When frustrated or if you have successes you can share it here if you wish and receive support from others and offer support to others. ....
 
***It's a very good chance that you might find that you will make some new friends here. 

Please come in and continue to be involved at your own pace. 

Below, I posted Important LINKS that will tell you about Susan's Place.  Included there is information about the site that will help you navigate around and best utilize the features here.   
Please look closely at the LINKS in RED, there answers there to many questions that new members ask.
Again, Welcome.
Danielle

Here are some links to the site rules and stuff that all new members should be familiar with:


Things that you should read
Check out my Personal Threads that have more details about myself (click Links):
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               "Positive Mindset... put away negativity"
                           "Susans Writers and Book Readers"

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>>> I've been Full Time since December 2016 :icon_chick:
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Online Alaskan Danielle

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2018, 08:37:44 am »
@charizard     
Oh, and another thing Charizard ... to let more members here on the Forums know of your arrival and therefore you will receive more involvement in sharing information of interest with you and other like-minded  members reading it will be more apt to share their thoughts with you.

If you would, please go to the  Introductions Forum  to tell the members about yourself!  You should include a summary of the key information that you wrote in your first posting here.
 
Again, Welcome to Susan's Place,
Danielle

Check out my Personal Threads that have more details about myself (click Links):
   "I am the HUNTED PREY : Danielle's Chronicles"
               "Positive Mindset... put away negativity"
                           "Susans Writers and Book Readers"

Started HRT March 2015  3½ years ago, it's been an exciting journey
>>> I've been Full Time since December 2016 :icon_chick:
I am 38 years old, Single, and Self Employed in a small town up in the COLD North.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Online Dena

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2018, 11:31:50 am »
I feel disgusting saying this, but being seen as a female is like 'special status' in this environment. And I don't know if I can give that up to either be seen just as another one of the guys, or become something so far off the radar.
Welcome to Susan's Place. There is nothing wrong with being transgender and not transitioning. On the MTF side of things we have cross dressers who are comfortable with the male life but occasionally wish to appear feminine. Notice how there isn't an equivalent for somebody FTM? That's because society accepts women wearing mens clothing while it rejects men wearing women clothing. There is nothing wrong with wearing mens clothing in private or possibly in public where your comfortable. Start out with jeans and a flannel shirt which won't draw much attention. Add a few things that you like and build your wardrobe over time. By the way, my sister for some reason wears jeans and flannel shirts all the time. Possibly because she work where the air-conditioner is set low but I am not really sure.

Even people who desire a transition may not for many reasons. Among them is fear of the medical procedures, family commitments and reasons of employment. What ever your reason, it's more important to you than transitioning which means it's the right decision for you at the moment. As we get older, our values change and possibly at some latter date, you may see things in a different light.

For now, explore the site and ask questions. The better you understand your self, the better you will be able to deal with the issues in your life.
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Offline charizard

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2018, 06:12:07 am »
Hi @Dani
Science tells us that all snowflakes are different from each other and no two are alike.
So, I guess, we are all special snowflakes in some sort of way.
Yes I rather think that's their point - ie. they're claiming that some snowflakes are trying to be 'more special' even though all snowflakes are inherently unique/special. But those accusing others of this have likely missed the mark. It just stings to know that it seems to be a majority opinion.

Quote
Seriously, transition of any sort, involves some sacrifice. Employment is just one of many issues.
True, it's just the one that's impacting me the most at the moment even when I'm not trying to transition.

Quote
As a non-binary, you have flexibility in your presentation that other traditional TG people do not.
Maybe. This statement kind of threw me, to be honest. I have flexibility in that 'what non-binary people look like' has a good deal of flexibility. I have less flexibility in that 'what I want to look like' is much narrower.

Quote
Good luck with your decisions on how you want to live your life.
Thanks.



Thanks for the welcome @Alaskan Danielle.



Hi @Dena.
I definitely agree that society is much more accepting of women wearing men's clothing than vice versa. I wouldn't call it 100% accepting, but there is far more leniency granted by the gender police for women in western society.

I typically do wear things like that. But my problem is that I look like a woman-wearing-mens-clothes, which suits me far better than how I see myself when wearing women's clothes, but still doesn't fit how I'm supposed to look in my mind.

Thanks for the pointers.

Offline WallieWorld

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2018, 07:13:25 am »
Hi, I am new hear and yours was the first post I read after I signed up yesterday. I have kept coming back to your post again and again because I hear your deep pain and I can just feel it over here on my end. I don't know what you are going through (I am hear to learn how to support my child that may be transgendered) but I do know what it is to have cognitive structures that hold you back, the fear of rejection, family that have limited beliefs. It sounds like since you were very little that others have tried to push you into their idea of the "normal" gender look. These messages stay with you long after you move out from your parents house and if we don't learn new mental scripts they can stay with us a whole lifetime. I hope that you can learn new ways of thinking to replaces these scripts handed to you from your family, because in this you may find some freedom within yourself. I just feel your pain right now in feeling stuck. So stuck that you don't even know how to dress yourself, as you said. My hope for you is that you can take the path to freedom, to a place where dressing yourself is a joyous form of self expression, an embodiment of freedom and that you can come to a point where you can dress to match how you feel inside and that the joy of that moment will carry you so lightly that you feel as if you are gliding along rather than walking.

But right now you are in this stuck place. This place of fear (and for a good reason considering your job privileges and your mom's comment over something small like a backward baseball hat). I can't give you the answers, I can't tell you what steps to take. This is your journey and I don't have the map. But I can feel your pain and I just want to say that I  truly hope for you to find the freedom as you find the road to take you to freedom within yourself.

Online Allison S

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2018, 10:22:48 am »
Hi, I'm just wondering what field do you work in?

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Offline charizard

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2018, 04:03:37 am »
Hi, I am new hear and yours was the first post I read after I signed up yesterday.
Hi WallieWorld.
Thanks very much for your kind and understanding post. I hope everything with your child is going ok. It sounds like you're really trying to learn and understand as much as you can to help them, and that's really commendable.

Happily my feelings have eased up a bit since I last posted. It's a bit like that for me - comes and goes in waves, where at times it feels almost unbearable, then other times it's ok to sit with the dissonance. 

Thanks again.
Cheers,
Charizard

Offline charizard

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2018, 04:05:23 am »
Hi, I'm just wondering what field do you work in?
Hi Allison S. I'm in a technical services field.

Offline charizard

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2018, 04:19:59 am »
Update for today.

There's a friend at work who I have always suspected was trans (FTM).

At the time he joined the company, I was obsessively researching FTM stuff and was imagining that almost EVERYONE was trans - random people at the shops, on the bus, just anyone and everyone. He just happened to fit my imagined profile so I put it out of my mind for a while.

But there have been other signs since, and based on gossip I heard today I am 99% sure that he is. He totally passes (even the gossip today wasn't questioning this) but it's too much of an accumulation of co-incidences for me to think otherwise. And there's no way that I want to let him know that I think he's trans because if he is, then he's stealth and I'm not going to compromise that for him. It's up to him to say it if he wants, and not to say it if he doesn't.

For me it kind of sucks though cause he could be someone to talk about stuff with. But I'm not even going to try to bring up my own stuff talking to him while I'm in this weird in-between dodgy damn place where I don't know wtf I'm doing.
I'm super happy for him, but unhappy for me lol.

Offline Satinjoy

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2018, 11:07:00 pm »
Tricky spot to be in.

He may read you and come to you some day.

I live in multiple presents.  Its easy to hide my body.

Work became hard, eventually I started presenting nb.

Then my job went away.

If you can play the game, play it.  Doesnt change who you are at core.

Its the social construct.  Play it for what ot is if you can, then go home and put your hair up and be you.

But there is a point dysphoria may win out, and thats whete we all start making the tough choices with their associated consequences.

I wear a diamond engagement ring with my wedding nand and a gorgeous crystal pink blue white blue pink ring.  Clearly trans.

Other trans can come if they want.

And in my current place I am the only transperson i know.

Hopefully your coworker breaks the ice sometimes. 

Hang in there.
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Sh'e took the little blue ones.

Offline JB_Girl

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2018, 08:27:10 am »
Update for today.

There's a friend at work who I have always suspected was trans (FTM).

.....

But there have been other signs since, and based on gossip I heard today I am 99% sure that he is. He totally passes (even the gossip today wasn't questioning this) but it's too much of an accumulation of co-incidences for me to think otherwise. And there's no way that I want to let him know that I think he's trans because if he is, then he's stealth and I'm not going to compromise that for him. It's up to him to say it if he wants, and not to say it if he doesn't.

For me it kind of sucks though cause he could be someone to talk about stuff with. But I'm not even going to try to bring up my own stuff talking to him while I'm in this weird in-between dodgy damn place where I don't know wtf I'm doing.
I'm super happy for him, but unhappy for me lol.

Hi,
You mention that he is your friend and that he is stealth.  While it would be inappropriate  (wrong actually) to out him, if he is your friend you can talk to him about yourself.  Your truth is what you own and your truth can be shared if you want to.  To be queer is to be isolated, but the isolation is imposed internally as much as socially.  For us to live authentically is to walk the the arch of honesty to freedom.

This is your choice.  You can take the risk and perhaps find an ear and an ally or a friend.  I spent years in that hollow of insecurity and fear and understand that the choice is a tough one to make. Particularly at work, and to be honest when I came out at work few were particularly surprised but I was lucky in that one person understood and gave me a touch point there until I was ready.

Luck and peace to you both,

Julie
« Last Edit: July 25, 2018, 04:09:43 pm by Dena »
I began this journey when I began to think, but it took what it took for me to truly understand the what and the why of authenticity.  I'm grateful to have found a path that works and to live as I have always dreamed.

The dates are unimportant and are quite stale now.  The journey to truth is fresh and never ends.

Offline Satinjoy

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2018, 04:17:30 pm »
Hi,
You mention that he is your friend and that he is stealth.  While it would be inappropriate  (wrong actually) to out him, if he is your friend you can talk to him about yourself.  Your truth is what you own and your truth can be shared if you want to.  To be queer is to be isolated, but the isolation is imposed internally as much as socially.  For us to live authentically is to walk the the arch of honesty to freedom.

This is your choice.  You can take the risk and perhaps find an ear and an ally or a friend.  I spent years in that hollow of insecurity and fear and understand that the choice is a tough one to make. Particularly at work, and to be honest when I came out at work few were particularly surprised but I was lucky in that one person understood and gave me a touch point there until I was ready.

Luck and peace to you both,

Julie

Yup.  This.
Morpheus: This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the red pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the little blue pills - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes

Sh'e took the little blue ones.

Offline SallyChoasAura

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2018, 06:22:23 pm »
Hey I completely understand the feeling! I'm thinking about that maybe I am FTM trans or just genderfuild either way I'm not sure if I want to go through the the full transition process. We both have time to figure it out so don't worry if you're not sure yet.

Offline charizard

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2018, 06:16:08 am »
Thanks everyone. Yeah I agree that I can talk about myself to my friend and see if he says anything, but I feel too confused to start the conversation.

Maybe I'm just a tomboy who turned into a stupid nothing waste of space through lack of confidence to keep pushing the envelope. Maybe this is just another thing that I fail at.

Offline SallyChoasAura

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2018, 06:34:32 am »
Thanks everyone. Yeah I agree that I can talk about myself to my friend and see if he says anything, but I feel too confused to start the conversation.

Maybe I'm just a tomboy who turned into a stupid nothing waste of space through lack of confidence to keep pushing the envelope. Maybe this is just another thing that I fail at.
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I will not tolerate you beating yourself up. These things take time, so don't push yourself to hard or give up too fast. We all have our own place and our own pass. We just have to learn how to work with it.

Offline Maid Marion

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2018, 06:43:56 am »
Maybe you could start by putting together a set of male clothes.  If you are small like I am this isn't going to be easy.  But way easier as a non-binary than as a TG.  As NB you get to decide "close enough."  I have a cute white Calvin Klein dress shirt that looks girly.  Not what I would wear to jury duty.  For that I have an ill fitting boys's shirt made by Brooks Brothers. But, if you become TG, you now need to "pass." 

Offline LexieDragon

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2018, 12:09:48 am »
Quote
Maybe I'm just a tomboy who turned into a stupid nothing waste of space through lack of confidence to keep pushing the envelope. Maybe this is just another thing that I fail at.

Sweetie, do not beat yourself up.

I am new here too. I know what you are going through but from the opposite side of the coin.

I find myself questioning a lot now that my ditzy brain has started to add pi and pi together.

Some days I think I must be crazy and just trying to justify wearing a skirt cause its comfortable. Other days I feel like I never should have been male at all. And on other days, still, I feel like I am a fusion of both.

The more I have been reflecting on my own behaviors and experiences over my years of existence, the more this is all starting to line up and make sense. Still in turmoil at times, but making sense nonetheless.

Talk to your friend. Find others you can trust. I have 3 people that know about me in my life at the moment as I am sorting it out (and terrified to tell others tbh). Their help and support is proving invaluable. I hope you can find people to help you.

Its okay to be scared.
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Alexandra teh gr8

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Offline charizard

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Re: Conflicted and questioning
« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2018, 06:10:25 am »
Sorry, that night was a bit of a mess. :/ :(
At times it just feels like there's something inherently wrong and no amount of time or things I could do in the future can fix it.

But I've got a bit of breathing room today so all's good.
What you're all saying about taking time and reflecting makes sense. I just don't know how to work with that because it's not a neatly structured plan.

I'm annoyed that I've put on some weight (I was on a work trip for a few months so completely fell out of my routine) because it's made me even less able to 'look right' and I feel less comfortable in whatever I'm wearing. I have an awesome 2XS mens shirt that fits in the shoulders and arms but the rest of me was a bit too fat even before I put on the weight. At the same time I bought an XS (because I was too nervous to ask to try them on to actually figure out my size) and it looked ridiculous in the shoulders.  Maybe I could try it again now that I'm chubbier, but I don't think it'll help.
Just gotta kick the stress-eating habit and try and bulk up some muscle I guess.

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