Rejected [TW: genitals mentioned]

[Amadeus]

TW: I talk about female genitals.

I have an OKCupid profile, one that's very up front about who I am.  As in the first line at the very top says, "I'm an FtM chap..."  My profile is set to Everyone because I'm pansexual.

I met a few guys who wanted to get down with me.  We made plans but they always fell through.  Except for J.  J and I began talking in early May.  We did things on Skype where we saw each other's genitals, so he knew straight away I had a mangina.  We still did, ahem, things.  A few days later he came over and we got down properly.  He even went down on me, and went back of his own volition!

Needless to say, we had fun.  We had a lot of fun.  We were getting close...and then he suddenly decided that although he cares for me very much and is definitely attracted to me, he's more attracted to cisgender men with real flesh and blood penises.  Therefore, he saw no future with me and decided we shouldn't have sex any more because he was starting to feel attached to me.  So even though I was definitely attached to him, I suggested that we take a little time apart and he FLIPPED OUT.  Said he didn't want to lose me, that he loved me, he felt so guilty and terrible that he liked cisgender men more, blah blah.

I really feel like he basically said to me, "You're not man enough for me.  You lack a dick, therefore you can't be my lover and partner."  I confronted him about this during one of our long texting sessions.  I asked him, "What would you do if you had a cisgender boyfriend and he lost his penis?  [Because we're guys and we do stupid things with our genitals all the time.]  Would you love him any less if he lost his penis?"  J replied that no, he wouldn't love him any less.  But if he knew the man didn't have a penis at the beginning, he wouldn't even bother with him.

And I just stared at this text message in my phone and thought, "Dude!  YOU KNEW BEFORE YOU CAME OVER HERE!"

So, tell me, what would you think in this situation?  Is he just being a superficial git?  I would like to think that he's just getting scared.  Neither of us are used to being with people who genuinely like us and are attracted to us.  He's also got a really sh*tty background; he was a Jehovah's Witness for 32 years.  He's 39 now.  So he's still got some reprogramming to do.  He also has anxiety problems almost as bad as I do.  I really want to believe that he's just freaking out and trying to sabotage himself, or maybe he's thinking, "Can I still call myself a gay man?  Will I be accepted among my peers for dating a transman?"  [His friends are actually giving him sh*t for saying he doesn't see a future with a transman.]

Tell me I'm being stupid.  Tell me why I'm being stupid.  I know I'm stupid.  I'm a man, after all.  Heh.

[TrojanMan]

I think that he's saying that because thats what he believes he should say, and not how he actually feels. It sounds like he's a little "programmed" as you mentioned. Especially because of the great point you made about not having a penis. Maybe you should just sit down with him and discuss his internal worries about dating a transman.


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk

[Ephemeral]

Scared of attachment and he's using your mangina as an excuse to remain distant. It's therefore not you but him. You don't know what other flimsy excuses he'd tell other guys with dicks if he noticed that he became too comfortable, developed feelings etc. a little too fast for his own liking which frankly seems to be the problem here. Of course it wouldn't necessarily hurt them as much because our bits a little bit more of a sensitive subject to us, but he chose that precisely because he knew that either way. It helps to justify himself, your differences are too big.

As you say, he knew and he knew what he was getting into. You should confront him about whether he's actually looking for a serious relationship or not, what he really feels and what he wants. He's saying a lot of things about how he feels but does he mean them? What does he really want? The way I see things is that he was initially probably just looking to have some fun and have a more light-hearted relationship but nothing serious but the problems started when he began to actually grow attached to you for real and it made him reconsider. I mean, attachment is scary. You want to be with someone very closely and intimately and you don't want to lose those people, but at the same time if you are insecure of closeness, it scares you too, so you try to rationalize and negotiate a space where you can keep the cake and eat it at the same time except life doesn't work that way. There's no win-win if you are scared of attachment and is about to enter a relationship.

You should ask him about that and focus less on the dick and more on the nature of your relationship and what he himself wants and is looking for in a relationship, intimate and otherwise. With some proper prodding, I'm pretty sure you'll haul out the real reason from him eventually, which may be something he himself is no longer consciously aware of himself. It can be anything from ->-bleeped-<-ty past exes to really traumatic childhood experiences that he's yet to share with you.

Good luck. You may not come out the same after this conversation, though it seems as if you are already heading that way already. If he pulls himself through this though, I think you will find that you are in a better position than before, but it's entirely up to him and if he's ready to face his own demons or not.

[Brasileira]

I think from the bottom of my heart he lies ( I'm sorry but I need to be true with u ) men use always lovely excuses but most of time they feel nothing what they say but see it in a good way at least he does not want to hurt you. I have lot and a lot of experience with men ( gay, straight, bi, pan and etc. ..) they are also very curious, u must be always careful with men they will always surprise u but not only in a bad way.

[Contravene]

Most people, especially guys, use OkCupid and other "dating" sites just to hookup, they aren't looking for any kind of future from it. He's probably scared because on an emotional level he's getting attached to you but he wants to keep his options open and doesn't want to rule out having fun with all the gay cis men he can hook up with. Sorry if this is vulgar but he seems scared of losing his cis penis so to speak. Dating sites are usually purely for sex, the relationships from them are rarely real so maybe he's not used to developing an attachment to someone from the site either.

[Gothic Dandy]

From what you posted, he didn't actually say that you are less of a man because you don't have a typical penis. He said that he's more attracted to cisgender males. Perhaps he has never actually been in a relationship with a trans man before, and he is re-evaluating his sexuality.

It sounds to me like you are both emotional and attached, so I wouldn't be too quick to place all of the blame on him. He is confused about what he wants, and you are (rightfully) offended that his problem has to do with your body. I hope that you two have talked more since then, but from what I see here, I don't think this would be a healthy relationship for you to continue.

[FTMax]

Honestly? It sounds like a huge cop out, and it sounds like something that I would say to someone if I had been talking to someone else and was ready to move on. Especially given the nonsensical/contradictory responses to your texts.

You should forget about him. He sounds like a jerk. I know that's easier said than done.

[Amadeus]

Hey everyone.  Thanks for the replies.  J and I have talked just about every day.  Get some popcorn and soda for this ->-bleeped-<-...

He texted me about two weeks ago after we'd had a somewhat heated discussion.  I had turned my phone down and was sleeping with Prince Percocet, so I never heard it.  The next morning I had 12 texts from him.  All were him begging me to talk to him.
A week or so later he drunk-texted me.  I heard the phone this time so I texted back.  We ended up sexting and when it was over, it was the same ->-bleeped-<-.  I called him out: "You're scared.  Admit it."  He did admit to being scared, but didn't say why.
Since then it's been pretty much the same ->-bleeped-<-.  One night I said to him, "Maybe we should walk away from each other, take some time apart."  He lost his ->-bleeped-<-.  Said he didn't want to lose me.  Said he wanted us to stay in touch and be friends.  Yet he still flirts with me.  Tells me I'm handsome, that he wishes we could cuddle, do wibbly-wobbly sexy-wexy things.  Keeps asking me "Are you okay?"  I've told him more than once that I'm not happy with the circumstances, but that otherwise I'm fine.  So now we text at least once a day and he tells me that he wishes I was there with him.  For a while I would offer, "I can be there in an hour" and he always declined.  So now I don't even bother.

Yes, I should just walk away.  Thing is, I do love the guy.  There were other guys who I talked to on OKC that said they wanted to hook up with me, date, whatever, and nothing ever happened.  J made an effort, twice.  Which is huge for him, because he has some agoraphobia like I have.  I know he's got to be struggling with his identity right now, because it's pretty obvious he enjoyed being with me sexually.  That has to be screwing with his head.  So of course he panics and pushes me away.  What am I supposed to do?  Wait around for him to pull his head out of his arse and grow up?  Granted, I'm not going anywhere and no one else has stepped up to the plate.  But still...

Again, thank you all for your replies and your thoughts on the matter.   

[sparrow]

He's attached, he likes the sex, he's just struggling with his identity.  Our society has a lot of built-in transphobia.  His heart and libido are telling him yes, and his rational brain is struggling to catch up.  When he's not actively pigeonholing himself to fit a label, he's happy.  You know what it's like to struggle with your identity.  Put it to him in those terms, and help him cope as best you can.

Look, it's clear that he's already attached, and so are you.  I'd take an aggressive stance.  Court him.  Buy him flowers.  Take him on a romantic date.  Write him a stupid poem.  Convince him that you're worth it.  Relationships take work, and you've gotta take a risk if you want something that will last.

(caveat: I don't know how gay men pursue eachother, almost all of my experience is with straight girls)

[Amadeus]

UPDATE

Last night I sent an email where I pretty much said, "I'm getting sick of this push/pull bull->-bleeped-<-.  Either let me in or let me go.  You let me in, we could both be really happy.  You push me away again, I'm not coming back.  It's not fair to me."

Guess what he did.  Yeah.  Deleted me off his FB friends list.  Totally disregarded my request of "No excuses, no explanations".  Lied.  Bull->-bleeped-<-ted me.  Tried to gaslight me.  I'm just done.  We're done.

This is what I get for standing up for myself.  I get ->-bleeped-<-ed.  He knew exactly what he was getting into when he came over to my home.  He still slept with me.  Twice.  So, he ->-bleeped-<-ed me.  Already put his name up on an ex-rating site.  Because I am a bitter, bitter bastard right now.

[Ephemeral]

UPDATE

Last night I sent an email where I pretty much said, "I'm getting sick of this push/pull bull->-bleeped-<-.  Either let me in or let me go.  You let me in, we could both be really happy.  You push me away again, I'm not coming back.  It's not fair to me."

Guess what he did.  Yeah.  Deleted me off his FB friends list.  Totally disregarded my request of "No excuses, no explanations".  Lied.  Bull->-bleeped-<-ted me.  Tried to gaslight me.  I'm just done.  We're done.

This is what I get for standing up for myself.  I get ->-bleeped-<-ed.  He knew exactly what he was getting into when he came over to my home.  He still slept with me.  Twice.  So, he ->-bleeped-<-ed me.  Already put his name up on an ex-rating site.  Because I am a bitter, bitter bastard right now.

Sorry to hear that, man, but I could frankly see that one coming. He wasn't mature enough to handle it and it's unfortunate it sucks for you because he's the one who's hurting you, not the other way around. It sucks now, but there are other, better guys than that douche. Guys who are more secure in themselves and won't let your body determine the nature of your relationship.

[amber roskamp]

UPDATE

Last night I sent an email where I pretty much said, "I'm getting sick of this push/pull bull->-bleeped-<-.  Either let me in or let me go.  You let me in, we could both be really happy.  You push me away again, I'm not coming back.  It's not fair to me."

Guess what he did.  Yeah.  Deleted me off his FB friends list.  Totally disregarded my request of "No excuses, no explanations".  Lied.  Bull->-bleeped-<-ted me.  Tried to gaslight me.  I'm just done.  We're done.

This is what I get for standing up for myself.  I get ->-bleeped-<-ed.  He knew exactly what he was getting into when he came over to my home.  He still slept with me.  Twice.  So, he ->-bleeped-<-ed me.  Already put his name up on an ex-rating site.  Because I am a bitter, bitter bastard right now.

Sorry

I think you made the right choice giving him the ultimatum. He obviously showed is true colors. You can do better than him. It's really sounds like u did nothing wrong.

There are people out there that will love ur entire body, and will not care about the presence of a mangina. I know many of us girls would rather date trans men then cis men.
I'm def one of them. Not because you have the different parts then cis men.

To me trans men's masculinity is a lot more genuine. Many cis men rely on out doing other men to prove they are masculine but if I were to tell them they should hold my purse. they will treat the purse like it is a toxin. This shows they are really uncomfortable with their masculinity, and need other people's recognition to proves they are masculine. Most of the trans men I have met don't need that kind of thing to realize they are masculine. They know it, and feel freed by it. They aren't limited to the cis-normative perception of what is masculine. I think that gives trans men a few points in my own little sexiness scale.

I just wanted to share this so to help affirm what u already know that u are as much of a man as any other guy.

If he made u feel like u are less of a man then he is he can go f himself ( which I'm sure he will be doing sense he single).