Dubai

[profmichelle]

I found an old post about working in Dubai as transgendered.  But it did not address transsexualism.  I understand the Dubai does not tolerate homosexuality. But I cannot find information about how they handle transsexuals.  If I have a female birth certificate and have completed all surgeries, will they care?

I live a fairly stealth life in the U.S., but I am also 5'11".  I can blend into the culture here but I'm not sure I will blend in as easily there.  I would hate to take a job there, only to face intense prejudice and lose my employment.

[Elsa]

Although I haven't been in touch with any person from the LGBT community in any Middle East country.
But that's largely because most and almost NO person from the LGBT community wants to go there.

And you risk losing more than just your job and dignity by going there. The penalty in most of these countries if you are outed as a LGBT person is
death and/or prison for anyway between 7 to 20 years and/or fines and/or whipping and/or deportation

I don't mean to scare you but this is irrespective if you commit any act in the process of being outed. These penalties are just for being an LGBT person!!!
and they vary only slightly from country to country and the US and Europe have very little say in the matter. So don't expect any embassy support or support from your home country.

Try checking this link for more info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country_or_territory

I had other links as well but they are somewhere in my old post and I cant seem to find them.

[AbraCadabra]

What will happen if you are simply denounced, having had FFS, SRS, and all papers (passport) to say female?

Will I EVER be able to visit such a place without fear? I simply wonder.

Axélle

[Adrasteia]

I honestly wouldn't feel safe in Dubai even if I could remove any trans* issues entirely from my life. I recall looking into it when they started trying to become a tourist destination and although it is quite possible to go and have a great time, seemingly random things have happened to people and landed them in jail or nearly in a very bad situation.

It's unfortunate, because it's probably a case of a few [rich/powerful] individuals ruining it for everyone else.

[Elsa]

Dubai like many Middle East countries is ruled by a monarch with almost undisputed power/wealth. No one can argue or complain or they will face harsh penalties.

However, even without the monarch, there are other countries that are simply not safe for women.

Pakistan for example (am not saying this because I am Indian) but Pakistan and several Middle Eastern countries openly practise the honor killings of women who have been raped/abused. and some even put these troubled women in prison, sometimes with their children.

I wouldn't go there even if I was a cis woman.

[AbraCadabra]

Thanks for making that clear, no 'shopping' in Dubai for me then, ... Pakistan ... anything 'stan' best left alone as well methinks.

Did I ever want to go there BEFORE transition? Hardly, just as well.

Axélle

[profmichelle]

So far, the responses have been about women and LGB people.  I do not intend to have any physical relationship with a person while I'm there.  I'll be too busy running this business.  Everyone I know there loves it.  The women all tell it is very different from other Arab countries.

I realize being gay and cross dressing is illegal in Dubai.  But I cannot locate any policy about how they handle transsexualism.  It appears that they simply treat you according to your ID, but I would like to know.  I'll go for a visit in a few weeks, and I suspect I will get answers that way.  But I would like to know, just in case they bring me to "safe places" while I'm there.

[Cindy]

The straight answer to your question is I don't know.
However I have friends who worked in Dubai for 2 years, a married couple, he was in a very high power government job. He was pro-vice chancellor of a University and had been head hunted for the job. Very good salary, very attractive working conditions. They hated it. They couldn't drive anywhere they had to have a driver, for two reasons, she wasn't allowed to drive, so she had to have a driver. The driving conditions were very bad so a local driver was needed to 'protect' them. Foreigners having car accidents are at fault. The weather during the hot season was unbearable, and they are South Australians and we get hot weather. Entertainment and social life was basically limited to other foreign nationals.  As he was a high ranking Government employee he rapidly found that he couldn't do his job because no junior government officials were allowed to make decisions, and senior government officials were not allowed and freedom in decision making, they had to refer everything to members of the ruling family.

As his task was to 'Westernise' the particular university, or at least bring it into a Western success model, his job became untenable because it contradicted what the ruling family accepted as their desire.

Thee reason he took the job was that he was assured that Dubai was different to the other middle eastern oil rich countries and that they had a true desire to move forward into a 'western' economic and social model.

He decided that this was not true when the practicalities were involved.

It was sort of Catch 22 with spin.

I also have friends who have just (last week) returned form a holiday in Africa, the stopped in Dubai for 4 days on their return. They are originally from India, they said that they had no racial problems and people were very friendly but that the heat was unbearable, and that the locals also said no one goes out during the hot season unless you really have to.

Cindy

[profmichelle]

Thanks for this Cindy.  You're friend's position sounds very similar to mine, and people have been telling me same things.  Although, my school would be designed for foreign nationals rather than locals. So, we might have a little more freedom in design and execution.

I was just looking up the temperatures.  It's "only" 105F today but it is projected to be 111 to 117F for the rest of the week.  That would be unbearable.

On the plus side, I will likely be there during the "hot" season, so I can assess that for myself.  I do appreciate the perspective on university politics.  That seems directly relevant to my situation.  And I am getting the feeling they will tolerate me as a transsexual, provided they can keep me in their artificially lowered position as a foreign woman.

[aleon515]

I am just going to say something about heat. This is desert heat. There is something to be said about living with low humidity. I live in the southwest desert in the US. But I live in the high desert (altitude 1 mile). So everything I say is less true than in the middle east where the altitude is in some cases less than 0.  Everything in desert heat just makes things feel hotter. No shade. Zip. I love the desert but I find myself looking forward to rainy season (now). (We get 7 inches of rain in an average year which is actually similar to Dubai. Thing is I am near the mountains where it is much cooler.)

Everything I have read about living in Dubai would not make me live in it as a FAAB, let alone a transgender. I think they try to think more modernly than Saudi Arabia, say. But the whole of society and their culture (and the fact that they have one patriach) goes against it.

Wow, you sound like you must have a lot of brains and so on to give to wherever you hail (or another western country-- perhaps you want a little adventure to live and work somewhere else??)

--Jay Jay

[Cindy]

Thanks for this Cindy.  You're friend's position sounds very similar to mine, and people have been telling me same things.  Although, my school would be designed for foreign nationals rather than locals. So, we might have a little more freedom in design and execution.

I was just looking up the temperatures.  It's "only" 105F today but it is projected to be 111 to 117F for the rest of the week.  That would be unbearable.

On the plus side, I will likely be there during the "hot" season, so I can assess that for myself.  I do appreciate the perspective on university politics.  That seems directly relevant to my situation.  And I am getting the feeling they will tolerate me as a transsexual, provided they can keep me in their artificially lowered position as a foreign woman.

I would consider your ability to interact in any meaningful way with the men who you will need to get decisions through. My understanding is that very few if any woman have any decision making position and that Dubai officials would take no notice of a female opinion, unless they were from the royal family, and a foriegn female is of no position at all. I know my friend had no academic females, not by his choice BTW.

I'm sorry, I'm not trying to put you off, no matter how bleak my info sounds! I think you do need to go over to check the situation out first hand. I would also make sure your consulate is fully informed about what you are doing and who you are dealing with, just to be on the safe side.

My friend is now in Kuwait establishing a University there, he says the atmosphere is completely different and that the government is totally supportive and very keen to progress.

He did say in passing, while they were having dinner with me on one of their trips home, that alcohol and visitors was a real problem. They don't drink by choice but he did say that the officials in Dubai at least, did not turn a blind eye to foreigners drinking, it was sort of tolerated in compounds but was also used at times if they wanted to get rid of someone by destroying their work contract.
If you drank in public and made it obvious the law was applied.