Is J.C. Penny's Transphobic?

[Shana A]

Sunday, March 4, 2012
Is J.C. Penny's Transphobic?
Posted by Cyrsti at 9:58 AM

http://cyrstiscondo-cyrsti.blogspot.com/2012/03/is-jc-pennys-transphobic.html

Probably not but after you read this isolated story, you should at least wonder if they have policies similar to "Macy's".

Discrimation at Florence, SC JC Penney (Magnola Mall)
                                                                                                                        March 3, 2012
To Whom It May Concern,
Please allow me to introduce myself. My name is Markielynn Rundell. I am a transgendered female. I have been patronizing your stores since I was a young child. I have always visited your stores dressed as a transgendered female. Each time I visited, I enjoyed my shopping experience. Selecting clothing that I wanted to buy, and of course trying on the outfits before buying them was always a must. Of course being a transgendered female, I have always used the woman's dressing room. Up until today I did so with no problems at all.

[Michelle-G]

> you should at least wonder if they have policies similar to "Macy's" <

I have to say that this is unfair.  Macy's official position is to respect diversity and they do not restrict who gets to use what dressing room.  In fact, dressing rooms are not designated, they simply are located near the departments (men's or women's) they serve.

The Riverwalk Macy's in San Antonio fired the employee who failed to respect this position, so it's clear that this particular Macy's employee was a rogue actor and she paid the price for her intolerance.

Cyrsti clearly states that she holds the employee, not JC Penney's, responsible for this issue and that's exactly as it should be. Now JC Penney has the opportunity to step up and make a statement about their position regarding diversity.

There seems to be an emerging profile of the department store employee who regularly practices this sort of discrimination.  Usually a woman (I have not heard of male sales associates doing this), generally not a younger person, frequently African-American, and usually cite their religious beliefs as a justification for this sort of anti-trans bigotry.  And in every case I have seen so far, this personal position is in contrast to the explicitly stated or even the implied position of the employer.

I speak from experience.  This very same thing happened to me at another big-name retailer, same circumstances, same dialog, same types of participants.

The same thing happened in San Antonio, and now in Florence, SC.  My experience was in North Carolina.  I have not been able to collect enough data to determine if geography plays a part, but it's starting to look like it's southern (or at least just a conservative) state oriented.

[Annah]

as a formal employee, I have to say with a big @$$ resounding NO that JC Penney is not trans phobic.

When I was hired there, they did everything in their power (before my name was legally changed) to keep my legal name confidential. Everything was set up to accommodate me.

This person had a bad personal experience. People need to be careful when a person offends them to not put the blame on an entire company.

JC Penney rates 100% on the LGBT equality index.

This person needs to contact the managers rather than letting their emotions run wild and rant.

[mixie]

Unless the employee caused a scene with the others I don't quite see what she did that was so horrible.  I mean yes they need to educate their employees that there should not be such a big deal for a man to go into the women's changing room and vice versa.  However the woman writing the article states that she would not feel comfortable going into the mens room because she has developed breasts and wouldn't want to be looked at.  There have been incidents in the past of men dressing in drag and going into the women's bathroooms with cameras etc.

When the sales clerk confronted her I think she did the right thing by saying she was a woman and at that point it should have been dropped.  But I can't fault the employee for going to get her supervisor.  That's what she is supposed to do.

This is a tricky issue that requires reasonable accomodations on both sides.   If the writer of the article states that she herself feels uncomfortable changing in the mens section because of men looking at her,  why doesn't she understand the desire to keep "men" out of the woman's dressing room?   

I supposed I need to be educated much more so on this.  I'm usually a huge advocate for transgender rights.  But this doesn't make sense to me.   IMO there is no real difference or need to segregate men and women in bathrooms or dressing rooms.  The customer should not be "getting naked" to try on clothing that they don't intend to purchase.  That's just gross.  So women should be wearing stretch pants and tank tops under anything they try on anyway.  There should be no nudity.  If the woman herself doesn't feel comfortable with men being next to her in another private stall,  then why can't she see or understand why other woman might not want a transgender female in the other stall?

This is very confusing to me.     Someone please explain it better.   

[Annah]

i dont think there is much explaining to do on this one. She wrote the blog right after she came home from the experience rather than letting it sink in.

She used anger rather than rationality to write her story.

[veritatemfurto]

i dont think there is much explaining to do on this one. She wrote the blog right after she came home from the experience rather than letting it sink in.

She used anger rather than rationality to write her story.

agreed, and its not even the original post, but a re-post of the original post off another forum board.

I worked at a J.C. Penny's too, briefly in 2009... Their non-discrimination policy does mention sex and gender in the orientation.

The local area isn't exactly trans friendly either, according to my friend in Charleston that I just got to sign on but hasn't yet made an introduction.

[mixie]

Now me - I am an awkward cow in situations like this. I would say "Ok - shall I walk into the men's area in a dress and heels?" and drop the whole thing in the supervisor's lap. Is she really going to send someone presenting female into a male dressing room and cause no end of upset in there? Once she is forced to confront a choice like that, I think she would back down, especially if she was asked to accompany you into the mens' room to explain your presence there.

It might also be worthwhile to see if the state in question had laws about this. Here in the UK the law is very clear - you use the facilities appropriate to the gender you present as.

Beverley

I agree with this.  But they left before the supervisor showed up.   They didn't want to deal with it.  But the sales clerk did the right thing.  She was out of her league as far as responsibility goes.  If you don't know what to do, you go to your supervisor.  When she went to the supervisor, for all we know, the supervisor could have told her,  "She's to use the room she presents as"   or "Transgender women are allowed to use the women's room"   

Actually nothing happened.  I feel bad for the writer because for the woman to flat out say that "men can't use this room"  mean she flat out presented as male.    Although in the picture used she looks very female to me, perhaps she was dressed down that day and didn't pass very well.  I can't imagine a woman going up to a transgender looking woman and calling her a man unless she really came across badly and very male.   

In these situations it's strange.  I do understand that it's upsetting to be challenged about your gender in these situations.   But at the same time, instead of getting upset by it,  why not just understand that it's what is going to happen?

Once a person states their identifying gender the issue should be immediately dropped.   I don't get the whole thing about binary gender segregation anyway.  But I supposed women are worried about being sexually assaulted in dressing rooms or bathrooms etc.

What a mess.

[veritatemfurto]

Actually nothing happened.  I feel bad for the writer because for the woman to flat out say that "men can't use this room"  mean she flat out presented as male.    Although in the picture used she looks very female to me, perhaps she was dressed down that day and didn't pass very well.  I can't imagine a woman going up to a transgender looking woman and calling her a man unless she really came across badly and very male.   

again, the person on that blog (Crysti),  reposted it from another person (Markielynn) from another TG forum page so, we really do not know how passable Markielynn is.

I picked up this story from the "TG Forum" and I really admire the courage of Markielynn for taking it public!
Posted by Cyrsti at 9:58 AM