Was thinking about my child hood..

[Avinia]

Couldn't decide on a title for this since I am listening to a documentary and it is very late right now(or actually I noticed late for me has recently became around 2am)..

Anyways, I keep hearing from transgenders, that they knew from a young age... or something like that. So, I am kind of curious about that, of course thinking back on it, I have always wanted to be a girl, and I guess did play with girl toys while at a friend's house. But I find it interesting, I never really acted like a girl around my parents, and am now planning on coming out as MTF in the next few years. But both of my brothers dressed cross dressed when they were younger, and both are straight and very masculine(though my younger brother still has a high voice).

But yeah, I can of course see a lot of things that make me think I have always known, like I always have hung out with more girls than guys, and just can't relate to any guys, and that I have always chosen a bit more feminine items in secret(like I used to be really into a TV series aimed toward boys, but I always roleplayed as the girl characters).

Now I wonder how much of my shyness or anti-social behavior is actually caused by hiding so much from my parents over the years.. now I can barely even tell my feelings to them or any of my opinions.

So yeah, I am kind of curious about how other people on here feel about when they were kids? I am actually kind of thankful now that I didn't tell my parents back then, because I probably wouldn't have known for sure, and likely wouldn't be who I am now.

[helen2010]

Avinia

I think most of us have had dysphoria from very early on in life.  I think that dreaming about becoming a girl, being shy and feeling our of place or unable to naturally know how to be alpha male appear to be quite common experiences for tg folk on this board.  A good gender therapist is very useful in helping you understand just who you are and how you can best move forward.

I am sure that there will many folk along in a moment to share their experiences.  My dysphoria started at 4 and continued until I was prescribed low dose hrt.  I am transitioning MTA/Q and definitely consider myself as non binary.

Our narratives vary, but dysphoria is almost always a constant.

Safe travels

Aisla

[Sheala]

Avinia, I have to admint that my history is just like yours. I never "knew" untill i was 31, part of that is that i had next to no contact to any in the LGBT comunity. so i never could relate to any one else. I also had more female friends then male, and always roleplayed as a woman. I do recal being told an lot that boys dont do this or that. so there where always little things that i can look back and say yes it was there, i just didnt know what to look for at that time in my life.

and as Aisla said dysphoria hits us all, just in slighltly diferant ways.

wish you the bast,
Sheala

[Lady_Oracle]

I can remember a lot from back then. There were so many red flags going off. One of my memories was when I would constantly try to tuck my penis and make that area flat, I remember feeling so relived when I would. Another time was when I dressed up as a spice girl(I was scary spice) for my 5th grade talent show and for the first time I just felt free! And I knew what transgendered meant thanks to my 5th grade teacher. He told the class of a person that had fully transitioned. However thanks to the machismo culture I grew up in, I was terrified of coming out.

[suzifrommd]

Avinia, I spend a lot of time thinking about my childhood. I did NOT know from a young age. I was 50 when I first suspected I might have gender issues. I remember in my mid-teens, after I had my first girlfriend, that I wished her body parts were mine, but I've found a couple other signs:

* In nursery school, my two best friends were girls. I went over to their houses (which my mother, bless her, didn't discourage).
* In 2nd grade, my best friend was a girl. Once again, my mother didn't discourage my friendship with her. We stopped being friends after we got teased a lot.
* I was not an aggressive kid. I was always picked on because it did not come naturally to stand up for myself.
* However, throughout most of my childhood, I felt and acted like a normal boy.
* When I went to summer camp, in my early teens, I always chose female friends. That trend continued throughout my entire life.

[stephaniec]

my childhood was kind of rough because I was extremely introverted and never talked to anyone not even my parents . this lasted through grade school and beyond. I had a severe cross dressing problem through grade school, high school, college and basically to the present with a long period of denial when I didn't do it until transitioning .

[Carrie Liz]

Childhood gender-nonconformity isn't the be all and end all of being trans. Yes, most MtFs are to some degree more feminine as children, but not everyone. Cultural pressure to act a certain way, and a childhood lack of understanding of what gender really is in the first place, mean that it's a bit more complicated.

You seem to understand that others who are not trans in any way also express childhood gender nonconformity, and you're right. Among those who were admitted to therapy for childhood gender nonconformity, only 10%-25% eventually identified as trans in adulthood.

Early puberty is the key. That's the age where most people grow out of their childhood gender nonconformity, and accept their identity as their birth gender. But for those who are trans, the opposite happens. They start developing body aversion, and their dysphoria gets stronger. In a study of teenagers who identified as trans strongly enough to be put on puberty-blocking hormones, 70 out of 70 retained their trans identity into adulthood. So currently, according to WPATH, the most accurate marker of whether one is trans or not is how they respond to puberty.


The reason I always say this is because when I started transition, I was really scared that I was making the wrong decision, because I pretty much had no childhood gender-nonconformity at all aside from always having girls as best friends. Had you asked me about being trans at that age, I would have laughed and said "no way." But then as soon as early puberty hit, suddenly out of nowhere I started developing trans tendencies. I started hating the body hair that was coming in, was scared to death of my voice changing, started hating the pictures that were taken of me because I hated looking like a developed male. I started hating my genitals, and started developing more feminine social tendencies, and hating being treated like a guy. So despite believing that I was trans for almost certain because of my teenage experience, I went through a lot of doubt simply because I didn't have that same sense of "I've always been a girl" that others say they had. So it was a great relief to know that WPATH acknowledges that one doesn't need to have any childhood gender-nonconformity whatsoever in order to be trans, that the real signifier was the early-puberty years. And the APA's official diagnostic manual (which I'll get to in a moment) makes no mention of age whatsoever.

Now I kind of look back at my childhood and see it as though I myself was one of those tomboyish gender-nonconforming girls who thought that I was a boy as a kid, then hit puberty and all of a sudden grew out of it, and wanted to be feminine. The only difference is that for me, I couldn't be feminine, because my body betrayed me and insisted on making me more masculine.

So yeah... I appreciate that a lot of people on here knew since they were kids. But I think it's a problem when anyone tries to apply their own experience to the population as a whole. Some knew since their first memory, some didn't know until puberty, some didn't even know until later. According to WPATH, gender-nonconforming kids definitely aren't necessarily trans, a lot of them grow out of it. Teenagers who identify as trans pretty much are trans. And while it doesn't specifically mention anything about those who didn't develop a trans identity until adulthood, I would like to share the following:



According to the DSM diagnostic book, here are the only requirements to be diagnosed as trans:

"A marked incongruence between one's experienced/expressed gender, and assigned gender... of at least 6 months duration, and manifested by 2 or more of the following indicators:"

1. Incongruence between one's experienced/expressed gender, and one's actual primary/secondary sexual characteristics. (We call this "body dysphoria.")

2. A strong desire to be rid of one's primary/secondary sexual characteristics due to this incongruence. (Or in young adolescents a desire to prevent the development of anticipated secondary sexual characteristics.)

3. A strong desire for the primary/secondary sexual characteristics of the other gender.

4. A strong desire to be the other gender. (Or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender.)

5. A strong desire to be treated as the other gender. (Or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender.)

6. A strong conviction that one has the typical feelings and reactions of the other gender. (Or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender.)


That's it. At least 2 of those indicators, persisting for 6 months or more. It makes no mention of at what point in life these things must occur. Just that they need to be there. And according to the APA, these criteria yield a true positive rate of identifying gender dysphoria 94.2% of the time, and a false positive rate of only 0.7%.

[Kaydee]

I am about to turn 57 and only realized I am transgender in January.  Before that I thought of myself as I guy with some strange characteristics.  I also had little contact with the LGBT community, or I would likely have recognized it earlier.  Looking back I wonder how I could not have realized I was trans earlier, but there seemed to be something in my mind that would keep me from reflecting on the trans behaviors.

There were many things that should have tipped me off - starting as an adolecent - I was cross dressing when I could 'borrow' the clothes, I would regularly fantasize about wearing the clothing of women I was around, I was unaggressive as a male and regularly picked on, I stopped singing when my voice changed (though I didn't know why), I was never able to work out how to get a date (and the girls were not at all interested.)   

So, had I known about being transgender all the evidence was there.  But I never could put it together.

What I am trying to figure out was weather I never knew, or did I once know and repress it all under social pressure?

[Misha]

There are a lot of similarities between us. In some cases it's almost copy/paste.

I was viewed as a "weird" child since early age. Very isolated, introverted, no interest in socializing, high interest in natural sciences... That was the part defined by my asperger which couldn't have been diagnosed at that time as the work of doctor Hans Asperger wasn't translated into other languages until 1994. And of course random claims that I'm a girl at the age of 4 or 5 (not sure when exactly).

My older sister and I shared toys and I used her clothes when she grew up from them. Only later last year I learned that my mother didn't care about the cross-dressing for financial reasons and that she always tried to pick as unisexual clothes as possible so that they could be reused. So not sure if it can be called cross-dressing then :-) . That partially went even through puberty.

When I actually did socialize I always preferred the girl collective. In the elementary school it led to bullying but later on it only led to questions like: "You spend so much time with girls and you don't date or sleep with them?" And then the usual comments: "You sit like a girl", "You play with your hair like a girl", "You spend so much time in the bathroom like a girl". Did I care? No I didn't.

However my definite decision to undergo sex reassignment therapy came in early 2008 (I was 22.5 years old) when I took my first job as a junior programmer. And guess in what kind of workplace I ended in: men everywhere. So I started my planning and preparations to ensure absolute independence should anything go wrong. And I put that plan into action last November :-) .

[stephaniec]

Childhood gender-nonconformity isn't the be all and end all of being trans. Yes, most MtFs are to some degree more feminine as children, but not everyone. Cultural pressure to act a certain way, and a childhood lack of understanding of what gender really is in the first place, mean that it's a bit more complicated.

You seem to understand that others who are not trans in any way also express childhood gender nonconformity, and you're right. Among those who were admitted to therapy for childhood gender nonconformity, only 10%-25% eventually identified as trans in adulthood.

Early puberty is the key. That's the age where most people grow out of their childhood gender nonconformity, and accept their identity as their birth gender. But for those who are trans, the opposite happens. They start developing body aversion, and their dysphoria gets stronger. In a study of teenagers who identified as trans strongly enough to be put on puberty-blocking hormones, 70 out of 70 retained their trans identity into adulthood. So currently, according to WPATH, the most accurate marker of whether one is trans or not is how they respond to puberty.


The reason I always say this is because when I started transition, I was really scared that I was making the wrong decision, because I pretty much had no childhood gender-nonconformity at all aside from always having girls as best friends. Had you asked me about being trans at that age, I would have laughed and said "no way." But then as soon as early puberty hit, suddenly out of nowhere I started developing trans tendencies. I started hating the body hair that was coming in, was scared to death of my voice changing, started hating the pictures that were taken of me because I hated looking like a developed male. I started hating my genitals, and started developing more feminine social tendencies, and hating being treated like a guy. So despite believing that I was trans for almost certain because of my teenage experience, I went through a lot of doubt simply because I didn't have that same sense of "I've always been a girl" that others say they had. So it was a great relief to know that WPATH acknowledges that one doesn't need to have any childhood gender-nonconformity whatsoever in order to be trans, that the real signifier was the early-puberty years. And the APA's official diagnostic manual (which I'll get to in a moment) makes no mention of age whatsoever.

Now I kind of look back at my childhood and see it as though I myself was one of those tomboyish gender-nonconforming girls who thought that I was a boy as a kid, then hit puberty and all of a sudden grew out of it, and wanted to be feminine. The only difference is that for me, I couldn't be feminine, because my body betrayed me and insisted on making me more masculine.

So yeah... I appreciate that a lot of people on here knew since they were kids. But I think it's a problem when anyone tries to apply their own experience to the population as a whole. Some knew since their first memory, some didn't know until puberty, some didn't even know until later. According to WPATH, gender-nonconforming kids definitely aren't necessarily trans, a lot of them grow out of it. Teenagers who identify as trans pretty much are trans. And while it doesn't specifically mention anything about those who didn't develop a trans identity until adulthood, I would like to share the following:



According to the DSM diagnostic book, here are the only requirements to be diagnosed as trans:

"A marked incongruence between one's experienced/expressed gender, and assigned gender... of at least 6 months duration, and manifested by 2 or more of the following indicators:"

1. Incongruence between one's experienced/expressed gender, and one's actual primary/secondary sexual characteristics. (We call this "body dysphoria.")

2. A strong desire to be rid of one's primary/secondary sexual characteristics due to this incongruence. (Or in young adolescents a desire to prevent the development of anticipated secondary sexual characteristics.)

3. A strong desire for the primary/secondary sexual characteristics of the other gender.

4. A strong desire to be the other gender. (Or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender.)

5. A strong desire to be treated as the other gender. (Or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender.)

6. A strong conviction that one has the typical feelings and reactions of the other gender. (Or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender.)


That's it. At least 2 of those indicators, persisting for 6 months or more. It makes no mention of at what point in life these things must occur. Just that they need to be there. And according to the APA, these criteria yield a true positive rate of identifying gender dysphoria 94.2% of the time, and a false positive rate of only 0.7%.

I think I got an A+ on the DSM

[JulieBlair]

I started reading this tread a couple of hours ago, was interrupted by a conference call and then took a walk with a girlfriend.  I have often wondered when I knew, or more importantly when I began to savagely repress that knowledge.  I think I always wanted to be a girl of some sort.  The sort who played Barbies, and built forts.  I had no vocabulary for that, and I didn't/couldn't say "I am a girl"  at least not until much later.

Somehow I think that the lack of vocabulary was inhibitory, as was the dominant culture at the time.  Even as a young adult I chose to try to be gay rather than transition.  I could be feminine, and in the art and drama crowd accepted, and even admired.  Nobody can emote like a gay boy in drag!  Didn't work out for me, the people I loved began to die of what we later learned was HIV Aids and I got scared right back into the university.  I don't know how, but I remain HIV Negative and am grateful for that gift.

I stuffed who I am down into a deep and very dark place, and assumed the mantle of who I thought I should be, responsible, hard working, most of all a man.  It took thirty more years before I could say "I am a girl" - Those decades weren't awful, but they were underlyingly sad.  I hurt some perfectly wonderful people trying to be what I was not, and in the end was pretty much emotionally and very nearly physically, dead.

Being able to say that simple phrase "I am a girl" out loud and to another person, was the key to authenticity and acceptance for me.  From there I could find the help I needed to begin the discovery of the person who was hiding in the basement of my soul for a very long time.  The hardest work I have ever done, led to the happiest me I have ever been.

Today I have friends of many colors, and many homelands.  I get to work with bright people who care not a wit that I am a woman, but rather celebrate my life and milestones with me.  Today I have a man who loves me, knowing my past he is open in expressing the desire that my future and his future merge into our future.  Today I have hope!

So did I know I was trans as a child?  Maybe at some level. Does it matter?  Not so much, at least not so much any more.  What does matter to me is that before I died by my own hand, I found an unsuspected inner resource that has propelled me into a world of color, of acceptance, and of authenticity.  I live the life of my choosing, In a  bit less than a year, I will have the anatomy to complete the process.  For now I feel powerful and whole.  I've closed with this before, but It is really true here.

My name is Julie Anne Blair
I live in Seattle Washington
I am a woman!

[PoeticHeart]

So, here goes my attempt at explaining my narrative.

During my child hood, I was very... policed. I was told by my parents and the world around me that this is what boys do and this is what girls do. I was raised in a cult of personality, and trust me, this just made things one hundred times worse. My sister and I would play with her dolls at points, or play dress up games online. I would promptly be informed to 'stop acting like a sissy'. It was these moments that would lay the foundation for utter and all out repression. During my teen years -- around people I thought it was appropriate -- I tried to 'butch it up'. I repressed my body dysphoria, and still to this day that leaves me confused about whether or not it existed. I'm still working on working through this bit of being trans. I was so envious of cis girls for a number of reasons. I remember telling my best friend 'If only I had been born a girl, my life would be so much easier'. Not that being a woman is easy -- I get that -- but that dealing with the world around me would've been so much easier to navigate. I wouldn't have to be something I'm not.

This all came to a head last August when I truly began questioning my gender. I really hardcore worked through these questions during this period of questioning. This past May I came out to everyone via Facebook. I posted a very long status about it, and for those that truly hold a dear place in my heart, have talked about it further apart from that status.

[stephaniec]

I started reading this tread a couple of hours ago, was interrupted by a conference call and then took a walk with a girlfriend.  I have often wondered when I knew, or more importantly when I began to savagely repress that knowledge.  I think I always wanted to be a girl of some sort.  The sort who played Barbies, and built forts.  I had no vocabulary for that, and I didn't/couldn't say "I am a girl"  at least not until much later.

Somehow I think that the lack of vocabulary was inhibitory, as was the dominant culture at the time.  Even as a young adult I chose to try to be gay rather than transition.  I could be feminine, and in the art and drama crowd accepted, and even admired.  Nobody can emote like a gay boy in drag!  Didn't work out for me, the people I loved began to die of what we later learned was HIV Aids and I got scared right back into the university.  I don't know how, but I remain HIV Negative and am grateful for that gift.

I stuffed who I am down into a deep and very dark place, and assumed the mantle of who I thought I should be, responsible, hard working, most of all a man.  It took thirty more years before I could say "I am a girl" - Those decades weren't awful, but they were underlyingly sad.  I hurt some perfectly wonderful people trying to be what I was not, and in the end was pretty much emotionally and very nearly physically, dead.

Being able to say that simple phrase "I am a girl" out loud and to another person, was the key to authenticity and acceptance for me.  From there I could find the help I needed to begin the discovery of the person who was hiding in the basement of my soul for a very long time.  The hardest work I have ever done, led to the happiest me I have ever been.

Today I have friends of many colors, and many homelands.  I get to work with bright people who care not a wit that I am a woman, but rather celebrate my life and milestones with me.  Today I have a man who loves me, knowing my past he is open in expressing the desire that my future and his future merge into our future.  Today I have hope!

So did I know I was trans as a child?  Maybe at some level. Does it matter?  Not so much, at least not so much any more.  What does matter to me is that before I died by my own hand, I found an unsuspected inner resource that has propelled me into a world of color, of acceptance, and of authenticity.  I live the life of my choosing, In a  bit less than a year, I will have the anatomy to complete the process.  For now I feel powerful and whole.  I've closed with this before, but It is really true here.

My name is Julie Anne Blair
I live in Seattle Washington
I am a woman!

aids was a major force in my life

[~Evelyn~]

I was so envious of cis girls for a number of reasons. I remember telling my best friend 'If only I had been born a girl, my life would be so much easier'. Not that being a woman is easy -- I get that -- but that dealing with the world around me would've been so much easier to navigate. I wouldn't have to be something I'm not.

I can totally relate to you on this one. I hated being something I wasn't and was sick of pretending, yep... I too was envious of cis girls.

[peky]

I was not shy at all, and so from the time I could, I express myself as forceful as I could. I made it clear that I was female,  and that is when the beatings began (by family, friends, teachers, and school mates), follow later on by psychotherapy follow and even  an exorcism !

I was hungry, cold, and abandoned... I retreated into my imagination and into the mountains and forest that surrendered my so called "home"...

I can summarize my childhood with one word: painful... fortunately now it but a distance memory

[~Evelyn~]

I was hungry, cold, and abandoned... I retreated into my imagination and into the mountains and forest that surrendered my so called "home"...

Yep Ive done that too only somehow I convinced my childish mind I was an elf and befriended the nearest tree and needed no use for mortal companions.

[peky]

Yep Ive done that too only somehow I convinced my childish mind I was an elf and befriended the nearest tree and needed no use for mortal companions.

OOXX to you !

[Avinia]

Thanks, wasn't expecting that many replies..

I am not too worried now that I didn't know right away when I was younger, and still don't know exactly what gender I consider myself.. though I have started dressing a bit more gender neutral it seems.. looking at the clothes I wear now compared to last year..

Hmm... Weird, feel a bit more calm now after reading all those posts.