Voice Feminization Surgery With Dr Haben

[Madison (kiara jamie)]

eva your voice sounds very female, the only thing i have noticed that might give you away is the way you choose your wording, you still use male pattern language,

i hope i don't offend, and i also speak the same and think using female pattern language will be my most difficult obstacle to overcome in my voice training because it is mostly retraining your grammatical choices when speaking and it will be like relearning english slightly

as for resonance i think you are doing amazing and any doubts in your voice quality should be shelved until your about 6 months post op since that is about how long it takes for soft tissue to significantly settle after any surgery, even in the case of voice surgery

[Eva]

Wow Eva, you sound great I would do anything to have a voice like yours.

Thanks If your not happy with your voice after trying to work on it you know Dr Haben is still working, far as I know

[Eva]

eva your voice sounds very female, the only thing i have noticed that might give you away is the way you choose your wording, you still use male pattern language,

i hope i don't offend, and i also speak the same and think using female pattern language will be my most difficult obstacle to overcome in my voice training because it is mostly retraining your grammatical choices when speaking and it will be like relearning english slightly

as for resonance i think you are doing amazing and any doubts in your voice quality should be shelved until your about 6 months post op since that is about how long it takes for soft tissue to significantly settle after any surgery, even in the case of voice surgery

Thanks No offense at all, I know I still talk like a male a lot of the time... Im not surprised I have a hard time changing my speech pattern either after 44 years of living a mans life

Its hard to make a recording of what I sound like day in day out... I try to avoid just reading and usually just ramble on about whatever' s on my mind...

Sometimes though and usually with my girl friends but sometimes men as well if I like them I can tell when im getting it right... Its weird but its just a feeling thats different...

Your right about the healing too, Im just real impatient 

[akegia]

Thanks If your not happy with your voice after trying to work on it you know Dr Haben is still working, far as I know

Hey, Yeah I actually have been emailing him recently. Might go with him later in the year or next year. (Your topic/posts have pretty much sold me on his methods)

[ImagineKate]

Eva,

It sounds much improved. It doesn't sound super high, but it definitely sounds female. Especially from where you started, you've certainly come a long way.

The resonance issues will be resolved with training, I think.

[Eva]

Thanks Akegia I was looking for something online and I see that Dr Haben updated his web page with more info http://professionalvoice.org/feminization.aspx

The info he has on smokers there is spot on... As a former heavy smoker I feel like even though Ive quit for more than 4 months now it has hindered my results... I had a VERY deep voice pre op though and now Im centered around 180-190hz... Im 2 1/2 months post op and I should be hearing my final result soon...

Honestly Im kinda disappointed, I feel like its still too deep    Im waiting on a call from Dr Spiegel today to discuss my upcoming surgery and my plans for a trachea shave... Mine is really not that bad but I understand my face/neck lift will possibly make it much more visible... Im worried about it making my voice deeper though   Im going to ask him for his opinion on doing a CTA in addition to what Ive already had done... He is an ENT too so Im also wondering if there's anything he thinks he could do while he's in there.... One thing about having a CTA that scares me is the scar on my throat If Dr S could do it and put the incision higher up on my chin Id probably go for that...

I donno in about two weeks I will have my 3 month post op consult with Dr Haben and see what he thinks about it and hopefully discuss any further surgical options to tweak it a bit higher... Ideally he could do it endoscopic with a laser...

Im also considering a consult with Dr Thomas in Oregon to see what he says and see if he could get me up to 200-210 hz with an endoscopic laser treatment like this...

http://voicedoctor.net/surgery/pitch/laser-vocal-cord-tuning

Kate thanks... It IS improved but I just want more, I guess Im just a perfectionist

Im also sure I could improve it a lot with training but there is no "training" to be had around here aside from going full time

Anyway here's where its at today...

http://vocaroo.com/i/s1v370yJQqVW

[Eva]

Well I just talked to Dr Spiegel, he said it sounds a lot better than it did when I saw him at our consultation  I could hardly talk then though, I was still recovering from this and pretty hoarse...

He says he can do a CTA if I want one with my upcoming FFS The question now is do I want one???
He said the incision would have to be a bit lower than for the trachea shave, it would also be longer but only about a quarter inch... About a 1 inch incision...

He also said depending on where my cords are tied he might be able to tie off a little more... He said he has done both the CTA and the web before...  Id love to have him take a look there when I see him for my pre surgical consultation... I think Id do the CTA and trach shave with my FFS, BUT Im not sure Id be able to talk very well after the CTA... With everything else going on with the FFS Im not sure I want to do that

Id still like Dr Habens opinion on doing a CTA and trach shave with my FFS I mean for a CTA Ive only seen recommendations of no use of the voice for at least a week... Dr S said Id be able to talk but it would be weak, Id have to speak softly and there would be no potential for harm like with a web if I just take it easy... I guess that makes sense but Im still not sure Id want to do the major FFS stuff and then not be able to talk very good while recovering for such a big ordeal

I guess it would depend on what Dr S thinks he could do with maybe making more of a web???
I want to hear what Dr Haben thinks there as well as far as going in and tying more off....

Id rather have Dr Haben make a shorter web BUT Id like it If Dr Spiegel did the CTA because I trust him more with the incision... Either way I cant do a web with FFS because Id have to start the whole 3 month VFS healing process over AND I know I cant talk after that even if I wanted to... Thats a week of NO talking at all... Id do it over again though If Dr Haben thought he could get me 2-3 notes higher...


I donno but I gotta make up my mind soon here... Im leaning towards doing nothing at all there for now, not even the trach shave and seeing how it looks after my FFS heals... 

Give it all a few more months THEN decide on additional VFS.... Thats probably the way to go I guess....

[warmbody28]

Yeah I say check with haben first. I know im going to see him for my surgery I think feb 17th and will be asking him a lot of the same questions

[anjaq]

Personally I think 190 Hz are fine. But thats just me. Its where I would probably like to end up, although I would not be unhappy if it is 200 or 180, given my original voice was at 110 Hz. The rest can still be changed by some small voice training. I would not do a CTA if I was you - not only does it leave that scar, it also restricts your voice in some ways and you may actually end up too high and sound false because of that. If anything, maybe that laser is an option to just add a few more Hz. But honestly I owuld rather wait and see first, and maybe check with a voice therapist experienced in gendered voices to see what may be bothering you and if it really is the pitch.

[Eva]

I dont even think its making 190 hz today More like 160-170.... I can easily hit 75 hz this morning I can hardly stand to listen to the recording so I wont bother posting it here

Really I feel havent got much out of this surgery sometimes Sometimes it seems pretty good too though, its very frustrating Sometimes I can do 190 hz but it seems very rarely lately

I feel like Ive actually lost the very highest range and I have nowhere near the falsetto voice I used to and I can still get WAY too low as well.... Im not sure how a CTA would work without much of a falsetto voice to rely on    It sucks, I used to smoke like a chimney and I had a higher falsetto voice than I do now nearly 5 months after quitting, AND having VFS

Im going to try to get in touch with Dr Haben next week for my 3 months post consultation and see what he says... I doubt Im gonna like it much...

[anjaq]

Keep in mind though that also the Yeson patients have often a bad voice in month 3 or 4 - apparenty that is usually attributed to the botox injections wearing off, but it may also be just part of the healing process. It seems to get better after that in most cases, though.

[warmbody28]

I dont even think its making 190 hz today More like 160-170.... I can easily hit 75 hz this morning I can hardly stand to listen to the recording so I wont bother posting it here

Really I feel havent got much out of this surgery sometimes Sometimes it seems pretty good too though, its very frustrating Sometimes I can do 190 hz but it seems very rarely lately

I feel like Ive actually lost the very highest range and I have nowhere near the falsetto voice I used to and I can still get WAY too low as well.... Im not sure how a CTA would work without much of a falsetto voice to rely on    It sucks, I used to smoke like a chimney and I had a higher falsetto voice than I do now nearly 5 months after quitting, AND having VFS

Im going to try to get in touch with Dr Haben next week for my 3 months post consultation and see what he says... I doubt Im gonna like it much...

I wish you the best of luck. Im going in for my surgery on the 18th. im going to document what they will let me. hopefully i have some good results that arent so inconsistent

[Lunarain]

Eva, I've been tracking your progress on this forum and I can honestly tell you that for the 1st time I think you sound very passable. And I hope your voice will continue to improve to your satisfaction. In case it doesn't, please don't be so hard on yourself by focusing your entire attention on just one aspect of being a woman. There's no perfection in anyone's transition as we all feel insecure about some aspects of ourselves to various degrees. Even for the ones passable in every way, they still have to deal with whatever problems life throws at them just like any other women out there. And I have yet to encounter a problem free cis woman. So cheer up! I wish you the best of luck in your journey! 

[kwala]

Greetings, beautiful posters!  I'm a newbie here but have been lurking for a while.  I have recently been in contact with Dr. Haben about doing a glottoplasty procedure.  I have a trained voice that gets the job done, but it's never been truly comfortable even after two years of working on it, and when I'm sick it goes out the window completely!  I have a lot of concerns about this surgery since I play a wind instrument professionally.  I would love a female voice that was more automatic, but I'm very hesitant to do anything that could have a negative impact on my career.  I also sing in a mezzo soprano range, which is just a hobby, but still important to me.  Dr. Haben says that the surgery can slightly change the airway and that any difference is minimal, but I have to wonder, has anyone who has had this surgery, or Dr. Kim's, noticed a change in breathing?

Eva, I've followed this thread closely, and I think your voice is much improved!  I'm sorry it isn't where you want it to be right now, but I hear a basic feminine quality in your voice and I have a feeling that with more training and experimenting you will find ways to make it even better.  I can only speculate, but as for falsetto/head voice I have to wonder if you might need to go about accessing it in a slightly different way.  I really hope this is the case.  I sing in head and mixed voice all the time and I would be crushed if I lost my upper notes!  I don't know if anyone out there plays a wind or brass instrument (or sings) but any feedback would be most welcome as I try to make this decision.  Also, to those of you who have shared your experiences with VSF: Thank you so much!  You are helping people to make educated decisions about a new and potentially life-changing process

[Eva]

I wish you the best of luck. Im going in for my surgery on the 18th. im going to document what they will let me. hopefully i have some good results that arent so inconsistent

Good Luck!!! Are doing the web and the CTA???

[Eva]

Eva, I've been tracking your progress on this forum and I can honestly tell you that for the 1st time I think you sound very passable. And I hope your voice will continue to improve to your satisfaction. In case it doesn't, please don't be so hard on yourself by focusing your entire attention on just one aspect of being a woman. There's no perfection in anyone's transition as we all feel insecure about some aspects of ourselves to various degrees. Even for the ones passable in every way, they still have to deal with whatever problems life throws at them just like any other women out there. And I have yet to encounter a problem free cis woman. So cheer up! I wish you the best of luck in your journey! 

Thanks Lunarain I feel like there's just still too much of the low end there but sometimes if Im just right with it I know its very good... Its just not as easy and effortless as I hoped it would be

[Eva]

Greetings, beautiful posters!  I'm a newbie here but have been lurking for a while.  I have recently been in contact with Dr. Haben about doing a glottoplasty procedure.  I have a trained voice that gets the job done, but it's never been truly comfortable even after two years of working on it, and when I'm sick it goes out the window completely!  I have a lot of concerns about this surgery since I play a wind instrument professionally.  I would love a female voice that was more automatic, but I'm very hesitant to do anything that could have a negative impact on my career.  I also sing in a mezzo soprano range, which is just a hobby, but still important to me.  Dr. Haben says that the surgery can slightly change the airway and that any difference is minimal, but I have to wonder, has anyone who has had this surgery, or Dr. Kim's, noticed a change in breathing?

Eva, I've followed this thread closely, and I think your voice is much improved!  I'm sorry it isn't where you want it to be right now, but I hear a basic feminine quality in your voice and I have a feeling that with more training and experimenting you will find ways to make it even better.  I can only speculate, but as for falsetto/head voice I have to wonder if you might need to go about accessing it in a slightly different way.  I really hope this is the case.  I sing in head and mixed voice all the time and I would be crushed if I lost my upper notes!  I don't know if anyone out there plays a wind or brass instrument (or sings) but any feedback would be most welcome as I try to make this decision.  Also, to those of you who have shared your experiences with VSF: Thank you so much!  You are helping people to make educated decisions about a new and potentially life-changing process

Thanks Kwala I put this out there so others that are considering this surgery have something to go by... There sure isnt much out there to be found concerning this surgery in NY with Dr Haben... In my experience though he's been spot on in describing the healing process and the potential for a less than optimal result due to my past smoking and a very deep voice to start with

That said I have ZERO regrets, I can live with it the way it is.... It IS easier now for sure

I havent noticed any issues at all with breathing, not an issue... As far as singing??? Well its not like I had this great falsetto singing voice thats gone now so I donno

Im waiting to hear back from Dr Haben after sending in my 3 month recording....

Im leaning towards doing nothing to my trachea or maybe just having Dr Speigel shave it down... Then having more tied off on the web in a few months after I recover from FFS...

Yes Id do it all over for 2-3 more notes.... Im scared of doing the CTA though...

[kwala]

Thanks Kwala I put this out there so others that are considering this surgery have something to go by... There sure isnt much out there to be found concerning this surgery in NY with Dr Haben... In my experience though he's been spot on in describing the healing process and the potential for a less than optimal result due to my past smoking and a very deep voice to start with

That said I have ZERO regrets, I can live with it the way it is.... It IS easier now for sure

I havent noticed any issues at all with breathing, not an issue... As far as singing??? Well its not like I had this great falsetto singing voice thats gone now so I donno

Im waiting to hear back from Dr Haben after sending in my 3 month recording....

Im leaning towards doing nothing to my trachea or maybe just having Dr Speigel shave it down... Then having more tied off on the web in a few months after I recover from FFS...

Yes Id do it all over for 2-3 more notes.... Im scared of doing the CTA though...

That's great that you're staying positive.  You've already had a tremendous improvement and there's nothing wrong with wanting a little touch up   I'm scared of CTA, too!!
May I ask, what happens when you try to break into falsetto now that this process is done.  Does it feel too strained, or is it simply that no sound will come out when you try to move up really high in your head voice?  When I am trying to expand my range, I usually do sirens on an "Ng" sound starting with a really really really light chest voice so that I can easily blend into head voice without a noticeable break.  I wonder if that would apply to the new structure of your vocal chords.

I got another email from Dr. Haben today, he seems to think that instrumentalists have a much less difficult time recovering than singers (which is a big relief).  I still need to do some more research before I commit, but this is looking more and more like something I want to pursue.   It's going to be hard to take that much time off of work, and it's really going to suck when I come back for rehearsals out of shape.  Hope they'll understand

[Eva]

Well... I feel like some of my "lost" falsetto might be from not putting so much constant effort into speaking at a higher pitch

I can still do my "mixed" voice and it sounds even better when I do it and I DO use it when I have to talk on the phone... BUT I dont have to use it as much now so I feel like the muscles that were trained to make it work aren't as strong as they were Also since a higher pitch is much more effortless the conditioning I used to have way up there is possibly less now than it was from atrophy...

But I used to be able to go 50 hz higher easily....

[warmbody28]

Hey. I'm not planning on the CTA as of right now. Although I did pay for that as well. ( I book like a week before his website changed to allow the other option). When I talk with him I will see what he says i I just need one or also the CTA. And then I will post my results on YouTube most likely