Among trans, referrencing transwomen as a girl or woman without cis context

[Evelyn K]

Not just here but in other trans spheres, I find it misleading when speaking of dating other girls or women, or referring to their wives (who happen to be trans) without noting they are trans when conversing with other trans peoples.

When I hear of a transwoman mentioning their girlfriend, I think to myself "awesome she passed the CIS test and is dating one!" only to be o.O when the trans component reveals itself and it feels disingenuous.

I know I'm not the only one. Amongst ourselves shouldn't trans folks be more upfront and honest about the candor of our conquests and note if they cis or trans or otherwise?

[Ms Grace]

Sometimes it might be useful to know that info principally for comparisons sake, but I'm not really fussed either way. At the end of the day it's not really my business if someone's partner is trans or cis.

[iKate]

I don't care. I am a woman, full stop.

[Evelyn K]

Yes amongst CIS ppls I would say I'm a woman. But the trans part will eventually require disclosure to anyone we're dating.

I get it that we're women, of course. But amongst ourselves we can't ignore that we're trans, otherwise we wouldn't be on a transgender forum.

[Dee Marshall]

I don't know, Evelyn, it almost sounds like staying cis women are better. Not healthy.

[Rejennyrated]

I don't care. I am a woman, full stop.

Yes I completely agree. I've date both trans and cis people, and it makes no difference. People are people, and in anycase in my eyes I am neither. I'm a currently cis person with an open trans history. Thats is to say I was trans, but I mostly grew up in my prefered gender, had genital surgery and now therefor (for the past 30+ years) consider myself effectively cis. Others may not see it that way, but as I have the right to self define, that is my choice, so they can go swivel on it.

By extension it's not my place to out anyone. I will do it now to my late partner, of 25 years, because she is now dead and therefore it no longer matters, but for a living partner I am duty bound to respect their choices and thus it is for them and not me to decide who they tell and when.

In the UK under the privacy provisions of the gender recognition act, it would actually be a criminal offence to out anyone without their prior permission. I contributed to that legislation and for me it 100% non negotiable.

Most of the time I choose to be entirely open about my past, but there are occasions when I've even been into trans spaces and not declared myself, sometimes because I'm going as a professional and therfore its just not appropriate.

Bottom line is I would say we all have the right to a private life with no exceptions, and while I mostly choose to be open about my history with people I would quite litterally rip anyone, be they trans or cis, several new arseholes if I found out that they had taken it upon themselves to out me without my consent, for whatever reason.

[Evelyn K]

I don't know, Evelyn, it almost sounds like staying cis women are better. Not healthy.

Not saying CIS women are better, but we can't be so prideful that it blinds our own reality of what we are.

[Ms Grace]

I get it that we're women, of course. But amongst ourselves we can't ignore that we're trans, otherwise we wouldn't be on a transgender forum.

I don't think we are ignoring that we're trans - here we are, as you rightly say, we're on a trans forum. Real life is different. I met a woman in real life the other day who was pretty quick to tell me she was trans and to tell me about her upcoming SRS, etc - but that was her choice. If I met a trans woman who didn't want to tell me she was trans then that's her choice.

[Zoetrope]

I agree, Evelyn, and I think you make a good point.

It's a contradiction to ask not to be referred to as trans, yet find it necessary to use the term to describe others like us.

We know what transsexualism is, and we aren't in denial of it. So why not embrace it all the way?

For me, denying what I am (transsexual) would be like pushing a skeleton back into a closet, which I have worked so hard to get out in the first place.

[Evelyn K]

Sarah you're hitting home runs lately.

Grace, personal question if you don't mind, if you where not open to dating a transwoman (for instance you've sperm banked and want children) would you feel mislead if she didn't reveal her trans status after a long period of dating? Dating is an investment after all.

[Ms Grace]

Well I am open to dating a transwoman, I'm not that interested in children - so it's a pretty hypothetical question. Plenty of people get involved with partners of either gender/sex without fully knowing their reproductive potential, ability, desires, etc - and still love them when their own parental ambitions go go pearshaped.

Besides, I thought you were discussing general observations about people not close intimate relationships.

[Evelyn K]

Well I am open to dating a transwoman, I'm not that interested in children - so it's a pretty hypothetical question. Plenty of people get involved with partners of either gender/sex without fully knowing their reproductive potential, ability, desires, etc - and still love them when their own parental ambitions go go pearshaped.

Besides, I thought you were discussing general observations about people not close intimate relationships.

And that's why I asked Because you insert some convincing things I haven't thought about.

General observations, yes, would like to hear more opinions!

[Jenna Marie]

I think it's rude to out people, basically. If my significant other didn't mind me telling people, then maybe, but I still feel like there's a bit of internalized transphobia in thinking a cis woman is a "better conquest"? I wouldn't want to brag about having graduated to dating cis women or whatever, so it just wouldn't seem like it was anyone else's business.

I don't want my wife telling people I'm trans without checking with me first - even other trans people if I don't know them - so I'd offer her the same consideration. I don't see it as denying anything about my own reality or anything so much as not sharing private information about a person I claim to love; I'd be equally startled if my [cis male] friend started telling people about his wife's hysterectomy before she knew them, even if the other person in the conversation ALSO had that surgery.

[iKate]

Not saying CIS women are better, but we can't be so prideful that it blinds our own reality of what we are.

That reality means little to me so I'm not really going around shouting it.

[iKate]

I agree, Evelyn, and I think you make a good point.

It's a contradiction to ask not to be referred to as trans, yet find it necessary to use the term to describe others like us.

We know what transsexualism is, and we aren't in denial of it. So why not embrace it all the way?

For me, denying what I am (transsexual) would be like pushing a skeleton back into a closet, which I have worked so hard to get out in the first place.

It's because I never wanted to be a transsexual. I embrace it like someone with cancer embraces cancer. You share the struggle with other people afflicted but in the end you just want it cured.

[Beth Andrea]

Not just here but in other trans spheres, I find it misleading when speaking of dating other girls or women, or referring to their wives (who happen to be trans) without noting they are trans when conversing with other trans peoples.

When I hear of a transwoman mentioning their girlfriend, I think to myself "awesome she passed the CIS test and is dating one!" only to be o.O when the trans component reveals itself and it feels disingenuous.

I know I'm not the only one. Amongst ourselves shouldn't trans folks be more upfront and honest about the candor of our conquests and note if they cis or trans or otherwise?

That's funny, I don't think about someone's girlfriend/boyfriend as "cis" or "trans"...I'm just happy they have one.

I think you say "it feels disingenuous" because revealing a partner to be trans shows that your assumption was false, and rather than humbly say to yourself, "Gee, I really shouldn't assume things like that" you shift the blame onto the other person for hiding her partner's gender status...which isn't really any of your business anyway.

immho

[suzifrommd]

When ever I hear that someone "should" do something in some way, my reaction is always "you're not the boss of me."

It's really between them and their partner whether they want to share their partner's gender history. None of us have a God-given right to that information.

[Evelyn K]

Yeah this all makes sense.

I'd humbly add that I was remiss in forgetting that, for one to reveal their girlfriends "trans" status in any capacity has privacy implications for said trans person.

Privacy is the best practice.

Thanks for the reply's!

[stephaniec]

personally , I don't think it's relevant to a conversation ,( disclaimer , I haven't dated for a long time , either cis or trans so my point of view may be irrelevant .)

[Marly]

I have a few good friends that are transwomen. I never refer to them as anything other than she or her. I did ask one about this and I fully agree with her reply. At any stage of transition, we are doing so because we are female. Physical aspects are just that...physical.
I am pre-everything, so basically a ->-bleeped-<- at the moment. But they all, including a couple of CIS friends, still refer to me as she or her. Despite the fact that I spend 90% of my time in guy mode.