Stealth members, sticking up for trans issues

[gabimoneratt]

I don't think the whole argument has been about stealth shaming... I am stealth, one of the biggest reasons why i am stealth is safety, or else i can be one of the LGBT people killed every 26 hours in my country for a single reason: hatred.
With that said, what really bugged me was people thinking their transition was all because of them, no help from other trans whatsoever and that they owe nothing to trans people... hell, if it weren't for Roberta Close and some other trans icons or trans people who fought for rights in my country i don't even freaking know if I'd still be alive. Changing documents is a lot harder here in comparison to North America and Europe, so even though i pass, whenever i have to show my ID people find out. That being said, if it weren't for trans women who fought for us to have free treatment, idk where I would be... I never found a good gender specialized therapist in Rio, other than mine who actually was thrown into it because the public health system started to consider transition and SRS the cure for "transexualism". Secondly, i would live my university life in hell because of name issues... thanks to the trans who fought for the so called "social name", I don't have to panic anymore because i know they won't call me by my old name in front of the entire class like they have done on my first 2 semesters (and i felt like poop for that...) I now have a student ID that states my name thanks to the ones who fought for it.
for me to say i owe nothing to anyone? THIS is what I think is wrong. Be stealth, don't be an activist, but be thankful. Thanks to them we get to be stealth, thanks to them we get to have a much better life than we would have without them... and realize that they do far more than us for the younger trans girls that are to come...so they can have an even easier life, so that they can be stealth if they choose to, unlike many older trans women... because if it weren't for them probably there would be no such thing as stealth

[Dread_Faery]

maybe you don't appreciate or understand the different risks and culture of where I'm at.

I suggest you get off your high horse of idealism and know, not in every land, being vocal or visible or having trans activism gets what we deserve.

some of us have to work for it. so please respect our risk aversion as much as I respect your free choice.

you can do whatever you like, as can anyone in a free world,  but I would like to respectfully remind you that you never have the right to mandate what people should or should not do.

it's ironic I have to say this, because in the stealth shamers have trodden all over the rights and free will of those who elect to remain silent, in their pursuit of drumming up vocal support

I'm not shaming people who chose to be stealth, I'm shaming you, personally, for your lack of empathy and callousness. There is a world of difference between wanting to be able to discuss trans issues without outing yourself, and saying that you owe nothing to the trans community.

I have nothing but respect for Nicole, because she is prepared to make her voice heard, as a woman. But you don't need to be trans for trans-misogyny and trans-antagonism to be issues that affect you, because they affect all women.

[Jessica Merriman]

 

No more personal attacks will be permitted under TOS. This is being monitored closely and will be locked and warning levels issued if this continues.

[Susan522]

"Be stealth, don't be an activist, but be thankful. Thanks to them we get to be stealth, thanks to them we get to have a much better life than we would have without them... and realize that they do far more than us for the younger trans girls that are to come...so they can have an even easier life, so that they can be stealth if they choose to, unlike many older trans women... because if it weren't for them probably there would be no such thing as stealth "

From the mouths of babes...

[androgynouspainter26]

This post is so depressing.  The amount of privilege blindness here is just making me sick, as is this underlying notion that all of you are "better" than those of us who for whatever reason don't have the luxury of stealth (and I've heard that directly stated by one of you in a PM).  I'm not even interested in this conversation, just exhausted and sick of people who keep saying that their way is the right way, and that stealth is the best thing someone can be.

Frankly, I think a lot of the people here are shaming those of us who aren't, can't, and will never be able to blend in.  Please, check yourselves.  I'm trying to be as civil as everyone else here, but this whole topic has me more than a bit angry. 

[Jessica Merriman]

I see no shaming at all, just disagreements. This topic has provided some facts.

1. There are those who are in imminent danger if they are discovered. Very true.
2. The trans people of the past got us where we are today. Very true.
3. We should all respect those who choose stealth. Very true.
4. Stealth members should be thankful for those of us who are out and open. Very true.

Stealth and open trans people are in a symbiotic relationship. EXTREMELY TRUE. 

[androgynouspainter26]

This wasn't directed at you...you've not at all been on that tangent.  But there is this underlying mentality of superiority and shaming of those who do not pass/stealth here, not from you but plenty of others.

[Jessica Merriman]

This wasn't directed at you...you've not at all been on that tangent.  But there is this underlying mentality of superiority and shaming of those who do not pass/stealth here, not from you but plenty of others.

I know that was not directed at me. 

I just did not want anyone to overlook the facts that have come out during debate. I personally see no shaming at all, disagreements, but no shaming. I do hope the younger, more passable members do not look down on those of us who don't well. If they do that is on them. You are always going to have ungrateful people anywhere over any topic. I personally love seeing those here who pass without a doubt because I know they will never have to go through what we did. If they are grateful for our open lives helping them achieve their goals I am happy. If anyone tries to shame or place a non passable person on a lower level we have TOS against that and action will be taken. 

[Jessica Merriman]

I don't owe anyone in any community.

Members may disagree with this, but I feel it is a true statement. None of us owe each other at all. Things are better though when we care for each other, but the poster is not in a position to do this for safety concerns.

[Jessica Merriman]

Same goes gor hanazono, if you are that stealth and passable then no one will suspect anything about you. They will just see you as a ciswoman who stands up for good values!

The problem is she is not in a position to take that chance.

  Listen, in the unlikely event I ever get to that point, stealth, I will not hesitate to stand up for what is right.

I do not support this as one never knows how they will react until it does happen. Sure, you can imagine that you would do it I am not saying you will not stand up for trans issue's, but until you are at that point, who knows. 

My career was filled with what would you do's, but things happen that are unexpected in life.

[Susan522]

Very simple! If you are that passable and have been stealth for the last 20 something years, then you can freely defend trans issues and stand up for them without being suspected of being one!....I have never been suspected of anything! Same goes gor hanazono, if you are that stealth and passable then no one will suspect anything about you.

There are some mighty big "if's" in this statement.  IMHO it is arrogantly presumptuous to ass-u-me that what works for you will/should work for all.

[Susan522]

This post is so depressing.  The amount of privilege blindness here is just making me sick, as is this underlying notion that all of you are "better" than those of us who for whatever reason don't have the luxury of stealth (and I've heard that directly stated by one of you in a PM).  I'm not even interested in this conversation, just exhausted and sick of people who keep saying that their way is the right way, and that stealth is the best thing someone can be.

Frankly, I think a lot of the people here are shaming those of us who aren't, can't, and will never be able to blend in.  Please, check yourselves.  I'm trying to be as civil as everyone else here, but this whole topic has me more than a bit angry.

I am sorry that you find this thread disturbing and depressing.  However, I certainly do not see any "shaming' on the part of those who are 'stealth'.  In fact what I see is exactly the opposite wherein those are have in fact achieved some degree of 'stealth', are being told that they should feel guilt or shame for having done whatever it was that they had to do to achieve that level of contentment or comfort.  Is that not the ultimate goal, to live in peace in their own skin, and on their own terms?  Perhaps it is those who are angered or depressed by the success of others, that "should check their privilege"?

[Susan522]

Susan552: No wonder you are being moderated.

hugs,
Samantha

Excuse me?  I am getting the snide implication, but just exactly is your point?  You don't like my POV, therefore I should be "moderated"?

[V M]

Okay friends

This has been fun, but not really very much fun

Wouldn't it be nice if people could express their opinions without going at each other?

Topic Locked

Thank you

V M