The anti-war thread.

[Anatta]

. You would be very hard pressed to find ANY US soldier that would open fire on unarmed civilians. On the other hand, if civilians are armed and engaging in terroistic acts then most soldiers would have no problem using lethal force.

Kia Ora Jessica,

So what happened at Kent State Uni ?  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings Are the National guards members different to other American soldiers ?

I'm not familiar with the differences between the National Guard and other US military troops...So I might be jumping to conclusions, getting the wrong end of the stick....   

Metta Zenda

[Devlyn]

@ Jen61, I have a confession to make. I'm not the anti-war person, I started the thread because Emoxon started this conversation in my veterans thread "Roll Call" and I didn't think that was the right direction for the thread. Hugs, Tracey

[tekla]

The American Army, going back to the Administration of George Washington has NEVER refused an order to fire on civilians.  NEVER.  Not in the Whiskey Rebellion, or the Civil War, or urban/campus riots, or - and perhaps the most glaring example - on their own (once) fellow soldiers.  (See: Bonus Army march on Washington, "Occupy" is not a new concept.)  The solider that carried out the orders that included shooting veterans of the First World War?  Douglas MacArthur.  The carvery charge was led by George Patton.

[Amazon D]

Kia Ora Jessica,

So what happened at Kent State Uni ?  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings Are the National guards members different to other American soldiers ?

I'm not familiar with the differences between the National Guard and other US military troops...So I might be jumping to conclusions, getting the wrong end of the stick....   

Metta Zenda

Yes i would think they would be sick puppies to shoot a citizen for protesting ..  but there are sickos in the military.. i know i was in the USMC in 73 ..

[Jen61]

Yes i would think they would be sick puppies to shoot a citizen for protesting ..  but there are sickos in the military.. i know i was in the USMC in 73 ..

I was attached to a USMC batallion for 3 years, kind of recently, and I can tell you that the USA Armed Forces of today are not those of 73. Things have change, a lot. Yet, they are what they are but they operate under tilte 14, they cannot operate in the USA. Police and the national guard on the other hand operate under title 10. Big difference.

[tekla]

Big difference.
Increasingly more of a technicality.

[Jen61]

Big difference.
Increasingly more of a technicality.

Is this the best you can do, I am dissapointed !

[tekla]

If you've been paying attention (which you obviously have not been) you would see that Congress is, right now, trying to rewrite some of those laws.  Secondly, the increasing militarization of the police has brought about the same reality through the back door.  When the ATF can 'borrow' tanks from the Army (as they did in Waco, and in Montana), the law you quote does seem to be not much of a barrier.

[Jen61]

If you've been paying attention (which you obviously have not been) you would see that Congress is, right now, trying to rewrite some of those laws.  Secondly, the increasing militarization of the police has brought about the same reality through the back door.  When the ATF can 'borrow' tanks from the Army (as they did in Waco, and in Montana), the law you quote does seem to be not much of a barrier.

How do you know what I have been paying attention or not ? Do not tell me, you are a psychic now !

But for the sake of an argument please enlight me as I am not aware of congress effort to change the military from operating under title 14 to tile 10

[tekla]

National Defense Authorization Act provision S. 1867, Sections 1031 and 1032.

[Jen61]

National Defense Authorization Act provision S. 1867, Sections 1031 and 1032.

NDA is  the "Patriot Act," it did not and would not change the title under which the USA Armed forces operate.

In summary: Patriot Act gives authority to USA agencies operating under title 10, FBI, Homeland Defense, Cost Guard,  the National Guard, and police agencies; yo arrest anybody in the USA and detain them indefinitely if they are suspected terrorist. I also allows the USA military to arrest enemy combatants and suspected terrorist overseas. IT DOES NOT HOWEVER ALLOW THE USA MILITARY TO OPERATE IN THE USA.

What Congress is trying to do with the Patriot Act is two fold: a) make it permanent, and b) place some modifications to it to stop potential abuses.

You see my dear Tekla it is my job to never take my eyes from the eight ball