Hi,
I am someone very extrovert and talkative. My manners and behavior is one of the major factor that betrays me. I exaggerate a bit too much when I am in public and act like I am constantly excited specially when I am with my female friends. The way I walk is like I'm a top model constantly doing catwalk and this, a real female never walks like this, neither can I walk like a real guy nor can I walk like a real genetic female.
Do you know an e-book or website who guides MTF transsexuals on mannerism and how to behave like a genetic female?
If there's a café in a mall somewhere, you can sit down with a cup and quietly peer out over the people walking around, you can pick up a lot of information that way.
Just don't "stare" at people for too long or you might get in trouble.
As Miniar said: Observe, observe, observe.
Once I started transition I found I would watch women more intensely. I would see an attractive woman and try to puzzle out what it was that made her attractive - clothes, manner, posture, hair, makeup, features, figure, etc. - and how much of that would fit my age and size and shape.
But also as Miniar said: Don't stare; just watch.
I also ask for advice from my women friends. I tell them I was never a 13 year-old girl, so there's a lot I never learned. They've been helpful, but a lot of what they do they do without realizing it, so they usually can't help a lot.
Relax into yourself. Don't try too hard. Let that woman inside you come out, and you should be fine.
Good luck, Shelina.
- Kate
To add to Miniar and Kate's good advice, it sounds as though you may be trying too hard. Don't force it.
I got sent to a class to learn how to walk like a girl when i wa sin Jr high, I regret it but Dad didn't want to be embarrassed in front of the bishop for confirmation.
Quote from: Shelina on August 09, 2009, 02:29:19 AM
Do you know an e-book or website who guides MTF transsexuals on mannerism and how to behave like a genetic female?
How does a genetic female behave? My mum behaves different than my nan; my cousin's total tomboy & my fiance's sister's a girly girl.
QuoteI exaggerate a bit too much when I am in public and act like I am constantly excited specially when I am with my female friends.
Sounds like a lot of women, especially young ones.
Maybe watching models and how they walk will help. Then take it down a notch since you are not on the catwalk. Many women walk like they are on a forced march. Not at all femme. I try and do not if I pass or not. Also I have noticed some ladies use their hands and gesture alot while talking.
Like others have said relax, be you. It will come.
Hum.. Walking. Guys swing their shoulders when they walk and not their hips. Girls swing their hips and their shoulders don't move. Blend, look and walk as other girls do. It does that time to unlearn one way and do it another way. Guys elbows are away from the body. Girls keep the elbows closer to the body. Very general infomation, but there is no set pattern that works for everyone.
I'm 6 foot and solidly built, but must be doing something right 'cos my best GG friends Mum said "How does Steffi manage to walk so gracefully?" ;D :icon_cool: I was delighted of course!
All of what Beni said is true.
* Walk upright (regardless of your height! - men often lean forward and often slouch.)
*Wear heels, ( - but not so high that they make you unstable...... maybe 2 inches at first. I've talked to several GG's about this and even they feel clumpy and inelegant in clunky heels)
*Don't set out to waggle your ass - that only happens on the catwalk.
*Men tend to splay their feet outwards and place them a few inches apart:-
Imagine a line about a half-inch wide...... as you step, keep your feet straight ahead, point your toes and try to put your feet down so that the instep touches the line.
- to do this, you'll need to rotate your hips slightly and that will give you that feminine swing, but without overkill.Men walk from the thighs, women from the hips.
*Men walk onto their heel and roll that forward onto their toe - womens feet hit the ground much flatter, with the toe touching down only slightly later than the heel. ( except some women in trainers or very flat shoes who walk in the male style)
*Notice how women also swing their free (bagless) arm and by how much.
*Women often grip the strap of their shoulder-bag. Notice that when they make a fist, they tend to not curl their fingers in as much as men do, therefore leaving their fingernails visible - which is the best way when your nails are longer and nice if you've taken the trouble to paint them.
* Women not only gesture with their hands a lot more whilst talking but also do it more at face level, whereas men tend to keep their hands lower.
*Women use more facial expressions whilst talking and also a little more lip-movement.
(....my Speech Therapist's last exercise was to have me saying phrases like "Ruth's red-rose root was ruined" ...... the point being to not simply make the "R" sounds using only the tongue and with the lips fairly flat, but to include a slight lip protrusion as if going "oooo" . She required me to make a similar lip movement on "We wish you well on your way to Weymouth)
I paraphrased several of these from a website - can't remember where and some people may argue the finer nuances of some of it.
An important point with all of them though is to be subtle. It's just the natural way women do stuff - overdo it and you come across as either Camp or Caricature.
Try to eliminate the male ways rather than overdo the female ways.
- and as others have said, watch women.
I wrote a somewhat lengthy article about this some time back and I think that it ended up in our wiki. So, please take a look there. It's just advice. You can do what ever you want.
But to be short.... slow down, enjoy your walk. Don't plod with your feet and try to put your forward foot slightly in front of your lagging foot.
Cindi
How did you learn how to act like a genetic male? What did you learn?
Quote from: Steffi on August 09, 2009, 11:33:09 PM
I'm 6 foot and solidly built, but must be doing something right 'cos my best GG friends Mum said "How does Steffi manage to walk so gracefully?" ;D :icon_cool: I was delighted of course!
All of what Beni said is true.
* Walk upright (regardless of your height! - men often lean forward and often slouch.)
*Wear heels, ( - but not so high that they make you unstable...... maybe 2 inches at first. I've talked to several GG's about this and even they feel clumpy and inelegant in clunky heels)
*Don't set out to waggle your ass - that only happens on the catwalk.
*Men tend to splay their feet outwards and place them a few inches apart:-
Imagine a line about a half-inch wide...... as you step, keep your feet straight ahead, point your toes and try to put your feet down so that the instep touches the line.
- to do this, you'll need to rotate your hips slightly and that will give you that feminine swing, but without overkill.Men walk from the thighs, women from the hips.
*Men walk onto their heel and roll that forward onto their toe - womens feet hit the ground much flatter, with the toe touching down only slightly later than the heel. ( except some women in trainers or very flat shoes who walk in the male style)
*Notice how women also swing their free (bagless) arm and by how much.
*Women often grip the strap of their shoulder-bag. Notice that when they make a fist, they tend to not curl their fingers in as much as men do, therefore leaving their fingernails visible - which is the best way when your nails are longer and nice if you've taken the trouble to paint them.
* Women not only gesture with their hands a lot more whilst talking but also do it more at face level, whereas men tend to keep their hands lower.
*Women use more facial expressions whilst talking and also a little more lip-movement.
(....my Speech Therapist's last exercise was to have me saying phrases like "Ruth's red-rose root was ruined" ...... the point being to not simply make the "R" sounds using only the tongue and with the lips fairly flat, but to include a slight lip protrusion as if going "oooo" . She required me to make a similar lip movement on "We wish you well on your way to Weymouth)
I paraphrased several of these from a website - can't remember where and some people may argue the finer nuances of some of it.
An important point with all of them though is to be subtle. It's just the natural way women do stuff - overdo it and you come across as either Camp or Caricature.
Try to eliminate the male ways rather than overdo the female ways.
- and as others have said, watch women.
I am going to write I disagree with alot what is written here. This is good advice if you want to come off stilted...which is not good. First off the wear heels advice is probably the worst peice of advice you can give. You really need to pick footware according to your height, If you are above 5'7" it would probably be a better idea to stick with flats. Secondly I know plenty of women who slouch, its not really that big of a deal. In fact alot of this is frankly not the best advice to be taken. There is better advice out there on this subject. Maybe I just happen to be one of those women where transition came naturally and did not have to overthink this stuff, but really the key is to be comfortable with yourself as female and not to overgeneralize women and thier behaviors (which is a problem with some trans women). Those younger folks I know who have assimiliated well I have noticed are the type that feel just as comfortable in sneakers, jeans and t-shirts then a dress and heels. It is best to define yourself and who you want to be. You would probably actually assimilate much better. There is alot more flexibility to express oneself as a woman. If you take a more stilted approach as supposed to acting naturally, it draws attention.
My best advice is to have alot of female friends who are not trans, it is better to acculturate than really anything else.
I am on another site that is all about how to's. Makeup, walk, mannerisms, the whole what you need to know. It is run be a very nice lady by the name of Lucille Sorella. You can Google her. She has passed on a lot of good info. Everything she has given me is on my hard drive.
Janet
Quote from: Shelina on August 09, 2009, 02:29:19 AM
Mannerism: HOW to behave as a genetic female and not as a >-bleeped-<?
easy. get away from trannies & observe other women.
Oh well...... it's no surprise at all that some don't agree with what I said. :)
- most of it was paraphrased from my Speech Therapist and from - among others - Transexual.org who say
"
There are major differences in body language between men and women. From time to time it will appear to converge because some men have innate feminine traits and some women have innate masculine traits. In General though, transsexuals need to have a slight stereotype in order to be unmistakenly taken as a member of the opposite birth sex ......."
Quote from: ShelinaThe way I walk is like I'm a top model constantly doing catwalk and this, a real female never walks like this, neither can I walk like a real guy nor can I walk like a real genetic female.
Hence my remarks, aimed at toning it down, yet presenting something that is
clearly female.
Most of the young girls who live near me slob around in T-shirts, jeans and trainers - but then they're GIRLS to begin with...... Sinead O'Connor looked beautiful with a shaven head, but I wouldn't recommend it as The Look for a transwoman trying to pass......
I just think that if one is stuck with a male physique and somewhat masculinised features then having body language which - whilst not being overdone - is unambiguously female is one of the things that you can do to help.
There are LOTS of women who dress and walk like guys - but they're not guys trying to come off as women, are they? ;)
Stilted ??? ...... if it's stilted then you're definitely doing it wrong ;D
Quote from: sweetstarsMy best advice is to have a lot of female friends who are not trans, it is better to acculturate than really anything else.
Yes, certainly agree with that.
Anyway....... I put my two cents in and I'm not interested in arguing so won't post in this subject again :)
Get around genfems and watch listen and learn. Also, DONT OVERDO IT! You're not a cartoon drag queen and you're not a 13 yr old girl, so don't act like either.
For me, one of my biggest problems was having my legs spread apart as I walked, so at first I would force myself to keep my legs together as I walk and it would hurt and sometimes, Yes I did forget...But then I would remember and do it again. Finally now about 97% of the time, I walk like a female. =]
One huge thing is to remember is that you are not required to "act" like a man anymore, which is something most all men are constantly conscious of, lest other men think they're being "sissy" or god forbid "gay". Once you realize you're a woman and it's okay to give up pretending to be a man, the rest will pretty much come naturally.
Be confident.
I stand five foot 9 inches tall (175 cm) and I'm, um, err, heavier than I like to be but don't look it. We'll go with 145 pounds (call it 66 kg). I am pretty darn femme.
That is to say, I wear heels (typically about 3 inches), and I wear dresses and skirts more often than my jeans (I don't own any pants). I wear makeup. My avatar is about the usual level of it (actually a little less of late, since its summer).
I'm not the best role model since I usually present cleavage and I'm fairly confident in my appearance and appeal.
earlier someone posted a few tips from a site. I encountered that site as well, lol. I will go ahead and second them.
Walk is important -- perhaps the best advice I know of is to walk with your hips, not legs or your back. Relax a little -- let your upper torso rest on your hips and swing your leg when you step from the thigh, not the knee.
turn your wrists a bit forward. Feels really weird at first, iirc.
When you swing your arm, let most of the swing happen below the elbow.
um, lol, its strange -- I can show someone in person really well -- but writing it out is hard.
but, in the end, what matters is your confidence in yourself. The old saw about "never let them see you sweat" is really very true: if you are nervous or worried, people will pick up on that.
Tension was my personal problem -- I tend to store it in my shoulders and was always hyper sensitive about them so I over reacted and kept them too stiff.
Be relaxed :D
and, on a personal note, avoid trying to catch snowflakes on your nose...
Quote from: FairyGirl on August 16, 2009, 12:16:10 AM
One huge thing is to remember is that you are not required to "act" like a man anymore, which is something most all men are constantly conscious of, lest other men think they're being "sissy" or god forbid "gay". Once you realize you're a woman and it's okay to give up pretending to be a man, the rest will pretty much come naturally.
I certainly hear you here, FairyGirl. I found that once I relaxed into being Kate, I often walk with my wrists cocked back a little - my arms down but my hands out. I'm very comfortable that way and have no idea if it is femminine, but I
know it isn't masculine. (I was told not to do it often enough when young. ::))
Walking from the hips gives you a little bit of a wiggle, also definitely not masculine.
BTW, when I presented male everyone (except me) accepted me as a man. But when I came out to my friends, two different ones told me they had been with a friend of theirs who didn't know me when they had seen me at a distance. When they said something like: Oh, there's *old name* their friend had said: Oh, I thought that was a woman. No wonder I used to get beaten up years ago when I was trying to be a boy. :P
- Kate
I agree with the others who said to hang out with genetic women. You'll get the hang of it!
I also got a lot of info from Lucille Sorella and in 2 months increased 1 cup size and picked up a lot of info from speech coaches to movement professionals. Works for me. Just google.
Thanks for all the great tips and I will defiantly take these to heart. I have tried to mimic from what I seen in malls and what not, so far it is not helping but I think I just need to work on it constantly. I know for sure my posture I need to work on, also work with my shoulders and keep them how they are suppose to be compared to a CIS Woman. I do slouch quite a bit still right now which I am trying to work on, but that is a hard habit to break. I am 5' - 10" right now without heels so I am not terribly out of the norm compared to CIS Woman. I have a few Woman in our office that is quite a bit taller then me and are very feminine. I am trying to work on my weight right now, I am a size 8 right now so not terrible but I would like to get more fit. Another issue of mine is not being confident, I do have body dysmorphia and I am always NOT happy with how I look and just incredibly critical about myself, hence the reason why I have very little self-confidence right now. I am trying to work on this but again it is incredibly hard to see something good about yourself when you hate everything that you see starting back at you in the mirror. >:(
Quote from: EmilyMI on January 08, 2013, 03:29:41 PM
I am trying to work on this but again it is incredibly hard to see something good about yourself when you hate everything that you see starting back at you in the mirror. >:([/font]
I know this feeling all to well. It really is a hard thing to overcome. I am sure you will be successfull. I wish you the best of luck.
Quote from: Brooke777 on January 08, 2013, 03:43:34 PM
I know this feeling all to well. It really is a hard thing to overcome. I am sure you will be successfull. I wish you the best of luck.
Thanks and yes it is, I am working on a daily basis and is a constant struggle for me. Trying to change in how you see yourself is incredibly hard and to stay positive is sometimes even harder.
Quote from: EmilyMI on January 09, 2013, 08:23:49 AM
Thanks and yes it is, I am working on a daily basis and is a constant struggle for me. Trying to change in how you see yourself is incredibly hard and to stay positive is sometimes even harder.
Just by your avatar picture, you are beautiful. Give it some more time and you will start to see it. I never thought I would see a girl when I looked in the mirror. But, I was wrong. Last week I looked in the mirror and saw a woman staring back at me. Mind you, I haven't seen her again and I'm back to not liking what I see. I do know that some day I will only see the woman I am and I will be happy for that.
Quote from: Brooke777 on January 09, 2013, 09:30:24 AM
Just by your avatar picture, you are beautiful. Give it some more time and you will start to see it. I never thought I would see a girl when I looked in the mirror. But, I was wrong. Last week I looked in the mirror and saw a woman staring back at me. Mind you, I haven't seen her again and I'm back to not liking what I see. I do know that some day I will only see the woman I am and I will be happy for that.
Thanks for the compliment, it does help me with my confidence and shows that I am moving in the right direction (even though I do not see it). I know I am VERY hard of myself most of the time, maybe I just need to trust what others say and just not let my fear get the better of me.
Easy. Unlearn all your masculine walking, moving, etc instead of trying to learn feminine ones.
It's gonna look like your acting and besides that downright silly....when people see your bodylanguage conflicting....masculine trying to be feminine.
Quote from: Dahlia on February 05, 2013, 03:45:48 PM
Easy. Unlearn all your masculine walking, moving, etc instead of trying to learn feminine ones.
This is what worked for me. It is easier said than done, but if you can relax into your new persona you may find that you naturally move in a feminine way. Growing up male, we get all these messages on how to walk and sit and act so that we don't look like a girl. It can be hard to let all of that early training go, but if you can you may find that your natural movement is more feminine.
- Kate
Late to this forum but as I'm new (green) reading it will benefit me also. I would venture a guess much would come second nature over time with hrt AND watching and emulating other women. Things I've already started working on is relaxing the shoulders and back, and walking from my pelvis not my chest.
Part of my issue is fighting a lot of muscle mass. I'm targeting my muscles to relax more but I believe hrt will over time soften my gait.
Maybe i'm wrong and if I am then working on the tings I can now will help me down the road.
--Sasha
One of the biggest things you can do is just relax. I know that sounds hard but when you let go of all the hang ups you were taught not to be like growing up and relax, things tend to be naturally there. Be expressive but not on purpose. Let your face show your emotions. It will become so natural you won't know you are doing it. Talking with your hands is a plus if it is natural for you. I had to always keep hand talking in check. Sometimes I would get a weird look from some guy and I'd put my hands in my pockets after that. For me, just relaxing the mental reflex to "don't do that" allowed me to just be me. I'm sure I studied my mom and grandma growing up. I spent a lot of time with both. I have also always observed people. How they act and interact. Much of that was seeing how not to act so as not to get beat up so its just stopping that reaction that will make it all happen for you.