Author Topic: Philosophical question  (Read 390 times)

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Offline kyla10

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Philosophical question
« on: March 22, 2019, 10:05:35 pm »
Let's say you are growing up and you are depressed and anxious.  At times you've questioned your gender but you are young enough that you may grow out of it.  Now, you're older and still anxious and depressed and no longer question your gender (you just never think about it), but you decide to try HRT anyway - you find an informed consent doctor and get your prescription.  Now let's say HRT fixed your depression and anxiety.

Does the fact hormones fixed your mental health issues mean you are trans despite not questioning your gender?  What do you think?

Offline Battle Goddess

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2019, 10:12:20 pm »
Define "gender."

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Offline Sophiaprincess2019

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2019, 10:33:02 pm »
Does the fact hormones fixed your mental health issues mean you are trans despite not questioning your gender? 
While I cannot answer for anyone besides myself, I can offer you my small perspective. I never questioned my gender, I knew I was a woman my entire life because lifelong questions have been answered that no medical professional, clergy, dream catcher, crystal ball reader or other person on this planet could answer. I don't think you need to fit a definition to a specific form for it to have validity. If you are trans, then okay, you are trans: so be it! We all support and love you either way. One thing I never waste my time with is convincing others I'm trans. I have no interest in what others think in the first place. I'm a transgender woman and I'm okay being her.

One thing I'd like to note here: The fact that hormones "fixed" my mental state in and of it's self doesn't make me trans, it's more than that. There are several factors that make me trans, hormones being ONE of them.

great post.....

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Online Gertrude

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2019, 10:33:49 pm »
Maybe it’s something to explore with a therapist.


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Offline Kylo

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2019, 10:42:54 pm »
I know from experience that hormonal problems cause anxiety on their own, unrelated to trans issues. Especially having low counts of hormone.

Knowing that, I wouldn't be surprised if some people experience problems more related to hormonal deficits than to problems with gender. If you are trans one of the main symptoms/diagnostic criteria is a pervasive (chronic or long-term) issue with the birth gender. But only the individual can say whether the severity of that issue warrants further treatment.
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Offline Kirsteneklund7

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2019, 02:12:59 am »
Let's say you are growing up and you are depressed and anxious.  At times you've questioned your gender but you are young enough that you may grow out of it.  Now, you're older and still anxious and depressed and no longer question your gender (you just never think about it), but you decide to try HRT anyway - you find an informed consent doctor and get your prescription.  Now let's say HRT fixed your depression and anxiety.

Does the fact hormones fixed your mental health issues mean you are trans despite not questioning your gender?  What do you think?


 This is a very good question. Is there a tangible physical condition that requires cross-sex hormones to alleviate the condition?. If a human needs an Estrogen or an Androgen based hormone system, then the scientific method should be able to prove it or discover the mechanism.

  I really think there is more to this than patients narratives. it is well known and proven that Testosterone and also Estrogen  are powerful anti-depressants.

 I personally tried Testosterone to cure my depression and anxiety and it made things even worse. I tried Estrogen later on and the relief was rapid and very substantial. Coincidentally my whole life I had questioned my gender. Trials with Testosterone and Estrogen proved it for me.

  Kind regards, Kirsten.
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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2019, 07:09:11 am »
I would not say that you are (or aren't) trans.  However having questioned your gender in the past, having thought HRT would be a solution strongly enough to start by informed consent, and having experienced an improvement due to HRT are all pieces of evidence that would support the possibility that you are trans.  There is enough evidence there to justify talking to a therapist about it.
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Offline Kirsteneklund7

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2019, 07:28:00 am »
Also I found I could not get conclusive proof of transness from a psychiatrist and 2 gender therapists. All I found was HRT and expressing my feminine self relieved the anxiety and angst.

 When I am post transition I might know(lol).


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Offline pamelatransuk

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2019, 08:34:58 am »
Hello Kyla

Many of us question our gender in childhood; I always knew I was a girl despite having a boys body and being brought up as a boy. Some transpeople do not consider or "know" in childhood but realize later in life.

At whatever time of life we question our gender, we usually (or at least until recently) have considered it a necessity to hide/bury/suppress and this is in many ways successful temporarily but the problem only comes back later at a higher rate.

I think you may need to discuss your situation with a gender therapist. However my initial inclination is that you are likely trans as you have questioned previously and then have probably suppressed it but retained the knowledge that something was "wrong" and needed positive action and that was HRT and it proved beneficial.

I wish you resolution and happiness.

Hugs

Pamela   



Offline Devlyn

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2019, 09:31:21 am »
Let's say you are growing up and you are depressed and anxious.  At times you've questioned your gender but you are young enough that you may grow out of it.  Now, you're older and still anxious and depressed and no longer question your gender (you just never think about it), but you decide to try HRT anyway - you find an informed consent doctor and get your prescription.  Now let's say HRT fixed your depression and anxiety.

Does the fact hormones fixed your mental health issues mean you are trans despite not questioning your gender?  What do you think?

I don't think you would get hormones through an informed consent process without questioning your gender.



Offline JanePlain

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2019, 01:32:56 pm »

 This is a very good question. Is there a tangible physical condition that requires cross-sex hormones to alleviate the condition?. If a human needs an Estrogen or an Androgen based hormone system, then the scientific method should be able to prove it or discover the mechanism.

  I really think there is more to this than patients narratives. it is well known and proven that Testosterone and also Estrogen  are powerful anti-depressants.

 I personally tried Testosterone to cure my depression and anxiety and it made things even worse. I tried Estrogen later on and the relief was rapid and very substantial. Coincidentally my whole life I had questioned my gender. Trials with Testosterone and Estrogen proved it for me.

  Kind regards, Kirsten.

This has been my experience also.

Offline Maid Marion

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2019, 06:58:56 pm »
Autism can also cause anxiety and depression that isn't touched by anti-anxiety meds because they don't address the underlying causes.

Offline Kirsteneklund7

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2019, 07:05:23 pm »
Autism can also cause anxiety and depression that isn't touched by anti-anxiety meds because they don't address the underlying causes.
I wonder if HRT & gender expression can treat the anxiety and depression when autism is a factor?

 I know there is strong correlation between autism & gender dysphoria.

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Offline Rachel

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2019, 03:40:40 pm »
Kyla, it was my experience that there were profound changes when I started E and before my T was suppressed. As my T became suppressed and my E increased the mental and psychological changes became much better. Not until I fully transitioned and finally accepted who I am that I feel good about myself and my depression is almost gone.  I am and always was female.

You stated you questioned your gender then do not think about it. Then you started HRT and feel better.

So, have you suppressed your feelings? Do you want to express? Do you want to fully or partially medical transition? Do you dream of being female? What happens when you imagine yourself as female? Do you envy females for their curves and voice and hair? When you think about transitioning do you feel alive? Notice I did not mention anything about sex in the questions; they are all gender based questions.

Growing boobs and expressing can be very scary in as much as others finding out how you see yourself. However, if you could fully transition and you lived in an ideal world and were fully accepted do you think you would fill a void in your life? Would it make you happy?

Only you can figure out if you are trans. A good gender therapist can help you answer the questions. What you decide to do about it is up to you and there is no one way or right way to transition.
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Offline JanePlain

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #14 on: March 24, 2019, 11:24:22 pm »
I want to report my experience but I don't want anyone to think I'm speaking as an expert. 

I had the same youthful experience that many report with identifying female and this was before I had a clue that there were people who had SRS or took hormones.  So its a long time later and I'm years post having my orchi. I think this is how I dealt with physical dysphoria.  Its not a test but why else would anyone do that on purpose? Its balls this balls that you need a pair. Get big ones.  Grow a pair blah blah blah. Its just too bad this didn't happen when I was 18 so you know where I stand.  Minus them and good riddance.

So without them my hormones are what I take externally.  My endo gave me license to Titrate the amounts of estrogen and testosterone I take within some parameters. I tried the male mix (High Testosterone / low estrogen) thinking maybe this would "fix" me. I had so much anxiety it made me non-functional. The other way around it made me feel "human"  Is that a true test? On a purely practical matter I wonder if it makes any difference?

I know that stopping at this point is going to sound strange.  Maybe its cowardly.  You ladies who are making it happen are amazing. Where do you get the moxie ("Balls") to go full speed ahead / where's Dr Bowers / lets get this done level action?  You ladies rock!

Practically speaking  I would need a bus load of money to even attempt to pass. Plus I have every relationship type of problem imaginable.  I am blissfully happy feeling functional and long done handling the testicular dysphoria.

Side note - I'm done with hospitals if I can avoid it and surgery and I?  Really bad (and scary) stuff has happened when I go under the knife.

Offline pamelatransuk

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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2019, 05:57:32 am »

So, have you suppressed your feelings? Do you want to express? Do you want to fully or partially medical transition? Do you dream of being female? What happens when you imagine yourself as female? Do you envy females for their curves and voice and hair? When you think about transitioning do you feel alive? Notice I did not mention anything about sex in the questions; they are all gender based questions.

Growing boobs and expressing can be very scary in as much as others finding out how you see yourself. However, if you could fully transition and you lived in an ideal world and were fully accepted do you think you would fill a void in your life? Would it make you happy?

Only you can figure out if you are trans. A good gender therapist can help you answer the questions. What you decide to do about it is up to you and there is no one way or right way to transition.

Hello again Rachel

You describe what so many of us experience before we decide to take positive action, so perfectly.

Your paragraphs above cover everything so well and with accuracy and much more detail than my reply had.

I hope both Kyla and so many others reading, take note and heed your advice which obviously comes from both experience and wisdom.

Thank you truly.

Hugs

Pamela  xx



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Re: Philosophical question
« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2019, 07:41:47 pm »
A philosophical question, you say. Then I'll give it a philosophical answer. Well... I've questioned my gender my entire life, or at least since I was in pre-school. I felt that "girl" was the last thing I could ever be, gender-wise. I though for sure I was a guy in my teen years and transitioned as a young adult. I was comfortable and felt empowered as a man. Then ten years later it turned out I was a cis woman all along.

Being on testosterone helped me in the past but ever since I went off it 6 months ago, I've been loving estrogen. Gender aside, both hormones have been both amazing and disastrous for me personally. Especially for my mood. Neither cured me from any of my actual issues. But figuring out my truth set me on the right track.

So now I'm detransitioning and slightly miserable about that, but I really love being a woman, for the first time ever in my life.

If you ask: can a person be trans without having questioned their gender? I am simply bouncing it back by asking: can a person be cis despite having always questioned their gender?

My personal experience answers "yes" to my own question, but I cannot answer yours. However I can imply that it might be just as possible, considering our scenarios are completely reverse. But then being cis is not the complete reverse to being trans, and there's always more to both than the gender aspect. There is also a certain amount of overlap, which most people seem to either overlook or be unaware of.

I think a more important question is: what do you want with your life? instead of just looking at the two boxes cis and trans. I had to do a lot of deep digging through my mind to find my answers. I'm suggesting you do too.
Mar. 2009 - came out as ftm
Nov. 2009 - changed my name to John
Mar. 2010 - diagnosed with GID
Aug. 2010 - started T, then stopped after 1 year
Aug. 2013 - started T again, kept taking it since
Mar. 2014 - top surgery
Dec. 2014 - legal gender marker changed to male
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Jul. 2018 - came out as cis woman and began detransition
Sep. 2018 - stopped taking T and changed my name to Laura
Oct. 2018 - got new ID-card

Medical Detransition plans: breast reconstruction surgery, change legal gender back to female, stay off T.

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