NOTE: In March 2018 my surgeon was switched to Drs Kleinberger and Shih after Dr Gill became unavailable.
As a result of a grievance I had filed with Kaiser (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,231228.msg2057286.html#msg2057286), I received a referral for an evaluation by Dr. Roop Gill (https://mydoctor.kaiserpermanente.org/ncal/provider/roopgill) with the Kaiser Sacramento office.
The appointment took a little over an hour. Dr. Gill updated her notes on my history and discussed my goals (gender dysphoria relief and safety) in wanting FFS. She took a complete set of photos, and then we sat at her computer terminal and went over the images. We discussed details of changes, difficulty, recovery and risks, all sorts of things. This was a more thorough evaluation than I had previously had.
We looked at my CT scans, both slices and volume renderings, and decided on the bone & cartilage work needed:
Brow reduction by opening and reconstructing the frontal sinus (Osterhouts type 3 procedure).
Orbit reduction by burring
Slight nose reduction, with a 'break' before the tip, a more feminine trait. No change in the bone structure setting the width, but removal of some soft tissue near the tip. No rotation needed.
Lip lift via an incision below the nose.
Shaving of bone to narrow the chin, soften the angle at the mandibular joint
Tracheal shave
Soft tissue work:
Eyebrow raise as part of bone work.
Suggested facelift, fat padding at deficit under the eyes, neck tissue, blepharoplast to open eyes further
Since we don't want to remove tracheal cartilage close to the vocal folds attachment point, a needle is inserted and position checked with a camera in the throat to verify the safe margin for tissue removal. The cartilage is shaved, or burred if calcified.
The forehead work will be done with a hairline incision. She suggested I bring by favorite hairpiece in so they could properly mark the incision on the surgery date! The frontal sinus bone will be removed and reset inward. My sinus bulge is unusually low so this may impact how much reduction can be done.
A blepharopasty would currently be covered for the right eye. (Pretty droopy; eyelashes touch the drooping tissue). This may change with the forehead work and brow lift.
The mandibular reduction involves burring at the joints and chin.
Dr. Gill would be performing the surgery with the department head observing. The procedures would be scheduled for mid-April or later, as soon as the OR schedule opens up for surgery planning.
Dr. Gill is new to Kaiser, but has been doing maxillofacial surgery for some time, including pediatric patients, who have relatively little bone to work with. She seems to have a good aesthetic sense as well as the right skills. As this surgery would be a full year sooner than what I had previously been waitlisted for, and I do like this doctors suggestions, sense, and skill set, I'm inclined to go with her for my FFS work. This may also be the only way I can get FFS done with insurance coverage. (See my link to the grievance post at the top of this post.)
I'll follow up with additional FFS activity with Dr. Gill in this thread.
Michelle,
Dr. Gill's evaluation certainly does seem well thought out and detailed. I was also impressed that she asked for your goals and sought your inputs rather than just telling you what she thought you needed. Good luck with the procedures.
Tia Anne
Good luck Michelle, I am so happy for you. :)
Yes best of luck Michelle! Your posts are motivating me to reach out to my insurance for the same.. crossing my fingers it's the only way I can afford it
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I would recommend if you can also see Dr Andrew Kleinberger in Norcal Kaiser Permanente. He spent a year long fellowship with Dr. Spiegel doing probably over 100 FFS cases. Training in FFS is uncommon and highly specialized. You do not get significant FFS experience during Craniofacial fellowship training. I spend a good portion of my practice now fixing botched attempts of FFS, particular the Type 3 forehead of new surgeons attempting to perform FFS. I would clearly ask any prospective surgeon exactly how many FFS surgeries they have performed on transgender fpatients. You typically do not want to be their first. The learning curve for FFS is particularly steep and very few places where you can receive adequate training. Dr. Dechamps-braly a craniofacial surgeon in San Francisco spent years under Dr Ousterhout learning FFS before performing FFS on his own.
Quote from: keojampamd on December 24, 2017, 02:16:32 AM
I would recommend if you can also see Dr Andrew Kleinberger in Norcal Kaiser Permanente. He spent a year long fellowship with Dr. Spiegel doing probably over 100 FFS cases. Training in FFS is uncommon and highly specialized. You do not get significant FFS experience during Craniofacial fellowship training. I spend a good portion of my practice now fixing botched attempts of FFS, particular the Type 3 forehead of new surgeons attempting to perform FFS. I would clearly ask any prospective surgeon exactly how many FFS surgeries they have performed on transgender fpatients. You typically do not want to be their first. The learning curve for FFS is particularly steep and very few places where you can receive adequate training. Dr. Dechamps-braly a craniofacial surgeon in San Francisco spent years under Dr Ousterhout learning FFS before performing FFS on his own.
I have been evaluated by Dr Kleinberger, in May of 2017, and am currently on a waitlist to eventually be scheduled for surgery. Best estimate is sometime in the first half of 2019. My California ACA coverage ends in November 2018, when i am forced onto Medicare, possibly Kaiser Senior Advantage.
Kaiser Senior Advantage may not cover FFS. Kaiser Member Services cannot give me a straight answer, which does not bode well. I do have grievances on file to try and get an answer as well as to protest the lack of care. I have been assaulted twice in the past year directly attributable to my being read as a transgender woman, and my current appearance is distracting to students in the tech training classes I teach.
I need FFS sooner, rather than in a year and a half more, if at all. How badly could they screw up? I'm perfectly willing to look like a deformed old woman. It beats reading as a man in a dress, with all the risks that entails.
See a doctor in private practice and pay the Charge Master rates? Maybe if I win the lottery. Overseas to Facial Team or possibly Thailand is barely affordable.
Complications that I have seen include
Large hole in the frontal sinus wall causing air to leak into the forehead. The forehead would move in and out with breathing and forehead puffed out when blowing nose or sneezing. I performed cranial bone grafts to close the hole and reconstruct the anterior sinus wall.
Large external scars when they were not needed such as external incision along with jaw angle to reduce the jaw. Large visible incisions over the tracheal cartilage. They should be placed high above and hidden underneath the chin. The incision does not need to be any larger than 1cm. Permanent hoarseness from over resection of the tracheal cartilage during Trach Shave.
Nerve damage with transection of to the supraorbital nerve and mental nerves causing permanent numbness of the forehead and lower face.
I heard of one case of injury to the superior sagittal sinus causing intracranial hemorrhage.
The most common complications however are incomplete surgery with unsatisfactory results. The 1st surgery is the best chance to get the best results and experience matters. You just don't want to be the 1st couple of cases for a surgeon during the steep learning curve. I believe the book Facial Feminization Surgery: A Guide for the Transgendered Woman
by Douglas K. Ousterhout MD is essential reading for anyone undergoing FFS.
Dr. Keojampa, thanks for the input and discussion of risks. I do appreciate that, but unfortunately I am not in a position where I can seek out the best possible surgeon.
Surgery is scary. Surgery has risks. There are additional risks from surgeons with insufficient experience carrying out procedures for the first time. I understand this, and have discussed some of these matters with the surgeon.
Surgery from a highly experienced surgeon won't be covered by insurance, or will require me to go another year and a half as is, and may still not be covered, as I mentioned above. Medicare coverage for transgender-related treatment is at the administrative whim of the Federal Department of Health and Human Services. Without insurance, surgery is expensive, likely $33,000 to $35,000 (USD) from the good doctor, or $55,000 from Dr. Dechamps-Braly. We're talking a year or two of living expenses for this surgery.
Not having surgery also has risks. Assaults against transgender women are on the rise. Acceptance in public is being pushed back strongly by current political and ideological trends. My ability to conduct classes is in jeopardy. Heck, my ability to walk to the grocery store is at risk. (One assault occurred in broad daylight a block from the store as I was returning home.)
I realize this could just wind up as 'suicide by doctor'. I could wind up with my face in ruins, disfigured and in pain or numbed and paralyzed. This would have effectively no impact on my life, as I am already easily clocked, and treated as a walking freak show once someone in a group reads me. (Exactly this happened at Dr. Gill's waiting room. Nothing like seeing someone stare, then whisper to the person next to them, who stared...)
So, worst case, I'm a different sort of freak.
Best case, it works OK, the male 'tells' are reduced or eliminated, and I get to live my life a bit more safely. I can teach classes and have the students pay attention to the materials, not what I look like.
I can take what the insurance will cover and take my chances, or I can go without, with it's own risks.
Heck of a choice. Sucks to not be wealthy in a society that insists on for-profit medical care while denying us the right to exist if we are spotted, doesn't it?
Not getting FFS covered is the norm. If you can get it covered within Kaiser, tally it a win.
The only caution I would give is that recovery, at least in our age group, is grueling.
Those of us who are with Kaiser in Southern California are hoping and praying for the day when FFS is covered down here.
Given the family obligations that I have, my chances of raising the money for the minimum I would need (rhinoplasty, brow shave) are not good. In addition to that Kaiser would likely cover blepharoplasty, some lower jaw work, bucal liposuction, and tightening of the skin under my chin, which are far beyond my means at this point.
Please keep us apprised of your experiences with Kaiser.
Hi Michelle,
I understand how you feel. You are not a freak. I had ffs with Dr. Spiegel 9/2016 and have been on hrt for 4.5 years. I had done everything Dr Spiegel recommended. I sold a lot of "things" to pay for the surgery. People still look like at me and some whisper. It use to bother me but I have grown the ability to not care. Safety is always a concern. More so in warmer months when guys are on corners when I walk by.
I am sorry you have to deal with this. I probably would have been my worse enemy if I did not have ffs. I look andro so everything I wear and makeup helps heaps. Even with ffs I sometimes get sir, not very often but it happens.
If I were to do it again. Would do ffs in stages, perhaps 2 or 3. This is for healing and finances. I did not think I would make it so I did what I thought was best the first time. Air fair can be cheap to Thailand or India $530 round trip from NY with 2 checked bags and one carryon. I play around with the number of days and days of the year week. I looked at China air. I will not go to uae or turkey.
I hope to file my level 2 ffs appeal Tuesday. I most likely will not get any money but I win just by fileing. I will go to the insurance board. I am trans and will fight. I may not win but I will not lose.
Good luck Michelle! As another Kaiser Norcal member, I would be very interested in reading updates- thread bookmarked.
Quote from: Another Nikki on January 02, 2018, 05:31:12 AM
Good luck Michelle! As another Kaiser Norcal member, I would be very interested in reading updates- thread bookmarked.
Will do!
I'm waiting for scheduling now. Should be late April or early May.
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Quote from: Rachel on December 24, 2017, 09:47:16 PM
Hi Michelle,
I understand how you feel. You are not a freak. I had ffs with Dr. Spiegel 9/2016 and have been on hrt for 4.5 years. I had done everything Dr Spiegel recommended. I sold a lot of "things" to pay for the surgery. People still look like at me and some whisper. It use to bother me but I have grown the ability to not care. Safety is always a concern. More so in warmer months when guys are on corners when I walk by.
I am sorry you have to deal with this. I probably would have been my worse enemy if I did not have ffs. I look andro so everything I wear and makeup helps heaps. Even with ffs I sometimes get sir, not very often but it happens.
If I were to do it again. Would do ffs in stages, perhaps 2 or 3. This is for healing and finances. I did not think I would make it so I did what I thought was best the first time. Air fair can be cheap to Thailand or India $530 round trip from NY with 2 checked bags and one carryon. I play around with the number of days and days of the year week. I looked at China air. I will not go to uae or turkey.
I hope to file my level 2 ffs appeal Tuesday. I most likely will not get any money but I win just by fileing. I will go to the insurance board. I am trans and will fight. I may not win but I will not lose.
Dr. Spiegel won't give any revisions? I think that would be such a disappointment for ms if I did ffs and wasn't passable. Good luck on your appeal!
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Good luck Michelle and i fully understand about the not waiting i feel the same way but i look forward to seeing the result i think it will be outstanding didnt think about the wig consideration though
your dr,s analysis would give me confidence
I found the part about the procedure for
Recovery sounds scary .....and what the Dr said yikes
Still as you said theres more to be gained then lost its almost an imperative
I'm basically in this same pipeline right now and was wondering if you ever got scheduled or had any updates. I have my consult with Dr. Gill Tuesday after initially getting told "maybe 2 years" (with Kleinberger/Shih) and filing a grievance.
I've been trying to plan a bunch of things around when surgery might happen and it's been getting frustrating. So any information you might have on when you get scheduled is appreciated!
Quote from: JennyJupiter on January 24, 2018, 03:43:03 PM
I'm basically in this same pipeline right now and was wondering if you ever got scheduled or had any updates. I have my consult with Dr. Gill Tuesday after initially getting told "maybe 2 years" (with Kleinberger/Shih) and filing a grievance.
I've been trying to plan a bunch of things around when surgery might happen and it's been getting frustrating. So any information you might have on when you get scheduled is appreciated!
Dr. Gill seems to be getting all the grievance cases! I expect to hear something on scheduling in February, and I will post here.
The Kaiser Sacramento surgery scheduler for Dr Roop called yesterday. The book for April is now open, and they wanted to verify that I was still available starting the latter part of April for surgery. I don't have a date yet, but was happy to hear from them at all.
At some point soon, this month or next, I hope to have a surgery date and pre-op appointment. I do have a couple more questions to ask Dr Roop based on Dr Keojampa's feedback, but so far everything else checks out OK.
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Getting exciting, fingers crossed!!!
This is getting interesting. I have not yet heard back from Dr Gill's scheduler.
However, my first choice, Dr Klineberger, apparently has a opening August 28 of this year. The scheduler called and offered it to me.
Oh, decisions, decisions. Should I accept this?
Oh, who am I kidding? Of course I grabbed this one.
So, I am now scheduled for FFS on August 28, 2018 with Dr. Klineberger.
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Quote from: Michelle_P on March 12, 2018, 02:23:16 PM
This is getting interesting. I have not yet heard back from Dr Gill's scheduler.
However, my first choice, Dr Klineberger, apparently has a opening August 28 of this year. The scheduler called and offered it to me.
Oh, decisions, decisions. Should I accept this?
Oh, who am I kidding? Of course I grabbed this one.
So, I am now scheduled for FFS on August 28, 2018 with Dr. Klineberger.
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That's great!! Congrats on the appointment :)
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well, Roop Gill was pretty nice and all but regardless of wether i would recommend her or not doesnt matter. she was fired less than a month after my surgery so yeah l. i can say my results arent bad but unfortunatley now i need revision on my nose, she flat out skipped the lip shortening procedure due to her assistants opinion, which she asked for. she was supposed to lift my brows higher than they set before, they are pretty much the same height my eyes are a little dofferently shaped. last of all my jaw line is a bit higher on my right, now they referred me to dr phillips the cheif surgeon who is not a specialist. i dont know everybody. although as i said before it doesnt matter anyway. the story gets much worse but at the moment im too upset to elaborate
just wanted to inform you all of that.
Quote from: Michelle_P on March 12, 2018, 02:23:16 PM
This is getting interesting. I have not yet heard back from Dr Gill's scheduler.
However, my first choice, Dr Klineberger, apparently has a opening August 28 of this year. The scheduler called and offered it to me.
Oh, decisions, decisions. Should I accept this?
Oh, who am I kidding? Of course I grabbed this one.
So, I am now scheduled for FFS on August 28, 2018 with Dr. Klineberger.
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This is wonderful Michelle!
Well folks it is August 28, 2018 and for Michelle and I the day started at 04:00 am. Up, dressed, and out the door in time to Check in at the Kaiser Richmond, Ca. hospital. At about 7am they called her back to get her pepped. About 7:45 they let me see her for a bit before taking her off to the operating room and kicking me out to the waiting room. Now I wait. Doc said 8 - 9 hours.
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Quote from: Laurie on August 28, 2018, 10:41:47 AM
Well folks it is August 28, 2018 and for Michelle and I the day started at 04:00 am. Up, dressed, and out the door in time to Check in at the Kaiser Richmond, Ca. hospital. At about 7am they called her back to get her pepped. About 7:45 they let me see her for a bit before taking her off to the operating room and kicking me out to the waiting room. Now I wait. Doc said 8 - 9 hours.
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Yeah it seems like they like to get you up early on surgery day😀
Best wishes for Michelle😊
Yay! Michelle's turn to be passenger on a really great road trip. Fall asleep comfortably and then wake up in a new place.
Four hours in and four or five to go.
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7 hours in and no news so that is good news. Possibly 2 more hours to go.
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Michelle's status is one shown as "in OR, closing" It appears they ate wrapping up.
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And now for your moment by moment update by your on the spot reporter Laurie, brought to you by 20 Me Team Borax.. Michelle is now in recovery.
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Quote from: Laurie on August 28, 2018, 07:04:58 PM
And now for your moment by moment update by your on the spot reporter Laurie, brought to you by 20 Me Team Borax.. Michelle is now in recovery.
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That's good to know! Best wishes for a speedy recovery Michelle😊
speedy recovery girl.
Michelle is now settled into her room for the night. As expected she is groggy but able to answer the nurse's questions intelligently. She is sleeping comfortably now. I am staying with her tonight. Laurie
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YES! So glad to hear Michelle is ok and is now resting.
Quote from: Laurie on August 28, 2018, 10:36:27 PM
> As expected she is groggy but able to answer the nurse's questions intelligently.
And well sometimes I don't answer the nurse's questions intelligently... weeks and months later!
I'm so happy to know it appears to have gone well. In this case, appearances are everything.
Stephanie
Glad everything went went well!
See you two soon...
Little sis
Fingers crossed Michelle is doing well....
Great to hear 😊
Michelle is now settled into her own room at home. Ice packs applied and in her bed to rest. The doctor had told her that everything had gone according to ( ugh ) plan. If the object was to make her look like she is recovering from a severe beating, they succeeded.
Yes, it looks bad, but I think I can see some of the changes she was after even through the swelling and bruises. She has had a few bouts with nausea but not too bad. Like I said above she is home, in bed, resting. Lauri
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Yeah on day one I was doing swell!
The days ahead definitely get better, and then awesome.
Well wishes to both of you from one of the wandering honeymooners. We are now about as far away from the two of you as we can possibly be and still be on the same continent but please know that we are thinking of you and following your progress.
Love you both,
Debi
Quote from: Debi on August 29, 2018, 07:20:58 PM
Well wishes to both of you from one of the wandering honeymooners. We are now about as far away from the two of you as we can possibly be and still be on the same continent but please know that we are thinking of you and following your progress.
Love you both,
Debi
Thank you Debi and Tia.
We do know and we have been following your progress too. One would think that with all the waiting I have done recently, I would have had plenty of time to get caught up and respond to everyone but I haven't. Somehow the time goes away and then II'm tired and fall asleep.
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Quote from: Laurie on August 30, 2018, 12:15:20 AM
Thank you Debi and Tia.
We do know and we have been following your progress too. One would think that with all the waiting I have done recently, I would have had plenty of time to get caught up and respond to everyone but I haven't. Somehow the time goes away and then II'm tired and fall asleep.
I'm sure it's exhausting. Take good care of yourself so you can take care of Michelle!
Stephanie
Congrats, Michelle! I am hoping for your desired results. :)
Take care of her, Laurie.
Thank you, Steph and Ainsley.
I am doing what I can to take care of her. So far it hasn't been to difficult. A little cleaning and changing dressings. Should something come up the is a Kaiser hospital about three blocks from here complete with emergency rooms and ambulance services. I do not think it will come to that but they are there if needed.
Michelle is doing a bit better. Bleeding seems to be slowed from yesterday after changing dressing last night. She dined on a small bowl of yogurt flavored with finely chopped fresh berries and banana topped with whipped cream last night. This morning she broke her fast with a yummy Costco chocolate nutri-shake to ensure her dietary needs are met. Over all she's improving. Laurie
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FFS with a good surgeon followed with a Costco milkshake sounds great!
I don't recommend the opposite: a milkshake with a good surgeon, and then FFS at Costco.
Quote from: Kendra on August 30, 2018, 01:32:12 PM
FFS with a good surgeon followed with a Costco milkshake sounds great!
I don't recommend the opposite: a milkshake with a good surgeon, and then FFS at Costco.
Bwahahahaha! Made me laugh.
And now for the evening report.... Today has been uneventful. She has slept quite a bit and continued keeping ice packs on her eyes and chin. I decided to cook her and I a home cooked chicken and vegetable soup for our supper. It has been cooking about 3 hours and is quite savory. She of course can't have solid foods yet, so while I dine on the super scrumptious bits and pieces, she has to be satisfied with the broth after it cooled down.
Quote from: Laurie on August 30, 2018, 11:10:03 PM
And now for the evening report.... Today has been uneventful. She has slept quite a bit and continued keeping ice packs on her eyes and chin. I decided to cook her and I a home cooked chicken and vegetable soup for our supper. It has been cooking about 3 hours and is quite savory. She of course can't have solid foods yet, so while I dine on the super scrumptious bits and pieces, she has to be satisfied with the broth after it cooled down.
That type of broth is the most satisfying...It was made with love 💕💕💕
Last update for the night.
I changed Michelle's dressings again tonight. Again there was some bleeding as I took the gauze bandages off, but less than last night. As you would expect it is not a pretty sight under those bandages. I used more petroleum jelly this time to aid in bandage removal tomorrow night and more of the gauze bandages. I think I got the ace wraps more comfortable for Michelle yet still tight enough to help with pressure over the spots that tend to bleed. It is a good thing I am not very squeamish. Took her blood pressure and it was a bit on the high side which I think is better than low. she seemed much better today if tired and sleepy. No temperature or any sign of infection.
Calling it a night.
Laurie
Quote from: Jessica on August 31, 2018, 12:55:03 AM
That type of broth is the most satisfying...It was made with love 💕💕💕
I like that comment Jessica.
Hugs and love,
Laurie
Wishing you a speedy recovery Michelle.
Quote from: Kendra on August 29, 2018, 03:10:10 PM
Yeah on day one I was doing swell!
I see what you did there.
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Yes Tonga I saw it too but commenting encourages her more. Soon Stephanie catches on and there off to the races. Why they can't be serious like me I will never know. I think both are due for some fridge time.
Quote from: TonyaW on August 31, 2018, 08:05:04 AM
Wishing you a speedy recovery Michelle.
I see what you did there.
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Quote from: Laurie on August 31, 2018, 09:40:19 AM
Yes Tonga I saw it too but commenting encourages her more. Soon Stephanie catches on and there off to the races. Why they can't be serious like me I will never know. I think both are due for some fridge time.
Hey, I'm being good! I was going to say when you traveled to the surgeons, Michelle was cruisin' for a bruisin', but I didn't! See how much self-control I'm exercising? Besides, right now my fridge is dirty on top.
Stephanie, Official Member of the Hooligans.
Give Michelle a serious hug for me.
I may have been a little bit highbrow but then I had surgery.
My roommate went a month without being able to chew because of dental work. I learned that a food processor and a blender where my best friends. The blender would turn just about anything into a thick soup and the food processor would pre chew everything including meat. Your chicken soup could be run through either producing a much more filling broth.
Quote from: Dena on August 31, 2018, 05:16:36 PM
My roommate went a month without being able to chew because of dental work. I learned that a food processor and a blender where my best friends. The blender would turn just about anything into a thick soup and the food processor would pre chew everything including meat. Your chicken soup could be run through either producing a much more filling broth.
Thanks Dena.
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Hi Laurie,
After FFS, I think the 4th day I was eating cheese. I ordered a pound of American cheese ( I stayed in an extended stay)sliced thin. I was able to get that into my mouth while only opening my mouth a it a very small amount. I would let it melt in my mouth and then swallow.
Yogurt and eggs are good choices too.
Please tell Michelle hello from me. Also, that she has been through the hardest part and every day it will get better.
Quote from: Rachel on August 31, 2018, 07:38:46 PM
Hi Laurie,
After FFS, I think the 4th day I was eating cheese. I ordered a pound of American cheese ( I stayed in an extended stay)sliced thin. I was able to get that into my mouth while only opening my mouth a it a very small amount. I would let it melt in my mouth and then swallow.
Yogurt and eggs are good choices too.
Please tell Michelle hello from me. Also, that she has been through the hardest part and every day it will get better.
Thanks Rachael. She hasn't been wanting much until tonight when I managed to get a bit more into her. But II'll copy her words for today's update in the next post.
Hugs,
Laurie
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Here is Michelle's update for today in her words....
It's the third day following all of my facial surgery.
I'm continuing to heal, with the bruising and worst of the swelling starting to fade.
There has been some bleeding the past three days, not unexpected, but troubling. It appeared to be worse this morning, so we called the Head and Neck Surgery unit. One of the doctors called us back and mentioned some concern over a hematoma, also a concern in the surgeons notes, and asked us to have this evaluated at the Walnut Creek ER Department.
We spent a few hours in the ER, getting unbandaged, cleaned, inspected, and rebandaged. Wouldn't you know it? The bleeding stopped when I was unwrapped. The hair is a mess, naturally, but there is no hematoma, and all will be well. We will give the head incisions several days to knit before we try cleaning the matted hair of blood.
I'm continuing to regain mobility. I can't talk well with the compression bandages and the sutures in my mouth from the jaw surgery. I can handle soft foods, so Laurie was able to make me a nicer dinner tonight.
I had butternut squash soup, homemade chicken broth, and garlic mashed potatoes with broccoli. Dessert was triple threat chocolate ice cream. My weight is down but I anticipate reversing the the trend with my regaining my appetite!
I have a follow up visit in one week. Meanwhile, I expect to just continue healing here.
Michelle
It's me again.. Michelle and I were both very much relieved when we saw all bleeding had stopped when they unwrapped her today. I will admit to beginning to get worried even though her BOP was good, not running a temp, and no signs of infection at all. It was just the continued bleeding that I was concerned about.
While Michelle feasted tonight, I once again roughed it.
Hugs,
Laurie(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180901/d8363f2f1ab946c787a8dc099148165e.jpg)
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glad to hear there's no complications and michelle is on the mend!
Laurie! You are an angel for helping Michelle through her recovery and giving us the wonderful updates on her progress. I'm so glad everything went well. Your description of Michelle's appearance her first night at home has me shaking in my pumps. Onward to a speedy Michelle!
Hugs,
Donica.
Dear Michelle! I hope my questions are not too soon after your FFS as I know you are in recovery and need your rest. If I may ask? Am I going to have to file a grievance with Kaiser SoCal to get an appointment for my FFS? I have already requested FFS through my therapist well over a month ago and haven't herd anything yet? He has told me that FFS and many other transgender medically necessary procedures are now covered under Kaiser Senior Advantage Plus. Also, I'm in the middle of facial hair removal (Only 5 hours in) and was wondering what you did? Or did you already complete facial hair removal before getting your FFS?
Wishing you a speedy and successful recovery Michelle!
Hugs,
Donica.
Quote from: Donica on September 03, 2018, 12:03:14 PM
Dear Michelle! I hope my questions are not too soon after your FFS as I know you are in recovery and need your rest. If I may ask? Am I going to have to file a grievance with Kaiser SoCal to get an appointment for my FFS? I have already requested FFS through my therapist well over a month ago and haven't herd anything yet? He has told me that FFS and many other transgender medically necessary procedures are now covered under Kaiser Senior Advantage Plus. Also, I'm in the middle of facial hair removal (Only 5 hours in) and was wondering what you did? Or did you already complete facial hair removal before getting your FFS?
Wishing you a speedy and successful recovery Michelle!
Hugs,
Donica.
Donica, there is a closed Facebook group I recommend called: "Transgender Care Via Kaiser - Proud To Be Transgender (P2BT)" started by Kaylie Love. If you are a Facebook user, this is a must-join group for Kaiser MtF patients. Many have been down this exact path with Kaiser SoCal.
Your therapist should have filed a recommendation for FFS. You will almost certainly have to contact Member Services yourself to get this moved along, emphasizing that it is medically necessary care (which your therapist should have certified in the recomendation) and "timely access to care" which means it is Not OK to park this on a administrators desk for a few years in the hopes of a loss mitigation due to patient becoming uncovered (you leave Kaiser, die, or age out).
A grievance is filed through the Member Services website. For our issues emphasizing the medically necessary nature of the care and need for timeliness are the big points. I repeatedly emphasized my public speaking and training activies, and the loss of business due to my obviously being trans, and the consequent impact on my life.
I had about 220 hours of hair removal via electrolysis done prior to surgery. No electrolysis was done in the month before surgery to mitigate the risk of a skin infection that would have cancelled the surgery. I used an electric clipper once several days before surgery to get rid of the worst, and avoided shaving, as any nicks, cuts, or sore spots would have cancelled the surgery. (The surgeon goes over this in the preop instruction sheets.)
I did about 4 hours of electrolysis a week in the year before surgery, dropping to 2 hours/week early this year as I ran low on hair, and to one hour a week in July. I will restart in late September, and based on an evaluation them we will come up with a new schedule.
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 03, 2018, 06:03:45 PM
Donica, there is a closed Facebook group I recommend called: "Transgender Care Via Kaiser - Proud To Be Transgender (P2BT)" started by Kaylie Love. If you are a Facebook user, this is a must-join group for Kaiser MtF patients. Many have been down this exact path with Kaiser SoCal.
Your therapist should have filed a recommendation for FFS. You will almost certainly have to contact Member Services yourself to get this moved along, emphasizing that it is medically necessary care (which your therapist should have certified in the recomendation) and "timely access to care" which means it is Not OK to park this on a administrators desk for a few years in the hopes of a loss mitigation due to patient becoming uncovered (you leave Kaiser, die, or age out).
A grievance is filed through the Member Services website. For our issues emphasizing the medically necessary nature of the care and need for timeliness are the big points. I repeatedly emphasized my public speaking and training activies, and the loss of business due to my obviously being trans, and the consequent impact on my life.
I had about 220 hours of hair removal via electrolysis done prior to surgery. No electrolysis was done in the month before surgery to mitigate the risk of a skin infection that would have cancelled the surgery. I used an electric clipper once several days before surgery to get rid of the worst, and avoided shaving, as any nicks, cuts, or sore spots would have cancelled the surgery. (The surgeon goes over this in the preop instruction sheets.)
I did about 4 hours of electrolysis a week in the year before surgery, dropping to 2 hours/week early this year as I ran low on hair, and to one hour a week in July. I will restart in late September, and based on an evaluation them we will come up with a new schedule.
Thank you so much for the valuable information Michelle!! Yes, I am on Facebook and will definitely join the group. I was hoping I wouldn't have to jump through all the Kaiser hoops but as you said, It is very medically necessary and most certainly need timely access to care. I don't want to become another statistic of violence. whether or not FFS will lessen that possibility, it will certainly give me more confidence in myself.
In following your thread I now understand I may be looking at a year before I get an appointment and if so, that would be the one year mark of my RLE. But least I will have some 200+ hours of hair removal behind me. My therapist did give me the phone numbers for the "Transgender Care Nurse Coordinators". I will start calling them today as well as Member Services.
Thanks Again. Wishing you a speedy and successful recovery Michelle!
Lots of hugs girl!
Donica.
Surgery + 7 days!
It's been one week. We did the daily dressing change, and unlike last week (ER run!) or even a few drops on the inner bandage a few days ago, there was no bleeding and just small traces of oozing fluid on the inner bandage.
The bruises on the face are fading, and I am developing a lovely shade of yellow on my cheeks. It's... colorful...
I'll give the head incision a few more days to knit, and probably on Thursday try to soak the matted blood out of the hair, with warm water, peroxide, gauze sponges, and lots of time. Friday I will go to my followup appointment for unstapling, removal of some stitches and hopefully lose the nasal stabilization stuff.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/a3781d48c4d32ccc5452d5c795b437f5.jpg)
Even bruised and covered in dressings you look very feminine and pretty. The good news is that it is too late now for serious complications. So far your surgery is a success and please keep us updated.
xxxxxxxxxxxx
Surgery +8 days
I spent a couple hours in the shower washing out old blood from my hair. Hydrogen peroxide spray bottles strongly recommended, along with a good slippery conditioner!
Most of it is gone or broken up and the rest will be gone in a few days. There were no signs of infection or fresh blood.
I'm enjoying stealing a few hours from the mummy costume. I'm hoping I can lose the wraps on Friday. The bruising is there but fading slowly.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/f5d6f77dfac0b2f404b381474aa4a264.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/6e2188a6dacb7f2494718eda51ce08ea.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/41e04ba22433cb79efcdd75ada0765a1.jpg)
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Better and better everyday!
Hugs and smiles from Minneapolis 🌸🌸🌸
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 05, 2018, 06:43:04 PM
Surgery +8 days
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/f5d6f77dfac0b2f404b381474aa4a264.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/6e2188a6dacb7f2494718eda51ce08ea.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180905/41e04ba22433cb79efcdd75ada0765a1.jpg)
Oh my gosh, Michelle! It's so easy to see that the results are going to be wonderful! ❤️
Stephanie
The results are amazing. You already look 100% woman. Is that your natural hair or a wig? If it is a wig it looks great
Wow!!! Look at those big happy smiles. You are looking better and better every day Michelle. I caught up with you on FB. I glad to see you in such high spirits.
Hugs girl!
Donica.
Looking good and out of the woods!!
Thanks! I'm feeling better. The inevitable numbness and swelling is irritating, as are the compression wraps, but I'm hoping to be doing better this afternoon.
I have a postop +10 appointment for staple and suture removal today. I'll post how that goes.
You're really close to that point where bruising vanishes and then the subtle changes are fully visible - and amazing. The change is already so great, having been through this I can see past the bruises and much of your swelling is gone.
Almost there!!
Postop +10
The staples and stitches on the scalp and for the upper lip lift are gone. Still some swelling which will subside a bit over the next weeks, but some of which will be here for a year.
The bruises are just masked with the usual cosmetics.
The dissolving stitches for the blepharoplasty and septorhinoplasty are still here, but not intrusive. The dissolving stitches in the mouth for the jaw surgery are starting to break down and all looks healthy.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/ae0e6f07a9ab170068359c727b4d6b79.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/e093f4d6fb72b48aa9004935554ad5bd.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/e0a3ffe7eca559e21dd0b03c1f4e377a.jpg)
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Quote from: Michelle_P on September 07, 2018, 04:43:12 PM
Postop +10
The staples and stitches on the scalp and for the upper lip lift are gone. Still some swelling which will subside a bit over the next weeks, but some of which will be here for a year.
The bruises are just masked with the usual cosmetics.
The dissolving stitches for the blepharoplasty and septorhinoplasty are still here, but not intrusive. The dissolving stitches in the mouth for the jaw surgery are starting to break down and all looks healthy.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/ae0e6f07a9ab170068359c727b4d6b79.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/e093f4d6fb72b48aa9004935554ad5bd.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/e0a3ffe7eca559e21dd0b03c1f4e377a.jpg)
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Oh my Michelle! You look fabulous. And only 10 days. That's building my confidence. I didn't realize you can start using makeup that early. That's absolutely wonderful news Michelle.
Lots of hugs girl.
Donica.
Quote from: Donica on September 07, 2018, 05:00:31 PM
Oh my Michelle! You look fabulous. And only 10 days. That's building my confidence. I didn't realize you can start using makeup that early. That's absolutely wonderful news Michelle.
Lots of hugs girl.
Donica.
The makeup guidelines include nothing on or near the eye lift or lip lift sutures for two weeks, and nothing on the nose that might cause any pressure (including scrubbing) for three weeks. There aren't any other facial incisions, just discoloration in otherwise untouched areas that I used corrector and a concealing foundation on.
You look so great already! Bet you're glad to be past the most challenging hours and days.
You are now living in your future.
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 07, 2018, 04:43:12 PM
Postop +10
The staples and stitches on the scalp and for the upper lip lift are gone. Still some swelling which will subside a bit over the next weeks, but some of which will be here for a year.
The bruises are just masked with the usual cosmetics.
The dissolving stitches for the blepharoplasty and septorhinoplasty are still here, but not intrusive. The dissolving stitches in the mouth for the jaw surgery are starting to break down and all looks healthy.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/ae0e6f07a9ab170068359c727b4d6b79.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/e093f4d6fb72b48aa9004935554ad5bd.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180907/e0a3ffe7eca559e21dd0b03c1f4e377a.jpg)
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Like what I am seeing :)
And, the first of the bills has arrived... For the hospital, 9 hours of OR time and one night's stay:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180919/9cbdf5d80b3ccfef44c9e5c5170d37d2.png)
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Oh my! That's 3 time the total amount I read about in another forum. This does go toward your annual out of pocket right? My hospital stay per day is $250 and total annual out of pocket is $4400. Thank you for sharing this and please share what happens next?
Donica.
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 19, 2018, 04:13:46 PM
And, the first of the bills has arrived... For the hospital, 9 hours of OR time and one night's stay:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180919/9cbdf5d80b3ccfef44c9e5c5170d37d2.png)
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Oh... wow. The quoted costs for my facial surgery are a fraction of the total gross on your bill, but with my "insurance" I have to pay it all, and go out of the country to make it even close to affordable. This was Kaiser Permanente? I don't think that's available to me.
Stephanie
The amounts are supposedly the "usual and customary" charges. Then the HMO insurance side pays a discounted amount, and I have to pay my copay and deductible.
I'm at the Max Out Of Pocket amount already and won't owe anything additional.
By the way, that bill doesn't include the "professional" charges for the surgeons and anesthesiologist. Yow!
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Michelle, may I ask how you chose your FFS surgeon? I think after HRT and a bunch of electrolysis, this is the next step I'll need to take in my transition.
She hasn't received my bill for services rendered covering 10 days. And I do not accept insurance!
Post-op +21 days.
There is still a little bit of bruising, fading away. The sutures in the mouth are breaking down, and the swelling on the jawline is slowly decreasing. The jaw is not tender any more, but the left Masseter muscle is still a bit sore.
Here's me with a cosmetic cover-up over the bruises.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/ffa3ab2b4512f28a4e2df61e56bd5b7c.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/077e9a705acc46baeb6cb370e8c782c7.jpg)
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/5836c41276ceee69c23236ad09024f12.jpg)
Quote from: Laurie on September 19, 2018, 08:41:48 PM
She hasn't received my bill for services rendered covering 10 days. And I do not accept insurance!
Uh oh... Honey badgers! To the ramparts!
Quote from: Sarah1979 on September 19, 2018, 06:57:52 PM
Michelle, may I ask how you chose your FFS surgeon? I think after HRT and a bunch of electrolysis, this is the next step I'll need to take in my transition.
Drs. Kleinberger and Shih work for Kaiser NorCal, and happened to be the default surgeons for this within Kaiser. Dr Kleinberger trained under Dr. Jeffery Spiegel of Boston, a very good FFS surgeon. His technique makes relatively subtle changes, avoiding the obvious "You've had work done!" look. I preferred the more subtle changes, partially as they will age better, as well as look better now on an older woman. (I'm 64) The drawback is that he had an extraordinarily long waitlist, and was doing 40-50 FFS patients a year.
I filed a grievance and was shifted to another surgeon new to the system in the Sacramento office. I was evaluated and put in the queue to be scheduled in a few months when the doctor suddenly left Kaiser. With all of the Sacramento doctor's patients left hanging, Kaiser granted Dr Kleinberger more Operating Room hours, and added many patients, including me, to his queue. I was scheduled for August 28, 2018, much better than the old estimate of mid-2019.
Quote from: Laurie on September 19, 2018, 08:41:48 PM
She hasn't received my bill for services rendered covering 10 days. And I do not accept insurance!
But I've heard that you do accept alternate forms of payment...
Stephanie
Quote from: Steph2.0 on September 20, 2018, 07:59:23 AM
But I've heard that you do accept alternate forms of payment...
Stephanie
Fridge Chocolate !!!
You know, when you're scrounging around the house and can't find any. You look on top of the fridge and there is that bit of leftover chocolate with the wrapper all peeled up and waving. Who cares if it's a little whiter than it used to be. That chocolate is worth it's weight in gold ... well, maybe not, but still .. :D
Quote from: Steph2.0 on September 20, 2018, 07:59:23 AM
But I've heard that you do accept alternate forms of payment...
Stephanie
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/9aeadda183b5fb551ebde55e46f15b0b.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/bda4c4125ff72f4c32da54da666fb342.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/16a36f89e5c0a3fc0876c810795146d9.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/8352fd2157b5c3c16a594eba85441ace.jpg)
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 20, 2018, 09:58:57 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/9aeadda183b5fb551ebde55e46f15b0b.jpg)
I just gained 10 lbs
Quote from: Faith on September 20, 2018, 10:00:08 AM
I just gained 10 lbs
Not really Faith. Her servings will only add 3lbs.. If I dished it up you might gain 15....
yes they were good.
Hugs,
Laurie
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 20, 2018, 09:58:57 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/9aeadda183b5fb551ebde55e46f15b0b.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/bda4c4125ff72f4c32da54da666fb342.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/16a36f89e5c0a3fc0876c810795146d9.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180920/8352fd2157b5c3c16a594eba85441ace.jpg)
IDK Laurie? That looks like a sufficient form of payment to me. Fit for an Angel.
Oh, I just realized that bottom picture is a <<<<PIZZA>>> :D.
Quote from: Michelle_P on September 19, 2018, 04:13:46 PM
And, the first of the bills has arrived... For the hospital, 9 hours of OR time and one night's stay:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180919/9cbdf5d80b3ccfef44c9e5c5170d37d2.png)
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Holy , my gah.. and no surgeon costs.. hmm this is gonna be tougher than i thought.. i have a budget less than that .. and wow.. just plan wow.. surgical costs certainly have gotten out of control in USA/NA
Quote from: Veronica A on September 20, 2018, 05:04:31 PM
Holy , my gah.. and no surgeon costs.. hmm this is gonna be tougher than i thought.. i have a budget less than that .. and wow.. just plan wow.. surgical costs certainly have gotten out of control in USA/NA
Oh, this isn't the actual cost anywhere sane. These are the mythical ChargeMaster prices, not the actual agreed insured rates, or what a good FFS surgeon would have already negotiated.
Hospitals have something that they call internally the "Saudi Prince Problem". If an insanely wealthy person were unexpectedly admitted, what rate could be charged to soak as much cash as possible from a patient? Seriously. Hospital administrators live in an interesting world.
The actual rate is negotiated between insurers and the hospital, or the independent FFS surgeons and hospital. This is much lower than the ChargeMaster rate.
Finally, I am already at the Max Out Of Pocket level for my insurance, so I won't be on the hook for copay or deductibles. Everything done is covered by insurance except the blepharoplasty on the left eye. (I wanted them even!). I paid that before I was admitted.
I did have quite a bit of work done but the charges from the better known FFS surgeons for all of this would be around $42,000 to $62,000 without insurance.
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Quote from: Michelle_P on September 20, 2018, 06:35:57 PM
Oh, this isn't the actual cost anywhere sane. These are the mythical ChargeMaster prices, not the actual agreed insured rates, or what a good FFS surgeon would have already negotiated.
Hospitals have something that they call internally the "Saudi Prince Problem". If an insanely wealthy person were unexpectedly admitted, what rate could be charged to soak as much cash as possible from a patient? Seriously. Hospital administrators live in an interesting world.
The actual rate is negotiated between insurers and the hospital, or the independent FFS surgeons and hospital. This is much lower than the ChargeMaster rate.
Finally, I am already at the Max Out Of Pocket level for my insurance, so I won't be on the hook for copay or deductibles. Everything done is covered by insurance except the blepharoplasty on the left eye. (I wanted them even!). I paid that before I was admitted.
I did have quite a bit of work done but the charges from the better known FFS surgeons for all of this would be around $42,000 to $62,000 without insurance.
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thats better, i am not covered here for any of that.. soo all out of my own pocket.. and like my max is arou d 60k all up for FFS..
One month post-op, the bruising has almost vanished and the swelling is definitely reduced.
Things will continue changing slowly from this point on.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180928/abe977237f59b5f8706acf32a09dce02.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180928/3efca1c2ae5548aa15e8e435f2e11323.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180928/55e516fbb2f68f5b9d5909ac98e2a840.jpg)
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Here is a composite image of my pre-op appearance with my one month post-op (no makeup) images. This might make studying the details of the surgery's effect easier.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180928/24c1ed2588f12e7587c79ee6c7c5363e.jpg)
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Wow Michelle wow you look great! Omg and there's still the facelift to come!!
Well done, they did a very good job.... 😊
Iove the side profile... Wow look so much younger and so feminine
I agree the results are nothing but spectacular. The difference is dramatic but the effects are very natural.
That is just fantastic Michelle. I see changes that are more than subtle. I see very prominent feminine changes. You look lovely girl. Thank you for the great update.
Hugs,
Donica.
Post-op +6 weeks
My asymmetric swelling on my nose is almost gone at 6 weeks, and the sutures and rough spots inside the nostrils have mostly faded. The incision line below the nose spat a couple bits of sutures last week near the corners, but is now settling down and the rough areas are fading. It is barely visible at this point. There are still some discolored areas on the cheeks right below the eyes, but between BB cream sunblock and my undereye 'serum' concealer these are barely noticible.
I just lost the last of the 'dissolvable' sutures in my mouth yesterday afternoon.
Feeling is starting to return on my chin and a little bit on the forehead, and my smile is more even. Both eyebrows move, although the left one moves more, so I sometimes get that quizzical "Mr. Spock" look. My nose is crooked, favoring one side slightly, but it is the exact same 'crooked' I had before surgery, just with a cuter little nose with an upturned tip!
From folks who went through this before me with the same doctor, I know things won't be really settling down til at least 3 months postop, and a few changes and bit of healing will happen out past a year post-op. It is another test of patience.
I'll probably add another set of pictures in late October at the 2 month point.
Perhaps too early to say, but how satisfied are you with your experience with your surgeons?
Quote from: Another Nikki on October 08, 2018, 11:41:29 PM
Perhaps too early to say, but how satisfied are you with your experience with your surgeons?
Very satisfied. They did everything they said they would in the surgery, the results look quite reasonable for this point past surgery, and I have seen definite improvements in the way most others respond to me, appearance-wise.
I've just had my 2 month post-op check with Dr Kleinberger. No problems, all healing quite well. As expected there is still fluid (swelling) in the chin and tip of the nose, and a bit along the jawline. This will be around til about the 6 month point.
I put together a couple of composites. The first shows pre-op, and the 1 and 2 month post-op versions of me. The second shows pre-op, and post op at 8 days, 15 days, and one month, ti give some idea of how the initial appearance changes.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181102/0cabd889d6bcf4e7e396795cfda2bf1d.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181102/5b036fe10723137998d162865cd58ed1.jpg)
I love your new avatar Michelle. You are looking very lovely. That smile says it all. You look very happy.
Hugs,
Donica.
Michelle your results are amazing. How is the scar at the bottom of your nose? Has it faded any further? Overall how noticeable do you think it is?
Judi
Quote from: JudiBlueEyes on November 02, 2018, 10:41:11 AM
Michelle your results are amazing. How is the scar at the bottom of your nose? Has it faded any further? Overall how noticeable do you think it is?
Judi
Here is what that area looked like 4 hours post-op, and how it looks 2 months later. I would say Drs. Kleinberger and Shih did one heck of a nice piece of work.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181102/3d2acae30ab835f698507825f5dae05b.jpg) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181102/21b13fb9f5d929b2b49f9f07a63b1142.jpg)
I agree Michelle. I really can't see anything except a little redness. It just looks like you may have a cold.
Donica.
Quote from: Donica on November 02, 2018, 04:01:17 PM
I agree Michelle. I really can't see anything except a little redness. It just looks like you may have a cold.
As a matter of fact... Pesky thing slowed me down for a few days.
Thank you Michelle! The results are much better than I imagined from other peoples descriptions of their FFS. Your doctors did a great job.
Judi
@Michelle_P
Hey Michelle,
Thanks for sharing your photos, you look wonderful! The front on change is really good but the side profile - WOW! what an amazing difference! - the surgery has really feminized your side and angled profile. Lovely!
Take care,
Sonja.
Quote from: Sonja on November 04, 2018, 04:09:20 PM
@Michelle_P
Hey Michelle,
Thanks for sharing your photos, you look wonderful! The front on change is really good but the side profile - WOW! what an amazing difference! - the surgery has really feminized your side and angled profile. Lovely!
Take care,
Sonja.
Thanks! The changes around the eyes and the nose/upper lip area are remarkable. Jawline and chin changes are still somewhat hidden by the swelling, but should become visible in a few months. I can FEEL the changes in there, particularly on the chin. I'll do another photo update at the 6 month point.
I must state again how amazing your results are. Your doctors did a fabulous job. You look like your female twin sister. So natural and beautiful results.