Where's the support?

[Devlyn]

Every day I come to Susans and make my rounds. And every day I find anti-US comments in topics from hormones to lasagna. It's only a handful of posters, but their contributions take away from my enjoyment of this site. Thanks for making citizens of the United States feel welcome here. Think, people. Hugs, Devlyn

[JenJen2011]

No matter where you go, there will always be a few bad apples, unfortunately. Don't let it ruin your experience here though. Smile.

[Kreuzfidel]

I know that I have been one of those individuals, Devlyn.  I have thought about the unfairness of some of my judgements and would like to apologise.  I hope that you and anyone else I have offended can forgive me.

[caseyyy]

I may also be one of those people, as I know I've expressed horror and disgust at the health system in particular, and also politics. It's not that I'm anti-US, I'm just really shocked when I hear about how much others have to go through just to get basic services for their transition when for me, much of it is free. It seems unfair. But I certainly have nothing against those from the US or those who support and believe in the US. I actually have a great deal of respect for you in particular, Devlyn; while I may not agree with everything you say, you clearly are a hard worker with a backbone, with a strong sense of what you believe in.

[tekla]

Even the people in our politics are expressing horror at our politics. 

I find anti-US comments in topics from hormones to lasagna. It's only a handful of posters, but their contributions take away from my enjoyment of this site. Thanks for making citizens of the United States feel welcome here.
Worst of all, you know who most of those people are?  Right, Americans.  It's like the problem with American freedom is that we gave it to Americans who just off and say the darnest things.  I've seen only a very few (and not on this site) non-Americans who can critique, criticize, lambaste, condemn, castigate, and disparage the United States like it's own citizens do.  Hell, I don't see our own citizens even doing it on the scale that our politicians running for national office do.  Which is one of the sources of horror in our politics.

You know, if we can't criticize our government - who then should?

There is a line in Leonard Cohen's Democracy is Coming to the U.S.A. that always makes me pause and think.  He says:

Democracy is coming to the U.S.A. ...
It's coming to America first,
the cradle of the best and of the worst.
It's here they got the range
and the machinery for change
and it's here they got the spiritual thirst.

And, that ability to do that huge, running: critique, criticize, lambaste, condemn, castigate, and disparage is what powers that machinery for change.  Because he's right, that's why things change here first, why America has got to go first - even though it often ends up in last too.  We're going to be the about the last place that allows gay marriage, but, in the beginning, way back when - America was also the first place where (and OK, in the beginning it was only a few blocks of a few cities) where it was OK to be gay.  When we finish that (still years off) it will be the most cemented legal standing of gays of all of them, but it's just wheel going round and coming home again.  It's here we have the machinery for change.  And that change (of gays in society) has been profound and was founded on some mighty interesting condemnations of the American system and values, and with some mighty interesting takes on those systems and values also.  That's the machinery for change. 

You'll also find that some of those same people also do a pretty good job of defending parts of this country too.  You know, a lot to like and a lot to dislike too - its' a big place to go. 

And if someone is complaining, bitching, attacking, criticizing, laughing at even, our medical system... Hell, we've been doing that solid since the early 90s, and that's not even counting the HUGE fight over JohnsonCare (formally MediCare, it only seems fair with with ObamaCare and all) in the 60s.  People running for President bitch about it, Blue sites bitch about it and red sites bitch about it, people I know casually bitch about it, people at work bitch about it, my GF bitches about it, and I bitch about it - exactly who besides those making huge sums of money off of it IS happy with it?  Parts of it are golden, and other parts are all but useless.  So I'm pretty used to seeing it's problems brought out into the light and compared with other possible methods.

And to be sure the United States has a pretty big footprint around the world, and things that happen here impact people beyond our borders.

[Tori32]

This is just my opinion, my two cents if you will so I hope no one is offended or anything else negative. I love this country. I'm from Texas and was brought up to have a sense of patriotism and pride in my state and nation. That being said I disagree with A LOT of what happens in this country. I still wouldn't want to live anywhere else in the world (save for a small tropical island  ). One of the thing I love about America is the rights we have to voice our opinions. I think we must discuss the pros and cons of our country. After all, it the american way!

[spacial]

I haven't really noticed any direct attacks upon the US or any society as such. If they come from other Americans, especially living in the US, then surely that is not only acceptable, but sacrosanct. As is verbal disagreement.

But I do feel that, when we set ourselves up with a higher standard, when that is seen to be failing, then it is all the more obvious.

Moreover, the US lives very much in isolation. It goes it's own way on many things. If a comparison between the US and another state is seem to find the US wanting, that might be a fact of life.

But with respect and friendship, may I ask if some of your perceptions of criticism of the US might actually be international policies which the US participates?


If I may add, in direct support of Tekla's arguments, I doubt the UK would be out of the dark ages were it not for the inspiration and example of the US. Ours is, of course, a much smaller society where legal change is somewhat easier, being less incumbered by the preceptions of traditions of others.

But I can't imagine the progress in gay rights, for example, happening without the example set by America.

Economically, the UK may have been quite wealthy in the early 19th century and was probably the wealthiest nation of earth from the middle ages until the later 19. But the wealth was always concentrated in a few. Moreover, so was freedom. Even in the 1830s, men were still being sent to penal servatude for forming a union. That was so econically damaging, but only became apparent later, as competition came form other industrialised nations.

WW1, was the last war between the upper classes of different societies. It was the US which ended that. And in doing so, set in motion the ending of the institution of aristocriticism.

Just a few points.