Progressive Christianity 8 point Bulletin Question: For myself and friend

[Shawn Sunshine]

I need to know for myself 100% and for someone else also, where these first 2 Statements in the 8 point Bulletin are in fact saying that Jesus is not the way, that in some way this denies Jesus as being our saviour and Lord. I need some clarity on to what they mean. That it saying there is no need to come to the father or creator via Jesus. There is a person who brought this to my attention.

1. Believe that following the path and teachings of Jesus can lead to an awareness and experience of the sacred and the oneness and Unity of all life.

2. Affirm that the teachings of Jesus provide but one of many ways to experience the sacredness and oneness of life and that we can draw from diverse sources of wisdom in our spiritual journey.




I have an understanding of it, which i think could be right, but I want to hear from you all first.

[Susan]

It simply says that there are many paths to god, and that it doesn't matter which path you choose to follow as long as God is your destination.

Jesus made it clear himself "In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you."

Jesus is the way to God for Christians.

I think that God is all about the results and that means he would be smart enough to ensure that there were many ways to find him.

You have to find the one that works best for you. Jesus even told people how to identify them "You will know them by their fruits."

Sadly right now organized religion isn't really smelling all that good. Between Pedophile priests and nut jobs of all religions who think it's their mission to force people to God.

For some it's Christianity, some it's Islam, others it's Judaism. for some it might be Buddhism, or Bahai.

Ask yourself this, do you think god would really punish people for all eternity who have never even heard of Jesus, yet live a just and a moral life? And yes there are people on this planet who never have and never will.

Me I draw the good from them all.

[Dee Marshall]

Shawn, I think number one might also be saying that just following Jesus of Nazareth will not automatically make you an accepting person. Sadly many people still succumb to tribalism. Point 2 suggests this interpretation to me, but take my comments with a grain of salt, I'm not a Christian.

[Shawn Sunshine]

Thanks Susan and Dee

This is what I got from the President of Progressive Christianity (Yeah the actual President of the whole thing)

Dear Shawn,



I am sorry that you are haven't such a difficult time dealing with the fundamentalist Christians.  You may find it interesting to know what we recently asked the question on our Facebook page: "Have you ever tried to have a meaningful conversation with a conservative Christian and what was the result?" I believe literally hundreds of people responded. ( I stopped counting when it was over a hundred.) Apparently with a couple of exceptions, everyone responded similarly that the conversations went nowhere. Someone who has based their entire view of their reality on something called scripture, with a tightly woven story about God and Jesus, cannot shake one brick in the foundation of their beliefs or the entire thing will fall apart. That cannot hear facts or any exception to their belief system. They confuse belief and faith.



Therefore they have no idea how the Bible ( actually a collection of books written and shared over a 1000 years) came to be put together. They cannot see that there are several versions of God represented in the Bible and have no idea for example that the Jews from the Southern Kingdom did not believe in the same God as the Jews in the Northern kingdom. Both of those gods are actually represented in the Bible. They cannot begin to ponder why the author of Matthew has a very different idea about who and what Jesus was than Luke for example. They cannot see that there are very different versions of the birth stories and the resurrection in the different Gospels. They don't lie, they just cannot see. Therefore it is impossible for them to accept that there were many books written about Jesus even before the Gospels were written that were left out of the Book that we now call the Bible. Why were they left out? Because these gospels did not follow the story that would support the bias of the fourth century church leaders.



They have no idea that most of what they believe about Jesus is a result of a vote by Bishops under pressure from the Emperor Constantine, to declare Jesus as not only the Son of God but God himself. And that is the basis for the confusing concept of the Trinity. This is not what the early Christians, who were Jews by the way, believed. It would have been impossible for them to have even imagined such a travesty as a people who based their entire identity on the worship of one God.



I cannot take any more time to correspond but I suggest a couple of things. You might want to order or download our Study Guide. Some of the questions you are asking are discussed in the text part of the book. I also would suggest that you continue your own research. In the back of the Study Guide there is a suggested reading guide. I would probably start with Marcus Borg's book, Meeting Jesus Again for the First Time but there virtually hundreds of books out now that would be helpful in your journey.



Stay on our website and sign up for our monthly eBulletins. These are all free and cover many of the questions you have. You might also want to check out our Facebook page. There are constant conversation and comments going on. Many people are coming to the site with some of the same kinds of questions and find solace that they are not alone.



And finally do not beat yourself up trying to change anyone who is stuck in their own closed paradigm. I often say that if you cannot question the paradigm of your beliefs then there is probably something wrong or something missing. Fundamentalist sadly can be very mean because questions like your scare them.



Due to my work load I will not be able to respond to further correspondence. Please no not assume that I am not interested. I just cannot keep up.



Warmly,

Fred



Fred C. Plumer

President

[Lady Smith]

That's a fascinating message Shawn.  As someone who spends time seeking out and reading anything I can find about the early church I found myself nodding in agreement more than once while reading Fred C. Plumer's letter.  Christianity as it is generally known today is not at all the same as that practiced by the early church.  Even the Bible as it is known in Western society has been shaped by politics and the struggle for power in the church.  For this reason I tend strongly towards studying scripture that has it's origins in the early Syriac, Coptic and Ethiopic churches which doesn't have this political taint.