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The state of play after 1 year of HRT

Started by Joan, January 09, 2015, 05:53:42 AM

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Joan

Came out to my gf in Nov 13, started HRT in Jan 14, came out to my brother and sister and some friends in the summer, starting laser in June after messing around with the Tria thing for far too long, and I will hit my one year anniversary of estradiol injections this coming Sunday.

It's been an interesting ride and even learned, finally, at the age of 45, to love jazz along the way.

Physically, I'm a B cup on the left and an A on the right.  I've had almost no development in the width of my hips, though my bum is a nicer shape than it was before I started.  I've lost some muscle from my arms, although not really from my back. 

My face has changed to the point where people i don't know so well who haven't seen me for a months have trouble recognising me.  After 6 sessions of laser my once impressive beard is not much more than a shadow across my upper lip and chin.  My face is quite noticeably more feminine than it used to be.

That said, I still don't pass to anything but the most cursory glance.  Hey-ho...

Emotionally, I am now an empathetic person who can talk to people about just about anything for quite a long time - quite different from the gruff and defensive male I used to be.  This could be the HRT, and it could just be me letting myself let other people in.

I was set on full transition and SRS when I started, now I'm not so sure.  I went out regularly as a woman for the first 10 months after coming out.  I found the experience quite harmful to my confidence as a person.

I took a break for four months, got on with life, worked hard, saw old friends and made new ones, and enjoyed being a well-dressed and reasonably attractive man around town.  As I'm a lesbian, the female attention is definitely not unwelcome.  Taking a step back from transition has definitely helped me see a bigger picture, and the importance to me of my career, and my friends. 

I finally had some time off work around new year and Joan showed her face to the world again.  The world still looks back in puzzlement, and sometimes shock.  I've decided to take another break from going out.

In my heart I know what I'd like to be seen as, and I hope that someday I can get there.  I'm not stopping the hormones and I'm continuing the laser.  I'll give it another year and see where I'm at.  I know what I am, but I may not necessarily need the world to see Joan to live as Joan really is.

I know that GD is a different road for all of us.  For some it leads to full transition, and for some an accommodation with its effects.   I'm not sure exactly where mine leads, but good luck to you all on your own journey.

Love

Joan
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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katrinaw

Hey Joan, very interesting journey.... It seems from experience, and reading others notes that there is no real direction as everyone has different personalities and emotional breakpoints... I have been very inclusive for so many years trying to conform, now want to release my self, for better or worse... interesting the statements around emotional reaction to going FT...was my main biggest fear, hence HRT for many, many years prior to where I am now.
I also agree with the empathy, in fact that and emotion are my biggest changes... apart from total Jealousy when my SO is shopping... somehow I just can't come out there and then... the clothes shopping has been a massive transformation for me.
My music tastes have not changed, still like whatever is in vogue.... Face has changed, but to those around me, its been a long term gradual process... blessing or conundrum... I have only been out on fleeting trips as the real me, but do drive regularly alone as me... And yes, I do ramble on with anyone and most subjects now, unlike before.

Good luck with whatever path you choose, I have reached that do or forever hold.... position... and dreading the fall out and turmoil in the family over it... but...

Hugs and Kisses
L Katy
Long term MTF in transition... HRT since ~ 2003...
Journey recommenced Sept 2015  :eusa_clap:... planning FT 2016  :eusa_pray:

Randomly changing 'Katy PIC's'

Live life, embrace life and love life xxx
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Joan

Hi Katy

This is where I am now, and i don't know how I'll feel six months from now.

I never went full time, but I did spend a lot of my weekends out and about.  I've had 3 or 4 days when I just seemed to pass and those were really quite magical, when the world saw me as I see myself.  I read a lot here and there that going full time you eventually just get the hang of passing, and maybe it's the switching back to being a guy that dulls the edge of your presentation.  I don't know...I still have the hope of getting to that sometime.

Good luck with everything and going full time this year.  Like most things, if you own it you can do it!
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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Emily R

Hi Joan,

Have you continued transitioning or did you continued or your break from HRT .  What finally made you come to a decision?

Emily
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AshleyP

I know the thread is a little old, but thanks for sharing that, Joan. Because of my situation, I'm far more interested in the mental aspect of HRT over the physical changes. I'm currently pursuing approval to begin that phase of my therapy and am also trying to research those effects.

It's hard to discern what may be the changes from a placebo effect and what are the real changes different people report. Rightly or wrongly, I tend to put more credence on those that have started, stopped and then restarted.

Give us an update if you care to.

All the best,
AshleyP
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Joan

Hi Emily and Ashley

I guess I'm approaching 17 months on hormones.  The last few months I've seen quite a few physical changes.  I now fill a C, and if I where a proper bra then I definitely have enough to be satisfied with.  I don't where a sports bra and climbing the stairs can be somewhat 'uncomfortable'.  No one notices much though when I'm in male mode.

My hips have taken on a bit of fat (not enough for a female shape), my arms have slimmed out, I've lost muscle from the base of my neck, and my face has feminised a bit.

I'm still presenting male and no one doubts that genetically I am (no male fail), at least not here in Japan.  I did get some odd looks on recent trips to the States and Hawaii.

10months of laser has removed the dark hair patches, and there is just a shadow left now, but not much more than many women my age have I guess.

My hair has begun to grow in a bit where it was receding, but not enough I think to ever live without a wig.

I've ventured out a couple of times in the last few weeks.  The first time was incredibly nerve racking and I was very negative about how I was being seen, almost to the point of paranoia.  I spoke to the psychiatrist about this feeling of negativity that I can't get past, and he told me that it was more likely that people were looking at me because a) I'm foreign and stand out, and b) because I'm tall and stand out.  The next time I went out I decided to give this attitude a try and managed to come to place where I could feel I was passing, at least much more than before, and that made me feel a lot better.

Last weekend I get ready to go out again, but just couldn't find the courage to get in the car.  Maybe next weekend.

I think if anything the mental effects have got more pronounced.  I connect with people much better than I used to and it's improved my relationships, especially with women.  Whether it's related to the hormones or not I don't know, but my movement and posture is less and less male.  I'm less aggressive and more quietly spoken than ever, and I was never much of the opposite of those things.

I do have some anxiety about what kind of future this is leading to.  I like what I'm becoming physically and mentally, but I'm not sure I have the courage for full transition.  I go through phases and putting Joan back in the box, but she breaks back through in the end and she wants to be out full time. 

So I keep busy working one full time job and two part time, as well as being a full time student and keeping a girlfriend happy.  I try to make the most of each day that comes, and the future will work out how it's going to work out.

Sorry for the long post, but that's where I am :)
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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katrinaw

Hi Joan,

Wow a lot of change since January that's so, so good, I'm so happy for you :-*

It's funny you know, but the more feminine you start to look the more conscious of "failure" you become, you start to look at the details more... I am not full time, but out and about in the car I have no problem with anymore, its public places like trains, buses and bars etc. that I would avoid ATM, especially those places where people may loiter!

Its so nice seeing your neck reducing in circumference and your muscles shrinking up... unfortunately my hips have not gained much, if anything, but waist is much more feminine now, as well as my calves, despite skiing, have become more feminine now.

Nice you've made C cup.. only a B for me for last 6 years or so... But that's what I've been given, with right bra's etc. still look good.... LoL

L Katy  :-*
Long term MTF in transition... HRT since ~ 2003...
Journey recommenced Sept 2015  :eusa_clap:... planning FT 2016  :eusa_pray:

Randomly changing 'Katy PIC's'

Live life, embrace life and love life xxx
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Ms Grace

Thanks for the update Joan, really good to hear. Sorry I missed it when you first posted.

Are you still in Japan - I guess there may be some cultural issues to being trans there? Perhaps that accounts for some of the difficulties you are having presenting as Joan?
Grace
----------------------------------------------
Transition 1.0 (Julie): HRT 1989-91
Self-denial: 1991-2013
Transition 2.0 (Grace): HRT June 24 2013
Full-time: March 24, 2014 :D
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Joan

Hello again Katy and Grace

I haven't been posting much, but I have been dropping in here. Good to see you both looking so well.

Yes, still in Japan.  Employment after going full time could be difficult, especially in what I do, but most of the problems are in my head I think.

I regret going out so much when I still had a lot of beard shadow and bulk.  I think your approach, Grace, was definitely the best.  I need to get past the negative experiences if I'm to make any progress with this.
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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Anastazja

I accidentally stumbled upon some old and very negative information while waiting for the Susans server to come back online; this person asserted that every transition was a stratight line and if you didn't follow that line, then you were simply not a transsexual and were a liar.  It's weird how the negative voices tend to carry over the positive ones; anyway, just wanted to let you know that reading about your journey stopped my tears and made me feel good about being who I am.  The thing that I have learned from my brief time as an active member of this website is that everyones transition is different and unique to them; there is no right or wrong way to do it.  As long as you are being true to yourself, you can never go wrong.  Keep your head up. 

We should coin a nifty five-dollar term for anxiety about passing; I went for a walk in the woods and still got anxiety about passing.
Peace and love:  Everybody gets the hug!!!
Peace and love:  Everybody have the high-fives and cakes!!
Peace and love:  I want the cheese for breakfast!!
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Joan

Sorry for not replying, Anastazja.  I'm more forgetful than I use to be so I guess that's age catching up.

And yes - anxiety  :o

Another five months have passed - a very busy five months - which makes a total of 21 months on HRT.  Maybe another update might be useful to someone, so more ramblings from a middle aged woman in male drag.

My12 laser sessions have finished, and most of the dark stuff has gone.  The white hairs are still there, and I will start electro before Christmas, but with a clean shave and a bit of foundation I cannot cover up the most of it. 

I've bought some D cup bras because the Cs were getting too tight.  Still no real hips to speak of, although there is more far being deposited there.  That might just be the 5kgs I've gained since the spring :D

I gave up on my hair growing back enough, certainly in the immediate future, so I cut it back quite short, which means that wigs sit better.

Lost some more muscle mass, and having been quite bulky after a final male fling with weight training a few years ago, I'm now well built for a girl and fairly slight for a guy.

None of this gets me male-failed, but I have been described as androgynous lately.  Life goes on as a bloke without any real problems.

Last week brought the last few days of the summer break, and I had some time to relax, reshape my makeup skills, try out a few clothing combinations, do some stuff with my hair (wig of course), and fight off the urge to show myself to the world with the disappoint and heartache that was likely to bring me.  I couldn't, so three consecutive nights I went out and sat in the car, went out again, scurried into a convenience store and came again again, and went out and had a walk around town.  No danger, no abuse, no s->-bleeped-<-s - so far so good.

Yesterday afternoon I got the urge to go shopping, so I drove 100 miles, parked in the mall, chickened out and left the mall, bought some coffee at a nearby convenience store, drove back to the mall.  There then followed another internal struggle, until the part of me that thought 'Who am I living this life for?' won on points and I stepped out to face the world. 

The world responded with supreme indifference, which was exactly what I wanted.  An hour and a bit wandering around the shops, coffee in Starbucks, a few groceries at the supermarket on the way home and I was done.   Seven hours as me.  Beautiful I ain't, but I guess I was blending in as much as a 6'2" person of different skin colour in largely racially-homogenous country could. If I was getting read then nobody was letting on, and that is good enough for me.

The realisation that I would never be able to pass, and the uncomfortable life that would mean for someone as diffident as myself, is what had made me put the dream away and give up on full transition.  Now I have to decide what to do next.
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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Autumnleaf

Hi Joan, I have to say I loved reading your 2 year experience on HRT.  I do have a few questions though.  In those two years, how long did it take for you to lose the muscle in your back and traps?  Although I have a small frame, due to years of weight/fight training, I've developed large back and trap muscles that really tend to stick out.   

Also, how much facial changes have you noticed?  What type of changes and how quickly did they occur?

Thanks.
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transjoe

Hi Joan,

I hope you can find your way and decide what to do - I have been reading your experience with quite an interest.

When you say you can present as male how do you hide your D-Cups? I could not imagine how this works?

In your first post you mentioned a girlfriend - how does she take your transition and your bodily changes?

Kind regards, Joe
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Samantha C

Thank you for sharing your journey, you and I sound about the same build.  Tomorrow I am going to start HRT so hearing your journey has helped make me hopeful and perhaps a little more realistic of what to expect.
I met a girl in my therapist office who was getting her letter for SRS, I asked if could talk to her if she minded.  She said no ask me anything you like, so she shared her journey with me gave me her contact info and now I have my first girl friend.
My therapist call it "Transglow" it is the joy and happiness we feel when we are allowed or allow ourselves to be the beautiful people we are inside and outside.  As soon as she called me by my chosen name, I was beaming.  The girl I met we went on and on and I didn't even need HRT I loved it (it was happiness).
You are a very beautiful person, find a kindred soul to share that with and even as a friend who is walking the same road you are walking Hoping you find your peace.... hugs  :)
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Joan

Hi Samantha. You're starting tomorrow! I'm so pleased for you :) and yes, I know how wonderful it is it is to have a friend to share with.

Joe, you would be surprised what people don't notice and the dots that they don't connect even if they do.  I may be a D but my under and is 36 or 38.  One larger frame if you don't gather it all together in one prominent place the they don't stick out so much.  Lots of men my age have boobs. The there's no reason for people assume I'm developing breasts.  I used to be very conscious of them, now they're just me and I don't hide them.
For work I wear a shirt and tie, otherwise I wear a collared men's shirt.  I have pens or my phone in the pocket.  They jiggle a bit when I do stairs, but really, it's not really an issue.  Just avoid the beach ;p

My girlfriend went abroad for a year, and then she started a second.  I kind of drifted away from her and though We're still in touch we aren't dating at the moment.  It has been my experience that there are women for whom ->-bleeped-<- is not a barrier to a relationship.  My ex is now a champion of LGBT rights and is coming back in December.  We'll see what happens then.

Autumn leaf, hi there.  I'm sorry I don't know what traps are so I can't help you with that.  I was very thin for a while, but the male type muscle was still there.  As I've lost muscle I've gained fat, so I guess it's become bulk of a different kind.  I guess from about a year in it started to change and I've lost a fair bit of upper body strength.  The muscle on the outside of the shoulders seems to have reduced, so while my arms are a bit fat at the moment, the width of my shoulders is noticeable narrower than it used to be. 

And the face...I have a large nose and a prominent, though not necessarily wide and square chin.  I'm looking at photos of myself pre HRT and how I look now and not sure what has changed really.  What changes there have been have been subtle and very slow.   I still have a pretty masculine face I think, although it's softer than it was.  Losing most of the beard shadow is easily the biggest step forward.

Edit: Thought about it a bit, but a picture and a thousand words and all that.  I'll put these up for a day or so and you can see what can realistically be expected from HRT. The first one is a week before starting HRT in January 2014, and the second last week.  The first is pretty embarrassing and the second you can make off what you will.

http://i.imgur.com/NdlGPic.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/7YhpO24.jpg

Hope that helps.
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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Samantha C

Joan,
Thank you for the Congrats! and I'm so happy to here you will have your girlfriend for support again in Dec., that I'm know for myself is a huge thing.
Your first picture is better than I am, and I think the second is great from your description I definately share the same chin structure but strangely enough my sisters is very close to the same, so I think you will be fine and thanks for sharing the pics they're a little rainbow at the edge of my horizon.
I will be announcing in dec or jan at work and will be full time (my situation doesn't give me a part time option) When I do I'll put some start and where I am pics on this thread to share.

Hugs  :)
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mm

Joan, do you wear a bra for work?  I would think being a d they would move around, bounce and be uncomfortable if you didn't.
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transjoe

Hi,

I also am glad you will be supported by your girlfriend again - I think this is a very important point in life.

I also would be interested if you wear a bra under your Shirts with the D Cup or just let everythin bounce around - because I can't quite imagine noone notices bouncing D Cup breast without restriction.

All best wishes
Joe
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Joan

Hi Samantha, thanks and and I hope everything goes well for you :)

Joe and mm, I understand where you're coming from. 

I don't wear a bra for work and I don't find it particularly uncomfortable.  Maybe I just move slowly or something. Either a Japanese D cup is smaller to begin with, or I'm just blissfully ignorant of what everyone is thinking. 

Or people just don't notice. I think it is quite possible that a lot of the things that we obsess about, focused as we are on the physical changes of our transitions, are not on the radar for a lot of people who are focused instead on their own busy and often difficult lives.
Only a dark cocoon before I get my gorgeous wings and fly away
Only a phase, these dark cafe days
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Autumnleaf

Thank you Joan!  Wow, what a huge difference, as subtle as they are, the small changes seem to make a big difference.  You definitely look more feminine in your second picture. 

BTW, Traps is short for trapezius, it's the muscles between your neck and shoulders.  The thing that makes guys look like they have a thicker neck. 
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