Why would someone go "full time" before going on HRT or being on HRT a while?

[AbraCadabra]

How awfull, stalinistc in nature

Hum, and all based on SoC as they like to see it.
Interpretation makes their world go round...

Stalinist, fascist, nationalist, only the finest of it all :-)

Axélle

[Assoluta]

I was one who started fulltime before I went on HRT. For me, it was my own decision that, if I could not cut it presenting female to others on a fulltime bases, then why in the world would I subject my body to the changes and permanent changes HRT will make.

Also, remember, there are some countries that require at least some fulltime RLE before consideration for HRT is given.

I had no problems passing fulltime without the hrt. I was only fulltime for about 3 months before hrt, but i hadnt had any issues.n A lot of passing has to do with attitude more than the pills in my opinion.

I could pretty much Ctrl + C and Ctrl + V this for my own sentiments and what I did for my transition - I transitioned three months before HRT too!

Interestingly as well, I seemed to start looking more feminine after I decided to transition and presented as female, even though I hadn't started taking hormones! At the time you could have mistaken it for wishful thinking, but I look back at photos now, five years later, and my photos at 17 look more masculine than when I was 19 (pictures without makeup) and about to transition.

[Keaira]

I was told by my Sister that I would have to have an initial consultation with the Endo, have a chat with the hospital's Psychologist and get a blood test done before I could start HRT.

None of that happened for me. It was just a physical and then prescription. Then word got out that I was on hormones. 2 months later I was Keaira full time. Mainly because people at work found out I was on HRT and some of the men I worked with got a little uncomfortable with me sharing the bathroom with them. So I ended up using the women's bathroom and getting my name tag changed on my uniforms.  My doctor is even writing me a letter so I can get my gender marker changed.

[Mister]

I did no RLE of any sort.  I decided to transition, saw my doctor, wrote a ton of letters and went on with my life.  I tried to get everything done as quickly as possible and in a way that impacted my life the least.  If I could do it again, I'd do it exactly the same way.

[Lynne]

The official(and free) way in our country is that you have to change your gender marker and name before you get the approval for HRT and SRS. Not many adhere to this regulation, most people here self medicate for a while, or pay a private doctor to do the blood-work and prescribe hormones.
I find it quite hard to understand the reasoning behind the official method, it doesn't really make any sense, a lot of people have a hard time passing without HRT, why push them into a really uncomfortable situation?
I'm lucky because I would be alright without HRT if I work on my voice, but I don't want to wait too long to start it, but given my financial situation I may have wait until I can get my name changed.

[AbraCadabra]

The official(and free) way in our country is that you have to change your gender marker and name before you get the approval for HRT and SRS. Not many adhere to this regulation, most people here self medicate for a while, or pay a private doctor to do the blood-work and prescribe hormones.
I find it quite hard to understand the reasoning behind the official method, it doesn't really make any sense, a lot of people have a hard time passing without HRT, why push them into a really uncomfortable situation?
I'm lucky because I would be alright without HRT if I work on my voice, but I don't want to wait too long to start it, but given my financial situation I may have wait until I can get my name changed.

It keeps on to amaze me how so very different the SoC are being interpreted... hard to find words.
In my place of residence SA, I can NOT change my name, nor my gender marker (NO WAYS!) and then they expect us to go full time RLE without HRT for more then 1 year - mostly it becomes 2 years!
This is the time when you might have your 1st op (penectomy and orchiectomy - NO vaginoplasty yet!) THEN only may you get HRT clearance, and change your name and gender marker.

The obvious workaround, DIY HRT... and if you a citizen (not just a resident like I am) can apply to have your name changed - but gender change is only possible after GCS/SRS/GRS. It then will take another year or more before one's ID document is finally changed! At very best a 3 year process during which you need to work as a female with a male ID!

A very frustrating situation if you have to have GCS in SA. Otherwise some more sane rulings of 1 year HRT plus RLE will be fine, plus ONE letter for GCS, as is the case with Thailand surgeons.

Axélle
PS: may I ask your country id that is not an issue?

[Lynne]

I live in Hungary, Central Europe. The whole gender marker and name change can be done in 2-3 months if you have a little money and a little luck with appointments. You only need to mail the government 3 medical reports(psychologist, psychiatrist, urologist) along with your request and they send you your new birth certificate(at least 1 month) and then you can start to change all your other documents as well.

[kelly_aus]

This is the time when you might have your 1st op (penectomy and orchiectomy - NO vaginoplasty yet!) THEN only may you get HRT clearance, and change your name and gender marker.

I have to ask this, how do they do a vaginoplasty after you've had a penectomy? Given that the penis provides a lot of the donor tissue for a vaginoplasty?

[AbraCadabra]

I have to ask this, how do they do a vaginoplasty after you've had a penectomy? Given that the penis provides a lot of the donor tissue for a vaginoplasty?

Kelly, they (SBAH) ONLY do colovaginoplasty, yet they do 'keep' ALL scrotal and penile skin. How?
Both just bunched up (like two Turkish figs) behind a now created mini penis, sticking out in a perpetual mini erection. That's what I saw.
So, their version of penectomy mostly removes corpus cavernosa.

Furthermore, the urethra is not placed yet in the correct anatomical location i.e. further back, but comes out right after the mini penis, (to become the clit during 3d op). It's sort of like an early T Metoidioplasty clit... the size of a pinkie.

That is so, because there being no vagina/vaginal channel at the first op, the urethra be in the way during the 2nd op, i.e. colovaginoplasty.

The 3rd op then endeavours to create labia majora and minora from those 'Turkish figs' plus relocating the urethra (if you lucky...) and often easing open the ring-scar at the vaginal entry.

I hope this makes it clear - whether it makes sense, is written on another page :-)

Axélle
SABH = Steve Biko Academic Hospital, in Pretoria

[AbraCadabra]

Got that right hon,
I spend my last cent on having GCS in Phuket --- and I'm glad I did it.
Had some major motivation, right... :-)

They now they try to gather a group of 'victims' of that protocol-  which is strictly OK for natal females with cervical and vaginal cancer. That 2nd op, colovaginoplasty is mostly designed just for that.
GRS is just put piggy-back on it all, so as to save cost.
After all, those ops are free of charge.
And so you get what you pay for... well?

Axélle

[ApproachingMars]

I only just started HRT and have been living full time since 2003.

I did it because there was absolutely no fricking way I was going to continue living as female, knowing it made me unhappy, just because I couldn't afford hormones yet.  My personal appearance had nothing to do with it.  I found a group of people that accepted me and didn't care that I didn't pass to strangers yet.

Because of that experience I eventually gained the behavior and dress skills to pass pre-HRT.  That took time, though, and I'd be socially very far behind if I had just decided to wait until hormones.

[Tazia of the Omineca]

Well I go as full as I can, with my friends they call me a boy and refer to me as "Thomas" all the time. (Ick!)
When I am by myself and walking around I usually get seen as a girl even when I am dressed like a boy.
Once I got "Hey beautiful lady." walking home, and another time a guy checked me out while saying "I like your hair."
I just was always seen as a girl by most since I was 5. So I have always tried to keep up the appearance.

[pebbles]

Once I got "Hey beautiful lady." walking home, and another time a guy checked me out while saying "I like your hair."

Ooh you found a reasonably nice one... you haven't really been hit on until you've been hit on by a Foot fetishist. "Hey pretty lady I REALLY like your feet... Have you ever walked anywhere bare footed?" What an intresting evening. "Could I take your shoes off for you" lol XD It was in the middle of the fricking street!

How awfull, stalinistc in nature

Yep... This and the post you quoted was my general point. UK requires it.

I personally avoided that fate by aquiring hormones through other questionable means and basically doing the whole thing alone with very marginal resources.

I'm not allowed to endorse my methodology however in accordance with forum rules. But I will say I have no regrets beyond not doing it sooner.

[Maja.V]

I personally avoided that fate by aquiring hormones through other questionable means and basically doing the whole thing alone with very marginal resources.

I'm not allowed to endorse my methodology however in accordance with forum rules. But I will say I have no regrets beyond not doing it sooner.

I've gone through the same thing as you, and Axelle. We've only one therapist for the whole country, and if she denies treatment, you're out forever. Not to mention that one needs to go through RLE first, then they provide you with other things, like Axelle described. It's why I've started DIY.

[smooth]

I doubt I'd have got a foot past the gatekeepers and I wasn't going to waste any time trying. I followed an alternative route as well and didn't have anyone telling me what I had to first, or before doing that, or being considered for this, F that! Am I rid of the GD, you bet Do I wish I'd done it sooner, actually no. Apart from the GD my own life has been pretty ok and I'm not convinced it would have been better with my present day adjustments, in fact there's some things I don't think I would have experienced had I moved forward too quickly.

I read this earlier from Julie Marie
"I look at my partner Julie.  Hands down, without a doubt, I knew transition was right for her.  And today she will tell you it was.  I can't say the same for me.  As time goes on, I am finding the pendulum swinging back to male more and more.  I'm also getting tired of all the work I have to do to pass.  And I think I've ruined my voice.  I'd categorize myself as one of the fence sitters that HRT pushed over."

My own experience was the opposite. My experience pushed me back over the fence. I'm still taking E but I don't present as female or even androgynous. My chemistry is female but that's it. It's what I had to do to deal with my own GD but once that was dealt with I just wanted to get on with life without the added complication of further transition. I wonder if transition for some is a rolling stone gathering momentum and difficult to stop the faster it goes....

[El]

I know some people arent going to like this but i agree with the policy of requiring RLE before HRT. It makes sure that the people asking for these expensive and potentially dangerous drugs are serious about transitioning. This policy also makes the transitioner deal with the realities of being trans rather than living in the magic world where hormones will instantly make you a pretty princess. On the whole its a great way of saving NHS money, making sure only people who are serious and sure about transition have access to these drugs and forcing people to accept the reality of their situation. I am currently doing my hormone free HRT and i am glad it was required of me, i dont think i would pass so well if i hadnt had to make so much effort up to this point.

[AbraCadabra]

I would not argue with that, but there are also some people who HRT would help with the RLE. There is a lot a potential for mental illness in the trans world and there are a lot of suicides.

Letting people kill themselves off because RLE is a living hell for them, is not really a valid selection mechanism IMO

Beverley

I so DO agree with you Beverley.,

I have had "therapy" that was more concerned with the "therapist's" own reputation not making any mistakes, then any patient committing suicide.

Crying during therapy was not allowed, neither was to use the word SRS or ask for HRT. That was made VERY clear at the start. Nuts!

It's really very easy to go this way for some gatekeepers, since all that be said: "ah well, I knew... that person was mentally just too unstable, could not be given E... couldn't be saved, so sorry"

So, that was just another statistic and NO-ONE gives a damn.

Axélle
PS: I was very close during my early transition until I found ways to get HRT other then from that pompous, over-inflated, ass-hole of a 'psychiatrist'... (BTW, the only allowed gatekeeper for SA government hospitals)

[Stephe]

I agree HRT shouldn't require RLE and IMHO they should put you on AA BEFORE you start therapy as a diagnostic tool. If you like what the AA's do, then you probably will like what the rest of HRT does as well.

As far as SRS? I strongly feel RLE should remain a requirement. Pre or post op isn't going to cause any undo strain as far as living day to day or cause you not to pass/live as a woman. If someone can't live as a woman pre op, do they think somehow this surgery is going to make being a woman some sort of instant/simple given? And honestly being a woman involves a lot more compromises than many people grasp until they are there. Well worth it IMHO but they exist none the less and people NEED to accept everything that goes along with being a woman on a daily basis first. IMHO of course.

I lived for years full time before I was on HRT and think it helped me a LOT in developing self confidence.

[eli77]

I'll be at seven-ish months full time by the time of my bottom surgery.

I'm not saying that would be the right way to go for everyone, but it's right for me.

As far as SRS? I strongly feel RLE should remain a requirement. Pre or post op isn't going to cause any undo strain as far as living day to day or cause you not to pass/live as a woman.

No, being pre-op doesn't cause problems for passing, other than I can't go swimming.

But passing was never a problem for me. As far as causing undue strain on a daily basis? Ya, it does.

Good to remember that everyone has very different experiences, different starting points, different resources, and even different kinds of dysphoria.

[thefire]

Well for myself, I'm trying to go "full time" because it's the only thing within reach. I don't have insurance or the cash to pay someone $200 or more a week for 1-5 years in hopes of being given permission to seek a doctor who may or may not give me a prescription. I find that all too expensive, restrictive and out of reach. A name change is a lot more within my reach, even though I fear it being denied. But I really need some significant change to be happy and to feel like my life is moving forward and that I have control over how my life's going to go for once. And I believe a name change would be hugely beneficial for me because my birth name is ultra feminine and people expect to see a beauty queen with that name on my job applications, not some fat guy.