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When you've lost God, how do you fill the void?

Started by Anatta, September 17, 2011, 12:36:07 AM

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solexander

I was born Jewish, and then went through a lot of different desperate grabs at other religions when Judaism didn't feel right for me. I had such a hard time figuring out something to believe in that it was really hard accepting myself as Atheist. Overall though, it's been kind of freeing- I don't really believe in an afterlife, or anything, so realizing that I've really just got one go at this is what's probably kept me alive as of late, since I have really intense depression and suicidal tendencies. It's also been really freeing in that, hey, I've just got one go at this, so what I spend time doing should really be what I want to do with my time instead of anyone else- that's how I ended up transitioning, and that's something that's made my relationships with those around me a lot stronger, since I've been able to feel safe really choosing the people that I want in my life. For example, I no longer speak to my biological mother and most of the relatives on that side, but because of that I've been incredibly close to the rest of my family- I really appreciate them for being good to me, and standing by me, and being honest with me. Same with friends- I try not to give my time to people unless I really, truly care about them, and that's made my bonds with the friends I do have around incredibly strong. In a way, being Atheist has really made me appreciate my life and those around me and my impact on the world more than trying to be theist ever did, and I guess this is really just what's for me. So... I guess the void-filler here is those people I love and care for, and the knowledge that this is my life to do with what I wish?





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Rachelicious

QuoteIt must be very difficult to completely give up this god-centric comfort zone...

It was never really a comfort zone. I'd call it 'familiar', but the only thing making it so is the outside world making so much noise.

QuoteWhat brings you comfort, now you know/believe all your prayers have fallen upon deaf ears ?

Prayers do not fall on deaf ears if you use your divine gift of reason to subvert the need for any superstition to tell you what is right or what you should be doing. The world itself, outside of great struggles, is actually filled with the building-blocks of happiness. That which we can sense, can know, creatively embark upon, etc.

QuoteWhat do you do to cope with your apparent lose of faith ?

It's not a loss of faith, it's a gain. Faith in what is real, only scorn for the hypocrisy that chains people to outmoded behaviors and ways of relating to other people & the world around them. If you really have faith it will be evident in the way you live your life unless you are stuck in fear, which is sadly what religion excels at promoting.

QuoteDoes it bring you a sense of 'freedom' ?

Yes, namely in being free to trust in myself to carefully evaluate what is right and moral. This is at the heart of what it is to be human (let alone getting the courage to transition. Prejudice towards atheists is fairly severe, actually, because people think an atheist has no morals or code of living.)

QuoteKeep it all about how you are feeling now-coping with this lose...

You keep calling it a loss. People who 'lose' faith and would still inside like something to believe in will just go to the next religion that promises the way. Those who turn their backs to religion with eagerness and reason have everything to gain. I do not think it is about what belief system is "true" but which is aligned with your goals, abilities, propensities as a person and how you're going to use them to shape your world and experiences.

My defiance of your will to focus on "coping with this los(s)" exemplifies my will to define at least my own beliefs as much more than a "lack" of beliefs, and instead speak to what is real rather than how others want to see things. I consider a willingness to brand convention as outmoded or lacking objectivity as I continue an ever more enlightened state of being to be central to my spirituality.

Wishing you all a happy Sinday  >:-)
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whatismylife

there is no void, and nothing lost.  all you've done is begun to think more critically and rationally about the universe.
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dalebert

I may have mentioned something about this before but the title and OP are somewhat loaded questions. They project things onto others that presume they've had a similar experience as the OP.

I tend to see religion as being similar to an addiction. If you have a "hole" in your life because you're missing something of substance, we have a tendency to want to fill that up. Sometimes people fill it with something unsubstantial like certain addictive substances or behaviors. It feels to me that religion is another hole-filler of sorts, and not a very healthy one. It's similar to giving yourself over excessively to fantasies and escapism. I enjoy video games and RPGs myself, but I'm very aware of not letting escapism be my entire life. To an atheist, religion is just a fantasy that people use to escape reality. I am inclined to think that letting that go is the first step to filling the hole with something of substance, like actually working on meaningful real-life goals and developing meaningful relationships; things that have meaning in the real world we live in. Build up the one life you have here in the real world. If you truly want to be whole, then that's what it takes.

It's important to acknowledge that if people were raised in a healthy manner, without delusions, they may not have holes that need filling.

Jess42

I can honestly say that I don't think god was ever there to begin with. ??? Maybe just wishful thinking of something more or just something else. So the void was never really a void to begin with. I just don't see too much of anything that approaches divinity anymore. :-\
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Polybun

Quote from: Anatta on September 17, 2011, 12:36:07 AM
Kia Ora kind folks,

::) This is for those members who have lost their faith[in a god] and now embrace atheism...[or if not pure atheism, at lease atheistic agnosticism]

Quite a few members here were born into religious families, attending Church, Synagogue, Mosque, Temple,  etc, on a regular bases-praying to a god for guidance, assistance, forgiveness, etc... 

It must be very difficult to completely give up this god-centric comfort zone...

What brings you comfort, now you know/believe all your prayers have fallen upon deaf ears ?

What now fills this void ?

What do you do to cope with your apparent lose of faith ?

Does it bring you a sense of 'freedom' ?

Please try to answer the above question/s without venturing into an attack on those members who still choose to believe...Keep it all about how you are feeling now-coping with this lose...

Remember folks this is in the 'ATHEIST" section,[for obvious reasons] so if you're a theist, please keep this in mind if you feel incline to pass comment...

I would also like to add the last part of a PM message[which I found quite interesting and informative] sent to me by Sera [relating to another of my threads on atheism]  "Atheists believe in the 'non-existence' of God!" 

Metta Zenda :)

What void?  Not something I have ever experienced.  Nor should anyone.  The fact is, the world is far more fascinating and impressive without god.  If you explain the interesting things in the margins of reality by "god did it" thats a far more shallow world view than accepting the facts for what they are, and being fascinated by them.
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Ali girl

I was baptized as Methodist.  That being said, when my first transgressions were revealed, my parents took me to the pastor (I was 17).  After a private very open conversation with said pastor, he was quiet before telling me that he did not need one of "your kind" degrading his church.  I felt abandoned and lost.

About a year later this same pastor proceeded to run off with his german immigrant girlfriend and abandon his 3 children and wife.  I realized at that moment that religion was nothing but empty rules for people who can not live on their own moral compass (personal view).  This was confirmed years later when my friends wife (a pastor) was terminated from her position for not divorcing her transgender husband. 

I now subscribe to the church of atheism in the ways of Penn's Sunday School podcast.  I have found more love and happiness in living life the right way the first time and not falling into the pray on Sunday, sin on Monday mentality.

The bravest thing I ever did was live when all I wanted to do was die.

If someone shows you their true colors, don't try to repaint them.

"I'm not the person I was yesterday and I'm not the person I'm going to  be tomorrow. I'm just figuring it out as I go along, just like everyone else in this world." -Laura Jane Grace
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TabbytheDruid

#87
Not sure which god you're talking about, but I'll get in on this. I've disliked religion for quite a long time and it's not like you're born believing so there is no void to fill. Losing an arm? Now that would leave a void. I would feel a void without science because I wouldn't have modern medicine without it. I would have died from having cryptic tonsils and getting repeated throat infections if not at birth considering infant death rates (it wasn't much better for the mother either) were so high until we discovered germs. I figured out pretty early on that praying is just usually mindful meditation or a compulsory act to manage overwhelming emotions. It's just time set aside to relax, slow down a little and use some introspection which is likely what most people are perceiving as "guidance". I've seen people use praying to psych themselves up for a big event, to have their team win the superbowl, to have their country win a war, pray to convert people, pray to make someone straight, when people can't handle the death of a loved one and need the comfort in an afterlife (I don't see why more people aren't comfortable being atheist and believing in an afterlife, my other is the only other atheist I've met who also expresses believe in the possibility). I'm not judging anyone for the way they grieve, just know there are non dogma related ways.

When a bunch of bad things happen all at once I often find myself being like "What the **** universe!?" It's that old I need someone to blame feeling that wells up inside. Its completely poop but hey, life isn't fair. You either move your buns despite the odds, or you can give up and fade away. Nobody is going to live your life for you, just friends who'll help and enemies who'll hinder. As one of my favorite quotes says: "When life gives you lemons don't make lemonade! Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons; what am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's going to burn your house down... with the lemons! I'm going to get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!".  Alright I'm done, I'm just rambling now.

I had originally written a different brick of text in response but in the end I just said forget it and went to sleep as it was getting a little late; in the morning my phone was dead and about 1/4th of the message was posted. This is the new version where I wasn't too tired to think.
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Kylo

Well what fills the "void" for me, even though I never was religious in the sense of believing in a god, is that I have the freedom to think what I want and believe whatever I want. That is not necessarily a 'comfortable' thing, as it puts all responsibility upon myself for my own well-being, but you have to make sacrifices for freedom of any kind.

Most of the monotheistic religions seem to have this thing about them where they treat those who believe as if there should be a sort of child-like state in which we give ourselves up to the all-knowing "parent" of the god, and find comfort in that the same way a child can be assured a parent will protect them and worry about all the things that need worrying about. Like wanting to revert back to a state of dependence where all our needs are fulfilled, and we don't have to feel uncomfortable about things. God is the "shepherd" and we are the "lambs", god is the father and we are the "children". The imagery is strongly reflected in a lot of monotheistic writings, this idea of being a child in need of a parent. And "salvation" in many of these religions seems to me to bear a resemblance to the state of being in the womb, reunited intimately with your creator and wanting for nothing. And quite a few other religions that are polytheistic toy with the idea humans need to appease far greater beings because humans are lesser beings.

If you need that state, then I can understand wanting to fill the void that being separated from your creator would create. But if you don't need to feel that, there is not much of a void to fill, nor a sense of disconnection, loss or shame.

I find it better - even if it is uncomfortable - not to want to feel helpless or revert to the desire to be protected by someone or something else. And more satisfying to think I can face up to the universe's reality and explore the nature of existence without needing that so badly it causes me to shrink from the answers I don't like.
"If the freedom of speech is taken away, then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter."
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Zumbagirl

Quote from: Anatta on September 17, 2011, 12:36:07 AM

What brings you comfort, now you know/believe all your prayers have fallen upon deaf ears ?

  The fact that I live a good life and am comfortable with my idea of what it means to be a moral person. Read Kant's categorical imperative to understand me better. I live by the simple maxim that I treat everyone the way I wish they would treat each other. To me religion is a direct contradiction to this maxim but I hold out hope that others can see the light.


QuoteWhat now fills this void ?

  Life fills it. It's all we have is life. Anything else is an unprovable lie. So live a life worth living. Saying I  had a void though is like like saying if I don't have religion then where do I go for morality? Anywhere but religion. Do I worry about the end of my life? No. None of us are going to escape this world alive. None of us.

QuoteWhat do you do to cope with your apparent lose of faith ?

  I don't think religion was a huge part of my life except when growing up. My parents are deeply religious and still are. They were mad at me for the longest time when I told them I was an atheist, but hey that's the way it goes. I suppose if I had said I was a buddhist or something else they would feel the same way as well.

  In my case, there is nothing to 'cope' from. Freedom FROM religion is way better than freedom OF religion if you get my point. I don't need a magic book or someone on a pulpit preaching and begging for money to tell me right from wrong. I know what is right and what is wrong. It's called being a reasonable person.

When the day comes and this world shrugs me off I will be as dead as a dead tree, dog or dolphin. There is no tree heaven. There is no people heaven either. There are no ghosts, demons or other things hiding in the shadows. Dead is dead. Millions of years from now I will be oil in the ground, fossil fuel for a future internal combustion engine.

QuoteDoes it bring you a sense of 'freedom' ?


Absolutely it is one of the greatest freedoms I know. Skepticism, logic and critical thinking may seem odd to a religious person, but it means I can reason things out for myself without the need for religion. I can still plod happily through this world with nothing but my wits to guide me and still live a happy righteous life.
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Wednesday

God is the void. Everything else is filled and waiting for us to explore (by the way I neved had faith).
"Witches were a bit like cats" - Terry Pratchett
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Midnightstar

My doubt started when i was seven so i guess i never had a void to fill
i had to get over fear though
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FreyasRedemption

(Alert: This is likely one of the longest posts in the history of Susan's Place. But please bear with me, OK?)

Well, technically I am a former atheist (whole history: started out at 4 years old as Protestant Christian, became atheist at 8, became Vilaqaren at 16) but I suppose telling about the time when I was one, and how I became one, gives me the right to post here.
So, as I said, I started out as Protestant Christian. My first contact with religion in the first place was....I don't really remember what the event was exactly called, but my family never went to church or anything. Anyway, I was 4, and it was this kind of event that mainly involved singing. Or at least in theory, mostly it was the adults singing and trying to get the kids to sing along. It didn't involve any parents, however. The songs were pretty much all about God and Jesus as someone to turn to when you were worried, and things like that. Back then, I didn't really understand the concept, but I kind of liked it as according to the songs, God was a kind of like the ultimate parent and friend at the same time.


Fast forward to primary school. As it was written in the official papers that I was Protestant Christian, (and technically it still is, but that information is worthless, as the same paper also states that I am male.) I had to study religion, and back in the early grades that meant a selection of stories from the Bible. Now, that wasn't so bad, and I kind of liked it due to how easy it was. You just had to memorize some details, and you automatically got a good score with that alone. Now, as for how I became an atheist.....well, there were the sermons. A priest from a nearby church showed up and held a sermon on a Friday morning twice a month. Those sermons were among my least favourite times at school, and I wasn't alone with my opinion. It had started out as a potentially cool new thing, then quickly became old, then boring, then annoying, and soon we were at the point where we sang along with mock lyrics or tried to discuss our latest video game accomplishments without the teachers noticing. And that is how I stopped caring about God, Jesus, the Bible, or Christianity in general, and started declaring myself an atheist.
At the point I reached secondary school, the whole class was unofficially atheist, mostly because we felt that Christianity was being forced upon us. We outright envied those whose official papers stated that they were atheists, because they never had to attend those sermons or any church-related events. We had those, too. Sermons for the advent, Christmas, Easter, the beginning of summer, all held at the local church.

My opinion towards Buddhism, Jainism, Shinto and the like was more positive, as those religions were different, exotic, and I learned about them without having to believe in them. And then there were the "pagan" religions, which I (at the time, of course) thought of more as mythology than religion, not something one could believe in, but still interesting stuff that one could even look up on their spare time. We didn't really have much about those in school, it was still all very Christianity-centric in our school, though none of the teachers was a fanatic, so we could even openly voice our dislike of religious studies, and really didn't have to care about anything involving religion outside religion class. Though there was a time we pretended to be a human-sacrificing cult during recess, and somebody's fundamentalist parents tried to raise an outrage over their kid having participated in that.
Yeah, back then religion really didn't mean much to me. Religions were either something bleak and hypocritical that was being forced on me and others, or interesting, but trivial knowledge about cultures that were either dead or on the other side of the world. As such, I was an atheist, for all intents and purposes, and back then I wouldn't have traded that independence from religious rules, restrictions, fears of divine punishment and all that stuff for anything.


As I matured up, I started to realize that maybe a negative attitude towards Christianity was not exactly the right thing to think like. Sure, it was being forced upon me, but in its core, the point of all that wasn't trying to harm me. The religion's attempt to "convert" me was misguided and frustrating, but the religion as a whole didn't really deserve all that hatred I had for it. Sure, I still have some resentment towards Christianity, but that is mostly because of how it is negatively affecting the world for me and others, and not because it was being forced on me as a kid. And that resentment is not exactly towards the religion in itself, but towards the people who use it as a reason to harm others or make their life difficult.
Same thing with all other religions. I never hate the religions in themselves, and most I actually find quite interesting, but I do still have my share of hatred for the people who use their beliefs for harmful purposes.
That includes people from the religion I follow (technically, me and the majority of the religion of Sala'i Vilak are no longer in speaking terms because I tried convincing them to finally re-introduce themselves to the world and become officially recognized as a religion. That, and they didn't really respond well to my personal beliefs about our gods, or to my opinion that every single Christian in the world isn't an evil fanatic who wants to see us all burn on a stake. Well, at least I tried.) and atheists, too.


As for how I ended up choosing an obscure, virtually unknown and officially nonexistent religion over atheism, something completely new and unknown over what I had been able to rely on most of my life.....that is another story, and doesn't really belong under this topic.
Anyway, I think I'm done for the night. I really need to sleep after writing this much stuff.
There is a better tomorrow.
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Tessa James

From where I sit there is no evidence that gods, religions and the so called supernatural world exist with out humans.  Seems clear that some folks got it backward.  Gods didn't create us in their image we created them in ours.  In that context it might be easier to imagine people who traveled on foot, owned no books and had little recourse to consider alternatives but did engage in wholesale war and petty crimes against each other.  Crude codes of conduct, morality and law may always be needed.  What isn't needed is another unassailable and inscrutable answer delivered from on high by the latest self anointed religious leader.  Those edicts are a dime a dozen in the dust bin of history.  A pretty good clue as to their current value too;)

There is current speculation that belief in the unknown or unseen is part of our very genetic make up.  I readily await those deterministic maps of humanity but consider what is unknown and unseen to be quite beautiful without the need to posit a being who created it all. 

There is much more beyond our shiny, ephemeral lives and indeed beyond this galaxy that offer endless opportunities for discovery and wonder.
Open, out and evolving queer trans person forever with HRT support since March 13, 2013
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Laurel D

I really haven't felt the strong need to fill that void. I guess this void has been filled, by taking care of myself. And by working on enjoying this life, because as far as I'm concerned it's the only one we're going to have.

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