Author Topic: Which hurts less  (Read 28816 times)

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Online LizK

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #540 on: March 12, 2019, 08:06:24 am »
You attitude displayed in your response to me is what will get you through....you care...she cares...there is a way forward and a positive outcome for you both is very possible.  :)

Liz
Transition Begun 25 September 2015
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GCS 4 December 2018
Voice Surgery 01 February 2019

Online GinaG

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #541 on: March 12, 2019, 08:20:22 am »
Dear Liz and Faith:

My plan is to delay the absolute statement that I will transition to my wife until September at the earliest.  Over the next 6 months I hope that things evolve and that we have a natural dialogue without confrontation.

She continues to acknowledge that I am on HRT.  We still hug and we still kiss but we still don't talk about my gender dysphoria much less the possibility that I will transition.  Even I am still having difficulty processing that.


I know that she realizes through my actions and words that I love her and I am not leaving.  I believe that she feels the same and doesn't intend to leave.  I think that she has greater fears of what transitioning means than even me.

Her refusal to speak to a therapist requires my absolute commitment to being patient.


Hugs,

Emma

Dear Emma.

I am in a similar position.  It has been clear that my wife's fears are as great as mine.  Kiss and love.  It's most of what we are trying gto do.  She has her worries too. 

I am finding doubts are s big part of my journey but also real joy.  And growing sense of being on the right path.  I saw that in your smile and throughout this wonderful story.

Keep smiling!

Hugs

Gina

Offline KimOct

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #542 on: March 12, 2019, 08:21:54 am »
I definitely am picking up on the Kim/Moni tag team act.  You can be sad periodically but no wimps allowed ;) ;D

Moonflower thanks for having my back. 

This is going to be a year of lots of doubt.  It starts every time I kiss my wife.  My single goal is to keep us together through this.

Its fragile but every day she stays with me gives me hope.

Yeah I like goofing around with Moni she cracks me up and if we are always serious this will be a depressing place.

But what you said above is absolutely true -"You can be sad periodically but no wimps allowed."  The absolute truth especially when it comes to transitioning. - No wimps in this deal.

I get sad a fair amount of the time - just ask Ashley LOL she has heard 3 years of it.  But after the pity party it's time to put on your big girl panties and move on.  What other choice is there? 

Do I get sad? Sure. Plenty.  But then it's time to get going again.  Welcome to life.

P.S.  Maybe Moonflower has some advice regarding your wife.  Ssshh  quiet, don't tell her I said that.  :D
The first transphobe you have to conquer is yourself

Offline Emma1017

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #543 on: March 12, 2019, 10:20:01 am »
Thank you Liz and Gina for your thoughts.

There is constant doubt and that doubt brings fear.  I agree Gina, seeing Emma smile in every photo has convinced me that I am making the right decision but that doesn't prevent that nagging doubt from crawling in.  Positive thoughts are always appreciated.

Kim I believe that being an adult is recognizing that sadness is part of our lives and not letting it control you.  Clearly you get that.  If I wasn't transgender there would be other things that would generate sadness. 

Being transgender definitely makes that sadness unique but, as so many have shown on this site, there is still plenty of room for excitement and joy.  I do enjoy the many celebrations that are shared here!

Hugs,

Emma

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #544 on: March 12, 2019, 07:40:54 pm »
I have to say that this is a really great group of people on this thread. I feel good being a little part of it. I think my perspective is from a little further down the road them some of you. (Kim and Liz are always wanting to race me.) I see though that this is an agonizing process and you can't see into the future. You have this thing driving you and there are hints that indicate you are going in a good direction, but really there is no knowing absolutely what is right for you. So, I think sadness kind of goes hand in hand with the elation that you also experience in this process. The fact that others are involved makes this especially tough. I would like to applaud the positivity that I hear from you here. I fully believe there are times to mourn the bad or sad things. I lost my brother and a best friend within a few weeks this past summer. Yeah, I did my share of mourning. A very wise young friend (  @Sailor Mars on Susan's) inspired me with something she said. It was, "Don't let the darkness kill your light." That one little quote has helped me tremendously in keeping things in perspective. So I mourn and then get up, dust myself off, and keep looking for joy. Don't get me wrong, doing that with dysphoria was really hard. Let me just repeat, you ladies are awesome! Keep plugging!

Okay, who let serious Moni in here. KIM!!!!!!! What the f..............
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

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Offline Moonflower

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #545 on: March 12, 2019, 07:48:57 pm »
It is a delight reading your contributions!

Can those of us, who lost their spouses along the line, hire you on an hourly base?  We all need an understanding  shoulder to cry on once in a while!
Thank you, Linde, for your appreciation. Thank you also for sharing your story in the various threads here at Susan's. I'm here for you, too.
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15 years ago I started discovering the woman hiding behind my husband's facade
Fall 2018 my baby's coming out full time! Hello BlueStar!  :icon_female:
BlueStar beginning HRT

Offline Emma1017

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #546 on: March 13, 2019, 07:09:30 am »
Got massively pounded by doubts the last few days.  Lost a lot of sleep.

Really hounding myself with "Why do you really need to do this?" 

There was a phrase that I learned in French class in high school that has stayed with me all these years:

    "Le cœur a ses raisons que la raison ne connaît point." "The heart has reasons that reason cannot understand."

This has stayed with me all my life, in part because I have an internal conflict.  I am massively logical and my profession relies heavily on it but I am equally massively a romantic. 

This might explain my constant internal conflict.  Logic solves life's problems while love gives life meaning.

I can't get the two sides to reconcile each other. 

Unfortunately, the rub comes for me when I logically know that I should transition but in my heart I know that if I transition I am jeopardizing the love of my life.

There is cruel irony at work here.

Hugs and a few tears,

Emma

Offline Linde

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #547 on: March 13, 2019, 08:37:30 am »
Thank you, Linde, for your appreciation. Thank you also for sharing your story in the various threads here at Susan's. I'm here for you, too.
Thanks Moonflower, you are simply a wonderful human being!
Feb 2019, bi-lateral orchiectomy
June 10, 2019 Not enough Y chr detected to be male






Online GinaG

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #548 on: March 13, 2019, 12:14:02 pm »
Got massively pounded by doubts the last few days.  Lost a lot of sleep.

Really hounding myself with "Why do you really need to do this?" 

There was a phrase that I learned in French class in high school that has stayed with me all these years:

    "Le cœur a ses raisons que la raison ne connaît point." "The heart has reasons that reason cannot understand."

This has stayed with me all my life, in part because I have an internal conflict.  I am massively logical and my profession relies heavily on it but I am equally massively a romantic. 

This might explain my constant internal conflict.  Logic solves life's problems while love gives life meaning.

I can't get the two sides to reconcile each other. 

Unfortunately, the rub comes for me when I logically know that I should transition but in my heart I know that if I transition I am jeopardizing the love of my life.

There is cruel irony at work here.

Hugs and a few tears,

Emma


A big hug Emma.

I know it's small comfort sometimes to know I and others share these doubts and the dilemma.
I wake asking if I am being foolish, selfish.....all I come back too is the yearning pain I carry.
I cry daily,  step after step.   Hugs help.  I think of your story and others here. A lot. It helps me see clearly.  Your sisters here really care.

Another hug

Gina

Offline Emma1017

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #549 on: March 13, 2019, 12:31:08 pm »
Thank you Gina.  I needed the hug.

If it wasn't for you and everyone here I frankly don't know where I would be.  I agree, the 24/7 nature of gender dysphoria leaves little time for peace.  I had no idea January last year how important even an electronic hug could be.

Knowing that others share your pain and offer sincerely support and sympathy is massive.  Finally realizing you are NOT alone removes an enormous sense of shame, guilt and anger from my life. 

I am truly glad that this thread has been useful for others.  It certainly has been for me.

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #550 on: March 13, 2019, 04:36:32 pm »
Can I add a hug for you both?
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

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Online GinaG

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #551 on: March 13, 2019, 05:32:46 pm »
Yes please. 

I had a good day though.  My heamotologist who treata me for the blood clot I got over a year ago. Oked HRT and referred me.   I had delayed for months.  I climb this mountain.  I learned long agp climbing real mountains you can't hurry one step. Rest stops.  But moving again., finally.

Hugs are good

Gina

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #552 on: March 13, 2019, 05:39:35 pm »
Yes please. 

I had a good day though.  My heamotologist who treata me for the blood clot I got over a year ago. Oked HRT and referred me.   I had delayed for months.  I climb this mountain.  I learned long agp climbing real mountains you can't hurry one step. Rest stops.  But moving again., finally.

Hugs are good

Gina

Great news Gina! Hugs!
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

]

Offline KimOct

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #553 on: March 13, 2019, 08:41:25 pm »
Oh my gosh !!  Group hug already  :D :D

Yeah there is something a little different to the group in this thread.  I have read other outpourings of emotion and even though I am quite the sap and romantic and touchy feely sometimes I think ' alright already'  ::)

To me this seems different - maybe because I am so involved but there is a lot of genuine emotion here....
even Moni  :D  you know I like her a lot cuz I like to tease her.

This is a journey that is a constant evolution and will continue to surprise you even when you are well down the road.

Let me give an example from today.  So as I have been mentioning for a few weeks I started a new job today.  It is with a company that leases a floor at a Fortune 30 HQ.  A massive place with 4,000 people.  There are hundreds of people walking the common areas and cafeteria at all times.

I walk in and meet the other 10 in my training class - none of us have met.  We go on a tour.  I am getting constant glances from all of these strangers.  I am getting constant glances by many passers by.  Two years ago I would have been freaking out.  I would have been embarrassed, uncomfortable, self conscious.  Did I feel that today?  Yeah a smidgen I guess but no big deal.

Then I flashback to 3 years ago to when I first was out in public.  Rushing to and from my car.... not taking my sunglasses off... hiding.

This journey changes - it does get easier in many ways.  You just have to give it time - put on your big girl panties and do it. 

YOU ALL GOT THIS.

Hugs to all of you.

The first transphobe you have to conquer is yourself

Offline Emma1017

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #554 on: March 14, 2019, 07:02:53 am »
Hey Gina I am really glad that you had a good day.  You deserve it!

Moni and Kim thanks for the constant pep talk.  It always radiates out!

There are always doubts in life surrounding every decision.  Its just part of the deal.  The doubts around transitioning late in life are huge.  I know I am preaching to the choir with that statement here but doubts are also useful because they create caution to insure that you are making the best decision possible before you make it.

I am trying to reconcile my doubts so I know the day after the decision, making a public declaration of coming out,  that I made the right decision.  Before I get there I have another person and I simply need her to be a part of my life.  My doubts include protecting her and our relationship. 

I need as close as I can get to an absolute certainty before I make that final, irrevocable choice.

This thread would not exist if I was single.  I would have started transitioning last year.  I came to you all with a deep emotional crisis that I just couldn't resolve, hence the name of this thread. 

This painful crisis and the doubts it has created will not end until I step, irreversibly, forward, hopefully holding the hand of my wife. 

I know that's a lot to wish for.

I totally accept, as Kim and everyone ahead of me have shared, that even after that step, there will be other doubts and other crises.  That's life. 

This one is just a monster, the most soul-consuming in my life.

I am sorry about my continued ramblings.  I just can't stop the 24/7 thoughts and doubts.

Thanks for being my therapy.

Hugs,

Emma

Online LizK

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #555 on: March 14, 2019, 07:17:46 am »
Hi Emma

I think being cautious is very wise. Many have faltered in trying to do this. I managed to keep my 33 year marriage intact in a large part due to my wife's attitude and I will only accept partial responsibility for it.

One of the things I had to come to terms with was the question...do I really need to do this?

In the end obviously my answer was yes.

What I had forgotten about or minimalized was the years of angst, the years of thinking and wishing about it, the numerous bad decisions, the numerous bouts of self destructive behaviour and most of all the constant everyday thinking about this when I wasn't doing one of the other stupid things I just mentioned. Finally the sudden realisation that I was thinking about drinking again...I had been sober for 16 years and there was a very high chance I was going to drink again which was the equivalent of signing my own death warrant.

Try if you can and remember the times you have now forgotten about, the behaviour driven by your need...maybe then you will be able to make your decision with all the facts and not minimise how badly you are or aren't impacted by this.

Liz
Transition Begun 25 September 2015
HRT since 17 May 2016,
Fulltime from 8 March 2017,
GCS 4 December 2018
Voice Surgery 01 February 2019

Offline Emma1017

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #556 on: March 14, 2019, 10:22:22 am »
Liz I absolutely agree with you.  Actions speak louder than words and my continuing actions prove that my transitioning is inevitable.

My frustration and constant whining is that I need to wait a 18 months before I can make it official.  A lot can happen between now and then.




Offline KimOct

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #557 on: March 14, 2019, 07:21:32 pm »
Emma - I think you are being 100% candid regarding your wife being your greatest concern.  I do not doubt that for a second.  There are only two thoughts I want to throw in today.

1.  If you are miserable then she will be miserable.  I don't care how tough you are, how self sacrificing, how giving. 
I am confident it will poison your relationship.  This is obviously my opinion and I am nothing more than a bystander with an opinion.  The reason I give that opinion is that you should search yourself and see if it rings true and discuss it with your therapist.

2.  While I absolutely think your wife is your greatest concern I also think there is an element of fear about how you will be perceived.  That is normal.  I felt it immensely.  Why do I hold this opinion?  Because of many of the passing comments you have posted throughout these pages.  I am far from calling you out.  You are brave and as I have said many times you have done great things for yourself and others by sharing this.

Courage is not the absence of fear, it is doing something in the face of fear.
The first transphobe you have to conquer is yourself

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #558 on: March 14, 2019, 08:01:49 pm »
Hey Gina I am really glad that you had a good day.  You deserve it!

Moni and Kim thanks for the constant pep talk.  It always radiates out!

There are always doubts in life surrounding every decision.  Its just part of the deal.  The doubts around transitioning late in life are huge.  I know I am preaching to the choir with that statement here but doubts are also useful because they create caution to insure that you are making the best decision possible before you make it.

I am trying to reconcile my doubts so I know the day after the decision, making a public declaration of coming out,  that I made the right decision.  Before I get there I have another person and I simply need her to be a part of my life.  My doubts include protecting her and our relationship. 

I need as close as I can get to an absolute certainty before I make that final, irrevocable choice.

This thread would not exist if I was single.  I would have started transitioning last year.  I came to you all with a deep emotional crisis that I just couldn't resolve, hence the name of this thread. 

This painful crisis and the doubts it has created will not end until I step, irreversibly, forward, hopefully holding the hand of my wife. 

I know that's a lot to wish for.

I totally accept, as Kim and everyone ahead of me have shared, that even after that step, there will be other doubts and other crises.  That's life. 

This one is just a monster, the most soul-consuming in my life.

I am sorry about my continued ramblings.  I just can't stop the 24/7 thoughts and doubts.

Thanks for being my therapy.

Hugs,

Emma

Emma I think you have a pretty clear idea of what is important. It is so difficult when what you want might not mesh with the most important person in your life. Just so you don't feel alone, I know this feeling myself. It does tear you apart. I'm sorry you are dealing with this. No one on here can help you with this, well, other than to listen and be a sounding board. I can say that if transition is what you need, it is never too late. (I think we are of similar age.) I also can assure you that the feelings that drive you won't go away. In fact they are likely to get stronger as you open your mind to the thought of transition as a real thing. I think that if you really focus on understanding how your partner feels, and try to work on this together, it is your best chance of staying together. My partner and I are still together. We are definitely not the same as before, but we have used our friendship to overcome things that would have destroyed many partnerships. Some problems unfortunately don't have solutions that are 100% wins.
I think Kim and Liz can testify to the process being hard. They can also tell you that despite all that, the rewards can be amazing. I went to see my old boss today. He knew me as a pretty macho, many times angry automotive technician. We had our battles. lol Not in my wildest dreams could I have imagined talking to him, completely comfortable as a woman, as I did today. We spoke of old times with no hint of it being weird. As you think about things, keep in mind, amazing things are possible. At the bottom of the mountain it sure looks tall and impossible to climb, but one foot at a time will get you there. Be hopeful, be positive!
Moni

Mom, Kim's teasing me!  lol
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

]

Online LizK

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Re: Which hurts less
« Reply #559 on: March 14, 2019, 09:47:57 pm »

I think Kim and Liz can testify to the process being hard. They can also tell you that despite all that, the rewards can be amazing. ....Moni

Mom, Kim's teasing me!  lol

Moni is absolutely right...the process can be very hard but the rewards of still being with my soul mate are worth it...but isn't that the way with most things...anything worthwhile takes time and effort. I think you will be fine Emma. You seem to be very considerate of your spouse and are trying really hard to do everything you can...self doubt just comes with the territory.

Liz
Transition Begun 25 September 2015
HRT since 17 May 2016,
Fulltime from 8 March 2017,
GCS 4 December 2018
Voice Surgery 01 February 2019