I dont know if this is the right topic to post this under or not so soz if its under wrong topic.
Lately iv been getting stronger feelings about being fem and i really want to become one like have a sex change but i dont know weather iv gone too far or not.
I saw this site which offered a professional sex change in a nhs hospital in england and its all free becuase of our medical system out where all you have to do is be a woman for 2 years soil just to make sure htta it s what you want to do.
I wouldnt be one full time for 2 year n my friends tryin to talk me out of it.just dunno what ta do.if i had it done i would prob lose my friends n family only a few of my friends would stand by me.
if i dont have it done then these feelings just wont go away.dunno what too do.just needed to get htis off of ma chest :'(
Tammy, Friends and loved ones do have an unfair influence on what you do in these matters, but please try to seperate that influence from your own internal knowledge of what is best for you yourself. I know that is very easy to say and not so easy in real application, but until you are able to do this you can't really look deep enough inside to know what is right for you and only you.
And until you have began to act on your "feelings" and learn the reality of it within yourself, you are right, the feelings won't go away, in fact, if strong enough and not acted upon, Realistically and with total openness, they can have devistating effects on your life far beyond losing those you care about or how you are treated by society because of it.
If not sure to begin with, you just have to be objective enough to realize when you have reached a point of piece with yourself. For some, it's all or nothing, but don't apply that to yourself unless it is the overriding concern in your life, and if it is, then realize that nothing short will have the desired effect and realize there is much further to go in an emotional sense. It doesn't end with just physical achievement. It is the mind, and knowing all is as it should be, disregarding the social/cultural view of some, that is important.
Terri
Hi tammygirluk,
I'm 48 and I have found that my tg desires have grown with my age. I now live %90 of my time enfemm and have found happieness...without hormones or SRS. There are other paths, for most of us, than just SRS, to fullfil your femme self.
I came out to everyone I know and alot I don't know...by just living as my true self. Yes I feel like a woman and wish I really was one...but I am not and I have learned to accept that about myself...and enjoy the middle gender road I'm on. I am now proud to be transgender.
No mater what path you choose....you have to admite you are tg...and the path ahead will not be easy...like it has not been easy for any of us. It takes 'balls of steel' to be an out tg no mater what path you find for your own happieness.
So power to you and good luck
Love
DebTV
Consider that if one's friends (including family) won't allow us to be ourselves, is the loss of such friends really any loss at all ? Those 'friends' that cannot (or will not) accept you for who you are will be 'lost' long before any surgeries.
My advice is to figure out who you are, then take everything else (friends, family, how life will treat you, and so on) into the equation.
It is important to note, as was mentioned, surgery is neither the only option nor the end.
Not sure what i want to do but one thing i know is that i want to fine peace of mind i know i cant do that by trying to shutout who i am and what i do iv tried that for a year and its hard emotionaly.everytime you pass a clothes shop the feelings are still there and you wish you could go in and get some clothes.
Things would be so much simpler if my parents didnt have old fashioned views.Every time a c/d or transgender comes on the television my dad makes not very nice comments and my mum just says sad.
I know they only saying it at people on the tv but it hurts me too becuase im a c/d
My parents asume that all c/d and transgenders are gay but thats not true.Im not gay but i think if i came out they would think that im gay and disown me becuase they dont like that sort of thing.
me i dont judge anyone like my parents do.I always keep a open mind.It pays in life to keep a open mind with all things.
I think the only way i can have peace of mind is to be a full time c/d and see how it feel about a sex change after.Just got to do it in such a way that i dotn get caught by my parents.
maybe i woudl find peace of mind if i dressed full time but only in things that i can hide underneath my normal clothes.just as long as i got something on it will help with peace of mind.
Im thinking of coming out to a few people i know to see how they react like my best friend as he would never tell my parents and also my counciler as it would help me towards peace of mind if i could talk to my counciler about it.
thanks you for your replys they have helped me think and find answers.
Just got to take each day as it comes.
Tammy x
I am not sure if jewelry is a viable outlet or not, but an anklet can be hidden beneath socks without issue, or at least no one has ever commented about mine.
There are 'male' bracelets as well; thick link copper chain. ... *shrug* can claim you think it's therapeutic. (In my experience copper has to be constantly close to the skin for any effects but I digress). You can probably find some nice 'unisex' finger rings for that matter.
Perhaps a thought anyway.
"is the loss of such friends really any loss at all ?"
Yes, when you put it in perspective. That is what makes it so hard. I have always had so very few real friends and lately even less, but I still have a wife of 25 years who while still with me does not accept this in the least. In all those years, half of her life and almost half of mine, she has proven her love and devotion to me in ways that cannot be denied, yet she seeks to return me to some resemblance of what she married, or at least stop me where I'm at, even if I could never really be a man again rather then see me go on to surgery.
She is devious and subtle sometimes about it, though she seems to accept and like other T's I have entroduced her to and taken her to visit with when going out of town to visit them so she could see for herself what our relationships were and what kind of people they were, not her worst fears, and yes, losing her, when it eventually happens will be a tremendous loss in my life and whatever she does trying to stop me is my responsibility, she knew nothing of this when we were married, at that time I thought I was winning the conflict and could really be a man without serious damage to myself, I was early into a law enforcement career and thought that duty and dedication would help maintain disipline or I would not be fast enough when my time came and end it all in a meaningful way. I came close to self destruct less then 10 years later, total failure after thinking I had the strength to do it We tried the crossdress/dual life for a while as a compromise, but it was empty for me.
She has told me in the past she has been fearfull of my drifting out of her life and needs me with her and at my present job for my insurance mostly and financial support as she has been deadly ill for sometime and is on SSI as her only means of personal support after a high rising career of her own.
I have obtained all I can from my present employment/insurance and had been considering starting over again elsewhere alone, but I must stay until she is able to stand on her own again and then, wish it or not it will be goodby unless something changes but she says it will not as my continued presance hurts her to much in my present form, let alone surgery, to remain longer. And no, it will not be an easy loss. Our lives are so closely intertwined.
Such people are only following their own dreams of rebuilding a shattered life and are really no different then we who must do the same.
You can't just dismiss them because they are afraid or can not adjust to the change in relationship. even when they fight you every step of the way. It is trumatic to them and they are only human. You can only cope as best as possible and go on anyway, regardless.
Just as we must do what we must do, so do they and we can only try to understand while we break their hearts and minds while continuing to save our own at their expense. We only do it because we can not do otherwise. The alternative is no option at all.
Just one's feelings and thoughts on this.
Terri
"You can only cope as best as possible and go on anyway, regardless."
Which was/is rather my point.
It should be noted that I am not speaking of our Significant Others (of which our children qualify as also) when I say friends and family. (perhaps I should be saying blood-relation really)
How much say do we give people? Do we stand with them and be the version of ourselves that they want us to be? Who do we allow to dictate to us what we are? Somewhere in the sand a line must be drawn. I suggest being very reserved with who we allow to run our lives.
Honestly I'm not for discarding anyone, but it is wise to realize what our relationships do to us.
Sometimes its not as simple as who we let run out lifes coz if u still live with your parents you have to do as they say and in other cases you try to be someone else coz u dont wana upset em coz u love em.just parents i mean......
Valid point.
Though generally speaking you only have to appease those you live with.
If you want to do as other say because you want to please them then you have to find a compromise of doing what you want for you vs doing what you want for them. Hopefully you can get those wants to run in tandem.
I am not advocating live your life your way and to hell with everyone else by the by. Rather I think making everyone happy is the way to go, but make sure you make yourself happy in there somewhere too!
if u still live with your parents you have to do as they say
Yes Tammy, that is the situation of minors and not many options around it. All you can do is try to tell them, together or one at a time and hope they can understand and give you some cooperation in the matter.
There is so little you can do on your own right now and doubly hard to keep it from them if you try to circumvent them, and chances are they will find out if you do.
Most all the advice people would have is of little or no comfort to a juvenile, as ultimately it falls to the parents what will or will not be done and nothing official at all without their cooperation. It makes for a serious case of depression. You can only tell them and hope they will place you in therapy, or wait till you are old enough to do it on your own. Options are limited. My own parents were aware for most of my childhood and the times being what they were, tried to have me "Cured" which of course couldn't happen but back then, they had some creative ways of trying though, some of it being very 10th centry. Don't worry, its somewhat different today.
"generally speaking you only have to appease those you live with"
Well, I wouldn't call it appeasement, more like trying to assure them they are not being deserted while you do what you must. Depending on who they are, you can be spinning your wheels or earning their respect. Anyone not close enough to you to have a direct bearing on your life, or you on thiers doesn't really enter into it as they have no stake in you or you them. It is only those who have some diirect influence exchange that you really have to deal with in a personal way as any outside of that circle have no personal stake in your life.
I'd never worry about what Mr. and Mrs. Blow down the street have to say about it or base anything on their wants, unless I was going to live with them.
And it's not about pleasing anyone either, rather simply trying to take the pain of it out as much as possible for them. Sometimes it involves increasing your own pain to lessen theirs and in that respect, a matter of how much pain you yourself are capible of handling, and you better stay within known bounderies and not get chancy.
It's one of those things you can't get overcomfident about. I've done that a few times, overstepped my own ability beyond what I absolutely knew was in me to begin with. I was trained since childhood to know what I could do and not do,knowing my limitations, but I always had an problem with overconfidence and believing that with focus I could go somewhat further then had been confirmed. Depending on what it is, sometimes I'm successful, but I have some devistating failures in this regard, failures that wouldn't have happened if I had simply stuck to what I actually knew I could do with little or no doubt. Whatch out for over confidence. It can be your greatest detractor.
Living your life your way and to hell with everybody? No, thats a little sad considering what kind of life you would end up with that kind of attitude. And sometimes Your happiness, no matter what you do depends on if you yourself know you did the right thing by your own principles or not. In many circles, if you go outside the bounderies of those principles, it's called one strike and you are out. It's a matter of trust and it is rare for such people to ever extend trust again once it has been broken and any reasons for breaking it are worthless. It just isn't done. I know this deeply personally because I have broken a trust with such a person and knew better, as we shared the same values until I invalidated my own. It's for all practical purposes impossible to regain that trust no matter what your willing to do to earn it back or how you got into such a situation in the first place. Friends don't screw with each other, They go into things together, sharing with each other and protecting each other with all they have, nothing less is acceptable. I have proven myself to be a dishonerable person to my former friend and therefore can't be trusted as a friend who will always do right and I know how that feels to oneself. Pretty darn worthless.
All you can do is try to tell them,
In this situation I'd really really think hard to tell parents until either their views changed or I could stand on my own two feet.
I'd start hinting that those 'gay' c/d transgender types are just ordinary people trying to cope. Would have to be very careful how I responded though. After all, why would I think that anyway?
It makes for a serious case of depression.
It can be that definitely. If possible though it would be so much more useful to start making and acting upon plans to secure your own future. Hindsight as they say.
Well, I wouldn't call it appeasement, more like trying to assure them they are not being deserted while you do what you must.
Um, depending on the parents and relationship with.
There was a fellow in the chat a few days ago who it would have been nothing but appeasement and discarding as soon as possible. I have a fairly dim view of incompetent parents however.
But if it is parents you both love and trust then I see your point; but then if you love and trust them it's more of the compromise to make them and yourself happy.
*ponders* more like trying to assure them they are not being deserted while you do what you must.
... wise words.
Whatch out for over confidence. It can be your greatest detractor.
Oh so true! Sadly I've had to learn (and occasionally still do) that the hard way. ;)
And sometimes Your happiness, no matter what you do depends on if you yourself know you did the right thing by your own principles or not.
Interestingly I'd say always rather than sometimes. Actually I can't comprehend sometimes. For me it is always.
It's a matter of trust...
Interestingly I've been here, but on the flip side. An no I never trusted him again.
But you know what? People do stupid things. It's part of the definition. We need to do it wrong to figure out what is right (or to assure it is). Sometimes it is a necessity.
Probably just as well given that I'm stellularly imperfect.
"In this situation I'd really really think hard to tell parents until either their views changed or I could stand on my own two feet."
In this situation there is little if any choice but to at least feel the parents out or forget everything until of a proper age and employement situation. So you just have to be sure this is important enough to you to take a risk and if it is, then flip the coin. Possibility of getting some help, or possibility of being thought of as "strange" or even "sick" in which either case, even if they really think so, it could lead to therapy whereby it would be a trained professional who would be telling the parents what the problem is and possibly suggesting a more qualified specialst to continue therapy with. Case history is established early and possibly hormones can be begun at 18 if found to be necessary and prudent.
So, it's a matter of doing nothing constructive, or talking to the parents, who will either do as requested and seek therapy for the minor child, or believe they should to confirm their own suspicions. The decision is based on one's own conviction of what is desired in life and the will to see it through.
It will be embarrassing and possibly humiliating, and there is fear of possible knee jerks, but to a serious person, these are part of the territory if one is to conceivably make it in the first place. Know that in the beginning with no promise of getting to your destination, but your willing to try or your not, especially at critical ages for best overall development and socialization.
"If possible though it would be so much more useful to start making and acting upon plans to secure your own future. Hindsight as they say."
Try this for been there done that sight. What plans to act upon when you are a minor, in school and no job that will cover any costs? Unless willing to just put it off for a few or more years before starting and all that will be accumulated emotionally in the meantime, or trying to obtain help from the parents? who may come through for you even if they think you are in deep water.
Still comes down to either doing little or nothing in any constructive manner and scared all the time the parents are going to find out on thier own somehow, or taking the one chance you have as early as possible. Again though taking such action depends on just how serious the minor is and keeping in mind the minor may be misinterpeting a lot of puberty emotions that will lead to quilt and social problems with a certainty the longer it goes on. Therapy is quite proper here, even if causes aren't what the minor thinks, in fact especially so in such a case.
if anything is desired in an immediate or very near future, through the parents is the only option and if they do extend concern and help, half the mental problem is taken care of right there. Again. is it worth it to one to take the risk? If it's not worth taking a risk for, then what is it worth as a necessity?
"Um, depending on the parents and relationship with."
Yes, thats the biggest part of the equasion, along with the consistancy and depth of feeling of the minor and what they know about normal reactions and behaviors.
I would not approach telling them straight out if the overall projection has always been masculine. Spend a a while relating to them and the world in their natural emotional state with shields down, not attempting to act "girly" or "whimpy", or trying to dress as a girl for the time being. Just relate with natural emotions and reactions rather then masking them or changing them to suit a purpose, talk about it if parents ask, explain it is just the way you are, not necessarily Are as in Girl at this point, just as you are and feel. Then and later, consistancy and adherance to natural behavioral patters, rather then habitual or trained ones will heavily enfluence the parents thinking at the time of the "showdown".
"But if it is parents you both love and trust then I see your point; but then if you love and trust them it's more of the compromise to make them and yourself happy."
yes it is compromise. The parents, even if in agreement, may want a little control over the situation in dressing, when and where, etc. Fair enough at this stage, it's a matter at this time of accepting the idea things are happening and beginning to understand it for ones self in the first place and if therapy is going on, so much the better. Most likely have to wait until 18 anyway for an official diagnoses or for any hormones anyway when legal age is reached and more control is possible and more ready to take the big dive in an informed and responsible manner.
It all comes down to money, resources, ability to make decisions affecting ones entire life, and a commitment to seeing it through with eyes wide open to what will be faced. Sneaking around trying to hide things, not having any place to go and a thousand other things, possibly including no transportation, it's like a mine field for a juvinile, much more so then for an adult. For a kid, it's come out with it, with as much intelligence as possible, or forget it for the near future. It's the breaks.
"Oh so true! Sadly I've had to learn (and occasionally still do) that the hard way. ;)"
Funny thing about Mistakes. Learn to do something and then do it right, all the time and you have accomplished a goal, but what did you really learn, other then from an intellectual point of view about why mistakes must be avoided.
On the other hand, make one mistake and you all of a sudden learn down to the bone almost every single reason in existance why that mistake should never be made.
Learning from mistakes teaches you a lot more on a gut level, then never having made the mistake, and so less prone to it again (with proper mentality) then a person who is statistically due for one since they have always been perfect.
"Interestingly I'd say always rather than sometimes. Actually I can't comprehend sometimes. For me it is always".
depends on if you sometimes try to differentuate big mistake from little mistake and harmless mistake, thats what makes it "sometimes" and in many ways most all of us do it at some time or another. The alternative, or "one strike" law dictates there is no such thing as size or nature of mistake, jay walking or murder, same penalty. Bad is Bad, no big and small about it. few people can survive in that arena, but there are those who do and are most comfortable in it. That has to be weighed carefully anytime something has even a suggestion of not being right and definately across lines by any definition is therefore totally unthinkable.
"Interestingly I've been here, but on the flip side. An no I never trusted him again.
But you know what? People do stupid things. It's part of the definition. We need to do it wrong to figure out what is right (or to assure it is). Sometimes it is a necessity.
Probably just as well given that I'm stellularly imperfect."
See what I mean? As a matter of ethical morality, you intrincically believe in "one strike" yourself, yet admit imperfection in yourself along with compromising situations. So if confronted with "one strike" you must accept it yourself as proper and right despite any circumstances.
Live by it or die by it. It's a millinias old ethic and once understood, can never be crossed.
Terri
In this situation there is little if any choice but to at least feel the parents out or forget everything until of a proper age and employement situation.
Exactly.
My comment was based on the existing 'feel out' (parents reactions to tv).
So you just have to be sure this is important enough to you to take a risk and if it is, then flip the coin.
I do not advise coin flipping as a basis of decision making. What I have seen has shown that basically nothing is a pure 50/50 mix that a coin flip would be justified for.
Mind you what I normally come across is one thing is 45/55 in one attribute and 55/45 in another; and those things are package deals and you're stuck with one or the other.
Perhaps I'm blind and a coin-flip is justified in such cases but it does not strike me that way.
Possibility of getting some help, or possibility of being thought of as "strange" or even "sick" in which either case, even if they really think so, it could lead to therapy whereby it would be a trained professional who would be telling the parents what the problem is and possibly suggesting a more qualified specialst to continue therapy with. Case history is established early and possibly hormones can be begun at 18 if found to be necessary and prudent.
Pretty good reasons to chance it though. But SO much depends on the quality of parents.
So, it's a matter of doing nothing constructive, or talking to the parents, ...
Well, that does strike me as good logic (=
Not error free of course, but life isn't and as mentioned we oft get the deep end anyway.
What plans to act upon when you are a minor, in school and no job that will cover any costs?
Software development. (code::blocks, DevCpp, sdl, ogre, wxwindows, clanlib and so on)
Computer generated art (for games and such like – blender, povray)
Writing (probably not the best option unless you are very good; but practice makes perfect.) (OpenOffice, heck even just notepad or the more traditional paper and pen.)
Perhaps more if I thought about it ;)
My point is that if you have a computer and a net connection you have resources available. Distribution channel also, though advertising is still an issue. (At a guess writing you'd want to submit manuscript to publishing places though; too easy to pirate online literary work.)
None of the above has an age requirement and all of them *can* produce income.
While I think you make good points to chance telling parents I also think it is important to realize that you don't have to have their cooperation. – damn, I still sound like such a rebel – but it is true. Life is MUCH better when you and your parents get along swimmingly, but it is not a requirement.
Therapy is quite proper here, even if causes aren't what the minor thinks, in fact especially so in such a case.
Exceptionally true. Really one of the reasons therapy is (properly) harped on as a first step.
If all parents were like mine there would not be a question to tell or not, but they aren't. My parents are the exception rather than the rule.
If therapy was probable then it would be a good idea to tell.
I wonder if just telling parents you (Tammy) would like to see a therapist would have desirable results. (I.e. see therapist and parents not freaking out too much)
I think Terri's advice is better though (=
... along with the consistancy and depth of feeling of the minor and what they know about normal reactions and behaviors.
That is very true too as well.
It certainly does not help that puberty has an unfortunate way of upsetting our tea kettles too.
depends on if you sometimes try to differentuate big mistake from little mistake and harmless mistake, thats what makes it "sometimes" and in many ways most all of us do it at some time or another.
Oh very good point.
I'll have to pay more attention and see if I am doing this. Certainly not out of the question.
you intrincically believe in "one strike" yourself
I did yes. (and intrinsically probably still do as you mention)
I changed.
Which is just as well else I'd either be dead or in a penitentiary somewhere.
I have to break my own code of honor to survive in this society. Such is life.
I don't know. I try not to think about ethics and honor and such like normally. I just try to do the best I can and what I feel is right at any given moment.
Continuity is something I'm not so sure I possess currently.
Sorry about the term "Flip the Coin" 4 years. Dumb choice of words. To me it simply ment that one of two things would happen, you get what you want or you don't. It has nothing to do with odds, just one of two things will happen and if you don't get what you want, then you have lost little because you are basically only back where you started. There are perhaps only a couple of scenarios where I would even think about basing a decision of importance on the result of a coin toss, and even then it would only be in desperation to decide between two choices which had the same end result but different workable routes to get there.
As to money, if a minor can make money by programming, writing or any means at all and save it for later, then things would be wonderful, but you have to admit how hard that would be for the majority of Juveniles, or even a realistic possibility.
The "One Strike" mentality can be confusing to some and it can be harsh in it's application, but it has it's purpose and without it some occupations, cultures and traditions could not effectively exist as trust issues must be absolute without hisitation or the slightest doubt. If you are to place your life, future, welfare, safety, etc. into the hands of another, or act upon information provided by another, You must have no questions or the slightest doubt as to the meaning and intent of the other. If applied to mainstream culture, the culture would be devistated in short order by it. But is right and proper for those who adopt it.
Oh right ok, I understand.. different meaning that !
Mony, oh doth that pain I know well.
Statically improbable yes, to be sure. (though it is not improbable for a 15yo to whip out a game and throw it on the net.. what is improbable is that the game is actually worth something and sells enough to warrant continued interest). Presumably us TG lot are supposed to be smart cookies on average, so perhaps presumable that increases the odds a touch in the favor of making something worth something. (if nothing else it's something to put on the portfolio for later employment).
"One Strike" is very appropriate for high-risk environments where teamwork is a requirement. ... I wholeheartedly agree that it has it's place.
Probably less appropriate for a pre puberty child though, which is when I outwardly exhibited that mentality. – If I had not 'dropped' that line of though I would have... um... one person (apart from parents) from childhood to now that I would associate with. ... Mayhaps my peer group stunk worse than most?
This thought is deviating pretty far from the original topic though :-\
I am of age of employment but i cant get a job and when i do it doesnt last too long.
Iv decided to remain a c/d but not a full 1.iv made this choice becuase of my family but im not happy about it but i just dont want to upset them.
Today i had alittle chat with my mum as she knows i own womans underware as she found them in my room once but she thinks i just like to look at them so we had a chat about it today as i told her i got some more as she was wondering why i didnt like her going in my room so i had to say something.anways to cut a long story short shes ok with me having womans underware and she said its ok just as long as i dont dress up like a woman and go out and she also said if my dad ever found out that i had womans stuff in my room that he would not take kindly to it so thats why im only going to stick to womans lingeir and stuff that i can hide under my clothes and also skincare stuff as it goes un,noticed.
Im not happy about it but hey i guess is better then nothing.
Sometimes it feels like im just here to please my family but saying that they are good to me and half the people my age would have been told to leave home by now.
things have been really hard lately,mentaly i mean.
You need to live awhile before making such a decision as SRS.
Morgan