Sometimes it's all just so depressing

[Hayzer12]

Hey ladies and gentleman.

I just wanted to get on here briefly. I have been incredibly busy and haven't really been on the forums for quite some time, but I just sort of wanted to get on here and rant... and also to see if I was alone in my frustration and depression.

I am 25 years old, and have been on testosterone for going on four years now.

I still don't have surgery.

It's frustrating because I feel that I can afford to make payments on it if it wasn't for everything else.

I moved to Illinois last year around this time and was thrilled because I was able to get my ID changed over to male and then I received a Draft letter (which I wasn't sure was supposed to happen, but ah well) lol. So that was kind of cool, I suppose.

But spending 6,000 dollars in moving and getting set up really put my girlfriend and I behind significantly... especially in regards to saving for surgery.

I have saved, saved and saved, and then something happens where I have to dip into it. The last time, my dad lied and said he just needed to borrow money... and that he'd pay me back in two weeks. Well it's been months and he hasn't paid me back, and acts like it didn't happen....and I still haven't been able to replace it all.

I have 55,000 dollars in student debt that I'm paying off, old credit card debt that I racked up in college on summer courses, top that off with my rent, utilities, and all other bills... and I need to buy a new(well, new to me) car because I don't have one right now.

It's all so frustrating because I just want surgery.

I currently make a decent living, but my girlfriend is in grad-school and is living on a stipend so it's hard for us to make all of our bills, take 600 mile trips back and forth (a total of 1200 miles) to see her family (which is a big deal because she's from a Hindu family.. and they're extremely close) once a month, and do all the things we need to do financially and still be able to save up for surgery.

I hate it, and I feel like I'm the only guy that's 4 years in and hasn't had top surgery sometimes.

I know in reality it's not true... but sometimes it feels that way.

And ultimately I have been so depressed that my mental state has been wavering a bit because of it.

I'm stealth, and very few people in my every day life know... and it's hard to hide. Always has been, but has been increasingly so lately...It's a constant worry. And I hate it. "Why don't you just take your shirt off, bro!" "Dude, just stop being a wuss and take your shirt off ... put sunscreen on!" "SHIRTS VERSUS SKINS, GUYS" and always having to come up with excuses.

I'm an active guy, and my friends are active... and because of that it's becoming increasingly more difficult to hide. I don't even know what to do at this point.

My girlfriend also wants to get married soon, and in her family's tradition it's customary to have a larger wedding. She said she was fine court-housing it so we can put the money towards surgery... But I'm not OK with that knowing that her family would be highly upset. I'm not just marrying her. I'm marrying her family... and that's how it is with her specific culture.

I would do care credit, but I have read such horrible reviews about them and I'm not sure if I can afford 2-300 dollars per month. I may be able to do 150 or so per month payment... but I don't think 2-300 is an option because of the other debt that I am currently paying.

Does anyone have any other "loan" suggestions that would allow me to make lower payments over a longer course of time?

And am I alone here? Does anyone else feel like nothing is ever going to work out because of all the crap that life throws your way?

[FTMax]

CareCredit is just like any other credit card/loan. Don't get hung up on the fact that it's for healthcare. Most surgeons take Visa/Mastercard/etc.

If you know or feel like you won't be able to save and pay all at once because of life, figure out what your total spend will be (including lodging, supplies, meals, etc.). Figure out how much you can comfortably put down at once (think of it as a down payment). Then look for a credit card with a great introductory deal (0% interest for X months with no fees is what you want) to finance the rest.

You may even be able to do this with your existing cards. I have one that I've had since college (started in 2007), so they've raised the credit limit several times. I never use the card. I reached out and asked a customer service rep if it would be possible to get a 0% interest deal so that I'd have more incentive to use it. They applied it immediately, and I put the entire surgery on one card.

At the end of the 0% interest period, look for another 0% interest deal. Transfer the balance to the new card. The only downside of this method is that applying for these credit cards pings your credit report, so that'll likely go down a few points. Don't apply to anything without researching it. There are sites that can tell you what scores/credit history people have who get accepted and what their approximate credit lines are.

I feel you though. I'm at a point where I want to start looking at real estate, but I also have a hefty student loan balance due to grad school. Bottom surgery feels very unattainable without some kind of help from insurance.

[Tysilio]

You're not alone, Hayzer.  I'm only a year and a half or so into my transition, but damn I'm impatient, because I'm older and it feels like I have only so many years to enjoy the body I'm supposed to have. My insurance doesn't cover surgery, and although I'm doing all I can to change that, it will likely be 2-3 years, at best, until I'm able to get top surgery. The dysphoria seems to go up with every passing month, and sometimes I wonder how I can stand it.

When it gets bad, I have to remind myself of how much my life has changed for the better since I started transitioning -- how much happier I am, how the people around me say I'm a nicer person, how much more comfortable I am in the world. But it seems that as more time goes by, it gets harder to remember how awful things were before; in a way that's a good thing, of course, but when I'm hit with that dysphoria -- it doesn't help as much as I'd like.

You will get there.

You're a good person, and you're putting others' needs ahead of your own: lending your dad money, wanting your girlfriend and her family to have the things they need. But your needs are valid too, and there may be ways you can compromise. For instance, what if you and your girlfriend were to get married now, "court-housing it," with the understanding that later, when you've at least had top surgery, you'll have the "big fat Hindu wedding" with all her family?

Do you have insurance? Could you change jobs to work for a company with good benefits? My understanding is that Illinois has pretty good anti-discrimination policies, such that an insurer that covers a treatment for one group of patients can't deny that treatment to transgender patients -- this applies to mastectomy/chest reconstruction, from what I've read. Or is your girlfriend a student somewhere that has such coverage, and is there a way you could get coverage on her plan?

I wish for both of us that there were a magic fix for this, because it sucks. It seems like such a small thing to ask, considering the "return" in happiness and comfort in our own skins.

Just remember that your needs count too, and if they're not met, it gets harder for you to be there for others and meet their needs. There's nothing selfish about taking care of yourself -- you're doing it for the people you love, not just for you.

Hang in there. <bro-hug>

[CaptFido87]

Hi Hayzer12. Welcome to the land as flat as a pancake lol. I understand the emotions going through your mind. It can be tough to afford everything. especially living on your own. In chicago we have a lot of LGBT friendly areas that help people like us. The Center on Halsted is a great place for people like us who hang and get together to be friends. the surrounding area is full of places that help people like us. Some might even be able to help with getting the surgery done and possibly make it a payment plan.

First thing that needs to get discussed is that driving 600 miles to and from just to see her family. I understand that she is close to them but that's looking at possibly 10 hrs of driving just to get there. That's wasteful money. Especially at once a month. I can understand holidays but every month is just ridiculous. The money you put forth on wasting that can go towards paying off bills and helping get the surgery you need done. That's the biggest thing you need to talk to her about. Her family would understand it, I'm sure of it. Mention to them that you are having some financial troubles at the moment and traveling this big distance is cutting into you paying the bills. They wouldn't want you to lose your home. This day and age we have so many ways to communicate with people. You could get a web cam and have weekly talks with the family. Also you can call them often and have phone chats.

Now obviously you probably still have "breasts" if you haven't had the surgery. Just curious for me asking, how big are they? It seems you go around and people don't really notice that you have them, unless you've been wearing a binder. My point is if they aren't big than you may be able to pass in public with out people really noticing. Seeing as most american males are on the "over-weight" side it might not be as noticeable. Though you said you seem to hard time going around, maybe they are bigger than I thought.

Getting married indeed will be costly. There's no looking past it. This is also something you need to start saving on. I would focus on getting the surgery taken care of first as that seems to cause you distress and depression. She will understand. In order for 2 to work together, they must be on the same level. Have a sit down with her and discuss the surgery. She wants you to be happy, that's why she's with you. Make a list of pros and cons to her and thoroughly explain the problems its causing you. This will help her get on the same page with you and finally get it addressed.

Last thing to worry about is the credit cards and school loans. Those will get taken care of when they can. if you are at least paying enough to cover the interest and maybe a little of the bill, it will eventually disappear. You've got more important matters to deal with first. Like ftmax said you can use a credit card to pay for the surgery. getting your self in debt will likely happen but you can always get out of debt. You can't get yourself out of a sticky gender related situation if are still half and half you know. My aunt's have been in serious debt for as long as I can still remember. One hasn't paid her mortgage in at least 5 years. the other is getting a little better but still owes like 20 k in credit cards. She struggles trough life but is going strong. You gotta see it that way. You mentioned having  a decent paying job, this will help keep you afloat. Once your wife to be gets herself into a job, than it'll be a heck of a lot easier on both ends. Also with my aunt being in terrible credit she still was able to buy a new car a few years back, so there's places out there. Just have to look hard and you'll find a place.

You've got a friend in me. I live north of Chicago in the burbs, so if you ever want to hang I'll do my best. Hope things will go better for ya.

[Hayzer12]

Thanks for all the advice, guys..

I have thought about credit cards, but I have three already, and none of the limits are over 4,000 dollars. I mean I could probably request higher, considering I have had a couple for 8 years or so. So I might give that a shot.

Also, I am only going to be in Illinois for another year since we only moved up here for her school. I work through a corporation not located in Illinois because of the short-time here, and work from home from my computer remotely so that we can have an open enough schedule to go see her family when we need to while she's up here for school. I do have insurance, but it doesn't cover trans-related surgeries, unfortunately.

And I'm probably a b-cup or something - in reference to the size question, CaptFido87. I wear an underworks binder every day and it has become increasingly difficult to make up excuses as to why I can't be shirtless, or why I have a tank top on all the time..I have had guy friends laugh at me and ask if I'm wearing spanx. It's embarrassing lol.

No one really thinks MUCH of it, they just think I'm highly self conscious about my body (which isn't far from the truth, but still annoying considering I'm so confident in most other regards).

I'm pasty white, so I continually use the "I'll burn" excuse, but it gets old and friends are tired of hearing it.

But there's no way I could get away not wearing a binder. Although a b-cup may fly for some men, I'm not hefty enough. I lost a lot of weight - around eighty pounds or so - and before I probably could have pulled it off... but not now.

[King Malachite]

I don't have any loan advice, but have you considered looking into surgery scholarships?  The Jim Collins foundation and CK Life are a couple, and the JCF's 2016 grant cycle opened up this month.

[Tysilio]

...there's no way I could get away not wearing a binder. Although a b-cup may fly for some men, I'm not hefty enough. I lost a lot of weight - around eighty pounds or so - and before I probably could have pulled it off... but not now.

And let's face it, binding is not the long-term answer. It hurts, it's bad for our health, and it doesn't solve the, ahem... underlying problem.

[CaptFido87]

I see than about the binding. I would recommend going forward and getting the surgery. It seems your credit cards aren't too bad if they only go to 4k. You can get other credit cards to help cover the purchase of the surgery. Yea it sucks your insurance won't help you, but it you need to take care of this. You'll be much happier in the long run.

Kind of wish you were planning on staying. I was hoping for more friends

[Alexthecat]

Care credit is only bad if you do not pay it off on time. Skip a month when visiting her family. It will be between that or owning thousands in interest.

[Hayzer12]

But Care Credit is also bad because I was looking up and I heard that when using Dr. Garramone, you only qualify for certain pay-off times and that means your bill is at least 200 or so per month.

With an upcoming car payment, my student-loans, and other bills, it's not really a viable option to pay 200-350 a month extra.

And it's not just skipping a month or so of her family time... it'd have to happen all the time to afford 200-350 per month. And that's not really an option.

I'm looking at finding something that will only be around 150 or so per month.. just so that I KNOW I can make the payments.

And with credit cards, I'd prefer not to get more. I have three and I don't want the age of credit history to drastically impact my credit score - especially since we're wanting to buy a house in a year.

[FTMax]

And with credit cards, I'd prefer not to get more. I have three and I don't want the age of credit history to drastically impact my credit score - especially since we're wanting to buy a house in a year.

Between paying for a wedding, debts, potential surgery, and real estate...it sounds like you need to prioritize and make some tough decisions.

Your life expense-wise would probably be a lot easier if you threw whatever money you could save at eliminating your credit card debt or scraped together a few extra car payments and asked them to recalculate your monthly payments after paying them a nice chunk. It may only drop $50 off your monthly payment or less, but that's money that you could spend elsewhere.

[jumpthenexttrain]

I always felt depressed and angry because it seemed like everyone I knew got their surgery within like 2 years of starting T....and it took me 5 years of T and living stealth before I finally got surgery (and that's only because I got lucky by some miracle and my insurance from the job I had paid for it). If they hadn't paid for it, it would've probably been another 5 years before I could pay for it myself.

I work in manufacturing and it gets hot and sweaty. I would get irritated and jealous beyond belief when I saw other guys in sleeveless shirts or single layers and there I was, sweating to death under layers of clothes. And I had to make up some excuse for why I didn't just take my shirt off or wear less clothing

In your situation, I'd probably try to save as much as I could, put off the house, postpone the marriage, and cut out the family trips....but I say that because I don't have family and don't consider it to be important. Do what you have to do to be happy. In the end, what's life if you aren't happy? For me personally, life didn't really begin until after I had surgery. It just held me back so much, having to bind and hating warm weather and being too depressed to leave the house when it was hot and I had to wear layers.

You're not alone

[David Man]

Hey! About your friends, why don't you just say them the truth?

"I don't want to take off my shirt bc I have breast. Yes, the thing is I was fat. And I losed A LOT of weight. Do you hear about Matt Diaz? Yes, is awful. I don't have money for my surgery. Yes, I have to pay mi scolarship. Sucks, men."

And that will explain when, in the future, they'll see your scars on your chest.

Is just an idea. That excuse work for me, but my friends are used to my oddity.