Financially, Transitioning Can Be A Disaster

[tekla]

Some people value a modicum of personal privacy.

Check your watch.  It's 2011 in most of the US, and personal privacy is a quaint 19th century concept not a current reality.  Lawyers have made sure of that.

[JungianZoe]

I am going to fix my life or die trying.

Thank you for reminding me of the spirit that I need in tough times like this.

[Julie Marie]

The taking of an experience and applying it as an absolute does NOTHING except put more hyperbole out there that accomplishes nothing productive.  And if you really thought that one datapoint of real life experience spoke for itself, then my experiences as *I* lived them in a very conservative area of the State as well as within a very conservative agency should also speak for itself...

In my original post I spoke of trans people I personally know (not on the Internet) and how most of them suffered financially by transitioning.  Mine is not a single experience but rather the experience of most of the trans people I know.  I can think of only one exception out of dozens of examples (datapoints).  But as you said, your experience is one datapoint and I completely agree with you, that puts more hyperbole out there and accomplishes nothing productive.

You mean aside from the fact that I am NOT 'transgender?'

Medically and in the opinion of doctors, health care professionals and mental health professionals (the people often referred to in a court of law as "experts"), if you are XY and female identified, you are transgender.  Same goes if you're XX and male identified.  You can scream otherwise until you are blue in the face but that fact will never change.

[Gravity Girl]

But there is a world of difference between being TS and identifing as such. Being TS is a medical thing...identifing as TS is cultural and in a cultural identity sense a lot of people actually aren't TS.

But we should almost certainly step away from this direction of talk because any second now someone will get offended and start wailing about how they don't want you to tell them how they identify.

[Ann Onymous]

Medically and in the opinion of doctors, health care professionals and mental health professionals (the people often referred to in a court of law as "experts"), if you are XY and female identified, you are transgender.  Same goes if you're XX and male identified.  You can scream otherwise until you are blue in the face but that fact will never change.

The word 'transgender' did not EVER appear anywhere in my medical file.  The letters to my surgeon did make reference to my meeting a criterion to be considered 'transsexual' and that I was under care for a 'transsexual' medical condition.  Fortunately, I got my life in order before this 'transgender' horse->-bleeped-<- became so commonplace that it pervades a sub-forum captioned 'transsexual talk.'

Of course your reference to chromosomes also leaves out the other combinations that routinely surface...but it was clear that you wanted to turn the topic in a direction that runs people off from the boards. 

[Julie Marie]

Valerie, I realize posting the full name is often unwise and I know some here have been outed by posting a picture here or providing a real name and their life turned a disaster.  And that only supports my original post.  Still, some of us have posted real pictures of ourselves (yes, that's me) and used our real names (yes, that's my real first and middle name).  I figured I've got nothing else to lose, so for me it wasn't a big deal to do so.

Honestly, if coming out and transitioning resulted in being an overall positive experience, I would do the same thing.  I'd want to be positive example for the community.  But when being outed can cause one to lose something, I fully understand anonymity.  It's crucial. 

It's hard for people to believe what they see on the Internet.  So you need more than a statement to establish credibility.  Longevity, personal photos and real names all help in establishing that credibility.  If you went on LinkedIn and gave a fake name, your credibility would be sunk once you made personal contact.

Im sorry you had a bad experience with your job Julie.

Thank you Valerie.  There's not a lot that can be done now except to let others know this CAN happen.  It doesn't mean it will, just be aware it can.

[Renate]

Well, I like data points.
How about if the OP throws a poll at the top of this post?

Transition, for me, has financially:

• had a decidedly positive effect
• had a slight positive effect
• had no effect
• had a slight negative effect
• had a decidedly negative effect
• been a disaster

[Julie Marie]

but it was clear that you wanted to turn the topic in a direction that runs people off from the boards.

Please do not put words in my mouth.  Running people off the board never was, is not now, and never will be my intention.  Providing accurate and real information and real life experiences, however, always has been, is and always will be.

I read posts I respond to completely and carefully and post with great time and thought put into it.  I wish to offend no one nor do I wish to engage battle.  Getting along is a decision and one I prefer.

[V M]

No, the job I was in charge of designing was in full swing when they told me they had no work.  And the project manager, who pre-coming out, had said I'd be assisting him with job management like I did on an earlier job, stopped talking to me. 

I filed a complaint with the department of human rights.  That's still in progress.

I think it sucks what they did    I hope you're able to get some kind of settlement... Would like to know how it all turns out

Any prospects for a new job?

[cindianna_jones]

I definitely had three jobs where "my condition" was a significant factor in making my life miserable. It took a few years for me to leave that trail of history in the dust. It was a hard time.

But, somehow, I did manage to get a few great jobs and turned that situation around! Now, I work for myself. My boss is a real beeyach. She won't let me off on time or show up to work late. She makes me work overtime all the time and I never get paid for it!

[Hikari]

But there is a world of difference between being TS and identifing as such. Being TS is a medical thing...identifing as TS is cultural and in a cultural identity sense a lot of people actually aren't TS.

But we should almost certainly step away from this direction of talk because any second now someone will get offended and start wailing about how they don't want you to tell them how they identify.

Wise words, as always. Some paths lead to no resolution.

[Steph]

I definitely had three jobs where "my condition" was a significant factor in making my life miserable. It took a few years for me to leave that trail of history in the dust. It was a hard time.

But, somehow, I did manage to get a few great jobs and turned that situation around! Now, I work for myself. My boss is a real beeyach. She won't let me off on time or show up to work late. She makes me work overtime all the time and I never get paid for it!

I think your boss is a Jack Ass... Oh wait a sec...

[Gravity Girl]

Well, I like data points.
How about if the OP throws a poll at the top of this post?

Transition, for me, has financially:

• had a decidedly positive effect
• had a slight positive effect
• had no effect
• had a slight negative effect
• had a decidedly negative effect
• been a disaster

stupid poll is stupid and will prove nothing. firstly, those midway through transition or just finished in the last 5 years are almost certainly going to be financially worse off because even if they haven't lost their job like everyone is suggesting, they'll be paying or have just paid for everything. Secondly this is a support site and i the people who have had success won't really frequent here so the poll will not be a real reflection of reality, merely a snap shot of what has happened to people at susans. It would have been better to ask about employment status rather than financial gain.

[cindianna_jones]

I think your boss is a Jack Ass... Oh wait a sec...

Yup. Sometimes I wonder.

Cindi

[tekla]

She won't let me off on time or show up to work late. She makes me work overtime all the time and I never get paid for it!

Your boss sounds like me, except for the overtime deal, we're a union crew, overtime is our god.  But the showing up late?  I tell people who I hire that if you're going to show up late don't bother showing up at all.  I got rid of more people for that one thing then for everything else combined.  But I don't think that is really unusual in real working situations.  As far as getting off on time, when you're in strictly enforced overtime, 'golden time' as we call it after 12 hours, you really don't want it to end.

[RhinoP]

I started my transitioning with a FFS procedure first because it was something that was less gender defining (rhinoplasty) and simply would make me more attractive in either/or gender role, and it both set me in the poverty category, and what's worse, the procedure was botched. I wasn't able to file a lawsuit because the statute of limitations for malpractice is only one year, in which, concerning rhinoplasty, surgeons "by-pass" the possibility of being sued during that year because they all swear, even in textbooks, that it takes longer than a year for a rhinoplasty result to truly "show-itself" and heal properly, when it actually only takes as much as 6 months for the entire spectrum of swelling to go down, and only a month for true deformities and malpractice injuries to show themselves.

So it's been really building my life back up, ground up, to recover from all of that; it only makes things tougher that my disfigured feature is one of the many that cause a major disturbance in my social life - I look sickly to the point hardly any fellow young adults want to socialize with me, much less help me out in the financial/living department. Thankfully, I've found a way to at least help my nasal feature appear healthier and less maimed - I now wear a translucent bandage strip over the most deformed and scarred parts of my nose, and thankfully, it honestly hides it all quite well, though the problems surrounding the surgery (malpractice, deformed appearance, criminal doctor, no chance at justice) are still on my mind quite a bit. The post-traumatic effects have been devastating for years. However, the biggest worry of all - the way my nose itself looks - is less on my mind now since I'm able to successfully hide the feature from my and other eyes.

Now, if I only could have a wand that makes my forehead smaller, my skin less oily and red, my chin less lumpy, and my facial/leg/arm hair less thick or even non-existent, I'd truly be in business! I truly made a horrible mistake with choosing that FFS procedure first though; if I had chosen hormones first, I almost garauntee my nose itself (the thick, fatty skin, which was my biggest problem) would have changed all on it's own, no surgery involved. Sadly, I was so tempted by a non-RLE procedure and because of the fact I wasn't sure of myself all those years back, that it really all turned into the worst thing that ever happened to me in my life. Not really the worst by standard definitions, but to my emotions and what specific things effect me, it was.

[Nemo]

To bring some balance back into the thread - here's another exception. Hi there

After being unemployed for over a year, I got a voluntary job as a part-time web administrator for a Christian charity, in a building also home to a good few other projects that are also Christian. After three months, they liked me so much they offered me a paid contract.

Then transition started. Given the stories like OP, bad experience with Christians, etc., I was bricking it. I didn't want to lose a job I'd barely started, especially since the atmosphere's so warm, accepting and everything else. Job is good, people are great, it's the first I've ever been in that I truly enjoy. One of my biggest prayers at the time was that none of that would change through my being trans. The worst thing about that period that my paranoia made me defensive and snappy. I wasn't the best of people during that time, to my shame.

Fast forward to now. I'm still working with this charity, in the same job and even have a new one. I part-volunteer, part earn for another charity in the same building - well, we've moved premises, but still. I'm getting asked to do website work for other projects. The atmosphere is still warm, accepting, etc. - in fact it got *better* when I came out as people gave encouraging replies. My boss often asks after my progress - she's like a second mum :3

I am sorry for all the people who have gone through so much crap just to be who they are. I can only shake my head in dismay and wonder what these guys' problem is

[Julie Marie]

As has been with every group to which a negative stigma was attached, when you stick together and fight for your rights, eventually you will start the pendulum swinging the other way.  Unity is crucial but we're not so good on that front.  But as the penalties for non-conformity ease and the misinformation is replaced by fact, we should start seeing more and more of us standing up for the community.

Right now we have the fearless, those with nothing more to lose, and those with a strong sense of right, standing on the front lines.  That's the way it always is.  But as long as we can keep the numbers of those who are us, but reject us, to a minimum, we should see an increase of supporters as time goes on.

Society knows murder and physical violence will only land them in jail but resorting to things like creating financial hardship is rarely against the law or just too hard to prove.  So many of us have snubbed our noses at those consequences.  Maybe, eventually, society will get the message their tactics are failing.

[SandraJane]

To bring some balance back into the thread - here's another exception. Hi there

After being unemployed for over a year, I got a voluntary job as a part-time web administrator for a Christian charity, in a building also home to a good few other projects that are also Christian. After three months, they liked me so much they offered me a paid contract.

Then transition started. Given the stories like OP, bad experience with Christians, etc., I was bricking it.

Was the charity associated (not asking for the name of the Charity) with a particular denomination? It sounds like it has had a very positive effect in your life!

[Cindy Stephens]

What I find interesting is how some people seem to disregard what seems to be fairly accepted information, and disparage attempts at putting actual numbers on it.  It almost feels like the attempts to disavow global warming.  Not because it is wrong, just that is contrary to some preconceived notion.  I don't see how anyone can formulate a plan deal with it in their career without knowing the stats.  There are certainly plenty of unknowable's that have to be dealt with by everyone.  Look at the suicide and attempted suicide rates amongst  our people.  That seems to be accepted by the medical establishment.  I don't believe that this occurs because of merely coming to terms with being trans.  It is a direct offshoot of the social expense of being trans.

By the way is anyone else afraid of using any words to describe us?  You're going to offend someone when none is meant.  I wonder what cis people feel about it?