The other day a friend had asked me why it is that if I claim to be a homosexual, than why is it that I dress as a woman and have changed my name to a feminine name. She says that men who like men don't like women and vice versa. The question has had me very perplexed. Yet I couldn't intelligently answer her. Perhaps it's just due to the way that society sees me. Even though I'm a male who wears feminine clothes, they still label me as being a homosexual. A good friend gave me a good theory that because I prefer men more than I do women than I am a 100% heterosexual woman.
Gina :)
Hey there Gina.
Check out this thread:
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,416.0.html (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,416.0.html)
Steph
Thanks Stephanie for leading me to that thread. I'll read it thoroughly. It may be the answer and I'll discuss it with my friend. Hopefully I should be able to intelligently answer her about it. :)
Gina :)
(...not sure whether to post this in this thread, or the one Steph referred Gina to...)
I know at some point some Neanderthal will call me a (word used only to make a point,) "FAGGOT!!!" It was in fact a label that I spent many years running and hiding from.
I found it strange to do that because 1) I had looked deeply within myself, asking myself if I was gay. The answer that came back was 'no'. and 2) I personally had no problem or discomfort being around gay men (or for that matter, gay/lesbian women) but shied away from the association in public, lest I be identified by some neanderthal as also being gay (guilt by association...)
Now, what's really interesting is that, since finally figuring out that all these years I've been a trans girl (and didn't know it or wouldn't admit it,) any lingering discomfort with being around gay men has evaporated.
Very interesting, that...
Karen
Hi Karen,
I always thought of my self as a straight male (although at times maybe a lesbian in a male body) and now I have no idea of my orientation. I am certain I am a woman, but have no idea whom I'm attracted to at this point. I may end up being Bi, by the time I'm done with transition.
If somebody were to come up to me and call me gay, I would say "You're right. I like women, so that makes me gay." That's one of the great things about being transsexual, is that the sexual orientation thing is so confusing, that you can confuse anybody trying to insult you.
Melissa
Very interesting theory there Melissa. I am definately sure that I am a woman ( and that is not just based on that Gender Test) but I am very much attracted to men.
Today I received a very lovely hand made card from a friend who I have been corresponding with for a while and on the front it said: "I'm Thinking Of You." and when I opened it on the left side of the card it said" "I Love You" and then he expressed himself with some very hearfelt words on the right side of the card.
Now I have thought of the possibility that I may be Bi, but I have come to the conclusion that I make better friends with women than I do anything else.
I read through that thread that Stephanie had suggested, and unfortunately there wasn't too much there that could help me.
But you know Melissa, you're right when you say:"That one of the great things about being transsexual, is that the sexual orientation thing is so confusing, that you can confuse anybody trying to insult you."
Gina :)
Until I came to Susan's it had never occurred to me that these questions of sexuality would be so prominent. I always imagined that out crossdressers and transitioning people would have all the answers, had it all worked out, had made it all make sense. But I guess I was less alone in my confusion than I thought.
I kind of view the orientation concept in simple terms.
A genetic male or a transitioning FTM that likes women is hetero.
A genetic male or a transitioning FTM that likes men is gay.
A genetic female or a transitioning MTF that likes men is hetero.
A genetic female or a transitioning FTM that likes women is gay.
A MTF crossdresser that likes women is hetero.
A MTF crossdresser that likes men is gay.
A FTM crossdresser that likes men is hetero.
A FTM crossdresser that likes women is gay.
And anybody who likes men AND women is bisexual.
And I base this more on the plumbing as it were, than on the emotional content of those relationships. Hetero or gay in my mind has everything to do with sexual orientation in relation to sexual organs.
The problem I see coming up time and time again in these types of discussions is some sort of stigma that trans people seem to place on the thought of being attracted to members of the same sex OUTSIDE of gender adjusted presentation. It's almost as if a male crossdresser can think it is disgusting/inappropriate for two men to share emotional and sexual energy, but if one of the "men" involved is presenting as a woman, it somehow makes it less disgusting/inappropriate. (Side note: I haven't seen so much of this attitude in such a blatant manner from the FTM members of Susan's).
I know that I am painting with broad strokes here, but the impression I get is that there are some limited views on sexual orientation floating around the transgendered community. Gender and sexuality are often referred to as two wholly separate things. I posit that this is not true at all. However gender and sexuality are not intrinisically locked into an either/or dichotomy. You can be a straight crossdresser or a gay crossdresser. The only problem comes in from attaching negative sentiments to any of those terms. In my case, I was always afraid of being gay and crossdressing, so I presented as straight male to counter anyone calling me on crossdressing.
If you remove any negative attachments in your mind to the terms gay or straight, then what you have left are convenient labels to clear up any confusion as to "what way you swing." In this sense, presentation becomes seperate from sexuality in the one way that might matter most to a prospective partner that otherwise finds you emotionally and intellectually compatible; what exactly is under those knickers?
Bear in mind that I also prescribe to the Kinsey sliding scale of sexual orientation. Not everyone is all or nothing in any category, but having some broad labels to put things in perspective isn't necessarily a bad thing. It is what we do with the labels that makes them positive or negative.
As for the emotional and intellectual aspects of human relationships, not all straight people have the same kind of sex, nor do all gay people, and nor would I expect transgendered people to either. I can be a gay male who likes being feminine, but it doesn't make me a woman, regardless of how I present in or out of bed, if I am a guy finding romance with another guy. Or to call myself a male lesbian if I preferred sex with women but wear a dress does nothing but dilute perfectly good vocabulary words and further obfuscate what you and I already know: Love and romance is still love and romance regardless of what you look like or who it's with. Or at least that is how my overly tolerant mind and heart sees it.
I'm Paul Harvey and now you know the rest of the story.
OH this just became a rilly good thread, Madison. hey!
Quote from: madison on April 18, 2006, 05:57:43 AM
Until I came to Susan's it had never occurred to me that these questions of sexuality would be so prominent. I always imagined that out crossdressers and transitioning people would have all the answers, had it all worked out, had made it all make sense. But I guess I was less alone in my confusion than I thought.
And I base this more on the plumbing as it were, than on the emotional content of those relationships. Hetero or gay in my mind has everything to do with sexual orientation in relation to sexual organs.
The problem I see coming up time and time again in these types of discussions is some sort of stigma that trans people seem to place on the thought of being attracted to members of the same sex OUTSIDE of gender adjusted presentation. It's almost as if a male crossdresser can think it is disgusting/inappropriate for two men to share emotional and sexual energy, but if one of the "men" involved is presenting as a woman, it somehow makes it less disgusting/inappropriate.
Well now: one the major clues to me after all in these TS thing, as not imagining but Seeing Myself (have I mentioned that I was a teenage acidhead?) as a woman full on, you know receving.
And as I am so not tryina experience a failure of imagination in this, I can see that, well, that essential change in plumbing may need some, ahem, events of a very fulfilling nature.
I was never a crossdresser, this is more essential than clothing; like Eminem I was a little scared of something hidden (though not a textbook homophobe); shared energy with a male, not a problem, but anyone who can hook up a DVD player can tell you, a male plug does not fit a male jack.
And to ME, the option available seems a little less-than-authentic...
Make sense, Paul-(ine?)?
Wendy Cronkite sez "And that's the way it is".
Hey Madison,
You've brought up some very good points in your post.
Unfortunately society views cross-dressers adn transitioning people as the same, as in terms of sexual orientation. They automatically think that a MtF prefers men and vice versa with the FtM.
Technically I really don't think it has anythingto do with the plumbing, but more on how a person really feels. As for myself, I just feel more attracted to men than I do to women, and that is more on an inner feeling thna it is on anything else.
I've been in situations where I've been at a Gender Friendly nightclub, and a gay person comes up to me and he sees me as a woman, but he's only got one thing on his mind. I once sat and talked with a guy for a good hour before he did anything sexually with me. But that's a very good thought there about a male crossdresser can think it is disgusting/inappropriate for two men to share emotional and sexual energy, but if one of the "men" involved is presenting as a woman, it somehow makes it less disgusting/inappropriate.
Gina :)
I know that I am a female. I have never really been envolved in many sexual relationships. When seeing men and women in public, I am sexually attracted to women. I tend to think of the sexual act in terms a long term relationship with another person. I currently have a long term relationship with a female. I have never had a long term relationship with a man or any physical sexual relationship. Whether this makes me gay or bi or not makes no sense to me. Intellectually I can accept a relationship with a man, but I have never been in the presence of a man I would have a relationship with. Life is simpler for me to leave sex out of my identity and be a person to other people. Yes, I do like sex and have physically fathered six children. Raising these children I have taken part in practically every male or female role except nursing and giving birth. I guess my gender identity is female, I am monogogmus, and like many females will only have sex in the context of a long term relationship.
Michelle, your post would be a good example in my mind of utilizing the plumbing as the basis for the "orientiation" label. You are a male (physically) with a gender identity of female. You like women sexually and emotionally. I would "label" you as a hetero male (physically) with a female gender identity (emotionally).
I fear that this statement could offend some people, but it is not meant as such. And if this statement causes offense I believe it would be based on the statement I made previously regarding stigmas attached to the words gay/straight, male/female, and the psychological attachments we have placed on them. The problem I see is that so many of us are so confused by our sexual and gender identities, primarily due to the cultures we live in, and in an effort to make our reality seem normal to that society, we try to twist words and semantics to make everything seem normal, instead of making the reality normal.
If you were to transition Michelle, I would then change your sexual orientation to gay/lesbian. You would physically be a woman who identified as a woman who preferred woman romantically. Until that time, to use any other label only confuses the matter.
Somehow I feel it would be healthier for all of us in the long run, if we were more accepting of our own situations, especially if we have any desire of society of ever doing the same. In my case I would say that am a bi-sexual male (physically) with a partial female identity (emotionally). Is this more confusing to society, especially when I presenting in a feminine form? Yes. But it is the reality. I am a physical male with many feminine qualities.
Perhaps there would be less dysphoria in our community if we could learn to accept ourselves for who we are, the real selves, no matter how discombobulated that seems in everyday society. Ed Wood comes to mind as someone who knew who he was and labeled himself as such.
Know that I understand there are many gray areas when it comes to how we actually feel on the sexual and gender spectrums. I know that there are many crossdressers, that for any number of reasons, who will not transition, but in their hearts would prefer to be the opposite sex. These are the people I do not wish to offend or heap any more confusion onto. But this topic stems from the idea of being "labeled" and how to identify oneself. For those that wish to be the opposite gender, but will not end up transitioning, the reality still remains that you are your birth gender (physically) but feel and present as the opposite gender. The problem with using the sexual orientation labels as I have proposed, to my mind, is only because of the stigma we have placed on them, due to our own confusion. If crossdressers could proudly say in ordinary society, I am a man/woman who has a feminine identity, I feel as though so much confusion and dysphoria would melt away.
And it is this kind of thinking that could lead to a society where physical gender becomes a truly separate identifying factor from mental/emotional identity, and even stylistic identity (the appearance: clothes, mannerisms).
In that world, how you looked would not be locked to how you presented, would not be locked to how you thought/emoted, would not be locked to who you preferred to sleep with.
But then this begs the question (that has been posted in various forms on this site alone): What does it mean to be masculine/feminine or male/female?
Ultimately I only wish everyone the opportunity to find contentment and romance; regardless of how you choose to be labeled.
Find your day well.
I'd have to agree with Madison in her statement: If you were to transition Michelle, I would then change your sexual orientation to gay/lesbian. You would physically be a woman who identified as a woman who preferred woman romantically. Until that time, to use any other label only confuses the matter.
Gina :)
I agree with Madison's statement. I have often questioned my own sexual labels and came to the same conclusion that Madison did.
The other night I was reading through "TRUE SELVES", and there was a section that had really caught my attention. It was were Mildred had wrote about the fact that if I know that I am a woman, than if I am dating a woman, then it will feel like a lesbian relationship. So naturally I would feel more comfortable dating men, without the stereotypical labels that go along with it. Technically I feel that I am more of a social butterfly as a woman and in my previous life I was like a wall flower. :P So this more or less anwers my original question. Thanks for your imput ladies. ;)
Gina :)
Hi Madison, I always enjoy your posts but this discussion reminds me of some kinda of Aristotlean gender classification gone very awry or what happens when mutually exclusive definitions collide. You have to admit there is something funny about all these sexual and gender definitions clattering around like the Marx Brothers at a party. It's a little like some weird gender/sex DD game on psychotrops. But there is such a crazy sweet anarchy in the way we live, oh the confusing, maddening, surreal joy of it all. But then being reasonalble, makes for lousy art and being too easily explained- bad poetry.
Very good point there River's Edge. Unfortunately, thanks to society, they're the ones who label everything. If they can't figure out what it is, they simply put a label on it, and like you said, after a while it gets very cluttered with all these sexual / gender definitions.
Gina :)
I don't really care what society thinks. Like Melissa, I am uncertain of my sexual leanings right now. I've always been attracted to women but I now recognize much of that was envy and remains so. I have an interest in men but haven't met anyone I'd actually sleep with. That interest may evaporate with my first actual encounter since I have a generally low opinion of men.
What am I? Only one way to find out. ;)
Dawn
Sexually confused, who knows. Things have happened to me in the past that make it impossible for me to even let a man shake my hand or touch me. How could I have (well, you know what).
Sarah L.
Today my mind is in such a fog (and I am twitching and shaking like a leaf in the wind, I have no idea why).
Quote from: gina_taylor on May 04, 2006, 05:55:04 AM
they're the ones who label everything. If they can't figure out what it is, they simply put a label on it,Gina :)
How very true, it's easier for them to name a thing than to ponder it. Here's what I feel, if you control the definitions you control everything (the exceptions are sent to the gulag). We all want defintions we can wrap ourselves around, I just don't want to borrow any from my oppressors. Well ok, I tried to borrow one or two, but they didn't have any that fit without chaffing.
A story comes to mind,sometime in Eden, when Adam had finished naming everything in the Garden, he stuffed it all away in the garage in neat little boxes, then he put those little sticky labels on it all. One day, Eve had a garage sale...
I recently read "Alice in Genderland" By Richard J. Novic M.D.
Her description of himself as a heterosexual crossdresser is a bit confusing as she has both a steady boyfriend and a wife and family. he is a Psychiatrist so she is quite familiar with applying labels.
Its a great book and discusses in detail her struggles with CD expression and TS identity. he never explains the reasoning behind the hetro description. but from my point of view when she is dressed she is a woman and is attracted to men. when he is at home with wife and family he The man and is very attracted to women. making both the he and the she hetrosexual.
still confused?
yes..
Kate Alice
In regards to your reply Kate Alice, I've read Dr. Richard Novice's book "Alice In Genderland" and I thought it was a great book as well. That was one point that did enter my mind when I read it about how he can claim to be heterosexual, even though he's got a steady boyfriend and a wife and a family. But I really like your explanation. At times I actually thought that way myself. It's almost like a split personality.
In regards to your reply Dawn, I don't really care much about wht society thinks either. I know that they'll always be against me. Ever since my mom found out that she has a transsexual son, she's always refered to me as being 'abnormal'. She's 'normal' and just because I am the way I am, she's already labeled me as being 'abnormal'. Now about your interest in men, I was actually just reading something, where it says that after a transsexual has SRS her sexual preferences will slowly change. In a way the center point of a body is right where the crotch is.
I'm sorry to hear about your problems Sarah Louise. If you'd like to talk about them with me, please feel free to PM me.
Gina :)
You don't need to have SRS to start changing. I've been on hormones for a little over 3 months now and I have already started noticing changes. So far, I have had 2 crushes on guys in that time. It is very distressing for me because of my confusion. I also realized that I felt conditioned to look at women. I look at them more out of habit than anything else. I still lean more towards liking women, but it's changing. After more time on hormones and SRS, who knows. That's why I'm waiting until after to decide what I want.
Melissa
Oh, yes, Melissa, hormones are powerful stuff. Funny, they affect all of us pretty much the same way - although not necessarily to the same degree - physically, but the mental/emotional affects can be quite different.
I was a very straight guy, and I remember the shock I felt years ago after being on estrogen 6 months when I saw a young 'yard boy' walking down the road, stripped to the waist, and thought, 'Wow, that's nice." Slapped myself in the face and dang near ran the car off the road.
Between gender identity and sexual orientation, there are just too many degrees of freedom to express it well, sometimes even among oursleves.
I consider my self a non-practicing bisexual. I'm still much attracted to women, but now also to men. I have a wonderful husband who was born female to whom I'm completely faithful. (Well, I do look. ;D) I'll be 69 in a moth; so it's pretty much a moot point, Still confusing, though.
You young kids will figure it out.
Melissa, my dear friend and sister, I was just merely saying that SRS is one of the ways that can change a persons sexual orientation. I am well aware that hormones taken for a length of time as stated by Robyn can have an effect on the mental and emotional aspects of our transition. I'm sure that as the months pass by Melissa, you'll find that you are more attracted to men than you are women. I've been on Estrogen for a month and I've already started to notice the change in me somewhat. I had started taking Black Cohosh, but was advised that it would do nothing for me, so I've discontiunued using it. For the longest time I'll look at a woman, more to see what I can use from her instead of admiring her beauty, if that makes sense. ???
Gina :)
Yes, I have heard that SRS can have a profound effect on you sexual orientation. As for looking at women to see what "ideas" I can glean from them, I do that too. Maybe it's about makeup, maybe facial shapes for FFS, or maybe just to realize that in some aspects my body is more female than some GGs out there, which is a self-esteem builder.
Melissa
to myself I'd clarify this by seperating 'gender' from 'sex'; a person with external genitalia that match his or her partner's is classifiable as homosexual. This may include cross-gendered behaviors.
Quote from: jan c on May 06, 2006, 11:27:55 AM
to myself I'd clarify this by seperating 'gender' from 'sex'; a person with external genitalia that match his or her partner's is classifiable as homosexual. This may include cross-gendered behaviors.
I wouldn't. Many FtM's don't have bottom surgery, but they're still men.
Dennis
I'll second that, Dennis.
Dennis I do not disagree: gendered as men. Sexed as something else; is a reality. I unfortunately for now am @ the other side of the equation.
Not ideal but real. Heartbreakingly.
Quote from: Melissa on May 06, 2006, 10:29:33 AM
Yes, I have heard that SRS can have a profound effect on you sexual orientation.
...
Hrm, I am a ways from that yet but I am failing to see why. I am not defined by my genitalia, nor is my sexual identity, thank you very much. If anything SRS means I can do something, but I do not see how it will change my orientation. But as I said, I am not there yet
*wink* I will have to get back to you on that :P
I agree with Kimberly.
No offense to you,Jan, and correct me if I'm wrong,but as I understood your post,in simpler terms basically what you're saying is this:
Just because an MtF who likes men has 20grand or so and a good surgeon, she is exempt from the homosexual label.
But an FtM who likes women and doesn't have surgery(for obvious reasons) is forever a lesbian.
Surgery does wonders for transsexuals and I'm not knocking it,but no matter how good the surgery may be, it is still artificial,man-made.
And this is the sole factor in determining whether a TS person is homosexual or heterosexual?
Surely you jest.
Well put, Nero. I've been trying to think of a way to say exactly that.
Dennis
Sometimes I feel that the need to label creates more problems then it solves. I guess one could say that if the category fits wear it otherwise go about categoryless. If that is too scary to no category weary than make one up.
I think your gender identity, rather than you genetalia is what makes the determination.
Melissa
Miss gina_taylor:
You seem to be a wonderful and caring human being Gina.
A disadvantage of this fine quality is that often or not we care too much for the opinion of who come as caring curious friends. I have fallen for that so many times. This prevented me from finding my true way.
Early I learned by accident not to box myself into someone elses definitions(mind).
The subject is the word Homosexual that has no meaning because It means so many differrent things to different people. The sexual act is clear but does that commission makes a person one.
I have had sex with various "straight men and women" go figure. Ex-cons do not consider themselves homosexual ( givers nor receivers, see "men, women and rape".) I see myself as a lesbian >-bleeped-<. Male TG who preffers women. Quirky? yes.
I spent time and money in therapy to discover that I was paying for someone to get an education on Gender Dysphoria. They have no answers, is a living field sudy, we are defining the field. My sincere respects for the fine proffesionals in this field.
What is your faith in this? I am at peace with my creator in my role in this world, A straight female friend taught me that I provide a lot of help and understanding to those who need it, my TG life has taught me many skilss, tolerance and love can transcend barriers, illnesses. My experience is of benefit to society, that i know and so do many of my fellow straight neighbours.
With love, sheila
Time will pass, will you?
Quote from: Karen on April 16, 2006, 10:48:31 AM
(...not sure whether to post this in this thread, or the one Steph referred Gina to...)
I know at some point some Neanderthal will call me a (word used only to make a point,) "FAGGOT!!!" It was in fact a label that I spent many years running and hiding from.
I found it strange to do that because 1) I had looked deeply within myself, asking myself if I was gay. The answer that came back was 'no'. and 2) I personally had no problem or discomfort being around gay men (or for that matter, gay/lesbian women) but shied away from the association in public, lest I be identified by some neanderthal as also being gay (guilt by association...)
Now, what's really interesting is that, since finally figuring out that all these years I've been a trans girl (and didn't know it or wouldn't admit it,) any lingering discomfort with being around gay men has evaporated.
Very interesting, that...
Karen
Hi Karen,
Your quote here totally nails how I've been too (i'm MTF). I no longer feel scared that I'll be thought of as gay if I associate with, or show approval, of gay men. I believe it is from the strength I receive from accepting my femininity. Now that I know what I am. I'm comfortable with others who know who they are.
It's also funny because I examined myself for a long time to try to work out if I am gay. That identity just never fit me. Men are men whether they are gay or not, and I know I can't comprehend the gay male mind any more than I do the straight male mind.
It just occurred to me that if I had more exposure to the gay community, I might have tried that lifestyle, but it would have been frustrating because it would be because I didn't know that I am female. I didn't even know it was possible for people to be transgendered.
Becky
On SRS and orientation:
I think makes a sort of sense. At some deeper level, the orientation might have been there, but until surgery, it's supressed because it somehow feels awkward or inappropriate. Afterwards, there might be a feeling of it becoming 'right' that makes you freer.
I guess what I mean is... while I'm a little unsure yet, at some level I am attracted to men but I would never say I am gay. A relationship between men is not for me, which is why I've decided to hold off even dating until I'm basically fulltime. I want my partner to see me completely as myself: a woman, not a man.
For me, I tried finding men attractive, but it just isn't me really, so I guess I'm lesbian. I do however find myself attracted to FTMs, because the generally look feminine and lack the penis.
Melissa
Naw, FTMs rock because they generally behave as gentlemen, and that, to me, is just adorable.
Good point Kimberly. That too. Of course, I generally behave more lady-like than a lot of women and that gets noticed. :)
Melissa
QuoteFtMs, because they generally look feminine
Thanks Melissa. ::)
Feminine?!? Well, definitely my voice and my face is kind of ...well...
But, I can't look
that feminine, if I'm constantly being "mistaken" for a guy.
Well, except for the "pregnant" incidents.
Nero
I meant as opposed to the square jaw and neanderthal brow. I'm sorry, but I tend to like more feminine looking men.
Melissa
The FtM men I know all of them look like well masculine men to me... especially my best friends SO with his muscular frame and scruffy looking face. (she doesn't leave us two in the house by ourselves!!LOL)
as for my sexuality...
I like people!
Regardless of your gender or whats between you legs... I'm versatile type of girl who will take you as you present yourself!
As long as you stimulate my intellect and have good conversation then I can see myself being attracted to you..The physical aspect usually falls into place if the mental connect is there of course it helps if your just cute as heck too!!
guess that makes me "Tri-sexual!"
Cool!
Refusing to stay still on the sexuality spectrum
Chynna
Well, you identified as gay before you identified as TS, whereas I identified as straight before I identified as TS. I think that's one of the primary differences. While I agree that it's people before physical (and I have felt interested in very masculine looking men before), I do have some hang-ups about certain things, but that's just me. By square jaw, I was referring more to the bone structure than muscle.
Oh forget it. Nevermind. I'm just insulting everyone. Sorry. :(
Melissa
No insulted taken on my part..
I think I identified as straight first (kidding myself of course), then Gay, then BI, and final TS
but I think I get where your coming from But I ain't gonna try to explain it in text! LOL
Ok maybe
I have been attracted to certain FtM TS's that despite how much masculinity they had I still sensed this Feminine vibe. Maybe it was because I knew they were FtM and that preprogrammed by society part of my brain was still see the feminine aspect I dont know Ill smack myself in the forehead later for being so narrow minded.
QuoteI do have some hang-ups about certain things, but that's just me.
Hang-ups about certain things I'm intrigued?........If your willing to tell
LOL ;) ;D
Chynna
Sorry, no. That's private. ;)
Melissa
You didn't insult me, Melissa. I'm just sensitive right now, because I feel really manly until I open my mouth or take off my shirt, then I feel bad. Every time I shower, I have to look at these firm, perfect breasts (I haven't bound much since puberty) that I would love on a woman, but not on me.
So I guess I'm ultra-sensitive to the word "feminine" right now.
Nero thinking binding might not be so uncomfortable after all
Nero, I'm sure you probably do look manly. That's different than extremely masculine. I don't like a certain part of mine as well, but I don't think it makes me any less "womanly".
Melissa
QuoteThat's different than extremely masculine.
Exactly. I'm not hypermasculine in any sense of the word and I'm hoping I take after my father who has very little body hair.
It's likely if I develop body hair, I'll wax the majority of it off.
I would like somewhat of a beard, though.
Nero
always concerned with aesthetics
See, that's exactly the kind of thing I like. :) However, a little hint. Most women don't like beards because they're scratchy.
Melissa
*devilish giggle*
An some of us do because they are nice... (scratchy or not) -- I find it depends on the guy if he looks better with a given beard style, or clean shaven.
*wink*
No matter what you do or who you are there is someone out there that so digs your grove. It is a weird weird world.