Author Topic: Selective Services..  (Read 3540 times)

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ktmoore89

Selective Services..
« on: October 30, 2007, 11:29:23 pm »
According to federal and state law -
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Almost all male U.S. citizens, and male aliens living in the U.S., who are 18 through 25, are required to register with Selective Service.
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If you do not register, you could be prosecuted and fined up to $250,000 and/or be put in jail for up to five years. Registration is also a requirement to qualify for Federal student aid, job training benefits, and most Federal employment.
So what happens if your <not allowed> (MtF/FtM) then?

Well I decided to call and find out.

My situation:
I started my transition process from MtF about two years ago when I was 16 years of age. I decided to wait until I was 18 years of age to officially start my new life that way if anyone objected I'd be able to make my own choices and support myself. During those two years I did quite a bit of research and started taking minor actions like laser hair removal, building credit, finding a new doctor, etc. Right before I turned 18 I started hormones and came out to everyone. Once I turned 18 my new life began. I legally changed my name and sealed my old records. I changed my gender marker on all documents except my birth certificate and social security. However I haven't had my SRS yet, but am planning on starting with an Orchiectomy within the next month or so and then SRS within the next year.

My 1st experience dealing with the Selective Services:
I called the office of registration and explained my situation. I've never received anything from them but wanted to make sure that I did whatever necessary to avoid the possible punishments by not registering. I was told that even though I'm currently a female I was still born male and am required to register. All one has to do is fill out a registration card, list gender as female, and make a little note of being MtF. Once that was completed I was told to not to worry about dealing with Selective Services again.

Easy enough right?
Not with the world we live in.. :(

2nd experience dealing with the Selective Services:
About 1 month after registering I received a letter in the mail stating that females aren't aloud to register for Selective Services and if there was an error to notify them within 10 days or my registration will be canceled out of the system. Hmm.. well that sounds nice but I want to make sure that still doesn't cause me any problems. So I call the office of registration again. This time I managed to get someone that was inpatient, rude, and just plain disrespectful. This person laughed at my situation and repeatably called me "sir". I was put on hold several times and in the end the call just "dropped" somehow. So I called back. Was put on hold several more times and transfered. No one seemed to know what to do. They wouldn't even let me finish reading the letter I received. They couldn't find me in the system at all. I refused to register under my old name or as male though. Finally I was given the number of the headquarters for Selective Services. The person I talked to there gave me the same treatment plus wouldn't take anything over the phone as I could be anyone. That person suggested that I write up a detailed report to go before the board. Why should I write up a detailed report? I decided that the information is indeed correct and am willing to let it cancel out of the system. Besides  by the time I'm 26 I will 100% physically be female. I doubt they want to take this to the next level but I'm willing to fight it.

Has anyone else had to deal with this? I mean it shouldn't be this difficult.

Course.. just for a simple name change I had to go before the chief judge on the circuit level with a lawyer under a real trial..








lisagurl

Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2007, 10:51:34 am »
My story is too long to post but I can tell you it happen during Vietnam. My file at the selective service board is 10 inches thick and it took 5 years to finely be classified 4F for a physiological problem.  There is no end to the bigots there that want to make your life a hell. They are all veterans. No so simple.

Offline Terra

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Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2007, 11:43:32 pm »
I know its a bit of a pain, but why not just send it in with your new name, and leave it at that? After all, as soon as you show up should you ever actually be called, they will dismiss you. Less hassle, and less exposure to risk, as the government is very creative for making life difficult for minorities, especially the LGBT community.

Besides, your new name would probably disqualify you from service in and of itself. Not to be mean or put you down, but you are still technically a male as long as you have the parts, which means you have to check that box. Alot of legal documents have severe penalties for purposefully checking the wrong box and I'd hate to see you get burned hun.
"If you quit before you try, you don't deserve to dream." -grandmother

ktmoore89

Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2007, 12:14:40 am »
Besides, your new name would probably disqualify you from service in and of itself. Not to be mean or put you down, but you are still technically a male as long as you have the parts, which means you have to check that box. Alot of legal documents have severe penalties for purposefully checking the wrong box and I'd hate to see you get burned hun.

According to the state of Michigan.. all one needs to legally change gender is a note from a doctor. I've done that. So if my state agrees with my status why should I have to ever check "male"?

Offline Terra

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Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2007, 12:45:29 am »
Kati I agree with you, that should be enough. But the government supersedes the states rules. I understand that this seems unfair, and it is, but you have to ask if it is worth it and in your ability to fight it.

I suggest that the next time you talk to someone in the selective service you get their name, position, and contact number. If they give you the same kind of difficulty you can then ask to talk to their supervisor. Since they record their calls for legal purposes this will  get the supervisors attention if you are being mistreated. Because if they don't do something about it, they risk getting in trouble themselves.

If you continue to have trouble, I suggest simply putting male. Yes, again, I know it sucks but you don't want to risk not being able to get loans to attend college because of pride. Once you get the surgery you can always start putting female. The legal system is a minefield for people like us, so you have to be careful where you step and why. So again, is it really worth the risk to not just go with the system?
"If you quit before you try, you don't deserve to dream." -grandmother

SusanK

Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2007, 08:36:26 pm »
Kati, I suspect until you have successfully completed your transistion, including having your birth certificate changed to "F" then you will have to use "M" since it still your birth sex and it's what the Selective Service uses to define who registers. I suspect you have to register and then change it when you have the new birth certificate to verify you are no longer officially male. And then I suspect that will take time and several efforts, as the Selective Service is the most curmudgeon of the federal agencies, meaning they don't like removing anyone from their rolls and from being 1-A.

Thanks for the memories of 1968 and being 1-A. Not that I need it, but I'm personally worried our President will request reactivating the draft next year (since registering was never stopped and the list of eligible men is ready and waiting). All the Army needs is authorization and funding, and with the lack of new soldiers for the endless, unwinnable war, it's almost inevitable to try to reactivate it. And don't expect any Democrat to yell too loud unless they're already an anti-war one. After all it's about fighting terrorists and supporting the troops, ya' know.

I'll park the soapbox.

--Susan--

SocalledLife

Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2007, 01:37:29 pm »
Fill it out with male, and keep your fingers crossed that they don't start a draft again.  No point in even trying to reason with the fed over something that they very likely will never use.  Even if you were drafted you would most likely be tied up in the system for a very long time in your situation.  If not, we will probably be in the same unit!  ;D

If all else fails,
"You can get anything you want at Alice’s restaurant"

DANA

daisybelle

Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2007, 03:15:18 pm »
I guess ENDA does not provide answers for this either....

Daisy

SusanK

Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2007, 09:18:31 am »
Fill it out with male, and keep your fingers crossed that they don't start a draft again.  No point in even trying to reason with the fed over something that they very likely will never use.  Even if you were drafted you would most likely be tied up in the system for a very long time in your situation.  If not, we will probably be in the same unit!  ;D

If all else fails, "You can get anything you want at Alice’s restaurant"

Don't hold your breath about no draft. I'm betting we'll hear about it from Bush sometime in the spring-summer next year (hints in the State of the Union?) because Iraq is depleting troops so fast they can't be replaced despite the stop-loss (discharge, retirements), extended tours, shorter stateside tours, lower recruitment standards (no HS diploma, criminals, illegal/legal immigrant, etc.), more NG callups and reservists and higher re-enlistment bonsuses.

Almost all the generals are saying if we don't lower the troop strentgh in Iraq we'll need the draft by the spring 2008 because the Army and Marines will be exhausted. And that doesn't count any other global need for military forces, like after-attacking Iran or another "surge." The draft is almost inevitable unless something drastic happens. But then I'm hoping I lose my bet about this.

--Susan--

Offline Breastquest

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Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2010, 11:16:29 am »
They have raised the age at which one can enlist, and the atmosphere has definitely changed for the better since i got out in '90.

Offline LordKAT

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Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2010, 11:30:17 am »
They raised it from 35?

Offline Breastquest

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Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2010, 11:51:34 am »
My brother in law is 39, he is going into OCS in June.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2010, 12:19:20 pm by Breastquest »

Offline LordKAT

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Re: Selective Services..
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2010, 11:56:17 am »
cool, I was told it was raised to 45 when that used to be only ok if you had previously served.

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