Digit Ratios

[Rose City Rose]

So I remembered recently that there had been a number of studies on digit length as a predictor of certain traits, particularly the 2D:4D ratio (the ratio between your index and ring fingers).

Natal women tend to have index and ring fingers of roughly (not exactly) the same length or with a longer index finger (though obviously there are plenty of cis women with shorter index fingers).

What I found is that even though my ring finger was very slightly longer than the index, the difference was not that great; in fact they were of near equal length.  This together with the positive way I responded emotionally to female hormones, my grade 1 hypospadias, my small hands,  my slow puberty, and my high voice (it never changed completely), I think I may be ever so slightly intersex.

How about everyone else?  is your index finger a good bit longer, a good bit shorter, or about the same length as your ring finger?  And if you have the more feminized trait of an equal ratio, do you have any other indicators (high voice, feminine shape, hypospadias, etc) of a slight intersex condition?

[alabamagirl]

Mine look to be of equal or very similar length. My fingernails look rather femme, too. But I still got cursed with plenty of male attributes. Deep voice, lots of body hair... What is hypospadias, by the way?

[ImagineKate]

My index is very slightly longer than the ring on my dominant hand, and on my left hand they are about even.

[Paige]

How about everyone else?  is your index finger a good bit longer, a good bit shorter, or about the same length as your ring finger?  And if you have the more feminized trait of an equal ratio, do you have any other indicators (high voice, feminine shape, hypospadias, etc) of a slight intersex condition?

Hi Rose,

My index and ring finger on my right hand are the same size.  I'm right handed.  On my left hand the index finger is slightly longer than my ring finger.   As for other things, I tend to walk more on my toes, my therapists says that I have a lot of feminine facial features and I talk with my hands the way women do.

Take care,
Paige

[nikkit72]

Honestly, digit ratios, it is a load of rubbish.

[LordKAT]

What is hypospadias, by the way?

When the urethral opening is not at the end of the penis but somewhere on the shaft. Basically.

[ImagineKate]

As for other feminine things...  I have a bit of a feminine profile on my waist, no visible Adam's apple, hip rotation slightly forward. But I also have a crazy amount of body and facial hair like I could do duck dynasty in a short period of time. hands are man hands though, but my dad's hands are even worse, thick and broad so I may have gotten them from him. The voice I have can be high or low pitched at times but it falls in the mid to high end of the male range. Always had problems to impregnate (low count, low motility). Couldn't do it naturally so we had help.

So yeah I may be slightly intersexed. Or most likely not. Who really knows.

[RosieD]

Ooo! Is it the digit ratio thing cropping up again? I haven't seen that mentioned on here for at least three months. Digit ratio is not a sexually dimorphic thing. Even Wikipedia knows that.

Rosie

[alabamagirl]

Ooo! Is it the digit ratio thing cropping up again? I haven't seen that mentioned on here for at least three months. Digit ratio is not a sexually dimorphic thing. Even Wikipedia knows that.

Rosie

I don't think any of us are taking this terribly seriously. Even if it was 100% conclusive that digit ratios were related to gender, would any of us suddenly decide we weren't really transgender because of our finger size? I sure wouldn't.

I'm just happy I have some small physical trait that some attribute to my internal gender.

[Jaime R D]

lol, I've had people on another forum, not a trans one, try to say it was a foolproof way to spot our kind.  That sort, there is no arguing with...

[Dread_Faery]

Glad to see other people think it's BS

[Blue Senpai]

I coulda swore that a majority of us FTMs had voted themselves to have low 2D:4D ratios in a poll in some other thread. That was quite an interesting difference to note.

[kelly_aus]

I'm just happy I have some small physical trait that some attribute to my internal gender.

But it doesn't actually have anything to do with your gender, internal or external..

[alabamagirl]

But it doesn't actually have anything to do with your gender, internal or external..

I know that and you know that, but if some people think it makes me more feminine, I'm not going to argue. I'll take any added pass-ability I can get.

[ImagineKate]

I don't think any of us are taking this terribly seriously. Even if it was 100% conclusive that digit ratios were related to gender, would any of us suddenly decide we weren't really transgender because of our finger size? I sure wouldn't.

I'm just happy I have some small physical trait that some attribute to my internal gender.

Yep this.

[stephaniec]

sorry, couldn't resist

[Jessica Merriman]

Digit ratios are total garbage. No cis girls in my family passed it. Don't sweat digit ratios, it is what is inside your heart and soul that counts. 

[HelloKitty]

I agree about the digit ratio thing being hogwash. Both of my index fingers are ever so slightly longer than my ring fingers, but it doesn't mean a thing I don't think.

My body looks the same as a cis girl who is in rather good shape, my voice sounds female and nobody I meet these days has any idea I'm not cis.

Most importantly I'm comfortable and happy now rather than embarrassed, depressed and miserable before.
I have long suspected that I am intersex as well because of a few rhings including a surgery of some kind done on me down there when I was a baby. I know aboit the surgery, just not what it was. Parents are super tight lipped! :/

[HughE]

On it's own, whether you have a more male-typical or female-typical digit ratio doesn't mean very much, however there are a number of other biomarkers of below normal male testosterone during childhood and puberty, which are known collectively as a "eunuchoid habitus". This is a type of body structure that's usually associated with intersex conditions.

Here's a list of what to look for:

* long, slender arms and legs
* feminine looking facial features
* legs significantly longer than the height of your upper body
* an armspan more than 3cm greater than your height
* sparse or very fine body hair
* a female pubic hair pattern (like an upside down triangle and confined to the pubic area)
* an inability to build upper body muscle
* gynecomastica
* a female carrying angle
* a female digit ratio

Basically you end up with a body structure that's more like the one the female members of your family have than the male ones. It's more noticeable during your teens and 20s, since after that, testosterone (even at below normal male levels) will have masculinised your body to a significant degree. Obviously once you start on HRT that messes everything up, so if you're on HRT you need to remember back to what you were like before you started taking hormones (things involving bones, such as limb length and leg to trunk ratio, should still be the same though, since these don't change once your puberty has finished).

Just by asking around, this type of body structure seems to be way more common among MTFs and transfeminine people than among the cis male population (particularly among those of us born in the DES era). This supports the idea that transness is a kind of intersex condition, except one affecting the brain rather than the genitals.

[justpat]

  Hugh, most all of these fit me till I was about 40 then some things changed like little body hair before then after 40 it started growing . A funny thing is my SO who I met in 1973 told me she thought I was pretty when we met.