Do you percieve men and women in the same way being on E rather than T

[Auroramarianna]

Most law officials are male, firemen too. If someone saves your life, it's not likely that it'll be a woman. What's your point?

Not sure what you're trying to prove with that graphic, if anything it's a problem with culture/society, not gender...

Anyway, this is pointless. Keep hating men and worshipping women, but if you ever look at yourself and see a lonely person, you won't have to think too hard to figure out why that is.
You outright say you just want distance from "men", nevermind who they are or what they did for others. Any decent person will only want distance from you...

Most nurses, psychologists and social workers are female. Both men and women save many lives, though in different ways. But anyways, I do not agree with hateful comments against men. It's not like being a "man" is a premise to being an aggressive, bad person and just like "woman" is not a premise to an all flowerly, sweet and delicate human being. Women may not be as aggressive as men physically, but both sexes overlap in most other kinds of violence. Even if they didn't, there would still be no plausible reason to hate against men.

[Evelyn K]

If there wasn't so much male inspired mayhem going on in society, then maybe there wouldn't be so much need for law enforcement action in the 1st place. Comparatively it makes sense that a specific gender population is finding itself at a much higher frequency of having to "police" over their sorry aggressive selves. It's the only way to keep chaos from spilling over into the opposite camp, who are all mostly victims of the above.

There's no hate - just a picture of the facts.

You can't disassociate the one common denominator in all of this and the root enabler of aggression - testosterone.

[Auroramarianna]

Oh, and one more thingy.

Men are more successful at committing suicide, but for every man attempting suicide there are seven women doing the same. The means women use are just not as effective. A woman is much more likely to try overdose herself with pills and men are more likely to point a gun to their heads.

[stephaniec]

Oh, and one more thingy.

Men are more successful at committing suicide, but for every man attempting suicide there are seven women doing the same. The means women use are just not as effective. A woman is much more likely to try overdose herself with pills and men are more likely to point a gun to their heads.

A famous psychologist who teaches at the University of Washington in Seattle wrote her PHD thesis on the fact that men were far more successful at completing suicide attemps then women. Her theories are the basis for DBT ( dialectical behavior therapy ) used for the prevention of suicide. Dr. Marsha Linehan

[luna nyan]

Being on E has meant I am more aware of my personal safety.  I'm more careful walking the streets at night, knowing that I no longer have the strength there to help me get out of trouble.

Evelyn, I'm sorry to see that you have decided that half the worlds population is trash.  You'll cut yourself off from a lot of potentially good relationships, but if you feel comfortable with that...

[Evelyn K]

Being on E has meant I am more aware of my personal safety.  I'm more careful walking the streets at night, knowing that I no longer have the strength there to help me get out of trouble.

Evelyn, I'm sorry to see that you have decided that half the worlds population is trash.  You'll cut yourself off from a lot of potentially good relationships, but if you feel comfortable with that...

[Jane's Sweet Refrain]

Hi, I'm not a moderator and this comment is not meant to moderate. But I'm a little sorry to see that Stephanie's really interesting question took a detour into an argument about whether men are bad or not. The question prompts us to talk about perceptions, which by definition are not subject to argument (even though they might, as Evelyn K says about men, have a basis in statistics. But a lot of perceptions do not. They are about our lived realities.). I'm still interested in hearing about how the perceptions of others have changed, and I would really love to hear more.

Love to you all,

Jane

[stephaniec]

Hi, I'm not a moderator and this comment is not meant to moderate. But I'm a little sorry to see that Stephanie's really interesting question took a detour into an argument about whether men are bad or not. The question prompts us to talk about perceptions, which by definition are not subject to argument (even though they might, as Evelyn K says about men, have a basis in statistics. But a lot of perceptions do not. They are about our lived realities.). I'm still interested in hearing about how the perceptions of others have changed, and I would really love to hear more.

Love to you all,

Jane

Me too , I'd like to understand the depth of the effects of estrogen

[luna nyan]

Hazards of online discussion I suppose!

Back on topic.  I'm hormonally female (as of my last blood test), presenting and living male.

My perception of women hasn't changed.  I still can't relate in the way I want to, but that can't be helped given my circumstances.

Males, I can understand, but no longer relate to some of their attitudes.  There is that reservation inherently present due to the stoic attitude that society imposes on males, and I can't be like that anymore personally. 

Funnily enough, I seem to be able to connect with children better - I don't seem as threatening or something.

[stephaniec]

I'm the same way with the male attitudes, It's very difficult for me to deal with. The job I had for a long time was with overnight laborers who's Idea of an interesting conversation was talking about female breasts and whether they looked old and saggy or young and perky .

[Juliett]

Hazards of online discussion I suppose!

Back on topic.  I'm hormonally female (as of my last blood test), presenting and living male.

My perception of women hasn't changed.  I still can't relate in the way I want to, but that can't be helped given my circumstances.

Males, I can understand, but no longer relate to some of their attitudes.  There is that reservation inherently present due to the stoic attitude that society imposes on males, and I can't be like that anymore personally. 

Funnily enough, I seem to be able to connect with children better - I don't seem as threatening or something.

Actually, by comparing posts in the FtM forum with the MtF, you can easily see that society only accounts for 30-40% of it. The rest is wired by hormones. The majority of males are stoic and have difficulty expressing emotion because that is what testosterone does. The majority of females are more empathetic and feel emotions harder because that is what estrogen does. It is biology.

[Carrie Liz]

IMO the changes have a lot to do with socialization.

I was on hormones for like a year and a half before going full-time, and frankly didn't feel much different in terms of how I related to women versus men from when I was pre-hormones. Women were still these shining pillars of femininity that I couldn't get closed to, and they were still treating me as an "other" so I had a hard time feeling like I actually was one of them even though I talked with them so easliy. And men were the same guys as always, the group that I was reluctantly stuck with even though I didn't completely relate with them because of their occasional "need to prove my maleness" behavior.

Going full-time is what changed this.

Now that I've actually had a chance to do some "girl bonding," (particularly thinking of last night's escapade where a bunch of the girls I was with got drunk, and the entire conversation devolved into sex talk where the lesbians were ripping on the straight girls and everyone was revealing secrets and then suddenly everyone started touching everyone else's boobs,) I definitely feel included with the women. It's those emotionally-intimate moments that set male socialization and female socialization apart. And after a lot of that touchy-feely socialization (which I love,) the male standoffish "bro" socialization just seems a lot more alien because I'm not included with it anymore. Now it's more "just guys off over there doing guy things. Whatever."

So again, I'd say the real difference isn't hormones, it's more how we view ourselves. Hormones made a little difference to how I respond to things, and definitely made me more prone to hugging and crying and having a greater reaction to cute things, but it didn't really affect my socialization or how I viewed and related to men and women until the female hormones were combined with being perceived as female by others.