Pre-op "dilation"

[Apple]

Hi all,
having enough skin (penile+scrotal) for SRS is always a concern. One could say that there is never too much skin.

I have recently started what I would call "pre-op dilation": inspired by the "foreskin restoration (uncircumcision)" movement (just google it), I manually tug and pull on the foreskin using various grips for at least 30 minutes a day in total. According to the experience of the restoration community, up to 5 mm of new skin can grow each month on a penis when properly stimulated. It is really new tissue growing, not just stretching old. Nothing revolutionary, plastic surgeons have been doing such things with burn patients for years. Also, when people get fat, the same happens.

I'm posting this to let you all know of this possibility (more skin = deeper vagina + richer labia minora) and I hope to post my progress in the coming months.

Best Regards,
Apple

[beren_ts]

Glad that im not the only one that does that. Im also doing the same, since im circumsized and need the inner foreskin for my inner labia. I already did grow a good amount of new inner skin. Im t-taping at the moment, which gives you the advantage to tug while you're tucked.

And btw no i don't have any other pictures from dr. Schaff patients. But i've seen the results of some girls in real life and i have to say that i was impressed how natural it looked.

[suzifrommd]

My pre-op "dilation" routine involved having an orgasm at least twice a week. Probably wasn't as effective as yours, but I bet mine was a bit more fun... 

[JLT1]

OK....
April, May, June, July, August, September....that's 30 mm or 1.18 inches...  I'll try.

Thank You!!

Hugs,

Jen

[Apple]

One more good thing is that this way, one also grows the inner side of the foreskin (the pink, mucosa-like), the "top-grade" tissue which good surgeons use for lining the inner side of the labia and the vulvar vestibule, because it is the very same tissue that genetic females have in those places.

Besides tugging and pulling by hand, it is also possible to make or buy various devices to do it for you.

[Blush]

One could say that there is never too much skin.

Actually there is such thing as too much - cleansing can become a major issue, among many others I can't remember off the top of my head. I kept along with the dilation schedule so well that I was pushing above 6" and was advised by my surgeon to cut it back a little due to those concerns. Also consider cis women do not have endless vaginal canals, yes they stretch, but only so much, and only from a shallow depth.

...one also grows the inner side of the foreskin... it is the very same tissue that genetic females have in those places.

This is not true.

[Apple]

Actually there is such thing as too much - cleansing can become a major issue, among many others I can't remember off the top of my head. I kept along with the dilation schedule so well that I was pushing above 6" and was advised by my surgeon to cut it back a little due to those concerns. Also consider cis women do not have endless vaginal canals, yes they stretch, but only so much, and only from a shallow depth.

Interesting... But not having enough is certainly a far more common problem.

...one also grows the inner side of the foreskin... it is the very same tissue that genetic females have in those places.

This is not true.

Could you please elaborate? What I wanted to say is that the penile prepuce is embryologically homologous to clitoral prepuce + labia minora. Histologically, the tissues are the same as far as I know. All have keratinizing epithelium on the outer side and non-keratinizing (mucosa-like) epithelium on the inner side. The vulvar vestibule is, as far as I know, the same tissue as the inner side of labia minora (besides, it is difficult to draw a line between these two). Many top surgeons then use the outer side of penile skin (mostly shaft rather than prepuce) as the outer side of the neoclitoral prepuce and labia minora and they separate the inner side of the penile prepuce from its outer side and use it as the inner side of the new labia minora.

Of course, this does NOT apply to regular penile inversion SRS as performed by >95% of surgeons over the world, where the entire vulva is just regular outer skin. It only applies to Dr (please someone complete the list) Suporn, Chettawut, Sanguan, Bowers, Schaff, Djinovic. (Brassard uses mucosa from the penile urethra instead of the inner side of the penile prepuce.)

[Aazhie]

I just want to chime in and support stretching! I know it's not the same places but I stretched my ears with plugs and learned a lot about how the body will slowly create more tissue in these kinds of situations.  It may take a long time and not look like much, but it does happen.  In the case of jewelry stretching, there's a possibility of stretching too much and creating bad scar tissue, but a lot of the foreskin devices are mild.  It should not tear or hurt greatly, though if one gets piercing stretching it is a different process than the devices that assist in foreskin stretching. It's a slow, once or twice a day thing or a wear a device for specific duration that may help if done long enough. 

  Also, I know a herd of cis- women who have pretty impressive capacities, aka "vag of holding" powers, so unless there is concern of hurting yourself, a so called endless vagina should not make you self conscious.  Many of my friends have very functional happy lives and partners.  It's certainly possible for cis-vaginas to be trained, just as much as a surgically created or repaired one can be trained by stretching processes.  Cleaning is a certainly a factor to be kept in mind too, just know that there is a ton of variety...

[Muffinheart]

Smh at "pre op dilation"
Never heard of such a thing. Wonder what my surgeon (Brassard) would say to all this.
I went into surgery knowing I was "below" average down there, but for f sake, no f'ing way would I be touching it or stroking it to add more skin. GCS was the whole reason I got rid of the tumor, last thing I wanted was to massage and stroke or tug at it.

[Julia-Madrid]

Interesting idea, although Dr Chett, as an example, does not appear to suggest it as a pre-surgery technique.

Does any reputable SRS surgeon have any statement on this?

Also, how relevant would this be as a nocturnal technique, given that many of us are on anti-androgens?  I'm not sure what level of arousal we achieve while sleeping which would help this along.

Julia

[Eva]

Smh at "pre op dilation"
Never heard of such a thing. Wonder what my surgeon (Brassard) would say to all this.
I went into surgery knowing I was "below" average down there, but for f sake, no f'ing way would I be touching it or stroking it to add more skin. GCS was the whole reason I got rid of the tumor, last thing I wanted was to massage and stroke or tug at it.

Im with you there!!! No thanks, its bad enough having to shave down there to keep things tidy... I cant imagine putting that much focus on "it"  I can hardly stand to even look at it anymore...   

[Apple]

Interesting idea, although Dr Chett, as an example, does not appear to suggest it as a pre-surgery technique.

Does any reputable SRS surgeon have any statement on this?

Also, how relevant would this be as a nocturnal technique, given that many of us are on anti-androgens?  I'm not sure what level of arousal we achieve while sleeping which would help this along.

Julia

I do not expect any surgeon to be aware of this possibility. There is a reason why the foreskin restoration movement is called a "movement". The people affected by circumcision developed the techniques themselves, without assistance from doctors; it is a DIY movement. That is because doctors at least in the US mostly do not consider circumcision a "problem", so there was nothing for them to solve.

Nocturnal: using foreskin restoration devices at sleep is not recommended, because there is a danger of doing damage from rolling in the bed and especially from nocturnal erections. When asleep, people don't react to pain fast enough. Manual restoration at sleep is of course not possible, except for sleepwalkers


As others have noted, for many women such effort can be disgusting. It certainly does remind the unwanted parts. YMMV.

[Julia-Madrid]

Thanks Apple.  I think that perhaps I won't go to the trouble after all.

I revisited Dr Chettawut's website today and found this:  "...the lack of prepuce skin from previous circumcision will not affect the creation of inner labia (laibia minora) and vaginal opening because he can use the remnant of foreskin (distal part of penile skin near the circumcised scar) for the inner labia construction..."

So perhaps it's not so necessary with his technique.  In any event, I'm not terribly obsessed in reaching the pinnacle of anatomical accuracy.  Frankly, there are not many men who head down there with a flashlight,  so I'll probably be ok with whatever Dr Chett provides

xxx
Julia

[Blush]

Could you please elaborate?

They are in no way the same. It is true that everything's made from the same building blocks, but most parts don't end up functionally the same. You can turn testicles back into ovaries, erectile tissue back into vaginal rugae, etc. Yes there are analogous parts that can serve comparable functions, but for the major parts they are in no way the same (I'm postop for whatever my point of view is worth).

The erectile tissue (or inside of the foreskin) first off isn't the same color, doesn't produce mucus or natural lubricant that the vaginal rugae does, gets erect through blood swelling through the tissue, where as the vaginal canal expands due to the uterus retracting further into the body. You're saying that apples are the same as oranges here.

It is fundamentally impossible to convert these parts mentioned above back to their original building blocks, and then cause them to mutate back into the other sex's parts. Maybe next millennium I'll be wrong, I hope I am!

This isn't to discredit the fact though the the labia majora, minora, urethra, vaginal canal, and over all construction and function is replicated pretty darn well.

[Apple]

Blush,
we are both talking about completely different things. First of all, I did not talk about the vaginal canal at all. Perhaps you are confusing the terms "vulva" and "vagina"? I said there is correspondence between the penile prepuce and clitoral prepuce+labia minora. Nothing about erectile tissue nor vagina nor testicles. Please read my post again.

[Lara1969]

I am one of the Schaff girls who had a small penis. My vagina is approx. 18cm with the 4cm dilator.  I had sex with a few dozen men and not even one was too large.

Even a gynologist thought I am a CIS girl whilst sitting legs wide spread on his chair. Not even one man clocked my after we had sex. I get really wet when aroused.

He is a genius.

Second surgery with him is scheduled for mid of April. He will make some small adjustments and my BA for a really small fee (grs is covered by health insurance).

My beast and my vagina will like look similar to the really sexy and beautiful porno stars.

He does not publish much on the web.

Lara

[Blush]

Even a gynologist thought I am a CIS girl whilst sitting legs wide spread on his chair.

I'm not looking to spoiler your parade, but this I really don't believe at all.

Although I would be perhaps interested in more info or a consultation with your surgeon.