Author Topic: voice lessons worth it???  (Read 1873 times)

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Offline KatieP

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #60 on: April 16, 2019, 12:01:17 am »

I spoke to a guy from a very male macho portion of my life today. On one hand, I wanted to have a good female voice. On the other, I kept thinking, what is he gonna think of me suddenly talking girly to him. It really makes me realize that my mental adjustment has a ways to go. My hope is with better confidence, this might take care of itself. What ya think?

What's he going to think? He's going to think: It's not the same person I knew. This woman is someone new, and I need to relate to her like I do with other women...  ;D

So, even with my orientation being completely lesbian, the more macho the guy, the more I find myself trying to be and sound feminine, and put almost flirty emphasis on certain words and phrases. Not trashy, I believe. But cute maybe. It has worked pretty well even with macho types. I was in South America for a couple months, and even with "Latin Males" that technique was quite disarming to them.

Kate

Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #61 on: April 16, 2019, 12:26:17 am »
For me, my more masculine voice triggers even more dysphoria, so one of my goals is for as perfect a feminine voice as I am able to achieve.  It's an internal thing for me and is just part of my perfectionism getting in my own way.

I have a fairly broad range for being AMAB.  I used to be able to hit higher notes than my cis ex-wife.  I couldn't quite reach the lowest of the low notes that Geoff Tate can hit if you know who that is, but I can still get pretty low.  The only time I can scream like Jamie Lee Curtis is if I'm in the middle of a sneeze.  Then, LOOK OUT!  Ned Flanders time.

Now, if only I could carry a tune. :(

When I detransitioned I briefly took on a job that I had to deal with the public in their own places of business.  I would get really confused and surprised looks with some of the booming bass sounds coming out of this face.  On the other hand, my purely natural voice that I guess I'd developed throughout my 29 years living as a male sound exactly like Ira Flatow.  When I hear recordings of my spoken voice, I can't tell the difference between him and myself.

I know I can be pretty convincing on the phone, but I'm still far from perfect and I still have tons of tells and it bothers me.

I get especially nervous and tense around friends and family that know my past.  I hardly even tried when I was around my dad and even now I have a difficult time not reverting around my mom.

If I can ever afford it, I have hopes that voice coaching will help me with some of these issues.  Voice coaching and MH therapy.

Oh.  Dancing.  You will never, never, never see me on a dance floor.  I'm far too OC.  Worse than the white people dancing to Bon Jovi the meme!

And to see (hear) just where I am now, here's a link:

https://soundcloud.com/daxix/voicelesson001/s-Z29Hz

I guess I need to download and use a voice analyzer of some sort.  I hope I'm able to improve on this someday.

You seem like you have a decent pitch. It was hard to tell because it was so quiet but I think the next step is to work on inflection.

Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #62 on: April 16, 2019, 12:29:46 am »
What's he going to think? He's going to think: It's not the same person I knew. This woman is someone new, and I need to relate to her like I do with other women...  ;D

So, even with my orientation being completely lesbian, the more macho the guy, the more I find myself trying to be and sound feminine, and put almost flirty emphasis on certain words and phrases. Not trashy, I believe. But cute maybe. It has worked pretty well even with macho types. I was in South America for a couple months, and even with "Latin Males" that technique was quite disarming to them.

Kate

I understand where she is coming from. I noticed when I was talking with my parents that I tended to revert my speech patterns. I had to consciously not and then once I didn’t it was natural and it did help my mom to stop misgendering me in public.

It wasn’t easy but I can say that the more practice that is put in the easier it is to not revert to make speech patterns.

Offline Tribble

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #63 on: April 16, 2019, 12:51:01 am »
Thank, you, Natalie!  I do need to adjust my levels, somehow.  As it is, I have my input gain almost all the way up on my mic and my lips practically touching it.  I'll see what I can do.


TBH, this is the first time I've heard my recorded feminine voice since 2003 and it was horrible back then.


I had some Internet issues a moment ago and had to call Comcast.   She had zero issues with my voice.  I seem to be most comfortable talking on the phone.   Mics scare me.

[EDIT] Oops, that was interface input #2 I was adjusting.  Figured out my level issues and I'll record something in a little bit.  I lost 'Net for a while so I'm just now able to do some stuff again.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 02:47:35 am by Tribble »
2003-2004 -- Gradual transition -- I didn't correct pronouns and people basically settled on the right ones on their own.
late 2004 -- Orchiectomy.
Late 2015 -- Stupidly saw the political climate and spurned on by my husband's request for a divorce I detransitioned.
2019 -- Rebuilding my wardrobe so I can retransition.  Turns out I cain't bury my true self, after all.  I call these last few years my failed experiment.  At least I found my true feelings were real.

Offline Tribble

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #64 on: April 16, 2019, 09:36:28 am »
Okay, the same clip but I've compressed the hell out of it.  Sorry. :(

At least we should be able to hear it now.

https://soundcloud.com/daxix/voicelesson02/s-GVd3i
2003-2004 -- Gradual transition -- I didn't correct pronouns and people basically settled on the right ones on their own.
late 2004 -- Orchiectomy.
Late 2015 -- Stupidly saw the political climate and spurned on by my husband's request for a divorce I detransitioned.
2019 -- Rebuilding my wardrobe so I can retransition.  Turns out I cain't bury my true self, after all.  I call these last few years my failed experiment.  At least I found my true feelings were real.

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #65 on: April 16, 2019, 10:21:09 am »
What's he going to think? He's going to think: It's not the same person I knew. This woman is someone new, and I need to relate to her like I do with other women...  ;D

So, even with my orientation being completely lesbian, the more macho the guy, the more I find myself trying to be and sound feminine, and put almost flirty emphasis on certain words and phrases. Not trashy, I believe. But cute maybe. It has worked pretty well even with macho types. I was in South America for a couple months, and even with "Latin Males" that technique was quite disarming to them.

Kate

Thanks Kate,
   I think guys from that period of time (the macho days) accept me on a logical basis. Emotionally, they still are adjusting to 'me.'  They don't see me everyday, just once in a while. It's great that you mentioned the flirty aspect because you may have hit on part of my problem. I think I am afraid that I will come off as flirty with my lack of control and confidence. I would die if my old boss thought I was flirting with him. Too weird for either of us. If my orientation hadn't taken it's shift, maybe I would dismiss this possibility easier. In general, I am interested in flirting with guys now. (Not ones I knew before though.) Funny, I put this off so long, now I can't wait to start tackling this. I am realizing how limiting I am socially due to my voice.
   It would be funny if you had a hidden camera and like an announcer from one of the old wild life shows. "Now watch as the transgender female tries to vocalize. The male of the species meanwhile, seems to be trying to figure out how to adjust to this radically new environment." I can see him relating to me on old terms, with old references. Then, wait, that doesn't quite fit any more. Now, what's the new nickname, oh crap almost said the old name. Wow, it must be pretty confusing. I just don't want, "Is she flirting with me, yuck!" lol Thanks Kate, you helped me figure out part of this. The mental part anyway. @KatieP
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

]

Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #66 on: April 16, 2019, 10:44:06 am »
Okay, the same clip but I've compressed the hell out of it.  Sorry. :(

At least we should be able to hear it now.

https://soundcloud.com/daxix/voicelesson02/s-GVd3i

Ok that is much easier to hear.  ;D

You have your pitch up but I’m not sure if it is falsetto.

What you need to do is work on resonance. You want the vibration to come from your throat and not your chest. Take two fingers and put them under your chin touching your neck. When you speak move the vibration up to your throat.

You also need to work on inflection. You’ll want to practice utilizing pitch for emphasis rather then loudness. This bit is a little harder but if you can master it it will be very effective.

Offline Tribble

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #67 on: April 16, 2019, 11:28:41 am »
Thanks Kate,
   I think guys from that period of time (the macho days) accept me on a logical basis. Emotionally, they still are adjusting to 'me.'  They don't see me everyday, just once in a while. It's great that you mentioned the flirty aspect because you may have hit on part of my problem. I think I am afraid that I will come off as flirty with my lack of control and confidence. I would die if my old boss thought I was flirting with him. Too weird for either of us. If my orientation hadn't taken it's shift, maybe I would dismiss this possibility easier. In general, I am interested in flirting with guys now. (Not ones I knew before though.) Funny, I put this off so long, now I can't wait to start tackling this. I am realizing how limiting I am socially due to my voice.
   It would be funny if you had a hidden camera and like an announcer from one of the old wild life shows. "Now watch as the transgender female tries to vocalize. The male of the species meanwhile, seems to be trying to figure out how to adjust to this radically new environment." I can see him relating to me on old terms, with old references. Then, wait, that doesn't quite fit any more. Now, what's the new nickname, oh crap almost said the old name. Wow, it must be pretty confusing. I just don't want, "Is she flirting with me, yuck!" lol Thanks Kate, you helped me figure out part of this. The mental part anyway. @KatieP

I can totally see it! :icon_lol:

Adjusting to people from your past, whether it's friends or family, can be really trying for all of us.

Ok that is much easier to hear.  ;D

You have your pitch up but I’m not sure if it is falsetto.

What you need to do is work on resonance. You want the vibration to come from your throat and not your chest. Take two fingers and put them under your chin touching your neck. When you speak move the vibration up to your throat.

You also need to work on inflection. You’ll want to practice utilizing pitch for emphasis rather then loudness. This bit is a little harder but if you can master it it will be very effective.

Thank you.  I definitely need to work on resonance, that's for sure.

What I will say is that I had to be kind of quiet when I was recording that as sound travels in this house like we had no walls at all and someone was sleeping (or trying to), so my voice wasn't quite my normal speaking voice.  No, it's not falsetto, but I do need to work on all of my ranges and volumes.

I've started to watch a bunch of YT videos and I'll be working on this constantly.

I was just visiting my mom and I was chatting up a storm because I'm hopped up on caffeine.  I told her I heard my recorded voice for the first time in 16 years and how I knew it was horrible!  She told me I didn't sound horrible at all while I was there and sounded pretty natural.  I know the window guy didn't think twice.  I guess I was really tense last night (microphones scare me! almost if not more than people from my past do!).  I'll try to get a new recording in my more natural tone and resonance, but I think I'll be starting a voice training diary for further posts.

I really appreciate your suggestions! :)
2003-2004 -- Gradual transition -- I didn't correct pronouns and people basically settled on the right ones on their own.
late 2004 -- Orchiectomy.
Late 2015 -- Stupidly saw the political climate and spurned on by my husband's request for a divorce I detransitioned.
2019 -- Rebuilding my wardrobe so I can retransition.  Turns out I cain't bury my true self, after all.  I call these last few years my failed experiment.  At least I found my true feelings were real.

Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #68 on: April 16, 2019, 12:07:03 pm »
No problem. Let me know if you want to practice and we can practice. At one point there was going to be a group of us doing a Skype thing but I believe that Susans Discord server has voice chat rooms. I’m happy to help whenever.

Offline Tribble

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #69 on: April 16, 2019, 12:27:31 pm »
I'd love it!
2003-2004 -- Gradual transition -- I didn't correct pronouns and people basically settled on the right ones on their own.
late 2004 -- Orchiectomy.
Late 2015 -- Stupidly saw the political climate and spurned on by my husband's request for a divorce I detransitioned.
2019 -- Rebuilding my wardrobe so I can retransition.  Turns out I cain't bury my true self, after all.  I call these last few years my failed experiment.  At least I found my true feelings were real.

Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #70 on: April 16, 2019, 12:51:50 pm »
I'd love it!

Alright. I used ally get off the phone with my boyfriend around 9:30PM CST. I can hop on discord and we can practice your voice.

Offline Linde

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #71 on: April 16, 2019, 02:22:42 pm »
Alright. I used ally get off the phone with my boyfriend around 9:30PM CST. I can hop on discord and we can practice your voice.
Shall we all meet on discord once in a while?  I just bought a decent microphone and still need to install it!

Than you can hear how a tired old lady sounds!
Feb 2019, bi-lateral orchiectomy
June 10, 2019 Not enough Y chr detected to be male






Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #72 on: April 16, 2019, 02:28:50 pm »
Shall we all meet on discord once in a while?  I just bought a decent microphone and still need to install it!

Than you can hear how a tired old lady sounds!

Sure!

Offline Tribble

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #73 on: April 16, 2019, 08:44:21 pm »
Alright. I used ally get off the phone with my boyfriend around 9:30PM CST. I can hop on discord and we can practice your voice.

I'm busy until a little after 10 pm CST tonight.  My husband and I watch The Rookie.

I would have replied sooner, but I went to bed almost right after replying.  I didn't sleep last night.
2003-2004 -- Gradual transition -- I didn't correct pronouns and people basically settled on the right ones on their own.
late 2004 -- Orchiectomy.
Late 2015 -- Stupidly saw the political climate and spurned on by my husband's request for a divorce I detransitioned.
2019 -- Rebuilding my wardrobe so I can retransition.  Turns out I cain't bury my true self, after all.  I call these last few years my failed experiment.  At least I found my true feelings were real.

Offline NatalieRene

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #74 on: April 16, 2019, 08:45:32 pm »
It’s cool I’ll hop in around 9:30CSt but I’ll be up until midnight.

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #75 on: May 06, 2019, 09:26:18 pm »
Kate, with electrolysis down to two last visits, I could deal with $100 a visit. $300 is another story. I hope to be as happy with it as you seem to be. Chrissy, if this person doesn't work out I'll try out the site you offered. I get the nerves thing, Tribble. I tense up my voice in some situations, with certain people.
Okay, time to face my fear. It's the weekend so I can't call, but I found their website and contact info and I think I'll request a consult. Now, Moni now, you coward!

I thought I would update on the voice therapy idea. I had my evaluation today. My insurance pays for it but not for therapy. My session was about an hour. I was surprised about how many questions involved the context of how voice fits into my life. She was quite pleasant. She has never worked with a trans client as far along in transition as I am. Toward the end, there was some vocal testing. She said she was surprised at my vocal range. She seemed to be excited about the possibility for improvement. It was very encouraging. She told me she would not sugarcoat anything. I told her I would not let anything go by that I didn't  understand. I appreciated her honesty. I am very aware how unaware I am about where my voice is every time I open my mouth. It is hard to be consistent like that. She is looking to raise my pitch some, but not to an unnatural level. I left there excited but still nervous that I may not be as capable as she thinks I am. I have my first session in two weeks. If it is noteworthy,I'll write about it.
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

]

Offline Linde

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #76 on: May 06, 2019, 09:55:47 pm »
I thought I would update on the voice therapy idea. I had my evaluation today. My insurance pays for it but not for therapy. My session was about an hour. I was surprised about how many questions involved the context of how voice fits into my life. She was quite pleasant. She has never worked with a trans client as far along in transition as I am. Toward the end, there was some vocal testing. She said she was surprised at my vocal range. She seemed to be excited about the possibility for improvement. It was very encouraging. She told me she would not sugarcoat anything. I told her I would not let anything go by that I didn't  understand. I appreciated her honesty. I am very aware how unaware I am about where my voice is every time I open my mouth. It is hard to be consistent like that. She is looking to raise my pitch some, but not to an unnatural level. I left there excited but still nervous that I may not be as capable as she thinks I am. I have my first session in two weeks. If it is noteworthy,I'll write about it.
I hope you get the results out of it you are looking for!
Some of us meet regularly on Skype and do some yapping, and we correct each other if we slip into the male side of voice conversation.
I think that helps a lot, and I can talk now for hours in a row with my female voice (the others can do this, too).  We don't talk about specific subjects, we just talk about anything w want to talk about or can think about.  This way there is no artificial skeleton applied to our talking, and it is like real life conversations.

You may want to see if you can establish a similar group, and get really going with using your voice, it is lots of fun, and after a little while it carries over into your daily life!

Try it, it is fun!
Linde
Feb 2019, bi-lateral orchiectomy
June 10, 2019 Not enough Y chr detected to be male






Offline Donica

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #77 on: May 12, 2019, 09:56:17 am »
I started voice therapy back in September last year. I feel I have made some progress but now I feel I have hit a wall. I have reached the point where my average pitch range is natural and around 200 hertz, give or take 10 hertz. I have also developed the muscle memory to keep my larynx naturally high.

I honestly didn't think I could achieve this but it is now difficult and uncomfortable to revert back to my old voice. However, I'm still not happy with the tone quality of my voice. My therapist tells my I'm my worst critic but I think she is just being nice. The pitch and intonation are fine but I can't stand what I hear in playback.

Learning to naturally keep my larynx high has helped a little with my tone quality but I feel I have hit a wall and have not made any progress the past two months. I have already talked to my therapist about this. I have one more appointment with her where I will thank her for her help but will not continue with therapy. Or perhaps I can do better with another therapist?

At this point I feel stuck. 
Rebirth June 9, 2017. Started HRT August 22, 2017. Came out June 16, 2017, Full time July 9, 2018.
Started FHR August 9, 2018, Started VFT September 19, 2018, Name and Gender change October 19. 2018.

Offline HappyMoni

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #78 on: May 12, 2019, 11:12:39 am »
Donica,
   It makes sense to switch it up. I do believe it is rare that anyone likes their own voice though. I go for my first session Wednesday.
If I ever offend you, let me know. It's not what I am about.
"Never let the dark kill your light!"  (SailorMars)
"Moni" is pronounced like "Bonnie"

HRT June 11, 2015. (new birthday) - FFS in late June 2016. (Dr. _____=Ugh!) - Full time June 18, 2016 (Yeah! finally) - GCS June 27, 2017. (McGinn=Yeah!) - Under Eye repair from FFS 8/17/17 - Nose surgery-November 20, 2017 (Dr. Papel=Yeah) - Hair Transplant on June 21, 2018 (Dr. Cooley-yeah) - Breast Augmentation on July 10, 2018 (Dr. Basner in Baltimore) - Removed bad scarring from FFS surgery near ears and hairline in August, 2018 (Dr. Papel) -Sept. 2018, starting a skin regiment on face with Retin A  April 2019 -repairing neck scar from FFS

]

Offline KatieP

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Re: voice lessons worth it???
« Reply #79 on: May 12, 2019, 11:08:35 pm »
I go for my first session Wednesday.

Wooo Hoooo!!!!

I hope the results (eventually) astound you!

 ;D

Kate

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