My Experience On E2(17b estradoil)

[udra]

I have found this website useful leading up to my starting hormones. During all my research and forum browsing before starting hormones I came across several posts on here of trans women who had started taking E2 and were complaining of hair shedding. I also read various studies of tests of E2 administered to different types of rats to test for hair growth retardation or loss or to induce hair growth. There are almost no independent tests that I could find on E2 administered to humans for hair growth retardation or regrowth. The only ones I saw were being used to support the sale of hair growth products and were not conducted independently so are biased and not trustworthy. After all the reading I came to the conclusion based on the tests done on mice that E2 is a catagen inducer and caused premature termination of hairs. It is a hair growth retardant as concluded in all of the independent tests done on mice. I then weighed all the info I had read on transgender forums and websites saying that E wont make you go bald ect with the fact that none of them said "E2" won't make you go bald. It became very hard to determine at that point if Oestrogel 17b estradiol(E2) which had been suggested on some websites as a valid source of E for transwomen to use would cause hair loss as it did in mice or if by some fluke of genetics that it would be perfect for transwomen. I eventually took the risk and began taking the prescribed dosage for transwomen from my provider and had finally begun my HRT. Then guess what happened? My hair started shedding and it was very noticeable when I showered. I thought to myself "maybe this is normal for the beginning stage of HRT idk" and I started reading more on here and on other sites about other trans women having hair shedding after starting E2. I found several posts of transwomen saying exactly the same thing I'm telling you now. They were having alot of shedding after starting E2. I then continued taking the E2 for about a month to see if the shedding stopped or not. It never did. I then went off the E2. I started to wonder if maybe it was just that the dose was too high and I lowered the dose to the smallest dose that is advised for E2 dosage of transwomen as a standard on some reputable websites I found. So now I was on the smallest dosage of E2 and waiting to see if my hair started shedding again. Sure enough it did. It was less shedding and harder to notice but it was clearly shedding more than normal for me. I then went off of the E2 again. I'm now posting this as a warning for anyone else having the shedding problem and also I want to ask about an alternative that would work for me if anyone knows from experience. I'm starting to wonder if the E2 is simply being sold by some websites such as inhousepharmacy to get thier money but ignoring that it causes premature catagen and termination of hairs. This is my first post on this website and I'm sure it may be controversial so please I'm open to all opinions and want to hear what you think. Here are some links to support what I said about E2 causing early hair termination. There are 3 hair growth stages Anagen(2-7 years) is when the hair is alive and growing. Catagen is when the hair is no longer growing. Telogen is the last stage before it falls out. I am nearly convinced that E2 is being sold by these retailers to transwomen for something other than what it should be used for. Possibly causing them like me to have hair shedding. All these studies show that E2(17b estradiol) induces premature catagen stage. My HRT is now on hold becuase of this problem. If you are someone who is skeptical or thinks you know all there is to know please at least read the quotations I've posted here before you criticize my lack of being a doctor. I hope to read your opinions on similiar experiences or what you think of this and hear any advice you have.

Quotations and Links to where they came from:

"Based on the observation that other steroid hormone receptor ligands, which inhibit anagen (glucocorticoids, calcitriols), also induce premature catagen (1–4, 51), we hypothesized that E2 should be a potent catagen inducer."
"We confirm that E2 arrests murine pelage HFs in telogen and show that E2 is a potent inducer of premature catagen development." - https://academic.oup.com/endo/article/146/3/1214/2500447

"Estrogen Leads to Reversible Hair Cycle Retardation through Inducing Premature Catagen and Maintaining Telogen"
"However, the 17β-estradiol treated group entered catagen from anagen after four days of administration (P44), and stayed in telogen for at least ten days after stopping injection (P54–64). Interestingly, 15 days after withdrawal of 17β-estradiol administration (P69), the estrogen treated mice had their hairs regrown."
"Through time-lapse morphology assay, our present work elaborates that estrogen caused premature catagen and subsequently sustained telogen."
"Moreover, the present study also confirmed that the suppressive effect of estrogen on hair cycle is reversible, owning to retention of HFSCs." - https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0040124

[KathyLauren]

Hi, Udra!

Welcome to Susan's Place.

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[Lisa]

Hi Udra,

I had some odd experiences with hair shedding when starting HRT myself.  I started getting quite a bit of hair shedding within a few weeks of starting HRT (spiro + estradiol), which I was worried about.  I'd guess it was not-quite-double my prior hair shedding rate.  Now, I was also under a lot of stress (transitioning is a lot to deal with), and had made diet changes and lost a fair bit of weight, so those may well be complicating factors in my case.

In my case at least, the rate of shedding started decreasing again around the 3 month mark, and at 4 months, it's similar to where I was pre-HRT (maybe slightly more shedding than before, but not a lot).  At around the 1.5 month time period, my hair was noticeably thinner (all over, no specific spots) than before I started HRT, but it's gotten thicker again since then, and is now much closer to the thickness I had before starting HRT.

There was one paragraph in one of the articles you linked that caught my eye:  (From https://academic.oup.com/endo/article/146/3/1214/2500447 )

In mice, rats, guinea pigs, and dogs, estrogens exhibit inhibitory properties on hair growth (12–16, 31). In humans, however, E2 effects are more complex: E2 prolongs the anagen phase of scalp hair follicles in vivo (17), whereas it stimulates hair shaft elongation in frontotemporal male scalp skin in vitro (32). Recently we confirmed that E2 inhibits hair shaft elongation and prolongs anagen duration in female occipital scalp hair follicles in vitro (33). These contradictory results suggest that the control of hair growth by estrogens is much more complex than previously appreciated and differs among distinct integumental sites, genders, and species.

This seems to indicate that the results shown in mice may not apply identically in humans, and both papers were using mice for the studies.

I don't know whether I will have any future cycles of extra shedding on estradiol, but my basic philosophy on it is that if my blood levels of estradiol are consistently similar to those of a pre-menopausal cis woman in my age range, then that's the best I can do, and whatever happens with my hair is what happens.  The other physical and mental changes from HRT are far more important to me and if staying on HRT means that I gradually thin out and have to wear a wig some years from now, then so be it!

-Megan

[Rachel]

I take estradiol (E2). I do not notice any hair loss. I am post op almost 2 years. I use to inject IM but now inject SC if that matters. I have had 6000 hair grafts and they are doing awesome. I take a dab of T every other day on my tummy. My prostrate has atrophied. 

When I first went on HRT I also was using minoxidil and finasteride as well as spito and progesterone and E. My hair loss stopped and I noticed vellus hair growth. I do believe in years the fine hair grew into thicker hair but it took time. I needed hair grafts.

My hair looks awesome now although dry.

[Devlyn]

Typically when you're shedding 1/2" male hair you don't notice. When it's foot long female hair it tends to gather together at the drain and really catch your eye. Are you sure you're shedding more hairs and not just more hair?

[Lisa]

Typically when you're shedding 1/2" male hair you don't notice. When it's foot long female hair it tends to gather together at the drain and really catch your eye. Are you sure you're shedding more hairs and not just more hair?

This is definitely worth considering as well.  I my case I'd had long hair for a couple years before starting HRT, and I finally broke down and decided to count them to confirm that my shedding rate was indeed higher than normal for a while (be warned that if you have a pretty full head of thick hair to start with, that can be super tedious!).  Long before starting HRT though, just as I was growing my hair out, the increase in shed hair volume was a little scary some times.

Also I checked and hair loss / hair shedding are listed as one of the more common potential side effects on my estradiol prescription...

Then again, the increase in shedding I had seems to have been temporary as best I can tell, and I did have diet, weight, exercise, and stress level changes around the same time, so I can't clearly ascribe all of it to the estradiol.

[PurplePelican]

A good point from Devlyn, is it more hairs or just more hair?

You don't mention what action you are taking in regards to testosterone, which is an important factor - I suspect DHT is in play here. You also don't mention your E2 or T levels, which would give an indication as to what's actually happening in your endocrine system. I haven't come across too many women complaining about shedding who were on an adequate HRT protocol - most with the issue seemed to be DIY'ing it.

And just to reiterate what LeafyMeg4589 said, mouse studies don't always translate to humans and can often have quite different results - this is why other species are often tested later in the process.