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Proof that Women are beautiful and Diverse

Started by Noah, December 18, 2012, 04:06:32 PM

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Noah

As trans women we have a set of characteristics most commonly associated with male bodies, and a large part of our transitions tend to be about reshaping ourselves to feel more comfortable on this planet. I believe we ought to follow our heart withwhatever changes we need to make to be happy. But I also believe that we need to be honest with ourselves about the fact that women are varied beings who don't all look just one way or another. I, for example, have a stronger brow that really upsets me usually...it always has since before I knew I was trans. I wish I had a smooth forehead, but am not ready or willing to consider surgery at this time. That being said at 4 months on hormones I am passing 90% of the time, and whether that is because people think I am a cisgirl or because they are respecting my gender identity, is unclear to me...what is certain is that I am being determined a She, and it doesn't matter why. Either way, I am being seen the way I want to be. I often feel like my brow hinders my passing, but in my experience, it isn't true - yet I still feel that way.

I was just watching Gossip Girl and there was a character who everyone was referring to as a "perfect" woman, and how desirable and hot she was. In fact she really is beautiful. But the amazing thing is that she also has a very prominant brow. It makes her looks exotic and interesting, and obviously she has a gorgeous face and body to help but the point is that no one isolated feature can really determine if someone is male or female, attractive or unattractive. This woman has not had reconstructive surgery because of her intense brow bone, and that reminds me that I can be the woman I am without needing that surgery either. Of course, I may or may not choose to go that route later in transition, but that will be my level and educated decision. Not based in fear. x


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Beverly

A number of actresses have brow bossing or other masculine features. Angelina Jolie has a prominent jaw and heavily veined arms, but no one mistakes her for a man.

Disney Princesses are cartoon characters, not women. Some of us seem to forget that. We are allowed to be imperfect too, but we can still be beautiful.

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Noah

Yeah exactly, I think it is important to remember that we start off beautiful.
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A

I'm mostly cautious with women people say are perfect. Many models don't look very beautiful to me, having prominent masculine features.

This one, for example, I really don't particularly find her beautiful. Even, considering how superficial the people choosing actors can be, I'm seriously thinking that she must be a great actress to have gotten the character.

I always try to stay in the middle when it comes to that. On one side, it's not true that you have to change every single part of you that looks masculine. First, you just can't change everything, and second, it's true that the general population won't be thinking "brow ridge --->-bleeped-<-!". Strangers in general are pretty oblivious. If it has long hair, is dressed like a girl and speaks like a girl, then it's a girl. A few weeks ago, girls at school had a little debate on my gender. The decisive point: I was a girl because my hair was held with hairpins. And even, seeing as some think some over-six-foot-tall model with zero curves and really broad shoulders has a perfect feminine body, I'd say tastes are different, and some even prefer to see some masculinity in women.

On the other hand, it's not true that because star X, woman Y or model Z has a prominent brow ridge/broad shoulders/boyish hips/a deep voice/whatever and still looks like a woman, it's more okay or more feminine for a trans person to have this or that trait. There are just as many trans women who anxiously want every single masculine trait gone and forgotten than those who saw a popular star, or even any woman, with that masculine trait of theirs, and believed that if those women could pull it off, they could as well.

While it's entirely fine if they're happy that way and have managed to detach themselves from their need to look good, they might be deluding themselves as to how well they pass, how good they look or why they don't pass.

There are things to keep in mind that make it questionable to compare a masculine trait on another woman to the same trait on yourself (and this is a general you, not specifically addressing Noah, just "that trans person who's reading"):

1. As a trans person, you're very likely to have more of those masculine features than the one you're looking at. She's gorgeous despite her humongous shoulders? But did you see how round/smooth her forehead is, how slender her body is, how small her ribcage is, etc? That other one is pulling off her prominent brow ridge well, but give her the width of your shoulders and hips, your muscles, your jaw and chin, etc. and the whole picture might be darker.

2. Because a beautiful woman has feature X doesn't make it feminine or beautiful. Maybe she'd look even better without it. In short, pulling something off is not the same as it being a good thing.

3. Another key difference between cis and trans girls is that contrary to us, they (probably) weren't traumatised by being born male, and years of enduring masculine looks. While it's unhealthy to be super complexed about every other thing, it's normal to be more sensitive to some things because of some traits. Even assuming that a cis woman has the exact same and it can be objectively determined that you pull it off just as well as she does, I think it's okay to still want that trait gone. It can also be seen as: after all those years of hating yourself, it's okay to decide that you deserve to not only be okay with your face, but actually like it.

4. Trying to accept oneself is all right and entirely healthy, but sometimes it can be brought too far. I don't think this is all that often the case with trans people, but I think a good parallel can be made with obesity. People used to (and still do) shun fat people, to value thinness to an excess, causing huge self-esteem issues in not-so-thin people and an exacerbation of things like anorexy. Then a healthy movement appeared. They said: it's okay to have fat in your body, some people are not naturally thin, and you're not evil because of your belly. But in some cases, it was exaggerated until it became unhealthy. Now, some say: it's all right to be overweight, it's not your fault, so eat those fries. As a result, on one hand, you have obeses with nonexistent self-esteem because they think they're not worth as much as a person because of their weight and healthy weight people who want every single bit of fat gone, but on the other, you have obeses who were taught to think of being overweight as a relatively normal and uncontrollable thing, and group anorexics, super-thin model fans and people who judge harshly people over the sole fact that they're fat with people who argue that obesity is neither healthy nor visually pleasant.

In summary, I think that the decision of whether you have a feature corrected should be led mostly by you, not others. How much do you dislike it? Are you okay with it? Do you look feminine enough in your opinion with it? I think, just as it's okay for one not to pass if they feel okay with not passing, it's also okay to want to do more than just pass, independently of others. And just as it's not okay to change your perceptions of yourself because of X model who's sickly thin, it's not much better to change those perceptions because of actress X who has these or those masculine traits. People just compare things too much in general.

(Gosh, that was such a long post. I never intended to write so much. I feel like I've just been rambling for so long to say very little in the end. ._.)
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Emily Aster

While not really a masculine feature, I remember the whole Cindy Crawford craze growing up and I didn't get it. I had to ask what the big deal was. It was her imperfections that made her attractive to people. Being trans I tend to dwell on the little things and make them seem worse, but apparently perfect is less than perfect.
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mementomori

Quote from: bev2 on December 18, 2012, 04:51:02 PM
A number of actresses have brow bossing or other masculine features. Angelina Jolie has a prominent jaw and heavily veined arms, but no one mistakes her for a man.

Disney Princesses are cartoon characters, not women. Some of us seem to forget that. We are allowed to be imperfect too, but we can still be beautiful.



i love angelinas jaw when i have ffs i want to reduce the height of my chin and reshape it , so its softer from the front but i want to keep a shaper angle to the side of my jaw , im not even sure if thats possible though
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Shawn Sunshine

And whats wrong with Beau Arthur? She is pretty, in a Grandma sort of way.





Shawn Sunshine Strickland The Strickalator

#SupergirlsForJustice
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