my hormone levels- normal?

[Hideyoshi]

updated levels on second page

[Bijou]

.I'm not sure if this helps you any, I'm on low dose e and low dose Spiro @ 4 1/2 months, with pretty much all the results you mentioned. At 3 months, my levels were checked, and my estradiol - 79, testosterone-220 something. I started getting anxious about the t levels, but since I'm seeing great results, I'm not pushing it.
If you're happy with your results so far, and aren't experiencing any side effects or negative reactions, I would stay as it were. The less you put in your body, the safer you are. 

But of course, this is something to discuss with your Dr. And just to add, I think you look great!

[A]

You can't just throw numbers. You need to say the units. Else it's like saying "Amount of water: 3". 3 litres? 3 millilitres? 3 gallons?

But as a general rule, I think it's better to always have an antiandrogen. But do I look like an endo to you?

[Hideyoshi]

You can't just throw numbers. You need to say the units. Else it's like saying "Amount of water: 3". 3 litres? 3 millilitres? 3 gallons?

But as a general rule, I think it's better to always have an antiandrogen. But do I look like an endo to you?

I called up the doctor's office and asked for the numbers, so I'm assuming those numbers are of the standard units used when measuring hormone levels.

[Joanna Dark]

Well the high-dose E should inhibit T all on its own but finesteride only inhibits 5α-reductase which just stops the conversion of T to DHT which is good for balding but I read its AA properties leave much to be desired. If you don't want to take spiro, you could take a progesterone for use as an AA. Another girl here does that and she has had some phenomenal results. How come your endo didn't have you on any AA in the first place? I'm guessing she thinks the E will inhibit T all on its own. You'd obviously want to maximize your potential so if you think the E is not working well enough i'd def ask.

[A]

It depends on where you live. What the US (and, I think, a few other small countries...?) considers a standard generally isn't for the rest of the planet. Inches, ounces, pounds, pg/mL, gallons, degrees Farenheit...

[Hideyoshi]

Well the high-dose E should inhibit T all on its own but finesteride only inhibits 5α-reductase which just stops the conversion of T to DHT which is good for balding but I read its AA properties leave much to be desired. If you don't want to take spiro, you could take a progesterone for use as an AA. Another girl here does that and she has had some phenomenal results. How come your endo didn't have you on any AA in the first place? I'm guessing she thinks the E will inhibit T all on its own. You'd obviously want to maximize your potential so if you think the E is not working well enough i'd def ask.

I don't have an endo.  It's my GP who treats trans people as well.  I'll talk to him about spiro instead of finasteride, but he said I've been developing faster than his other patients, so I dunno.

[Jamie D]

You should be able to get a copy of your labs when you see the doctor.  It is a good idea to keep them in a folder with a list of your medications and dosages.  Not only is it a ready reference, but if you are like me, and see three different doctor - wait, four - a GP, an endo, a cardiologist, and a neurologist -  you need to have that information on hand.

Her is an interesting discussion about common MtF HRT myths:

http://t-vox.org/index.php?title=Hormones_:_Urban_Legends

[Aleah]

In my opinion, you should consider getting on Spiro. My T levels have gone to zero after 4 months.. sounds like your GP is being too conservative.

[muuu]

.

[Hideyoshi]

49 pg/ml is in the male range for estrogen, I think.

If it's in the male range, I don't see how there aren't tons of guys with boobs walking around lol

In my opinion, you should consider getting on Spiro. My T levels have gone to zero after 4 months.. sounds like your GP is being too conservative.

I'll leave a message for him tomorrow and ask him about my levels

[muuu]

.

[Hideyoshi]

Okay i called my doctor's office and left a message. Hopefully i can get the answers i need about the levels

[JennX]

Estradiol- 49
Total t- 278
Free t- 31.2

9 months normal dose finasteride
8 months high dose estradiol

Changes:

first month finasteride: loss of body odor, body hair grew back slower
After nine months combination therapy: aa cup breast,  body hair nonexistent, leg and pubic hair growth slowed greatly, body odor feminine, face and butt fat increased, physical strength atrophy, substantially smoother skin

Just wondering how the levels look and if i should consider asking my doctor about Spiro

If you live in the USA... which from the numbers you've posted, I assume you do, your values look like this...

E2 level = 49 pg/ml
Total T = 278 ng/dl
Free T = 31.2 pg/ml

So... I'm surprised no one else has answered you yet, but... you want results closer to this:

E2 level = between 150-200 pg/ml
Total T = below 40 ng/dl
Free T = below 1.0 pg/ml

When I started hormones (having never taken anything, no self-medication, nothing)... my Total T was between 190-200 ng/dl. And my E was in the 50-60 pg/ml... and I was a pretty cut/buff/muscular guy. So general statements can't always apply. Basically you want to maintain the ideal range levels I posted above for a minimum of 3 years to have the best effect from HRT. Some will develop faster, some slower. Time and maintenance of hormones in the ideal range will give you the best results. No short cuts I'm afraid.

I'm also not a fan of the no Spiro approach. Finasteride is a very weak anti-androgen. If you need to grow hair (which you look to have covered), go for it. But it's no substitute for inhibiting T production like Sprio.

Also make sure your doc is monitoring your hepatic function and if you go on Spiro maker sure to monitor your serum potassium level which should stay between 3.5-5.2 mmol/L.

[SamB]

If you live in the USA... which from the numbers you've posted, I assume you do, your values look like this...

E2 level = 49 pg/ml
Total T = 278 ng/dl
Free T = 31.2 pg/ml

So... I'm surprised no one else has answered you yet, but... you want results closer to this:

E2 level = between 150-200 pg/ml
Total T = below 40 ng/dl
Free T = below 1.0 pg/ml

When I started hormones (having never taken anything, no self-medication, nothing)... my Total T was between 190-200 ng/dl. And my E was in the 50-60 pg/ml... and I was a pretty cut/buff/muscular guy. So general statements can't always apply. Basically you want to maintain the ideal range levels I posted above for a minimum of 3 years to have the best effect from HRT. Some will develop faster, some slower. Time and maintenance of hormones in the ideal range will give you the best results. No short cuts I'm afraid.

I'm also not a fan of the no Spiro approach. Finasteride is a very weak anti-androgen. If you need to grow hair (which you look to have covered), go for it. But it's no substitute for inhibiting T production like Sprio.

Also make sure your doc is monitoring your hepatic function and if you go on Spiro maker sure to monitor your serum potassium level which should stay between 3.5-5.2 mmol/L.

Yes, what she said about the ideal levels.  I just got mine last week and my total T was 22, free T was 1, and my E was 187.  My doc said that is ideal for me, as a mtf.

[Kelly-087]

Ya we can't really say with no units attached.

Some labs do measure it differently within the US however.

[Hideyoshi]

If you live in the USA... which from the numbers you've posted, I assume you do, your values look like this...

E2 level = 49 pg/ml
Total T = 278 ng/dl
Free T = 31.2 pg/ml

So... I'm surprised no one else has answered you yet, but... you want results closer to this:

E2 level = between 150-200 pg/ml
Total T = below 40 ng/dl
Free T = below 1.0 pg/ml

When I started hormones (having never taken anything, no self-medication, nothing)... my Total T was between 190-200 ng/dl. And my E was in the 50-60 pg/ml... and I was a pretty cut/buff/muscular guy. So general statements can't always apply. Basically you want to maintain the ideal range levels I posted above for a minimum of 3 years to have the best effect from HRT. Some will develop faster, some slower. Time and maintenance of hormones in the ideal range will give you the best results. No short cuts I'm afraid.

I'm also not a fan of the no Spiro approach. Finasteride is a very weak anti-androgen. If you need to grow hair (which you look to have covered), go for it. But it's no substitute for inhibiting T production like Sprio.

Also make sure your doc is monitoring your hepatic function and if you go on Spiro maker sure to monitor your serum potassium level which should stay between 3.5-5.2 mmol/L.

Thanks for your response.

What was your free t level before meds, though? I keep hearing that free t is the one you want gone the most

[Theo]

When I started hormones (having never taken anything, no self-medication, nothing)... my Total T was between 190-200 ng/dl. And my E was in the 50-60 pg/ml... and I was a pretty cut/buff/muscular guy. So general statements can't always apply. Basically you want to maintain the ideal range levels I posted above for a minimum of 3 years to have the best effect from HRT. Some will develop faster, some slower. Time and maintenance of hormones in the ideal range will give you the best results. No short cuts I'm afraid.

Hormones can be fun. Rather androgynous, skinny, small hands and feet, a bit of gynecomastia. First measures were T at 759 ng/dl and E 48.2 pg/ml. My endo did a double take at the T value...

After 6 weeks of E-only (+ standard finasteride, but have been taking that for a year now), my T was at 424 ng/dl and my E at 165 pg/ml, at which point my endo put me on androcur (no spiro over here) to help get the T down. Unsurprisingly I've noticed more changes since then. 

[JennX]

Thanks for your response.

What was your free t level before meds, though? I keep hearing that free t is the one you want gone the most

I'm not sure, but it was mostly likely below "normal male" level. Most of my levels were starting out. I'll look thru my old lab work.

The big deal with a decrease in free T, is a decrease shows less is being produced... And is just not floating around free and not bound by receptors. You basically always want to have both free and total T tested. Some docs only test for total T... Which only gives you half the picture.

[Hideyoshi]

Doctor just called back

Started on starter dose of spiro

happy days ahead :3