Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Community Conversation => Transsexual talk => Female to male transsexual talk (FTM) => Topic started by: Jessica88 on November 05, 2010, 06:58:36 PM

Title: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jessica88 on November 05, 2010, 06:58:36 PM
I'm new, so I'm not sure if this has already been posted on here or not, but I was curious as to how many FTMs have dated/are dating MTFs, and vice versa. Interesting thought.

I personally would love to date an FTM  :P
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: A on November 05, 2010, 07:04:36 PM
I don't think it is the intention here, but the terms of service say talking about dates is forbidden to avoid the forum to become sex-oriented.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jessica88 on November 05, 2010, 07:09:14 PM
Sorry! Ha. This wasn't a hook-up kind of thing. I was just curious as to how many transcouples that we have on these boards. Ya know?
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: kyle_lawrence on November 05, 2010, 08:17:37 PM
I dated an MTF about a year ago, and I identify as Genderqueer/ FtM.  In someways it worked out really well. like it was easier for her to understand what was going on with me, like if I was feeling super dysphoric or something, and i understood what she was going through.  At the same time though, it was extra stressful at times, especially when we would try to go out somewhere together.  there were a couple times where neither of us passed in public, so we couldn't really stand up for each other without making the situation even worse, and times like that got really tough.

I don't regret anything about the relationship though.  I did and still do really love and care about her, but unfortunately circumstances changed, and it didn't work out for us to stay together.  We didn't even try to maintain a long distance relationship between vermont and Chicago.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: A on November 05, 2010, 08:22:35 PM
But I still like the idea of the topic and I would be interested to talk about it. But I think it would be safer to wait for a moderator's approval before going on with this.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 05, 2010, 09:08:54 PM
Raises hand****
I am MTF and my spouse is FTA.
Both of us are on cross sex hormones.
Sex/intimacy is a complicated mine field some days but that is to be expected with both partners experiancing dysphoria.

I find that being married too anouther trans person to be alot less stress than being with a cis person. When I have an issue over something due to dysphoria I do not have to explain it yet again for the umpteenth time. I just give hir that look that says it is a dysphoria thing and it is ok. It seems to work for us rather well.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nygeel on November 05, 2010, 09:29:51 PM
Haven't dated another trans identified person and don't think I would based on my experiences with trans women. I mean, if I found an awesome person who happened to be trans then that's awesome. I'm just not going to actively seek out trans women specifically. Hearing/reading somebody say/write "I would love to date an ftm" makes me a little uncomfortable.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Shang on November 05, 2010, 09:53:34 PM
I haven't dated a trans person, either.  I doubt I'd exclusively look for someone who was trans--I'm more into just wanting to date someone regardless of what they identify as.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: kyril on November 05, 2010, 10:08:07 PM
Quote from: Nygeel on November 05, 2010, 09:29:51 PM
Haven't dated another trans identified person and don't think I would based on my experiences with trans women. I mean, if I found an awesome person who happened to be trans then that's awesome. I'm just not going to actively seek out trans women specifically. Hearing/reading somebody say/write "I would love to date an ftm" makes me a little uncomfortable.
Yeah, that bothers me too. (It's also why I'm uncomfortable with people who identify as pansexual. I don't like being "othered.")
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: some ftm guy on November 05, 2010, 10:30:46 PM
that idea is cool, both would understand each other in a way that one trans and one cis person wouldn't... maybe that'd be easier for both people in that understanding being transgendered sense*thinks* i could go into something like this but i don't want to go some place in person or anywhere where people are actively seeking out an ftm or mtf, don't want to be someone's  fetish. that's just creepy, ya know? I'm not an object or giant sex toy, I'm a person. i would want whoever I'm with whenever that is to like me for who i am (there are other things about people other than their gender identity) and not just because I'm a transmen.

not being mad. i don't think you intend on hooking up with anyone since you said you weren't. i think I've seen a guy somewhere here who's gf is also trans.
anyway, welcome to Susan's  :)
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Janet_Girl on November 05, 2010, 10:46:27 PM
Quote from: A on November 05, 2010, 08:22:35 PM
But I still like the idea of the topic and I would be interested to talk about it. But I think it would be safer to wait for a moderator's approval before going on with this.

Will an admin do?  I have often thought we should stay with our own kind, if you know what I mean.  But Dating another transperson, the whole coming out thing is basically a non issue.

And your SO understands better then any one what you are going through. 
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jessica88 on November 05, 2010, 11:04:38 PM
Ah, I see how my comment "I would love to date an FTM" could come across as odd. I didn't mean it in the 'I have a fetish for FTMs and I am solely looking for my partner to be FTM" kind of way, I was simply saying that an FTM would be easier to date in terms of them understanding the situation. Sorry for the confusion.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nygeel on November 05, 2010, 11:46:20 PM
Kryil: I would say the same BUT there are pansexual people that identify as such because of those with non-binary identities as opposed to seeing all trans people as not having binary identities...if that makes sense.

A: I don't really think that coming out is a non issue with a trans person dating another trans person. There are people with different opinions of "how to be trans" which can be an issue. Like if I am stealth and my partner is not, coming out could be a problem...plus there are huge differences (at least that I've seen) between many trans women and many trans men about being trans.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Carson on November 05, 2010, 11:47:55 PM
I am not dating anyone at the moment but I would have no objection to dating an MTF. I don't think that I would go specifically looking for an MTF but I also would exclude them. I also didn't take you asking that question as weird, nor did it make me uncomfortable.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Brendon on November 05, 2010, 11:58:18 PM
Quote from: kyril on November 05, 2010, 10:08:07 PM
Yeah, that bothers me too. (It's also why I'm uncomfortable with people who identify as pansexual. I don't like being "othered.")

As a pansexual trans guy, I'd like to share my thoughts on this.

The people who identify as pan and say that it means they like men, women, and trans people also make me uncomfortable.  :-\

I do NOT think being pan is about liking trans people. Obviously trans men are men and trans women are women, and as such they fall into the categories of men and women. I'd understand if people said "I like men, women, and people who identify in a non-binary way (this is the most inclusive term I could think of, let me know if you have one that works better  :embarrassed:)".

When I say I'm pansexual, I mean that how someone identifies (man, woman, bigender, genderqueer, agender, etc.) is not a factor in whether or not I will love them.

I'm sorry that you've had bad experiences with pansexuals, and I hope you know that we're not all like that.

To answer the original question though, I've never dated another trans person. The first and last person I dated was a lesbian, who despite knowing I identified as male when asking me out, refused to respect my identity. I've not been so keen on dating since  :-\   

Edit:
I apparently type really slowly, because when I started typing this Nygeel hadn't responded yet  :P. Sorry for the redundancy I suppose.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Sharky on November 06, 2010, 12:14:16 AM
I haven't, but I would.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Aegir on November 06, 2010, 01:38:55 AM
I wouldn't be mad if I was dating a special someone and they came out to me as trans. It'd make it that much easier for me to come out to them :D
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 06, 2010, 07:33:34 AM
I live with and love an androgyne.

Pansexual is all I have to work with here.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: NightWing on November 06, 2010, 12:11:51 PM
I have.  It didn't work out in the end.  It's pretty difficult for me to be attracted to a guy's body (so I normally just identify with straight, not bi).  So I tried looking past her physical body but that sadly doesn't work.  I can't force myself to be attracted to something I'm not. We were friends before that so I guess being new to the trans issue and having no other real people to relate to, we just connected with each other, tried dating, it didn't work, so now we know. 

So in short, I don't care if a person is FTM/MTF if I'm dating them.  It just depends on the person themselves. 
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nathan. on November 06, 2010, 12:14:57 PM
Quote from: kyril on November 05, 2010, 10:08:07 PM
Yeah, that bothers me too. (It's also why I'm uncomfortable with people who identify as pansexual. I don't like being "othered.")

Pansexuals shouldn't view mtfs and ftms as "others" as they are male or female. I'm pasnexual because I could date a man, woman or someone with a different gender identity.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: kyril on November 06, 2010, 02:55:56 PM
But that all still implies that GLBS people wouldn't date someone with a different gender identity, which isn't true. I identify as gay, but gender identity isn't a factor in my sexuality - I'm attracted exclusively to male bodies that produce male pheromones, but those bodies can house quite a range of minds with different gender identities.

And a lot of people do include trans people in their list of reasons why they identify as pansexual.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nathan. on November 06, 2010, 03:31:48 PM
Quote from: kyril on November 06, 2010, 02:55:56 PM
And a lot of people do include trans people in their list of reasons why they identify as pansexual.

I know thats why I said shouldn't and not don't.

I identify as pan even though I almost exclusively only like male looking bodies.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Ryan on November 06, 2010, 06:41:45 PM
I'd date a trans woman, but I wouldn't go specifically looking for one obviously.
I imagine it could get fun with double the dysphoria flying around though.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 06, 2010, 08:03:43 PM
Quote from: Ryan on November 06, 2010, 06:41:45 PM
I'd date a trans woman, but I wouldn't go specifically looking for one obviously.
I imagine it could get fun with double the dysphoria flying around though.
Sevan just said you hit the nail on the head when I read this too hir.
Dude....omg you dont know the half of it.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: _Noah on November 06, 2010, 09:26:09 PM
On the pansexual topic, I  identify as pansexual, and when asked what it means, I say, "I'm attracted to people." Rather than "I'm attracted to men, women, trans, etc." That being said, when asked what my orientation is I'm more than happy to just say I'm queer, and leave it at that..
On another note, I haven't had much experience with relationships but as said up there^ I'm attracted to people, so I wouldn't exclude another trans person.

*if that makes sense*
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: some ftm guy on November 06, 2010, 11:04:09 PM
I would date/be in a relationship with a woman (maybe not only women anymore, don't know, that's been confusin me lately)whether she was trans or not or genderqueer/non-binary it does matter way more about personality and how much we have in common. i just wanted the point i made last night to be made just because i wasn't completely sure what you meant but now i do lol. i wasn't reeeally creeped out or uncomfortable by it, just makin sure heh heh.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Arch on November 06, 2010, 11:22:14 PM
I haven't dated and wouldn't date an MTF, but I know a few trans people in my local community who have dated other trans people (MTF + FTM, that is).
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: xAndrewx on November 07, 2010, 01:50:31 AM
I'm pansexual. Right now I'm just nothing because unless I meet someone really special I'm waiting until I'm at a comfortable point in transition to date. I feel like if I'm not happy with myself at all right now then I can't make someone else happy. Maybe I'm odd though.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Alessandro on November 07, 2010, 03:08:50 AM
Quote from: kyril on November 06, 2010, 02:55:56 PM
But that all still implies that GLBS people wouldn't date someone with a different gender identity, which isn't true. I identify as gay, but gender identity isn't a factor in my sexuality - I'm attracted exclusively to male bodies that produce male pheromones, but those bodies can house quite a range of minds with different gender identities.

And a lot of people do include trans people in their list of reasons why they identify as pansexual.

Conversely to this poster I identify as gay but I don't mind if the body is female as long as the gender identity is masculine. I don't find femininity attractive, hence I wouldn't date an mtf but would another ftm.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: kyril on November 07, 2010, 04:25:10 AM
The only reason I wouldn't date a pre-transition mtf because it wouldn't be fair to her: I'd be attracted to the physical traits that she disliked/rejected/didn't identify with. I wouldn't be attracted to an mtf on HRT for the same reason I wouldn't be attracted to a natal female of any identity.

I would probably be attracted to an ftm on T if he were my type, and if so I would date him, though I haven't been in close enough proximity to one to find out (that I know of).

And I've been attracted to male-assigned androgynes and genderqueer people. I'd happily date one of them so long as they were comfortable being male-bodied (if they saw themselves happier with a female hormone balance or female or neutrois genitalia, I don't think I could work with that). Conversely, a female-assigned androgyne who saw themselves as male-bodied would probably work fine after some time on T, but an FTA who was happy with their female body wouldn't work.

So I guess I do care about gender identity somewhat, but only to the extent that I want to be sure that my partner's identity corresponds with the way I see them. The identity in itself is completely unrelated to my capacity for attraction, which operates on the lizard-brain level of "smells male? deep voice? looks healthy?"

I think that's where a lot of the disconnects come in when discussing sexualities, because some people define their sexuality based on a strong lizard-brain reaction that doesn't even recognize gender/identity, while others define it based on some degree of higher level processing that takes in behaviour, personality, and identity inputs. I think that difference might actually be of more interest than the more common ways of dividing up sexualities.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Alexmakenoise on November 07, 2010, 02:59:32 PM
I'd be open to dating a trans person.  I wouldn't seek out TG people specifically, but if someone I liked happened to be trans, it wouldn't be a big deal to me.  Dating a trans person would be good in that there would be another way in which we could relate to each other, but I think the dysphoria would be really hard to deal with.  So it would even out.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: sneakersjay on November 07, 2010, 03:36:09 PM
I'm gay, and I would date a transitioned trans guy, meaning he'd have to be on T and have had top surgery and be masculine, as I am attracted to male identified people and male bodies.


Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 07, 2010, 08:54:00 PM
Years ago before transition was on either of our radars we both knew eachother had transgender feeling and ideation. When I found out Sevan had GID I latched on. I see hir as my opposite in almost every way. Mutualy suffering from GID although very chalenging is nice in a way.
If I am having some issues behind GID or if ze is, all we have to do is say just that. With a cisgender mate explaining GID and it's symptoms can be a pain in the ***.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nikolai_S on November 07, 2010, 10:35:19 PM
I've been dating another transguy for almost 10 months now, so I can confirm at least that FtM+FtM can work excellently. Double the dysphoria is definitely tricky, but it's also great to have someone who actually understands what you're going through. And since I'm bi, I'm not bothered by him being physically female. For that matter, when I look at him all I can see is a guy, even with female attributes.

As for an FtM dating an MtF, my boyfriend and I recently went very long distance, probably long term, and I told him I was okay with him dating someone there, who happens to be a transgirl who's just started to come out. They've been dating for just under a month I think. Seems to be going well thus far - she's asexual so that takes some potential issues away.

In the pansexual debate, I don't like the concept because it seems almost like saying bisexual isn't accepting enough. "You may like both genders but I like ALL genders AND no gender." I understand why some like the term. But the bisexual people I know are all fine with dating outside the binary, so it doesn't seem like a problem to me.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Brendon on November 07, 2010, 11:08:24 PM
Quote from: Nikolai_S on November 07, 2010, 10:35:19 PM
In the pansexual debate, I don't like the concept because it seems almost like saying bisexual isn't accepting enough. "You may like both genders but I like ALL genders AND no gender." I understand why some like the term. But the bisexual people I know are all fine with dating outside the binary, so it doesn't seem like a problem to me.
I'll be honest, it makes me intensely uncomfortable that you "don't like the concept" of my sexual orientation.  :-\

It's a perfectly valid identity, and I feel like you're implying that people identify as pansexual just to one-up bisexual people. I don't identify as bisexual because to me it implies that there are only two genders that I can like (bi does mean two), and I don't feel that way. I don't mind people who identify as bisexual (and if they date outside of the binary and identify as bisexual, that's cool too), but I personally don't identify that way as I don't feel that it fits my identity. I'm getting sick of the backlash for being pansexual, most of which, for me, has come from the LGBT community.

Sorry for the thread hijack, but I don't want this to go without being addressed  :embarrassed:
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nikolai_S on November 07, 2010, 11:24:42 PM
I'm sorry my phrasing caused offence. I was just giving my input to the conversation that was happening earlier in the thread. A lot of which was already questioning why people identify as pansexual, so I didn't consider my opinion any harsher than that.

I certainly don't have anything against people who are pansexual - my boyfriend identifies as pansexual. But I personally find it so similar to "bisexual" that it's always struck me as an unnecessary distinction. Bi refers to two genders, but I don't see why it can't include people who are 25% of one gender and 75% of the other. Then there is the problem of people who are ungendered, granted. But I've chatted with several pansexuals online, and I've definitely gotten an almost elitist vibe from many of them. I'm not biased against all pansexuals as a result, but that does contribute to my opinion about the term.

edit: I just reread that and I'm pretty sure it sounds like I'm being an arse. I'd post tomorrow when I'm less sleep deprived, but I'd probably have no recollection of this thread anyway.... so sorry, just ahead of time, if this looks rude or something.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Brendon on November 07, 2010, 11:54:06 PM
No hard feelings. I don't want you to feel like I'm singling you out; I was just skimming through responses and yours caught my eye.

I won't deny that there are some jerks out there with the "holier than thou" attitude. (Between you and me, most of the ones I've known like this were in it for the "look how politically correct I am!!!" factor, and they mysteriously stopped being pan when nobody cared  ::)) This is not to say that there aren't some pansexuals who really are total tools, but I feel like that happens in every community. There's always going to be a gay/lesbian/bi/pan/omni/poly/a/straight/etc. person who thinks that their orientation makes them the best, but that certainly doesn't mean that all people of that orientation are like that.

While I understand that bisexual and pansexual may seem similar, I still feel like using bisexual for all non-monosexual identities would be rather confusing. Most people interpret bisexual to mean 'likes men and women' (woe to anyone who gets me started on how you don't have to like men and women to be bisexual, and could like any other combination of two genders instead.  ;)), if people who like more than two genders feel comfortable identifying as bi, then more power to them  :); being able to decide how you describe your identity is empowering, and I'm all for it. A lot of people don't feel comfortable identifying this way though, and, from personal experience, I can tell you that having people insist that I'm bisexual is just as hurtful as being told that I am not a man. Everyone has the right to form their own identity, and I think that Bisexual/Polysexual/Pansexual/Trisexual/Quadsexual/etc. are all separate, valid identities.   

It's hard to convey tone through text, and I don't want you to feel like I'm lashing out at you. I think I understand where you're coming from, and I just want to make my opinions on bisexual=pansexual clear.

For real though, no hard feelings, and I wish you and your boyfriend all the best.

*Thread hijack over  ;D*
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Arch on November 07, 2010, 11:54:37 PM
I think I know what Nikolai_S is getting at. I've run across a few pansexual people who do seem to have a chip on their shoulder and go out of their way to disapprove of any orientation but pansexuality. It really bugs me when a pansexual officiously says that THEY don't discriminate based on gender. Whenever I hear that, I wonder if they at least draw the line between humans and other species. I know that's obnoxious, but I don't like it when people think they're better than I am because of sexual orientation; I hear enough of that from militant heterosexuals.

But we shouldn't let a few folks give pansexuality a bad name, should we?
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: kyril on November 08, 2010, 12:26:09 AM
Quote from: Brendon on November 07, 2010, 11:54:06 PM
Most people interpret bisexual to mean 'likes men and women' (woe to anyone who gets me started on how you don't have to like men and women to be bisexual, and could like any other combination of two genders instead.  ;)),
Well, I guess where we differ is that I read bisexual as "likes (some) male and female bodies," which I guess is an outgrowth of my physically-based interpretation of sexuality in general. I don't think most people who identify as bi are talking about gender - I think they're talking about sex.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Nygeel on November 08, 2010, 01:50:32 AM
Quote from: kyril on November 08, 2010, 12:26:09 AM
I don't think most people who identify as bi are talking about gender - I think they're talking about sex.
Are they attracted to the dick, or the person behind the dick?
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: kyril on November 08, 2010, 02:17:59 AM
Quote from: Nygeel on November 08, 2010, 01:50:32 AM
Are they attracted to the dick, or the person behind the dick?
Well, just in general those of us who define our sexuality by sex rather than gender...we come for the dick (or pussy, or related features, not all of us are genital-focused) and stay for the person.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Lee on November 08, 2010, 04:06:51 AM
I just wanted to put in my two bits on the pansexual issue.  I know that in my opinion, MTF/FTM people don't count as "other."  However, It wouldn't bother me dating someone who doesn't identify as male or female.  This counts as pansexual to me, but I identify myself as bi.  It just gets me fewer funny looks.  I've never met anyone bi who, to my knowledge, doesn't fit this description, but I suppose there might be some who only like men and women.  I don't see why it's a big issue, though.  We all like who we like, and lets let everyone else do the same.   :P
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 08, 2010, 08:05:55 AM
I considered myself bi, then my spouse came out as androgyn and started using T.
Androgynes are not men or women. Bisexual does not fit me anymore. Pansexual is the only obvious choice left. I like the word and what it signifies.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: jamherst on November 09, 2010, 02:51:14 PM
I'm not sure if I would date an FTM unless they were an image I could look up to. I've always considered a cisgendered male to be more complete in the physical way and would always envy that more. However, in a relationship it's not merely physical. If an ftm had similar gay roots as I and could relate with me, I think I would. Other than that, I prefer bio guys as my current standing/views.

^^; I haven't met a lot of ftms in person and many of them were straight so, it was hard to speak with some.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: A on November 09, 2010, 06:19:41 PM
Hmm... I think I would, but I'm not sure. Being with someone who reminds you every day of what you've been through because they have been/are going through the same. Once I have completed transition, I expect to live a life as normal as possible, and I don't know if dating another transsexual would bring up too many bad memories...
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Sevan on November 14, 2010, 09:37:00 PM
*waves* I've already been discussed a few times through out this thread (lol!!!) so I feel odd adding my two cents but here we go anyway. I am currently married to Cyndi and don't see that changing anytime soon. (or...ever...lol) Which is to say...yea! I'd happily date a trans person.
As to the pansexuality debate/discussion. I'm pansexually identified. I feel like...for me it fits because gender/sex really isn't something that attracts me or deters me from a person.
Also I'd like to say...on that point..that while I see trans-men as "men" and trans-women as "women"...their sex may not yet match their gender. To me..I don't see trans people as part of "other" (unless their like myself and identified as such...to some extent) but I think when you've got a body that doesn't line up with your inner self or your desired self...and your looking for someone who will accept you as you are *now* (not necisarrily "chase"...meh.) well...that'd be what I see as pansexual. To some extent anyway. Gosh that was REALLY hard to get out. lol!!! I hope that made sense. Many many layers...and my hand motions don't really translate in this written thread!! lmao!

In unrelated and- I'm not sure if she'll see this- moment...Seven!!! hehehehehe I laughed alot when I read your (of nine). Sevan is going to be my legal name soon (HOOOOORAYYYYY!!!!!!) and I ENDLESSLY get asked if I'm "of nine" hehehehe
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Morgan on November 16, 2010, 09:30:33 PM
My girlfriend and I started dating before we knew we were trans. Now we're transitioning together :) Her MTF and me FTM.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 16, 2010, 10:16:09 PM
Waves to Morgan.
   (I like him, he was the first person who I became aware of in a relationship similar to Sevan and mine.)
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Morgan on November 16, 2010, 10:23:42 PM
:D Hi Cynthia!

Elaine says hi too.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jamison on November 26, 2012, 04:20:54 PM
I identify as queer, but I don't use the label as many pansexuals (I think?) do. It's more of a political statement to say, "I like who I like, what's it matter to you?" At the end of the day though, I'd probably never date a dude.

With mtfs,  I've never actually dated one, but I have had sex with one. Sex is a big part of my intimate relationships, and I just don't think I'm sexually compatible with pre-op mtfs. I correlate dick with masculinity and that trips up my whole power-ratio I prefer during sex. I see them as women completely, but I don't think I could give them what they need (?) during sex and thus, I probably wouldn't pursue that relationship.

Some of them are damn sexy though, so I'm not saying it's impossible. I know I could never date a non-op mtf though.

As for the double-dysphoria, I don't see it so diff as with cisfemales. I wouldn't want to date a cisgirl who had severe self-conscious issues as I wouldn't want to date an mtf with severe dysphoria. Do I get dysphoric? Of course. But for the most part I'm a pretty confident person, and I know the longer I'm on T, the sexier I get. I need a girl with a personality to match, cis or not.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Natkat on November 26, 2012, 05:22:47 PM
I guess you could say I been dating an mtf before. at least we had sex and alittle something-something going on for a short while.

I identify bisexual, and I dont really think twice about it being trans or cis I date. in my head it just women or men with diffrent bodyparts like if your out with people with dark or light skin, fat or skinny people, each got there own charm.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on November 26, 2012, 06:18:38 PM
I am dating an mtf. Funny thing I identified as asexual until I found out I was trans. I am not sure what my sexual orientation is. We met in the support group and it is pretty much my main socializing at this point. So it wasn't hard meeting her. We have had a few dates. I can sense that my dysphoria might be kind of an issue, but we'll see. She is post SRS. But I am pre-everything.

I feel it's a bit strange from the standpoint of me never passing but she often does. So when we are in a restaurant, they'll say "what do you ladies want". Grrr. I am happy for her that she is passing, but mad that I am not. At least it gives me something happier to focus on. I might otherwise make a funny retort like "I don't see no ladies here".  I would say that wiht a cisfriend but not a transwoman.

I am also only 5'1" and she is tall.

There is some fun with the gender binary. For instance who drives? (She does as I have a tiny little Japanese car). Who pays? (mix it up) And so on. I am not too big into the gender binary but I feel myself pulled by it a bit.


Anyway, I feel the challenges might make our relationship stronger. 
So far I am having a pretty good time and am really happy to be dating.

I don't know what my sexual orientation is. I am so used to be asexual, all I'll say is I am not now asexual (I think), though I maybe have switched from non-romantic asexual to romantic asexual. Because I now like cuddling and so forth.

Hey Sevan nice to see you around!! It's been awhile! 


--Jay J
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Brooke777 on November 26, 2012, 07:17:44 PM
The guy I have been dating is an FTM. I don't know why that confuses some people in my life. As far as I am concerned, he is 100% male. He is currently pre op, but plans to have Phalo and his chest done as soon as he can afford it.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: FullThrottleMalehem on November 26, 2012, 08:13:25 PM
I wouldn't have any problems dating another trans individual, and think it would be nice in some ways to date another FTM since they can relate and understand what I'm going through. Of course this is a moot point since I am in a committed relationship with a cis person that is understanding, so hypothetically speaking

On the pansexual issue. I consider myself pansexual instead of bisexual because I am not attracted to specific genders but people's personalities and compatibility. I have no problem dating people that identify outside of the male and female gender spectrum, and to me bi means attracted to people who are/identify as only male or only female, since bi means two. I don't think I'm better or worse than anyone because of my sexuality, and I don't believe any sexuality is better or worse, that would be like saying bisexuality is better than heterosexuality, when in reality neither is better, they are just different. Everyone likes what they like and there should be no problems with that as long as people are respectful of the orientations of others.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Adrian_Michael on November 26, 2012, 08:41:29 PM
Jumping in late again.

FtM pansexual person here(*waves*).

My cuz and I just had the following discussion. They claim to be "polysexual" while I am pansexual. To them, they are "poly"sexual because they do not discredit trans people, but are not comfortable with all of the various spectrum.

I am pansexual because gender and genitalia play no consequential factor on my attraction.

Would I date an MtF? In a heartbeat, if our personalities match.

I would also date an FtM, or an andro, or an asexual person, or a butch lesbian, or a femme male,  or a flowery hippie.

Gender expression doesn't play a role in my choice.

Now, if you can't brush your teeth regularly and are stank, yeah, that may take you off the list.

I don't run around with everyone, but I also don't limit my options when the choice is available.

I also rarely, if ever, discriminate based on height. I'm a short dude. It's hard to find ANYONE, regardless of gender or biological background, who isn't taller than me, LOL
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: FullThrottleMalehem on November 26, 2012, 10:01:19 PM
Quote from: Adrian_Michael on November 26, 2012, 08:41:29 PM
Gender expression doesn't play a role in my choice.

I don't run around with everyone, but I also don't limit my options when the choice is available.

I like how you put this. A common misconception bout pansexuality is that we are attracted to everyone we meet or have a lot of of partners. I know I certainly am not attracted to everyone I see, it's just that what plumbing someone has plays no part in whether or not I would have a romantic relationship with them. There are pansexual people who are poly amorous and I am not bashing that at all, but even then that is not really the same as sleeping with a ton of people, at least I imagine not in a respectful relationship of that style.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Brooke777 on November 26, 2012, 10:24:28 PM
Quote from: FullThrottleMalehem on November 26, 2012, 10:01:19 PM
I like how you put this. A common misconception bout pansexuality is that we are attracted to everyone we meet or have a lot of of partners. I know I certainly am not attracted to everyone I see, it's just that what plumbing someone has plays no part in whether or not I would have a romantic relationship with them. There are pansexual people who are poly amorous and I am not bashing that at all, but even then that is not really the same as sleeping with a ton of people, at least I imagine not in a respectful relationship of that style.

I find that a lot of people think that just because I am pansexual that I just want to have crazy orgies and sleep with everyone. Personally, I am monogamous. I want to be in a relationship with one other person, that's it. As FullThrottleMalehem and Adrian said, I don't care about their genitals. None of that matters to me.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: GentlemanRDP on November 26, 2012, 11:42:07 PM
Quote from: kyril on November 05, 2010, 10:08:07 PM
Yeah, that bothers me too. (It's also why I'm uncomfortable with people who identify as pansexual. I don't like being "othered.")

This ^ Completely.

That being said, I've never dated another trans person; MtF, FtM, or otherwise.
I definitely wouldn't say that I'm against it, but I won't say that I'm 'Looking' for another transperson.
Whoever I end up with, as long as I genuinely care about them, then whatever they have between their legs doesn't mean a thing.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Zerro on November 27, 2012, 04:55:53 PM
I dated one of my best friends(who is MtF) up until recently. Everything was fine until we got to the, ah, sexual part of our relationship. We both suffer from terrible lower dysphoria and could not look beyond how we each had the body the other wanted. So while we could see each other as we were, we were both unhappy being together due to how our dysphoria affected things intimately. We're still friends, but we don't think we can date each other again. It just won't work.

Ultimately, I don't really want to date someone else who happens to be trans. It can be overwhelming, and draining to be with someone who is going through an experience close to your own. I'm not entirely opposed to it, like say I got to know someone and then maybe they shared that they're trans with me and I decide to try and make it work, but the chances are still slim of things turning out okay.

I really just want to be with someone who sees me as a regular dude and not some sort of special snowflake, I guess. I end up ditching people - friends too - if the trans thing comes up. I don't want to talk about it with people, and I don't want others to know about it. I might be able to get over it and date another trans person post lower surgery, but I can't say for sure until I get there.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: AscendantDevon on November 27, 2012, 05:31:56 PM
Quote from: Morgan on November 16, 2010, 09:30:33 PM
My girlfriend and I started dating before we knew we were trans. Now we're transitioning together :) Her MTF and me FTM.

Woah like, same with me. Also, I dated a transguy in the past. I don't know why, I have always found myself attracted to gender variants. I'm bi/pan/whatever sexual, and for some reason I always find myself more comfortable with other people who are bi/pan, and/or androgynous, etc etc. Maybe because I feel like I have a greater understanding or connection with people who are as fluid as me. I feel like it takes a lot for straight/cis people to really get me.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: therewolf on November 27, 2012, 06:53:27 PM
I'm dating a trans girl. Yes, dysphoria is a problem, but we work around it. We started dating shortly after I came out.  I think it was critical that she understood what I was going through, and still does. I think if we ever broke up I would be very hesitant to date a cis person again.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: anibioman on November 28, 2012, 01:25:04 AM
Quote from: Nygeel on November 05, 2010, 09:29:51 PM
Hearing/reading somebody say/write "I would love to date an ftm" makes me a little uncomfortable.
same.

contrary to what many other people have said i dont think i would want to date a mtf not that i wouldnt. i just dont think it would work well because i have issues about my masculinity and having a girlfriend who could potentially have male characteristics would make me self conscious.

but it would be nice to be in a relationship with someone who really gets my transition.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Simon on November 28, 2012, 01:54:09 AM
Everyone has a "type.

When you're in a minority that "type" suddenly becomes a "fetish".

Every girlfriend I have ever had has had blue eyes. That is something I'm apparently attracted to (subconsciously I must add) but does that mean I have a blue eye fetish? no.

If I was single I would date a straight woman (cis or trans) who had an affinity towards transmen. Why not, it would make me feel more confident in the relationship. I would know that I was her type, no questions asked.

I would date a pre op mtf with no issues. I would see her as any other woman because it isn't about body parts. Obviously all of us hate what parts we were born with and they have nothing to do with our mentality. Why should I penalize anyone else for something they can't help?
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on November 28, 2012, 12:51:59 PM
Quote from: therewolf on November 27, 2012, 06:53:27 PM
I'm dating a trans girl. Yes, dysphoria is a problem, but we work around it. We started dating shortly after I came out.  I think it was critical that she understood what I was going through, and still does. I think if we ever broke up I would be very hesitant to date a cis person again.
I do not see me ever being with anouther cis person after my relationship with Sevan. Only anouther TS/TG person can understand my issues and respect them completely. A cis person will never truely understand my journey.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on November 28, 2012, 06:43:50 PM
Quote from: cynthialee on November 28, 2012, 12:51:59 PM
I do not see me ever being with anouther cis person after my relationship with Sevan. Only anouther TS/TG person can understand my issues and respect them completely. A cis person will never truely understand my journey.

Well that's true. She understands that I am dysphoric. It makes life a lot easier. I would date  a cis person.

--Jay J
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: AscendantDevon on November 28, 2012, 10:26:49 PM
A person can be a misunderstanding jerk whether they're trans or cis. Alternately, either or can be supportive and understanding. I think  'not being able to date a cis again' is sort of silly, as trans people are so few and far between. Its got more to do with finding individuals worth your time, and love.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on November 28, 2012, 11:39:34 PM
I go to a trans group for meetings and a variety of social activities, etc.
I probably have more contact with trans people in a social setting than cis people. So even though the actual statistics aren't good that I would meet a trans person in society somewhere, the odds of me meeting one are really high.

--Jay J
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Phoeniks on November 29, 2012, 01:33:55 AM
Quote from: AscendantDevon on November 27, 2012, 05:31:56 PM
Woah like, same with me. Also, I dated a transguy in the past. I don't know why, I have always found myself attracted to gender variants. I'm bi/pan/whatever sexual, and for some reason I always find myself more comfortable with other people who are bi/pan, and/or androgynous, etc etc. Maybe because I feel like I have a greater understanding or connection with people who are as fluid as me. I feel like it takes a lot for straight/cis people to really get me.

I'm much the same. I identify as pansexual mostly because during the last few years, I've almost exclusively been attracted to queer or androgynous people. I'm attracted to the middle of the gender spectrum, I like people who have feminine, masculine and androgynous traits. The term bisexual is very misleading for me, since I'm (usually) just not attracted to people who are obviously inside the gender binary. :P

I know I have had no problems dating some MTFs or FTMs, but it'd make me feel guilty if I noticed I was attracted to the traits they don't want to have/ don't identify with. So people who want to be in the middle / outside of gender binary are the most obvious choice for me.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Vonglick on December 21, 2012, 08:41:02 AM
I'm a MtF and I'm dating an FtM. We both fit into the binary and are very comfortable with each other and our bodies. The double dysphoria isn't an issue at all and in fact makes it easier on both of us. Sex is great and we both enjoy each other the way we are. He's pre op top, it doesn't bug me. I'm pre op bottom but have no Intention of having lower surgery. I'm the first mtf he's dated, and he's only the second ftm I've been with the first not being a relationship.  He likes women and I like men. We both pass very well, and eventually are even thinking about having our own genetic kids. So it works well for us and we are happy. :)
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: blue.ocean.girl on December 21, 2012, 11:05:39 AM
I actually really like the idea. But, I think the situation is very confusing. I might search out a trans guy, but I wouldn't want them to feel like I'm specifically looking for a trans man as opposed to wanting a man... no, I'm looking for a man--exactly what they are--the trans part of it just means he's someone who understands me, and I understand him. I think it would be so great to have someone that loves you who can identify with life as you've seen it--as a trans person. And having their viewpoint from the opposite side of the trans spectrum--from the male side--I think would make for an awsome relationship. 
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Vonglick on December 21, 2012, 12:07:50 PM
Well I found my boyfriend on OKCupid and I searched specifically for a transman and he knew that, I don't he felt like he was being stalked by a predator, preferences are preferences, it's not wrong to express them. Let's face it with all the different combinations with gender identity and sex and all the body types among them, there's nothing wrong with specifying a preference because it is important to be attracted to people, and that doesn't necessarily denote a predatory stance
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Emily Aster on December 21, 2012, 02:19:59 PM
I can see some allure to it with the understanding of issues, but I don't think I could do it. I think I'd have to draw the line at just friends. Maybe after a transition when I feel more confident in myself, I'd see things differently. It's just such a struggle learning how to fit into society in your true gender after years of learning the wrong way and to have a partner doing it at the same time, I think it would just make both of our transitions more difficult.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: opheliaxen on December 21, 2012, 04:40:46 PM
I usually don't like being around people with the same issues as me because it just reminds me of my own issues
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Vonglick on December 23, 2012, 06:16:34 PM
Well, I think in any relationship it is imperative to be complete on your own before trying to add another person to the equation. Trans issues are so broad though some people after identifying they are trans feel complete and others even after physically changing everything that is possible still feel incomplete. Whether this is a trans related issue or an underlying issue who knows...
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Simon on December 23, 2012, 06:40:06 PM
Quote from: opheliaxen on December 21, 2012, 04:40:46 PM
I usually don't like being around people with the same issues as me because it just reminds me of my own issues

I don't see being trans as an issue. It causes certain issues that can be overcome but it's just a tiny part of who I am. There would have to be many other shared common interests/dreams for a relationship to work. Regardless if it is trans/trans or not.

If people are just searching for other trans people to be with then I don't think it would work regardless of gender identity status.

That being said I look forward to being around many other trans people once I relocate to a city. I think it is easier to resolve common issues we all share in groups and feel comfortable about certain things.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on December 23, 2012, 11:14:57 PM
Well there are issues and issues. I don't mind trans issues. But there are people who are nasty people and that sort of thing, and they aren't the kinds of issues I want to be exposed to.

I don't see her as dysphoric as I am. But I am very early in my transition and she is later.She is passing (sometimes) as female and I am not passing as male.

I don't think either of us is particularly interested in maintaining the gender binary, so that creates some interesting situations.

--Jay
Title: Re: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: opheliaxen on December 23, 2012, 11:16:36 PM
Quote from: Simon on December 23, 2012, 06:40:06 PM
I don't see being trans as an issue. It causes certain issues that can be overcome but it's just a tiny part of who I am. There would have to be many other shared common interests/dreams for a relationship to work. Regardless if it is trans/trans or not.

If people are just searching for other trans people to be with then I don't think it would work regardless of gender identity status.

That being said I look forward to being around many other trans people once I relocate to a city. I think it is easier to resolve common issues we all share in groups and feel comfortable about certain things.

I don't see being trans as an issue either.  But there are common issues that come with it that I am disintested in working through with someone else again.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Sybil on December 24, 2012, 12:08:10 AM
In October I was entertaining a relationship with a pansexual man. I decided against it because I wasn't happy with my body and I ultimately didn't feel for him. He didn't see me as an other, I was just a woman to him. He was very adamant about that. Not all pansexual or bisexual people see people like us as "others." I'm willing to bet most are willing to simply see us as men and women.

As for me, personally, I think it would really depend on the FtM. I don't see FtMs as anything less than men, but I want a guy who has a guy's downstairs. If I fell in love with an FtM and he was my type and he had his bottom done, then that's wonderful to/for me.

I really prefer men who are masculine looking and masculine in personality (but not obnoxiously so), and I prefer men who are taller than me (I'm 5'9"), but I'm sure there are FtMs out there who are taller and who are really manly. To me it's just about meeting the right person and being able to have a great relationship, which includes a satisfying sex life. When I'm post-op, I really want and need the traditional male/female dynamic. That's what it boils down to for me.

I refuse to even enter relationships at the moment because my dislike for my bottom is too intense. I need my partner to "complete" me when the future rolls around, and if that person is an FtM, then I'd be just as happy as I would be with a cis man. A man is a man.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: CandyRossario604 on August 26, 2013, 04:18:01 PM
well i can see the advantages and disadvantages.Overall my partner believes they are a man i will treat them that way and i as his woman.Havent met a ftm and dated one and at the same time its not like im actively seeking one out if i meet one who i like and likes me back then its on otherwise... life continues
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Oriah on August 26, 2013, 10:33:56 PM
it happens.  I started a relationship with someone after coming out, who, after we hooked up, figured out he was trans too.  We're not sure if he'll ever transition or not, but it may have been one of the things that caused the initial magnetism between each other....I was the girl in a boy he always wanted and he was the guy in a girl I always wanted....of course, that's not how things started out, but that's why we fell for each other
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on August 26, 2013, 11:26:57 PM
Sevan and I are still together 4 years into our transitions, 7 years of mariage and 9 years into our relationship.
So the MTF and FTM (or FTA in Sevans case) relationship is a good paradigm to work with it seems to me.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: TheLance on August 27, 2013, 01:21:15 AM
I think that if my current gf (who is cis) and I ever break up I would prefer to be with an mtf woman because we would be able to understand one another on such a deep level. I don't see much difference between cis and trans women attraction wise. My type remains the same either way, so I'm not a '>-bleeped-<' or anything, heh. Just wana be understood.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on August 27, 2013, 10:50:41 AM
I talked about this. Funny thing though you know the thing about us being all different orientations. But when as you transition, you don't look the same and that can affect you whether your cis or trans. I think my gf might be my ex. No bad feelings as this was always more of a date than a relationship but it is one of those things-- just like any other gf thing.

--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jared on August 28, 2013, 10:23:51 AM
I had a relationship with a transgirl who was post-op so we just dealt with my dysphoria :'D But she definitely knew how to. When we had troubles it wasn't because of being trans, just common problems. However I have an MTF friend who said 2 people in a relationship is too much with the same issue. Somehow I think it might be true but it wouldn't hold me back if I really like someone.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on August 28, 2013, 11:57:12 AM
Quote from: Jared on August 28, 2013, 10:23:51 AM
I had a relationship with a transgirl who was post-op so we just dealt with my dysphoria :'D But she definitely knew how to. When we had troubles it wasn't because of being trans, just common problems. However I have an MTF friend who said 2 people in a relationship is too much with the same issue. Somehow I think it might be true but it wouldn't hold me back if I really like someone.

Well actually we don't have the same issues. You might think that, but we really don't. Yeah maybe gender dysphoria but in the big broad world of issues, we don't/didn't.

--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on August 29, 2013, 11:20:53 AM
I have to disagree Jay. Almost ALL the issues are the same. There is almost no difference except the direction one is going.
I come to this opinion from living it.
;)
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on August 29, 2013, 11:51:03 AM
Quote from: cynthialee on August 29, 2013, 11:20:53 AM
I have to disagree Jay. Almost ALL the issues are the same. There is almost no difference except the direction one is going.
I come to this opinion from living it.
;)

Not what I mean actually. I mean to say that aside from trans issues-- and we were at different places in our transition-- we all have other stuff going on and she and I didn't/don't have all the same stuff going on.

Without saying much about her, say one person has family stuff, another has job stuff, someone else has school stuff and so on.
They may be trans, that some trans people have different kinds of things, regardless of gender. I am retired, I have one family member, I wasn't married. Someone else may be going thru a divorce.




--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Violet Bloom on August 29, 2013, 11:59:46 PM
When I think about the possibility of dating transpeople it ends up really messing with my head.  I have a pretty good sense that I want to be in a relationship with a female but that this female would fill a husband-like role and be a sexual dominant.  As such when I look at FTMs I am often drawn to them by their personality traits and the more typically male role they might play.  At the same time I have to admit that I'm also attracted to what I would term their 'latent feminity' which is a recipe for causing them major disphoria.  When I look at MTFs I am attracted to their female traits but would be put off by their 'latent masculinity'.  The commonality here is that I don't have an attraction to most masculine physical features so in both cases I would likely be doing myself and the MTF/FTM a disservice by trying to enter a relationship.  I am not saying it's entirely out of the question, as I tend to favor what I would call quite androgynous or boyish women especially if they have a lot of pride in being a strong-willed, smart and capable character.  I concluded a couple years back that there was a good chance that my instincts would lead me to enter a relationship with someone not fully physically female and that I would just have to accept it if it happened and learn more about myself in the process.  If I meet someone that I really connect with on a personality level and am attracted to physically I will not strike them down if I later learn they don't have female or fully female genitalia.  I'm just not sure it would work out too well.

This all gets terribly complicated once you start to consider all the variations and combinations of non-polar gender and sexuality.  I feel rather ill-equipped to navigate this and extremely nervous about even starting conversations about it with potential mates.  I expect to hold off on any kind of relationship until I get well into my transition so that I am at least presenting a clear picture of myself to others and know better how to explain myself to them.  If it turns out that someone of any variation I wouldn't have expected shows interest in me at that point then I may just roll with it.  I really would just prefer that they don't have any major hang-ups with their own body.

Recently someone I knew from a support group started an MTF transition.  They wanted to be friends with me but I got the distinct impression they wanted to try dating me.  I managed to avoid speaking directly to the issue and I haven't heard from them for awhile.  Unfortunately, although they seemed rather nice, I just wasn't into it particularly because they were actively transitioning and I didn't really know how it would turn out.  To me they were always going to be far too male and it would never feel right.  Certainly I didn't want to have to spell that out for them.  I really hope I never have to be in a position of telling anyone trans I can't date them because they are 'too male' since it may do them major mental harm.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jared on September 10, 2013, 03:57:03 AM
Quote from: aleon515 on August 28, 2013, 11:57:12 AM
Well actually we don't have the same issues. You might think that, but we really don't. Yeah maybe gender dysphoria but in the big broad world of issues, we don't/didn't.

--Jay

I aggree partially, but all our issues comes from gender dysphoria, what we want to change in our bodies it's opposite.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Sammy on September 10, 2013, 05:41:42 AM
I could see myself in such kind of relationship - theoretically. Because, I know only one FTM and I would not want to date him - because of issues related to his personality, not him being trans  :P. But such relationship would be kinda tricky - partially because of the mentioned issues of latent femininity and latent masculinity features, which are sometimes quite hard to get rid of. In fact, I cant see myself in a serious relationship with a cis-guy either - at least at this moment - I would love to date them, but I cant see myself living with a cis-guy 24/7.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Christine167 on September 10, 2013, 06:13:41 AM
I could see myself in a relationship with a FtM. At first I thought "Well sure maybe." But then I met a new FtM acquaintance/friend and he struck that crush switch in my head.  So.. I'm going to go find something cold to drink right as I still haven't shaken that line of thought to actually be able to hold a real conversation with him/about him. Yeah...  ^-^
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Taka on September 10, 2013, 08:27:05 AM
Quote from: Jared on September 10, 2013, 03:57:03 AM
I aggree partially, but all our issues comes from gender dysphoria, what we want to change in our bodies it's opposite.
i have lots of issues. most of them are not from gender dysphoria. i'm a horribly difficult person to be with, i have preferences, dislikes, things i need, things i can't stand. all unrelated to gender, be it my own or the other person's.
all relationships are different, as every person is unique. the dysphoria of a trans person might not be all that much worse that the dysphoria of someone who suffers from ptsd, ocd, panic attacks etc. not only trans people get suicidal, we're just more likely as a group to get that dysphoric.

as a rather pansexual person (i like people, not genders), i'm open to anything. i can't promise anyone a man or a woman though, they'd probably have to deal with both.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on September 10, 2013, 11:46:38 AM
Quote from: Taka on September 10, 2013, 08:27:05 AM
i have lots of issues. most of them are not from gender dysphoria. i'm a horribly difficult person to be with, i have preferences, dislikes, things i need, things i can't stand. all unrelated to gender, be it my own or the other person's.
all relationships are different, as every person is unique. the dysphoria of a trans person might not be all that much worse that the dysphoria of someone who suffers from ptsd, ocd, panic attacks etc. not only trans people get suicidal, we're just more likely as a group to get that dysphoric.

as a rather pansexual person (i like people, not genders), i'm open to anything. i can't promise anyone a man or a woman though, they'd probably have to deal with both.

Yeah that's really what I meant. She and I have gender dysphoria in common but we have rather different other issues because our lives have been pretty different. Not sure re: us but she is always going to be a friend. I know sometimes people hate to hear that but in our case I think it's good because we are coming to it mutually I think.

--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Brandon on September 10, 2013, 02:18:24 PM
That's a really good question, Honestly though I pefer cis woman, But Ive seen alot of mtf women who pass really well, And look beautiful
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Jared on September 10, 2013, 02:26:33 PM
Quote from: aleon515 on September 10, 2013, 11:46:38 AM
Yeah that's really what I meant. She and I have gender dysphoria in common but we have rather different other issues because our lives have been pretty different. Not sure re: us but she is always going to be a friend. I know sometimes people hate to hear that but in our case I think it's good because we are coming to it mutually I think.

--Jay

Oh okay, got it. I meant only trans issues coming from gender dysphoria, but sure there are many things that aren't really "trans related" issues and they are because of dysphoria.
Taka what you mentioned are things that cis people experience too, but that's not really new to anyone  :D
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Taka on September 10, 2013, 03:48:35 PM
I just wanted to mention a few things that can complicate a relationship a lot. Trans people can have all the same difficult issues as other people, that are not caused by gender or body dysphoria. Understanding the gender related issues might not always be enough.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Gene on September 10, 2013, 04:05:58 PM
Quote from: Nygeel on November 05, 2010, 09:29:51 PM
Hearing/reading somebody say/write "I would love to date an ftm" makes me a little uncomfortable.
Yeah, kind of makes me feel more like they fetishize MTF/FTMs rather than wanting to genuinely be with them as a person when they say stuff like that.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on September 11, 2013, 12:24:45 AM
Quote from: Gene on September 10, 2013, 04:05:58 PM
Yeah, kind of makes me feel more like they fetishize MTF/FTMs rather than wanting to genuinely be with them as a person when they say stuff like that.

Of course there are exceptions. I might say that just to say, well I'd like to date someone who shares some of the same concerns that I do rather than it being a fetish. But I would be a little more wary of a cisperson thinking this way, makes me wonder.

--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: blue.ocean.girl on September 11, 2013, 10:40:37 AM
Quote from: aleon515 on September 11, 2013, 12:24:45 AM
Of course there are exceptions. I might say that just to say, well I'd like to date someone who shares some of the same concerns that I do rather than it being a fetish. But I would be a little more wary of a cisperson thinking this way, makes me wonder.

--Jay

I completely agree... I have had so many experiences like this with cispersons. I just think I've given up on romance with them. :/ Maybe I'm just jaded right now :p But it may be more difficult to find, but I really would love to find an FTM to build a relationship with, not because I'm interested in FTM's specifically, but because I'm interested in men, and finding one where the transsexual thing was not a novelty or a fetish for them, but just the norm, would be ideal i think.  ::)
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on September 11, 2013, 12:03:19 PM
Quote from: blue.ocean.girl on September 11, 2013, 10:40:37 AM
I completely agree... I have had so many experiences like this with cispersons. I just think I've given up on romance with them. :/ Maybe I'm just jaded right now :p But it may be more difficult to find, but I really would love to find an FTM to build a relationship with, not because I'm interested in FTM's specifically, but because I'm interested in men, and finding one where the transsexual thing was not a novelty or a fetish for them, but just the norm, would be ideal i think.  ::)

Yes that's right being trans becomes normal in the relationship. It's LESS fetish in some ways. But of course many cispeople don't see trans people as odd or unusual.

--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: Taka on September 11, 2013, 02:12:35 PM
i'm pretty sure i could manage to make it a fetish despite it not being a novelty to me... i like ambiguity in sex and/or gender (both male and female futanari...)

not that i prefer trans people, i don't think that's the case for me. i also like people with nice long hair, manly men, uber cute girls, catty creatures etc. my only serious fetish seems to be (old) scars. might not be too good if dating an ftm who's had top surgery... didn't think of that before *sigh*

oh well. personality is the most important to me anyway. i'd never date anyone just for some physical feature(s).
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: AshleeLC on April 02, 2014, 03:58:55 PM
Personally, I think it would be easier to date a FtM, maybe not in bed, but the fact that we would both have a common ground and be able to understand eachother better. Also it would be quite obvious whos role is which, aka whos the man and such
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: aleon515 on April 02, 2014, 10:35:28 PM
Quote from: AshleeLC on April 02, 2014, 03:58:55 PM
Personally, I think it would be easier to date a FtM, maybe not in bed, but the fact that we would both have a common ground and be able to understand eachother better. Also it would be quite obvious whos role is which, aka whos the man and such

I dated an MTF, and it was NOT really easy to figure this out. I think the fact that I was very early in transition made it more difficult I suppose. But we did have a lot of understanding of each other. We aren't dating anymore but it is going to be a forever friends type of thing for sure.

--Jay
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: cynthialee on April 04, 2014, 10:58:34 AM
I find that being intimate with my transmasculine spouse rather easy.
In my universe the genitals are reversed on the sex's.

Kinda weird I know, but it works for me.
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: meganB on April 07, 2014, 08:52:26 AM
Since about a few years I became good friends with this FtM boy (both pre everything). Somehow we just instantly clicked and had been friends ever since (also even before he was on the T I found that he was handsome, just from a friends point of view). From there we became good friends over time (we also started HRT at almost the same time).

After some time he started to really open up to me and before I knew it he started to flirt with me and I flirted back (and I started to get feelings for him). Eventual he asked me out and I accepted it (prior to this I never considerd dating him). We arent dating now though (he doesn't know if he likes me or not), but he definitely doesn't want to lose me *big sigh*.

About pan/bi/straigth/gay, for me it doesn't matter what square I'm in. Gender doesn't mather to me, as long as he/she is someone who I could really love I'm fine with anything (he also doesn't want bottom surgery and i'm fine with that).
Title: Re: FTM/MTF dating?
Post by: stephaniec on April 07, 2014, 05:55:38 PM
I'm 5 months on HRT. before this I had worked with a FTM. We were some what friends , but because of the conditions of the work environment it was a little stressful. He was very good looking , but at the time I was in some what denial of my self. I did though feel a strong sexual attraction for him and if I had been transitioning at the time its possible we could of dated.