This restroom design is the most practical and acceptable for everybody.
Safe & Practical Restroom Design (https://qz.com/933704/how-to-design-transgender-friendly-bathrooms-that-make-people-of-all-genders-feel-safe/)
qz/by Lisa Selin Davis 03/16/2017
This is wonderful design.
One of the really nice parts about transitioning is no longer having to go into a bathroom used by men who pee on the seat, the commode and the floor in front of the commode and even across the floor. I hate multi-gender bathrooms as a solution. Women's Rooms are also a nice way to get away from male energy for a few minutes. . .
I went to the beach in SoCal a few days ago, and all the bathrooms at the beaches were labeled ALL GENDER. Now, these bathrooms have always been unisex bathrooms, but they had put up new signs that were specifically All Gender. It's nice to know some places are being supportive and inclusive.
Quote from: Gail20 on April 28, 2017, 10:45:13 AM
One of the really nice parts about transitioning is no longer having to go into a bathroom used by men who pee on the seat, the commode and the floor in front of the commode and even across the floor. I hate multi-gender bathrooms as a solution. Women's Rooms are also a nice way to get away from male energy for a few minutes. . .
I tend to agree with you. I hate to have to share a toilet with men...they don't sit to pee so it inherently gets soiled.
Quote from: ainsley on April 28, 2017, 11:26:46 AM
I tend to agree with you. I hate to have to share a toilet with men...they don't sit to pee so it inherently gets soiled.
I sit to pee all the time and find the limited number of stalls in the men's room to be inconvenient. Wish I could use the women's room.
It has amazed me how much nicer Women's are then men's, less broken doors, haven't seen any graffiti yet and just generally cleaner and better maintained.
I hate having to still use the men's at work and I don't think shared facilities work because men just vandalise and soil everything.
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Quote from: Tammy Jade on June 21, 2017, 09:30:54 PM
It has amazed me how much nicer Women's are then men's, less broken doors, haven't seen any graffiti yet and just generally cleaner and better maintained.
I hate having to still use the men's at work and I don't think shared facilities work because men just vandalise and soil everything.
I've seen really messy ladies rooms (really-really messy), but maybe we keep ourselves to a higher standards? At least we do not sprinkle all over ;)
Quote from: elkie-t on June 21, 2017, 11:44:28 PM
I've seen really messy ladies rooms (really-really messy), but maybe we keep ourselves to a higher standards? At least we do not sprinkle all over ;)
Well I hate to think what the men's would have been like then :P
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I agree with everything that was said. I just don't understand us Americans obstinance to unisex bathrooms. I was in Europe in 1998-2002 and there are unisex rooms all over and neither gender cared that you shared it with the other. I don't see the big deal. Just allow common bathrooms. I guess I wasn't as sheltered as I think.
it depends where in Europe, they have a unisex bathroom culture in northern European such. as Sweden, Denmark, Germany but not at all in Italy and Spain. In France it's in between...
I would not agree on Germany. Pretty much all public places, restaurants and bars have gender separated bathrooms.
The population is very accepting which is good, the laws in Germany are somewhat antiquated ( took forever to finally allow same sex marriage and there seems to be some movement on the TSG which regulates name / gender change procedures for transgender - will be a few more years tough before it becomes easier)
Quote from: vegantranswoman on August 22, 2017, 04:37:36 AM
it depends where in Europe, they have a unisex bathroom culture in northern European such. as Sweden, Denmark, Germany but not at all in Italy and Spain. In France it's in between...
To be totally honest I wish all public restrooms were totally private.
I like others I know have been forced to use public restrooms and to me they are extremely uncomfortable. I have no problems using the ladies' room but... To be completely honest I would rather squat outside in the grass hidden in the bushes or behind a tree with my boyfriend keeping a lookout.
Quote from: elkie-t on June 21, 2017, 11:44:28 PM
I've seen really messy ladies rooms (really-really messy), but maybe we keep ourselves to a higher standards? At least we do not sprinkle all over ;)
One phrase: Squat and hover.
It honestly depends on the location. Highway rest stops are next level disgusting I think for both men and women... and to be honest, since I haven't been in a men's room in awhile... I think the women's restrooms are worse. Bars are another typically bad location...
Quote from: Gail20 on April 28, 2017, 10:45:13 AM
One of the really nice parts about transitioning is no longer having to go into a bathroom used by men who pee on the seat, . . .
Sorry, but I have to disagree there, I've seen women's bathrooms with pee all over the seat.
Quote from: LanaR on November 04, 2017, 07:21:02 PM
Sorry, but I have to disagree there, I've seen women's bathrooms with pee all over the seat.
Yeah me too. Some are just as disgusting as men's restrooms. I have used both and on a daily basis.
LGBT? Really? I have seen so many "gloryholes" in men's rooms that it ain't even funny. I feel more comfortable in women's restrooms though but have seen holes between the stalls there too. ??? I have always shaved my legs even from puberty and have small boobs so it was always awkward in the Men's room. Kind of like I didn't belong. :-\ Driving trucks I have to wear a bra because my boobs will get so sore from the bouncing on rough roads with heavy loads and that kind of leaves an outline on your blouse or t shirt or tank.
I hate public restrooms though. Having hairless legs and having to use the restroom at 3 AM while someone is "horny" next to you using it really sux when they try to corner you. Rest areas just stay away from because those are worst at night. OMG so many people instead of knocking on the stall door peek between the spaces. If they find you attractive then... Be careful.
I hate public restrooms. On one hand we may be a target and on the other we may be a trans target. So I always try to use private restrooms instead of public with the stalls. It is just me though. I mean I do use the ladies' restroom now but that hasn't always been the case. :P
Quote from: Gail20 on April 28, 2017, 10:45:13 AM
Women's Rooms are also a nice way to get away from male energy for a few minutes. . .
Many years ago in Karasburg, in what is now Namibia, I went through a door displaying the Gents sign. Between the door and the actual toilets was a comfy lounge. Men seem to feel the same way about female energy.
Quote from: LanaR on November 04, 2017, 07:21:02 PM
Sorry, but I have to disagree there, I've seen women's bathrooms with pee all over the seat.
My mother travelled everywhere with antibacterial wipes and paper toilet seat covers. She didn't like sitting on seats touched by other women's grubby bums.
Its an interesting concept, would only go in new buildings though. No one would spend to retrofit
I've been in plenty of women's rooms that use that same design. All that would be required to make it dual gender would be to change the sign outside. I've actually used one that was dual gender, but it was at a transgender medicine conference at a University. I suspect that they did just switch the sign for the meeting because it did not match the others.
The difficulty is that many women are going to be leery of going into a room with only a single exit, no windows and men present. This is often cast as the problem with transgender people using the restroom associated with their gender identity. I can endorse the desire for safe space as I was once cornered/threatened in a bathroom (I was presenting androgynous/femme but had not yet switched to the Ladies' Room. I did immediately thereafter.), although I would quickly add that:
1) Transmen are men.
2) Transwomen are women.
3) Neither are inherently predatory or dangerous.
4) Most of the people freaking out in the bathroom debate seem to be men.
Quote from: rmaddy on November 30, 2017, 10:50:04 PM
...
4) Most of the people freaking out in the bathroom debate seem to be men.
I'm sorry that you were intimidated in a male rest room.
I haven't seen any statistics or enough news stories to agree with your statement that most of the people "freaking out" are men. Most politicians are men, so most speakers in public debates are probably going to be men. Also, the Snopes Dot Com website has identified a number of fake news stories about male police or security guards overreacting when trans women use female facilities. Perhaps that has caused a perception that it is mostly males who object.
There are plenty of cis women who are unhappy when they learn that a trans woman is using their facilities, as can be found by Googling
"Morganna Snow, 24, was banned from using the women's loo after up to 20 clubbers reportedly said they were 'uncomfortable' sharing the facilities with her"
and
"Female guard accused of hate crime after forcing transgender woman out of ladies' lavatory".
People are always going to see us by what we have between our legs instead of between our ears. That kind of tells me where their minds are. ;)
Even posing as a guy sometimes and using the men's room a while back, there were plenty of Glory holes between the stalls and I have been hit on and one time almost raped in a rest area in the middle of the night.
The whole debate is kind of crazy. One side claims that I am a freak yet would probably get raped in the middle of the night while wearing makeup, heels and hair. So why can't I sit and pee again while wearing a skirt, heels and makeup? Well I can most times if not all. Even sitting to pee some woman always seemed to walk in and sit in the stall next to me and commence with grunting. ::) Truck drivers ya' know? I do not poop in public. Driving I would shower everyday and then do that business in private.
As a trans woman people should be able to used the restroom of their choice but I would be kind of scared of someone next to me standing to pee. Are they MTF in a Ladies' room? Even at home I sit to pee. I hate when guys splash and yes when I was younger even have used men's rooms and standing??? Urine is so corrosive and I will splash. :embarrassed:
But I will say to all you girls while presenting use the ladies' room or pee outside behind a tree. If you are dressed and use a the men's room then you are either inviting trouble or violation. But even with me don't want to use the ladies' room dressed as a guy and vice versa. Hell as a guy and looking feminine you may even face crap or potential rape. And vice versa if you are a FTM in the men's room so get one of those thingies that will allow you to pee standing up. Or sit and grunt at least for a few minutes.
Why do Cis people think that we are sexual deviants? I have never hurt a child and have never raped anyone. Yet a child molester can use the proper restroom. Gays too because they are attracted to the same genitals they have. A vagina holds no special interest for me. :embarrassed: So when I use the ladies' room all the women are safe. ::)
Jesus Christ the space between the door and the stalls? Does anyone know how many people look through those tiny slits? Instead of knocking and asking if the stall is occupied most people both men and women seem to want to look ::). But now this has mostly been truck stops so take what I said for what it is. But it gets kind of annoying if a man, woman, Trans or cis. I really try not to use public restrooms though.
I had to pee real bad today and worked up the nerve to use the 'Ladies' for the first time! But I couldn't find it so I asked where it was, He sent me to the Unisex. It was close[whew!] so I went there, maybe next time! The bad part was it was nasty, toilet paper every where and piss on the seat :(. I have a bad left leg and must sit, my wet discovery sucked... I wish women that 'hover' would learn to aim to.
I have seen many places in different parts of Europe with unisex toilets and common washing up area, but ran into it for the first time here in Canada at a restaurant in Toronto last week while I was visiting. I made a point of asking for the manager and told him how happy I was! He told me this is the future and they are proud to accommodate all guests.
As for women's toilets I have found the rooms themselves to usually be much nicer but the toilets to be sometimes worse regardless of country. Reminds me in the past talking to waitresses who said the same thing in bars/pubs. Makes you wonder what these people live like at home.
Quote from: Gail20 on April 28, 2017, 10:45:13 AM
One of the really nice parts about transitioning is no longer having to go into a bathroom used by men who pee on the seat, the commode and the floor in front of the commode and even across the floor. I hate multi-gender bathrooms as a solution. Women's Rooms are also a nice way to get away from male energy for a few minutes. . .
Women's rooms are not much different. A lot of women stand to pee over the seat because they don't want to sit on it. I always carry a small can of Lysol in my purse to disinfect the seat.
This is one of the things I don't look forward to if I transition. I never realized there were "glory holes." Now I know to look out for them. What an informative thread! Thanks everyone?
Also, that all gender design looks pretty good to me.
I have been in men's rooms when cis women presenting as women have entered and used one of the stalls and washed at the sink afterwards. They were not approached or even touched and were never in any danger. Why can't the same be true for a cis male using the female restroom?
Better than that, why can't we just have all multi-user unisex public restrooms with private stalls and a common sink area?
That makes perfect sense to me. I think it's because of prejudiced people who want to be able to continue to discriminate under the guise of "safety."
I still think that this is the way to go.
https://qz.com/933704/how-to-design-transgender-friendly-bathrooms-that-make-people-of-all-genders-feel-safe/
Ooh, I like the design in that article.
Regular public restrooms are terrible. Why would I want to do my business in a place where everyone can see and hear everything I do?
The thing you are forgetting...money. Redesigning and adding new bathrooms costs money. People can't just flip a switch and magically generate bathrooms so bigots and transwomen can feel more comfortable.
Quote from: Angelic on August 31, 2018, 09:03:04 AM
The thing you are forgetting...money. Redesigning and adding new bathrooms costs money. People can't just flip a switch and magically generate bathrooms so bigots and transwomen can feel more comfortable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w38cLPaZ7nA
Haha, I like that clip.
That said, I do like most of the gender neutral bathroom designs I've seen, not because they're gender neutral, but because they are designed with privacy in mind. If any of the public spaces I use installed bathrooms like that, I'd be very happy.
I live in a country where tgs are accepted by society. However, no female or passable tg, I know, wishes to have a unisex restroom facilities. As tgs who have used male facilities and female facilities, we know that there is a great difference in restroom behavior between male and female. Women so often use the bathroom as a social gathering place and a place to just be away from agressive men and those leering looks. So many females just enter restrooms to relax and get away from bothersome men.
Its a big NO from me. I am so glad we do not even need to initiate this debate here.
I don't know what country you're from, but it sounds like transgender people are accepted enough there that no one questions the right for transgender people to use the restroom of their true gender, in which case gender-neutral restrooms aren't really necessary or a notable improvement.
In the U.S, it's relatively likely that a female restroom patron will complain that there's a "man" in her restroom if she sees a mannish-looking woman, and will confront them about it or get the local security involved. This happens to both transgender and cisgender women. If that happens, there's not really a way for the accused individual to prove that they're a woman, rendering the whole idea of gendered restrooms pretty pointless since it's impossible to tell with certainty what gender someone is without some sort of incredibly invasive and inappropriate check.
Gendered restrooms only work when practically 100% of the population voluntarily go along with them, and don't complain about about the sorts of other people who choose to use the same restroom they do. Once people start using restrooms opposite of their assigned birth sex and others complain, it becomes clear that gendered restrooms are unenforceable. So while they may work wherever you live since it seems that cisgender don't make a fuss about transgender women using their restroom, I don't see any other solution for the U.S.
I still think the ultimate solution is a common restroom with private stalls and a common wash area (see my post # 29). Separate facilities will always create a problem for the MTF individual as women tend to be non-accepting. I have occasionally seen even cis-women using the men's restroom without incident.
Just make all public restrooms unisex. Some people will complain initially but will ultimately become accepting.
Quote from: mac1 on January 20, 2019, 12:39:55 PM
I still think the ultimate solution is a common restroom with private stalls and a common wash area (see my post # 29). Separate facilities will always create a problem for the MTF individual as women tend to be non-accepting. I have occasionally seen even cis-women using the men's restroom without incident.
Just make all public restrooms unisex. Some people will complain initially but will ultimately become accepting.
I agree 100%. But I don't think it will ever happen. Too many closed minds.
As a nonbinary trans man who's had to clean both men's and women's bathrooms at a restaurant, I don't think there's any rhyme or reason on any given day how clean those bathrooms were. Sometimes the men's had pee everywhere, sometimes the women's did. Sometimes the women's had random scrawlings on the walls, sometimes the men's did. Typically, both were overflowing with trash, and I was expected to somehow clean them both (multiple times a shift, preferably) while making my manager watch the host stand for as little time as possible.
As far as "real world" experience goes, I've seen some pretty nasty women's restrooms, and since being able to comfortably pass while using the men's, a few nasty men's rooms, too. For the most part, however, both have been about as clean as I'd expect a public restroom to be. Which isn't spotless, but not so bad that I refuse to use it.
I've thankfully never experienced violent speech or inappropriate comments in either restroom, though I realized about a month ago that I needed to be more careful. A kind woman in her twenties held the door open for me as I left the restroom and called me "dude" in a friendly, but pointed way, and my stubble certainly showed it. I used to defer to the women's if the men's was crowded, especially after shaving, but I suddenly realized how obviously masculine I'd become.
Now that I've had top surgery and am trying to grow out my beard again, that gender-neutral bathroom design feels like the safest, most comfortable public restroom in the world. I don't expect to be harassed in the men's room, but I'm certainly terrified of it.
- Alexander