We really are a small community. Are we considered "tight knit?"

[JamesG]

Because you don't have to.

[Satinjoy]

I don't go outside of Susans to meet other trans, for many reasons.  Exposure, or seeing something I don't want to see - I need to be among the authentic and that is more likely here in Susans.  I cannot afford to get anything negative about trans right now.

That being said, relationships are forming in here that are completely priceless to me.  I hope they feel the same way about me, I dont know or not, but I would be totally overcome by fear right now if I didn't have the ability to come here.  And when any of us hurt or want to leave, I hurt a lot.  I cannot do this by myself any more I will crack up.

I would have no idea what my gender identity is turning into if I wasn't part of this precious group.  I am very fragile right now and it wouldn't take much to take me out.

So is it tight- this place may be, there is probably a core group sharing that is tight and that I love seeing posting.  They may not feel close to me but I sure feel close to them - you my dears -

Yeah those stats are not right, they are old ones, the one in 250 is newer.  We may never really know.

Evylin I am jealous of your lipstick girl.  Emily you look great, and have helped me a lot, since I appear to be outside the norm here somehow and I need the courage to be genuine.  I still feel like a third sex, definitely not male, but not a girl either.  Unique, but not alone.  We gave up on trying to diagnose me with a label, seems like I don't have one. LOL.  Definitely physically a preop transwoman though.  That is simply a fact.

Stay close to each other girls, we have something very special here.

[barbie]

Transgender people are not tight knit compared with lesbian/gay people. Basically, transgender people are too much diverse in their gender identity and expression, while lesbian/gay people are coherent each other with potential love, and are interested in other people. On the contrary, we are introspective, focusing on ourselves, not to others.

barbie~~

[ErinWDK]

My therapist gave me some data from another site that cited statistics from the 2000 US Census.  Those showed 5% of the population as in some way trans.  This would range from minimal exploration with cross dressing to those living in their correct gender full time.  Those living full time were about 400,000 in 2000.  About 2/3 MtF and the rest FtM.  Only about a third had GCS.

There are a LOT more trans than anybody in the cis world wants to admit.  And, yes, we are really isolated.  The closest support group for me to try and plug into is a two hour drive away.  They meet at a time I have a conflict, so to go I would have to make arrangements to deal with my other responsibilities and risk outing myself coming up with reasons.

This is tough.


Erin

[katiej]

My therapist gave me some data from another site that cited statistics from the 2000 US Census.  Those showed 5% of the population as in some way trans.  This would range from minimal exploration with cross dressing to those living in their correct gender full time.  Those living full time were about 400,000 in 2000.  About 2/3 MtF and the rest FtM.  Only about a third had GCS.

Wow! 1 in 20 are transgender in some way.  That's a lot more than I realized.  And about 2/10ths of a percent of the male population has transitioned...or roughly 1 in 650 men.

There are a LOT more trans than anybody in the cis world wants to admit.

It's probably ignorance more than anything.  Maybe not that they don't want to know...they just don't know.  Heck, I've been trans my whole life, and even I didn't know how many of us there are.  We as a group really are good at hiding!   

[Evelyn K]

You ppls are actually probably my best fwiends

We understand each other

[BunnyBee]

I find the very idea of a trans community, at least in the US, to be kind of a farce.  I mean in india and thailand I think there is an actual trans culture occurring.  My experience is ofc biased by my own non-desire to find such a community.  I mean I just want to blend into the world and live my life and am not seeking a trans community to connect with.  So I suppose there could be little pockets of community existing outside of support groups in America that I don't know of.  I get that my experience is skewed away from seeing it.

But the only place I personally have seen trans community actually exist is on this forum, and other online forums like it that I have never really delved into, aside from that it exists as a sort of myth that (usually cis) people talk about because they can do nothing but project gay tropes on trans peeps cause we're confusing and must be thrown in some box so why not that one?  I honestly have never consciously met another trans person in the real world.  The only trans friends I have, I met here, none of whom I have ever met in the flesh.  How can there be a community or a culture surrounding a condition that is so rare and woodworked that you literally could go your whole life without making a single meaningful IRL connection with another person of your ilk?  Are people sharing a medical condition even an ilk?  Idk.  But woodworked is the key I think to there not being a community in the US, cause that's cultural.  In Thailand and other places trans people seem to be drawn together, and that is the only way we could ever mix with each other enough to create an actual culture cause we're too few, and too dispersed.

There is a real online community though and it saves lives all the time, cause I think you need to connect with people like yourself and realize you are not totally alone to find hope which is the key to surviving this condition.  I can't even imagine taking on the process of transition before the internet existed.  Maybe connections forged in these online communities now will start to build a community of some sort in the future.  Is that something most of us actually want?  Am I totally off-base?  I only have my own perspective and experiences to base anything on.  What do you all think?

[mandonlym]

Yeah in the Philippines the bakla (third-gender) hang out with each other even though they don't sleep together, and generally sleep with masculine men (who often also have wives, but that's another problem). I think it's partially because it's more accepted there so there's not a culture around stealth the same way it is in the U.S. There's also more homogeneity since they desire the same gender, share tips and stories, etc.

I am happy to meet and hang out with anyone here who feels like hanging out with me in NYC. Pm me if you feel like. I'll make sure to look as cis-looking as possible so you don't have to get worried about being clocked. :p

[jussmoi4nao]

]

Yeah in the Philippines the bakla (third-gender) hang out with each other even though they don't sleep together, and generally sleep with masculine men (who often also have wives, but that's another problem). I think it's partially because it's more accepted there so there's not a culture around stealth the same way it is in the U.S. There's also more homogeneity since they desire the same gender, share tips and stories, etc.

I am happy to meet and hang out with anyone here who feels like hanging out with me in NYC. Pm me if you feel like. I'll make sure to look as cis-looking as possible so you don't have to get worried about being clocked. :p

Nahh, when I go up to visit you I want us to be trans obvious haha. Gonna glam it up, 6 inch heels and everything, then cruise for ->-bleeped-<-s, haha, just kidding...mostly.

What's funny is, I've never been clocked, and I can't even pass as male atm, but I also couldn't care less about it. Gender ain't nothin but a thing. I think people get too worked up and take the fun out of self expression.

[Ducks]

I ran across some stats from the census but can't find them again... the numbers for the US were 700,000 transgender.  What I've seen for percentages is 1:30,000 FtM and 1:10,000 MtF.  When I was trying to figure this out in the 80's the stats were 1:100,000 were MtF.  I lived in a city of 100,000 and so I figured I was it.  I met one woman early in her transition in college and she told me who was cool on faculty and who the surgeons and therapists were.  I never really saw her again after that but that was all I needed.

Bad Joke Warning:  what do you call a group of trans women?  A Clock of ->-bleeped-<-s.  Seriously, that was a joke, no fair getting offended.  I don't think trans women are tight knit because we are a mirror to each other that only shows our worst fears.  I hope that will change with the newer girls being able to come out early in life and be accepted, but it is unlikely that there will be lots of trans women in the same place to socialize with, the exception being college or larger cities.

Besides Julie who started me on the right path, I've only ever met 1 other trans women (that I know of) in my life, and I didn't even know she was until the office busybody told me "I knew her when she was doug".  I just thought she was one of the gals.

Found the study - it's from 2011 http://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/Gates-How-Many-People-LGBT-Apr-2011.pdf

[Joanna Dark]

Ironically, lately I care a whole lot less about being identified as trans, though that may be because no one thinks I'm trans or male, ever. But, I had this friend that was trans (she has since detranstioned and started smoking crack so I cut her out of my life like a malignant mole) and about, idk, seven months ago or so we went out while our BFs went to some car movie. She was a lot more gay identified too and didn't pass. But, I hung out and went out and about a pretty bad part of town anyhows. Excpet for some park she wanted to go to it was dark and i'm all of 5'5 and 118 lbs so...yeah, scary. The other thing is she didn't pass and really wanted boobs. Like she was obssessed with breasts and having them. And lil ole me happens to be a 30-32D, so needless to say she was jealous and always talked s~!t. But she tried to pick up guys and several called her a ->-bleeped-<-got. But, when they looked at me, they didn't say word one. I almost felt like a ->-bleeped-<- hag though I'm sure if I had a conversation with someone at this point I would have stopped passing. But I was on HRT for like a couple months so my face didn't change all that much yet. And with my soon to be BF not around I was scared.

I really don't know what the point of that was other than you don't always get clocked by virtue of hanging with a non-passable trans girl. I have a really high pitched voice too so I'm sure it helps. And I have no visible tells: small hands, small feet, small head, tiny narrow shoulders, the whole nine yards. I was attempting, or am attempting to get more involved with the queer community here in Philly and even joined a queer bookclub, but that will be mostly lesbians, and I can swing that way, but it will be awhile sine I'm in love with a man. Hopefully forever. He did say once we will be together til we die an then be buried next to each other so...I'm on his team. And hopefully take his name. *heart flutters while picturing herself staring at a crowd through a veil in a white strapless wedding dress with a tight bodice with lots of lace, a hint of cleavage and a full flowy skirt pushed to the max with petticoats with two girls behind her carrying the ten foot tail of her dress like she be the queen bee*

Anyhoo, aside from my wedding fantasies, I just don't ever see a burgeoning trans community outside of small pockets of peeps in large cities that prolly came together by virtue of being trans but don't stay together because of it. I mean other than being trans I don't see a lot of conversations here about stuff I would love to talk about. There's rarely anything about makeup, fashion, beauty, gossip, babies, boys, boys, and boys....I mean the stuff I would talk about is outnumbered like 10 to one by conversations about guns and techy stuff. i get enough of that from my man. There's a lot of hormone related stuff and transtion related stuff so I keep coming back but I could talk about men like all day and makeup or gossip or other stuff peeps here seem to have zero interest in and so I feel like this little priss in a sea of tomboys. And that's fine. Don't take that the wrong way. But for a community to build up there has to be more in common than "oh you take X dose; I take Y dose." How bout that spiro...heard it...ok im rambling. time to shut up like three paragraphs ago.

[mandonlym]

But she tried to pick up guys and several called her a ->-bleeped-<-got. But, when they looked at me, they didn't say word one.

What's crazy is being mistaken for cis by other trans women. I've coined a term for this: being cissed. My funniest story about that was when I was at a drag/trans bar rooting a friend who was participating in a beauty pageant, and I came so the only seat I could find was on the arm of a couch next to this guy who started talking to me. Then his trans gf came along and said, "Don't forget, c**nts are bad for you," then he said, "She only lets me talk to you because you're not trans." That was twelve years ago pre-op and I felt triumphant at the time. Now if that were to happen I would find it sad, like my whole history has been erased. But that's just activist me.

[BunnyBee]

There's rarely anything about makeup, fashion, beauty, gossip, babies, boys, boys, and boys....

Start these topics, I would post in them .  Ofc I kind of come and go and couldn't be counted on to see them, but surely there are others interested in these things?  I would actually probably be on here more if there were more topics about things outside of trans issues I am interested in.  I too find it's rare to run into such threads and get bored and don't check in for weeks.

[aleon515]

I don't think the stats are correct on trans people nor do I agree with the idea that there are so many more trans women than trans men, it makes no sense. OTOH, it might be that there are more *identified* trans women, because you can live as female on the boundaries kind of in a very masculine way. I'm sure a lot of trans guys lived this way in the past, esp. You kind of see a "boom" in trans men  and I think that fewer trans guys will live like this in the future. Also since T, allows a lot more trans men to "pass" they end up being stealth, a lot of times.

I am really part of the trans community in Albuquerque, where we have a very strong center and so on. You don't see this everywhere.

BTW, there is a running meme about there really only being 6 trans men in the whole world and we all know each other.

--Jay

[Evelyn K]

I've thought about this, if I was MtF trans post-op I wouldn't even tick off the census orientation "T" designation. Why should I? For all intents and purposes I would consider myself to be a gay (or straight) [F]emale and try to live my life as stealthy as possible.

Maybe it's fear of re-igniting my dysphoria after moving on... or perhaps a sense of pride? Superiority that I've crossed over? "I don't want to be associated with those ->-bleeped-<- cross-dressers any more!"

Could be. Probably.

[Joanna Dark]

Then his trans gf came along and said, "Don't forget, c**nts are bad for you," then he said, "She only lets me talk to you because you're not trans." That was twelve years ago pre-op and I felt triumphant at the time. Now if that were to happen I would find it sad, like my whole history has been erased. But that's just activist me.

HA! That's great. My BF still says its funny to see the look on my face when everyone calls me miss or young lady. We met when I first started transtioning, which in a way I wish we met just a couple months later since I had barely changed then and I am andro from the door, But, when people used to ever call me sir or anything, I would get all upset and then he'd have to console me and I would cry and leave places. But now that never happens and most of the time now I'm always super happy and beeming. But that's a great story. I hope it happens to me.

Start these topics, I would post in them .  Ofc I kind of come and go and couldn't be counted on to see them, but surely there are others interested in these things?  I would actually probably be on here more if there were more topics about things outside of trans issues I am interested in.  I too find it's rare to run into such threads and get bored and don't check in for weeks.

Maybe I just will 

OTOH, it might be that there are more *identified* trans women, because you can live as female on the boundaries kind of in a very masculine way. I'm sure a lot of trans guys lived this way in the past, esp. You kind of see a "boom" in trans men  and I think that fewer trans guys will live like this in the future. Also since T, allows a lot more trans men to "pass" they end up being stealth, a lot of times.

IDK though, I think T does allow a better transtion outwards, there's still the issue of GCS for trans men, which I really feel bad about. My BF actually brought it up one day. All the sudden he is this fountain of trans knowledge and was talking about trans men and how they can pass better with T but the surgery isn't as good and he kept going on and on about neo-vaginas and how they look just like the real thing and it's so amazing. Like this was out of the blue. It blew my mind. Then I blew him. True story.

Anyhoo, the one thing I noticed is that FTMs seem more willing to still participate outwardly in behaviors that are stereotypically associated with their assigned birth status. Like at this group I go to, haven't been lately, but whatevs, and a lot of the FTMs would still wear makeup and nail polish and stuff. not all of them. Some. And that's great. The only problem I saw is all of them also wanted to be a part of dudebro culture. Why is beyond me. Crap, hipsters are better. Must be a Philly thing. And in dudebro culture painting your nails hot pink is a big no-no.

I've thought about this, if I was MtF trans post-op I wouldn't even tick off the census orientation "T" designation. Why should I? For all intents and purposes I would consider myself to be a gay (or straight) [F]emale and try to live my life as stealthy as possible.

Maybe it's fear of re-igniting my dysphoria after moving on... or perhaps a sense of pride? Superiority that I've crossed over? "I don't want to be associated with those ->-bleeped-<- cross-dressers any more!"

Could be. Probably.

Yeah, after I'm done GCS, I will not put down T. NO WAY. NUH UH.

[@Diana]

I dont have any real life trans friends, only know them from website/FB .. I studied everything by myself from small FFS to BAS & SRS (asked a bit of this & that from my friends on FB) 

[Evelyn K]

Yeah, after I'm done GCS, I will not put down T. NO WAY. NUH UH.

Oh teh sarcasm! 

[mandonlym]

Start these topics, I would post in them .

I've started boy dating threads and transition-related things tend to take over pretty quickly. My wacky adventures seem to make for interesting stories among my cis friends, but in a context where a lot of people here are in transition, I tend to come off as overly braggy even to myself. I've never quite figured out how to handle that, whether online or in person.

[Ducks]

Transgender people are not tight knit compared with lesbian/gay people. Basically, transgender people are too much diverse in their gender identity and expression, while lesbian/gay people are coherent each other with potential love, and are interested in other people. On the contrary, we are introspective, focusing on ourselves, not to others.

barbie~~

I agree with this, I also think that for the most part, Gay and Lesbian people gather to find partners.  It is really the only way.  Imagine all trans* only were attracted to other trans*... then we would have a community and our own bars and would identify as a single entity.  Instead we transition and melt into the GL or Straight societies to find our partners.