Author Topic: Trans-sexuality and the goddess  (Read 14318 times)

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Offline Illuminess

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Re: Trans-sexuality and the goddess
« Reply #40 on: November 15, 2014, 01:00:15 pm »
Yeah, Gardner certainly was. I can't imagine he and Crowley were the greatest of friends.
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Offline AbbyKat

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Re: Trans-sexuality and the goddess
« Reply #41 on: January 11, 2015, 09:00:39 pm »
I am a Wicca, and I was transsexual. As a former member of the LDS church, and as a visitor of different services, I think of being able to permit to myself a judgment.
In most Christian churches transsexual people (or other TG) aren't seen with pleasure, and are patient at best ".
How, however, does it look to my religion which is a goddess's religion? Are transsexual people also condemned here? How was it in ancient times? And how does the goddess see tg people?
What do you mean?
I know the answer, but I would hear with pleasure your opinion in addition.

I know this is a bit of an older topic but I wanted to chime in.  To me, it's simple.  Nearly every Earth-based religion through history has had their "two-spirit" archetype that is often seen as holy.  If given the science and medical means we have today back then, they would most likely have ended up transitioning.

The male/female balance in Wicca is important which is why many backwards-thinking Wiccans (etc) feel a transgender person is an "affront" to nature.  I view it as exactly the opposite.  Making that journey from a place you do not belong into a place you do is an allegory told many times throughout several goddess myths.  I see the transition as a very divine one that is completing a person, bringing them back home to where they belong.  Being born with the wrong equipment can be viewed as a test and suppressing it is more of an affront to the gods than expressing it.

If the goddess can transition and coexist with three selves and the god can simultaneously be his own father and child... I'm pretty sure it's okay for a person to transition.  It seems perfectly in line.

Besides, my wife has always called me her "sexy man witch" but I know she thinks it's odd that I'm wearing a dude-suit.  Hopefully, when I open up to her, she'll take that as a plus. ;D

Offline Illuminess

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Re: Trans-sexuality and the goddess
« Reply #42 on: January 11, 2015, 09:27:16 pm »
Making that journey from a place you do not belong into a place you do is an allegory told many times throughout several goddess myths.  I see the transition as a very divine one that is completing a person, bringing them back home to where they belong.  Being born with the wrong equipment can be viewed as a test and suppressing it is more of an affront to the gods than expressing it.

If the goddess can transition and coexist with three selves and the god can simultaneously be his own father and child... I'm pretty sure it's okay for a person to transition.  It seems perfectly in line.

I love this perspective, and it's one that I share. The Goddess has been suppressed for so long, and so she is returning, seeping in through the cracks. I wouldn't be surprised that a large majority of transgender people are in tune with ancient religion and esoteric philosophy.
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AnnMarie2017

Re: Trans-sexuality and the goddess
« Reply #43 on: October 13, 2017, 02:32:04 am »
I'm older, new to Susan's Place, and only out to myself for about six months. My spirituality is an important part of my life, so naturally how my gender situation relates to that is important as well. It's funny, but until I started reading the posts in this topic it never occurred to me that my experience of coming out to myself could have been much more difficult spiritually if it hadn't happened the way it did. My natural inclination would have been to have been very inhibited about "invading sacred womanspace." The Goddess led me here so gently.

I've embraced Paganism in some form or fashion since 1990. I consider myself Wiccan, although many people wouldn't; it was my first approach to giving some form to my Pagan spirituality, and my heart remains there. I think this is chiefly due to Scott Cunningham, to whom I will always be grateful. I think his book for the solitary practitioner is one of the best books ever published about this religion.

Despite the duotheism of Wicca, the God has never been an important part of my spiritual practice. I'm not sure why. I was a Christian for many years; but Christianity isn't particularly monotheistic ;) from my point of view. I do acknowledge him, but don't relate to him. The Goddess I know as Tana, who I first learned about in Raven Grimassi's book on Italian Witchcraft. She has been my goddess for about 20 years.

I've known since early adulthood that I was, as a woman I knew in college put it, "really in touch with my feminine side." A good friend in the Craft, who never breathed a hint of this to me when he was alive, told his wife in very emphatic terms that I was gay; she told me this after he died. And, when I was married, my wife and I would go for ritual to the house of a gay male couple, who once told me that I was the "gayest straight man" they had ever met; and they were very puzzled over it.

Prior to coming out to myself, I don't remember ever experiencing gender dysphoria as gender dysphoria. (I have experienced it since; it was terrifying.) I've since realized that it was there, and was extremely debilitating, but that it masqueraded as something else. However, that being said, about 10 years ago I had a very intense experience of gender euphoria, though I didn't know that's what it was at the time. It was about this time that I admitted to myself that I would rather have been born female. I shared most, if not all, of this with my wife; and, without consulting me, she shared it with one of her friends, a transman. He suggested to her that I might be transgender, and she relayed the suggestion to me. I laughed it off. Not me. No, not me.

About a year after my divorce, I decided I wanted to explore this feminine side of mine, with the idea that bringing it to the surface and integrating it with the rest of my personality would make me a more whole, more complete person. Naturally, with a project like this, I asked Tana for her help; and she spoke to me -- not audibly (she's never done that) but in my mind. She said, "Are you sure? Because once done, it can't be undone." This told me that the consequences would be significant; but I really didn't see how that changed anything. Becoming a more complete person is why we're here in the first place, and I couldn't turn away from that. So, I said Yes.

I think it was a day or two later that I had a very strange experience. I was walking from my bedroom to the living room when I experienced a sort of disorientation; I lost my balance, a little. It quickly passed; but it was so unusual that I wondered if it might have had a spiritual cause. There were no follow-up consequences, however, and I set it aside.

Over the next days and weeks, I started doing things that I associated with femininity, or that helped me disassociate from my masculinity. Along with that, I began looking on the internet for material in this area that might be of help to me. Although I ran into transgender material, I did not consider it to be a possibility for me; indeed, while I believed at the time that the phenomenon was real, I believed that transitioning was, in principle, the wrong answer. I believed that we incarnate as we do intentionally, and I couldn't see why someone would intentionally incarnate in the wrong body; therefore, changing it surgically must be missing the point somehow.

Well, you can guess what happened from there. It wasn't too long before I began asking myself if I were transgender myself; and, the longer this went on, the more I hoped that I was. I even reached the point where, despite my thoughts on transitioning, I decided that, if I did find out I was a woman, I was going all the way. :) I just couldn't not do it.

When I reached the tentative conclusion that I was trans, I found a gender therapist (on the "Psychology Today" website) and sent her an email inquiry. I know how we can rationalize ourselves into getting what we want, and I wanted an informed, objective opinion. She answered my email and scheduled an introductory phone call. I had no idea how long a phone call this would be. How do you convey an accurate picture of yourself and your experiences relevant to your issue, and do it briefly? I spent some time trying to prepare for this; and, on the morning of the phone call, I was sitting in the parking lot of a grocery store, rehearsing the synopsis I was going to give her, when I had an epiphany. I suddenly just knew. "I'm a woman," I said out loud. "I'm a woman." And the next thing I knew, my rational mind rebelled against this. "How can this be? How can this be?" It was completely incongruous; yet, I knew it was true.

I see the gentle hand of the Lady all over this. The process for me was so sweet, so gentle; so much could have gone wrong or been much more difficult for me.

I don't know why my life has been as it has been. I do believe that things happen for a reason, that there is purpose and design in at least the major courses of our lives. I can't imagine why I've lived most of my life thinking I was male, only half-alive with my true self buried. But I don't indulge in resentment, probably because I'm so full of joy now. My heart is so full.

I hope it's obvious that, despite the length of this post about my coming out to myself, it's really a post about her, about the Lady. Other than the fact of our relationship itself, this is the greatest gift she has ever given me, the gift of my true self. I can't imagine a greater one, or more loving.



Offline MelissaPink

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Re: Trans-sexuality and the goddess
« Reply #44 on: November 12, 2017, 10:44:20 am »
I'm older, new to Susan's Place, and only out to myself for about six months. My spirituality is an important part of my life, so naturally how my gender situation relates to that is important as well. It's funny, but until I started reading the posts in this topic it never occurred to me that my experience of coming out to myself could have been much more difficult spiritually if it hadn't happened the way it did. My natural inclination would have been to have been very inhibited about "invading sacred womanspace." The Goddess led me here so gently.

I've embraced Paganism in some form or fashion since 1990. I consider myself Wiccan, although many people wouldn't; it was my first approach to giving some form to my Pagan spirituality, and my heart remains there. I think this is chiefly due to Scott Cunningham, to whom I will always be grateful. I think his book for the solitary practitioner is one of the best books ever published about this religion.

Despite the duotheism of Wicca, the God has never been an important part of my spiritual practice. I'm not sure why. I was a Christian for many years; but Christianity isn't particularly monotheistic ;) from my point of view. I do acknowledge him, but don't relate to him. The Goddess I know as Tana, who I first learned about in Raven Grimassi's book on Italian Witchcraft. She has been my goddess for about 20 years.

I've known since early adulthood that I was, as a woman I knew in college put it, "really in touch with my feminine side." A good friend in the Craft, who never breathed a hint of this to me when he was alive, told his wife in very emphatic terms that I was gay; she told me this after he died. And, when I was married, my wife and I would go for ritual to the house of a gay male couple, who once told me that I was the "gayest straight man" they had ever met; and they were very puzzled over it.

Prior to coming out to myself, I don't remember ever experiencing gender dysphoria as gender dysphoria. (I have experienced it since; it was terrifying.) I've since realized that it was there, and was extremely debilitating, but that it masqueraded as something else. However, that being said, about 10 years ago I had a very intense experience of gender euphoria, though I didn't know that's what it was at the time. It was about this time that I admitted to myself that I would rather have been born female. I shared most, if not all, of this with my wife; and, without consulting me, she shared it with one of her friends, a transman. He suggested to her that I might be transgender, and she relayed the suggestion to me. I laughed it off. Not me. No, not me.

About a year after my divorce, I decided I wanted to explore this feminine side of mine, with the idea that bringing it to the surface and integrating it with the rest of my personality would make me a more whole, more complete person. Naturally, with a project like this, I asked Tana for her help; and she spoke to me -- not audibly (she's never done that) but in my mind. She said, "Are you sure? Because once done, it can't be undone." This told me that the consequences would be significant; but I really didn't see how that changed anything. Becoming a more complete person is why we're here in the first place, and I couldn't turn away from that. So, I said Yes.

I think it was a day or two later that I had a very strange experience. I was walking from my bedroom to the living room when I experienced a sort of disorientation; I lost my balance, a little. It quickly passed; but it was so unusual that I wondered if it might have had a spiritual cause. There were no follow-up consequences, however, and I set it aside.

Over the next days and weeks, I started doing things that I associated with femininity, or that helped me disassociate from my masculinity. Along with that, I began looking on the internet for material in this area that might be of help to me. Although I ran into transgender material, I did not consider it to be a possibility for me; indeed, while I believed at the time that the phenomenon was real, I believed that transitioning was, in principle, the wrong answer. I believed that we incarnate as we do intentionally, and I couldn't see why someone would intentionally incarnate in the wrong body; therefore, changing it surgically must be missing the point somehow.

Well, you can guess what happened from there. It wasn't too long before I began asking myself if I were transgender myself; and, the longer this went on, the more I hoped that I was. I even reached the point where, despite my thoughts on transitioning, I decided that, if I did find out I was a woman, I was going all the way. :) I just couldn't not do it.

When I reached the tentative conclusion that I was trans, I found a gender therapist (on the "Psychology Today" website) and sent her an email inquiry. I know how we can rationalize ourselves into getting what we want, and I wanted an informed, objective opinion. She answered my email and scheduled an introductory phone call. I had no idea how long a phone call this would be. How do you convey an accurate picture of yourself and your experiences relevant to your issue, and do it briefly? I spent some time trying to prepare for this; and, on the morning of the phone call, I was sitting in the parking lot of a grocery store, rehearsing the synopsis I was going to give her, when I had an epiphany. I suddenly just knew. "I'm a woman," I said out loud. "I'm a woman." And the next thing I knew, my rational mind rebelled against this. "How can this be? How can this be?" It was completely incongruous; yet, I knew it was true.

I see the gentle hand of the Lady all over this. The process for me was so sweet, so gentle; so much could have gone wrong or been much more difficult for me.

I don't know why my life has been as it has been. I do believe that things happen for a reason, that there is purpose and design in at least the major courses of our lives. I can't imagine why I've lived most of my life thinking I was male, only half-alive with my true self buried. But I don't indulge in resentment, probably because I'm so full of joy now. My heart is so full.

I hope it's obvious that, despite the length of this post about my coming out to myself, it's really a post about her, about the Lady. Other than the fact of our relationship itself, this is the greatest gift she has ever given me, the gift of my true self. I can't imagine a greater one, or more loving.

Good morning Ann Marie,
I readily identify with nearly everything that you've written in your post.  My entire life has been a spiritual journey where I have asked many questions about our purpose on Earth and where I fit into that equation.  In 1975 I read an article about Gerald Gardner in the "Village Voice" and I was immediately connected to Wicca.  It wasn't easy to find books on the topic in a small town in Connecticut but I managed to find a few in a local used book store.  I ended up straying from Wicca when I enlisted in the Navy but continued to explore spirituality with regarding to Christianity, Universal Unitarianism, Zen Buddhism, Taoism and Native American shamanism.   I read Margo Adler's "Drawing Down the Moon" about the same time that I was coming to terms with my gender dysphoria.  I've determined for me that being a transgender and Wiccan are not exclusive because they are very significant components of who I am.  In that regard for me the god and goddess are also not mutually exclusive for they compliment one another in my spiritual universe.  Perhaps this is my female psyche attempting to rationalize the fact that I was born in a man's body?  Rather than fighting all that I attempt to embrace it. 

Thanks again for your post and look forward to hearing more of your thoughts on this topic.   As a side note, I believe that Scott Cunningham's "Wicca: A Guide For the Solitary Practitioner" is a superb book for anyone interested in our path.

Melissa
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Offline CincySixx

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Re: Trans-sexuality and the goddess
« Reply #45 on: March 05, 2018, 03:13:02 am »
I know this is an old topic...
I've been wiccan since 2007.
Neo pagans that claim to be wiccan but adopt other dieties
From other pagan faiths can irritate me but i try to be open...
Afterall we have different experiences. <3

In traditional wicca you have a:
Trinity Goddess
Hunter God
But oddly enough you do have The One.
A promordial diety in a way.
The wiccan bilaws do not go against transexuality.
The wiccan bilaws dont even mention un natural things being evil.
Witch craft in its essence manipulates the natural world.
Medicine or Potions created through natural alchemy cure sicknesses,
But they are >created<
Just like hrt and many paths we choose it may be "un natural"
But like a priestess healing her flock it was derived from many natural things at some point.
The hunter god, The goddess, and the one also clearly represent how man and woman are separate
And yet one. Created from a "source" a "combination"
So no i do not believe transexuality conflicts with traditional wicca.
I do respect your opinion though and we could go on to debate the evolution
Of witchcraft, science, and more.

But much love and many joys upon you.
Blessed be.
So mote it be.

<3
Cincy

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💛"We are all like one winged angels, it is only
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