What side affects from Androcur [Cyproteron Acetate], can be generally expected.

[TearDrops]

I have been taking Spiro as my AA, but because one of the stated side affects is that it is a "Potassium sparring Diuretic", I have concerns about taking it. My diet is full of natural and healthy Potassium, and I am very fit and  healthy. I have heard of two other drugs available, one is Cyproteron Acetate, the other is Bicalutamide. I have had good results from Spiro, and my Doctor is keeping close and regular checks on my bloods, but I am having to keep a very tight reign on my Potassium intake, which means my diet is not as healthy and tasty as I would like it to be. Can anyone out there, without breaking any of this Sites forum rules, tell me of the side affects that are most common, with each of these two drugs. I'm pretty sure that the latter, "Bicalutamide" promotes hair growth not just on your head but everywhere [ewh yuk!], but I may have heard wrong. Any information will be gratefully accepted, as it would be useful to go to my Doctor armed with as much information as possible. Thank you.
I would also like to ask the moderator that if this post is okay could it please be posted as soon as possible, with this paragraph obviously deleted, thank you.

[KayXo]

I think if you stay away from processed foods, salt substitutes, mineral water, sodas, energy drinks, fruit juices, go easy on the caffeine and tea, you should be fine. And as long as you eat enough salt and drink enough plain water. Healthy, unprocessed foods, I think, are fine.

But, if you are really concerned, there are alternatives.

Cyproterone acetate blocks and reduces androgen. It is associated with potential side-effects such as increased risk of prolactinoma (due to increasing significantly prolactin levels due to dopamine inhibition), increased risk of blood clotting, depression/anxiety in some, extreme tiredness which can sometimes be improved by taking enough E. Could also possibly adversely affect the adrenal glands but unlikely, according to most studies. In very high amounts (which you probably won't need anyways), can be harmful to the liver. But just so you know...

As for bicalutamide, you should know that it only blocks androgen, does not reduce it and has no effect on androgen in the brain. So, sex drive is not reduced, spontaneous erections mostly remain and testicles, I don't think, shrink. Whether sperm and semen is affected or not, I'm not sure. But, it most definitely helps in feminizing the body and strongly inhibits androgen. It will not stimulate body hair growth, in fact it will do exactly the opposite! From what I have gathered, side-effects seem quite minimal especially at the doses we need them for but, it's best to check with your doctor to be sure. Is more expensive than cyproterone acetate (and spiro) but if taken in small doses, cost can be significantly lowered.   

Lastly, you can go non-oral with estrogen and ask to just be on E. This can effectively reduce your T while feminizing adequately your body. But, you will most likely have to be on injectables or pellets for results to be good. Injectables can be cheap or expensive, depending on where you get them from. Pellets are usually quite expensive.

Oh and there are also LhRh analogues that suppress production of androgen from testicles. These are usually quite expensive. Given in the form of a nasal spray (buserelin acetate) or monthly (or every 3 months) implants/injections (leuprolide acetate, goserelin acetate, etc.)

[Carrie Liz]

I've been on both Androcur and Spiro. So here's my experience...

Androcur freaking KICKS YOUR BUTT. It is a very potent anti-androgen that can single-handedly knock your testosterone level down to completely nothing. I was only on it for 2 months before my first hormone blood test, and it single-handedly dropped my T level all the way down to 22, the basement of the normal female range, from whatever my pre-HRT normal male level was, that quickly.

It is VERY potent.

The basic thing that causes problems is that Androcur is a progestin. Progesterone is the "regulating hormone" that balances moods and keeps both testosterone and estrogen in check. Progestins compete for the same receptor sites as progesterone, and thus actually inhibit it from doing its job. So basically the estrogen will be completely allowed to run amok with your moods. While I was on Androcur, my mood swings were just completely off the charts. I went from being the happiest I've ever felt to feeling suicidally depressed several times a week.

Also, prolonged usage of Androcur can inhibit adrenal function.

Spiro, while a much less potent anti-androgen, plus with the side effects of potassium retention and being a diuretic, does not have these same issues. My moods have been much more stable on Spiro, without the violent swings. Plus since it isn't a progestin, the body's natural progesterone is allowed to work, resulting in a much more natural hormone balance rather than being completely estrogen-dominant.

[teeg]

I'm currently on Cyproterone Acetate. Is one AA better than another for feminization? While on Cyproterone Acetate my feminization has seemed to stop. It's been months since I've noticed any changes...

[KayXo]

Progesterone is the "regulating hormone" that balances moods and keeps both testosterone and estrogen in check.

This does not appear to be correct as many women who take bio-identical progesterone in addition to estrogen feel worst versus only estrogen and many women also report feeling worst during the second part of their cycle when E is only moderately elevated and progesterone rises significantly. I'm finding out, to my surprise, that perhaps I feel best on just E versus E+P.

Also, men have very little progesterone and extremely high levels of testosterone so progesterone has close to no effect in them.

All this puts seriously in doubt the absolute necessity of progesterone.

So basically the estrogen will be completely allowed to run amok with your moods.

Several women, including myself on very high doses of E, taken in the form of pellets/injectables feel better and our moods are just perfect. It seems it's the lack of E more than too much of E that is responsible for mood disturbances.

While I was on Androcur, my mood swings were just completely off the charts. I went from being the happiest I've ever felt to feeling suicidally depressed several times a week.

Androcur has that reputation to cause this in some. Perhaps because it reduces dopamine levels, or/and maybe because it inhibited androgen too much and you weren't taking enough E to compensate for that or/and that since it is a progestogen and all progestogens seem to have this common effect to make us depressed, progestins more so than progesterone (or perhaps not). Progestins, not only progesterone, have mild anti-estrogenic effects too so should also "keep in check" estrogen, as you say. But perhaps, its negative effects are partly due to just that, reducing estrogen effectiveness too much.

Also, prolonged usage of Androcur can inhibit adrenal function.

Although studies in general have not shown this to be true in the general population...there have been a few reports here and there so who knows? At this point, still purely speculative, I think.

Spiro (...) Plus since it isn't a progestin, the body's natural progesterone is allowed to work, resulting in a much more natural hormone balance rather than being completely estrogen-dominant.

Spiro is actually a progestin but with apparently very weak progestogenic effects.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spironolactone

"Spironolactone has weak progestogenic properties.[26][55] Its actions in this regard are a result of direct agonist activity at the progesterone receptor, but with a half-maximal potency approximately one tenth that of its activity at the androgen receptor.[38] Spironolactone's progestogenic actions are thought to be responsible for some of its side effects,[56] including the menstrual irregularities seen in women and the undesirable serum lipid profile changes (which are both seen with other progestins as well) that are seen at higher doses.[25][57][58] They may also serve to augment the gynecomastia and breast tenderness caused by the antiandrogenic/pro-estrogenic effects of spironolactone,[59] as progesterone is known to play a role in breast development.[60]"

The notion of estrogen dominance stems from the risks associated with estrogen action on endometrium/uterus if not opposed by progesterone. If estrogen dominance were really true, many transwomen would feel quite bad on just estrogen or high doses of estrogen without P which is clearly not the case and seems to actually be quite the opposite. Theory does not always translate into actual fact.

[KayXo]

I'm currently on Cyproterone Acetate. Is one AA better than another for feminization? While on Cyproterone Acetate my feminization has seemed to stop. It's been months since I've noticed any changes...

Results will vary from one person to another. All progestins have mild anti-estrogenic effects, perhaps CPA much more so than Spiro as I probably think it is a much stronger progestin than Spiro so this could perhaps be detrimental but its anti-androgenic effects help E so which of the two wins out, who really knows? One can, after discussion with doctor, switch to another AA or just stick with E and see if there is improvement. Or perhaps, it's simply because your E is still too low. These concerns should be discussed with your physician, someone who is competent in that field.

[trans064134]

The basic thing that causes problems is that Androcur is a progestin. Progesterone is the "regulating hormone" that balances moods and keeps both testosterone and estrogen in check. Progestins compete for the same receptor sites as progesterone, and thus actually inhibit it from doing its job.

So adding bio-identical progesterone to HRT regimen with Androcur will have no effect or negative effects?

[Carrie Liz]

So adding bio-identical progesterone to HRT regimen with Androcur will have no effect or negative effects?

I believe I've been thoroughly proven wrong in this topic, so I'm just going to keep my mouth shut and let the experts handle it.

[KayXo]

So adding bio-identical progesterone to HRT regimen with Androcur will have no effect or negative effects?

Since Androcur is a progestogen but exerts different properties too, adding progesterone could prove helpful or not. The only way one can truly tell is to try if doctor is willing.