Autumn Sandeen: About Civil Rights and Bathrooms
January 19, 2012. 1:21 pm • Section: Trans Talk
Posted by: Jillian Page
http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/01/19/autumn-sandeen-about-civil-rights-and-bathrooms/Well-known U.S. trans advocate Autumn Sandeen wrote to me today with the following:
Hi Jillian,
Civil rights movements have often had significant bathroom aspects. Jim Crow laws in the American South are one example. During the struggle to pass the Equal Rights Amendment (ERA) in the USA during the seventies, opposition activists such as Phyllis Schlafly made headway for her side by arguing that the amendment would outlaw separate public restrooms for men and women. And during the push for the American Disability Act (ADA), opponents in the business community argued that renovating bathrooms to comply with ADA standards would be too costly.
There are two false premises going on in the current bathroom arguments — the "bathroom bill" arguments. One is that trans women are really men because the shape of their genitalia at birth doesn't match the sex associated with females. The other is that since trans women are argued to be men — usually referred to in these arguments as "men in dresses" or "transvestites" — and it's assumed that all men would be predators if they were allowed to pass through the door into women's public bathrooms, the fear mongering argument is explicitly or implicitly made that trans women are all going to prey on women and children in women's public restrooms.
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Ariel: A Different Point of View on the Washroom Issue
January 19, 2012. 7:55 pm • Section: Trans Talk
Posted by: Jillian Page
http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/01/19/ariel-a-different-point-of-view-on-the-washroom-issue/Here is something from longtime reader and contributor Ariel, in response to Autumn's comment in the preceding post:
Let's look at this question from a different point of view: that of women who have a right to be and feel safe in a sex-segregated facility. Can we agree that women have this right? And that safety is somewhat more of a concern to women than to men? We should also include that sex-segregated facilities are allowed even in a society that mandates equality of the sexes.
No one does a panty check when a person goes into a public washroom. Sex segregation is based on people knowing where they belong as well as, rightly or wrongly, appearance. Storyteller and writer Ivan Coyote has related several incidents of being screamed at by female washroom patrons even though she was born female-bodied and remains female-bodied. Clearly, some women (at least) do not want to see someone they perceive to be a man in their washroom.
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Autumn Responds
January 19, 2012. 10:44 pm • Section: Trans Talk
Posted by: Jillian Page
http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/01/19/autumn-responds/I am enjoying the debate. I enter this and the previous two as individual posts because of their length, and because I want other readers to feel they can respond to each of these well-thought-out entries. — Jillian
Hi Jill,
Ariel is, in my humble opinion, as wrong as can be. We don't base equality under the law on others' fears — if we did, we'd still have Jim Crow laws in the American south in part because many white men and women were afraid of what black men may do to white women — many still are afraid. Facts and logic don't support that fear, but that fear is what many in majority society based their oppression of African-Americans upon.
When it comes to previous civil rights movements, we in Canada and the United States consciously turned away from denying people in "suspect classes" the ordinary equality they deserve because of fear of what people in suspect classes may do. We base civil rights on the idea that all individuals are part of humankind and thus deserve ordinary equality. Our membership in a minority class of people should not determine what our rights are — especially when compared to people who may belong to larger and more powerful classes.
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The Washroom Debate: How About FtMs?
January 20, 2012. 8:34 am • Section: Trans Talk
Posted by: Jillian Page
http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/01/20/the-washroom-debate-how-about-ftms/My first thought after reading the many comments coming in about the washroom issue is that I will never trivialize the subject again. There are very serious concerns on both sides of the debate, and I hope that society can find a solution to meet everybody's needs.
Please feel free to continue commenting on the previous posts — there is much food for thought in them, and we are getting good comments from both sides. I also applaud you for debating in a civil manner.
While some of those commenting feel that it's about presentation, ie. if a genetic male identifies as a woman and presents as a woman, that person should use the women's room, others feel that it is about anatomy, ie. if you still have a penis, you use the men's room.
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Kristen Responds to Ariel's Comments
January 20, 2012. 10:04 am • Section: Trans Talk
Posted by: Jillian Page
http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2012/01/20/kristen-responds-to-ariels-comments/Here is something from reader and contributor Kristen:
Hihi,
Specifically regarding:
"Does someone with a penis, especially someone with no intention to change anatomical sex, have a right to use a sex-segregated facility designed for those who are female? How could anyone think so?"
And
"Such facilities are segregated by sex, not by gender."
Ariel is throwing the real world out the window in favor of a fantasy.
