"But you're different"

[iKate]

Some of my friends and others that know I who I am often compare me to other trans women they know or know about. Caitlyn Jenner obviously but also people we know in our social circle.

Most often they say stuff like, "you're different, you actually look like a woman." Or,"you actually try to look like and carry yourself like a woman." I try to explain that people are in various stages of transition and not everyone is able to "pass" and we should respect them and their rights regardless. But I usually get shut down after that or weird looks from people.

One guy even told me that Caitlyn Jenner is "mentally ill" and that I'm different because I'm not. I'm not his friend anymore because he just acts stupid and says dumb things.

It's a bit annoying because while it is validating I really don't like putting down the community like that. Not too long ago I was being called "sir" at every turn, and some people like Korean airport security did not even know what to do with me. So yes I know what it's like and to be honest I really doubt I pass fully. The voice carries me as well as my mannerisms and the fact that I have a female shaped chest but make no mistake, FFS and body contouring is in my future.

So do your friends do this and how do you deal with them?

[rosinstraya]

For me I don't think it's my comportment as such (or anyone else's) that worries friends - it's still much more the overall dealing with me as female and, I suppose, that broader idea of socialisation and your "place" in things.

People I know tend to be of a relatively left liberal bent - so they don't make disparaging remarks about trans people. Of course, I don't know whether they think differently- and that's not something I can worry about

[iKate]

For me I don't think it's my comportment as such (or anyone else's) that worries friends - it's still much more the overall dealing with me as female and, I suppose, that broader idea of socialisation and your "place" in things.

People I know tend to be of a relatively left liberal bent - so they don't make disparaging remarks about trans people. Of course, I don't know whether they think differently- and that's not something I can worry about

Most of my friends are quite the opposite. They're either hard right conservative or libertarian. (99% of them accept me though, or really don't care either way).

[Evelyn Ivy StaMaria]

Yeah I've had the same thing happen here. "But Eve you're different". No I'm not. Just because I pass and sound like a girl or look like one now it doesn't isolate me from the other transgirls okay? We all deserve to be treated the same way, it doesn't matter who looks "better" we all deserve to be treated like any other girl and to be respected. I don't really like it when my friends do that.

[Tysilio]

In general, women are judged first and foremost by their looks, to the point that it can become a moral issue -- big-bodied women, for instance, are likely to be seen as lazy, undisciplined, etc.  It sucks, and it needs to be changed.

I'd bet that one of the subtexts of "... you actually look like a woman" is that you're pretty attractive -- the way women are "supposed" to be.

Now that I'm read 100% as a guy, I'm astonished by the difference in how I'm treated. That initial appraisal of my appearance and tendency to dismiss me because I didn't look like a "proper" woman is conspicuously absent. I look exactly the same (well, OK, not quite the same...), dress pretty much the same, but I'm respected in a way I never was when I presented as more or less female.

As I said -- it sucks. Everyone deserves to be respected for who they are, not what they look like.

[suzifrommd]

Two choices, Kate, either try to educate them, or decide whether or not you want to be friends with them. I usually try educating ignorant people - It may be the only chance they get to learn accurate information about us.

[Tessa James]

In general, women are judged first and foremost by their looks, to the point that it can become a moral issue -- big-bodied women, for instance, are likely to be seen as lazy, undisciplined, etc.  It sucks, and it needs to be changed.

I'd bet that one of the subtexts of "... you actually look like a woman" is that you're pretty attractive -- the way women are "supposed" to be.

Now that I'm read 100% as a guy, I'm astonished by the difference in how I'm treated. That initial appraisal of my appearance and tendency to dismiss me because I didn't look like a "proper" woman is conspicuously absent. I look exactly the same (well, OK, not quite the same...), dress pretty much the same, but I'm respected in a way I never was when I presented as more or less female.

As I said -- it sucks. Everyone deserves to be respected for who they are, not what they look like.

Thanks for that post, it is so true.  I have found that some trans people have genetic markers and may "look the part" and are then considered obviously in need of transition or better accepted.  Yes, big girls like me and some of my friends may be seen as less believable or not ready for prime time while my thinner, shorter, cuter friends get a pass.  Luck of the draw for some, we didn't pick our parents.

[marsh monster]

That little phrase is exactly why I keep to myself for the most part outside of work. People say they like/love me, then you see what they post on their fb or say about something else that gives you an idea of what their thoughts actually are. When asked by someone at work why I took my fb down, I told him that I really didn't feel good knowing what so many people actually thought about a number of things and I'd rather get through the day being oblivious as possible to that side of them. Nothing else has been said to me about it since...

[iKate]

Two choices, Kate, either try to educate them, or decide whether or not you want to be friends with them. I usually try educating ignorant people - It may be the only chance they get to learn accurate information about us.

I generally do that.  Most people get the message. Those that don't, I dump them and they usually come crawling back.

[marsh monster]

In all honesty, I doubt education really works with many people except maybe to educate them on how to avoid offending you. Their idea of gender=born sex is generally not really going to change, they will just figure its easier to play along rather than offend you if they want to be around you. I've learned this from many years of dealing with people, even "enlightened" ones. There may be a few that might actually change their inner view on it, but I feel that its rare. To most people, we're always going to be different, even if they "accept" us.

[suzifrommd]

In all honesty, I doubt education really works with many people except maybe to educate them on how to avoid offending you.

Oh, MM, I really hope this isn't true. A really depressing worldview. I find that being trans is pretty simple and nearly everyone can understand if they try. The only people I can't educate are those who refuse to listen. IMO, most people really want to know the truth and are willing to learn.

[iKate]

Education works to an extent.

Rabidly anti trans people, maybe with a smattering of religious zealotry thrown in for good measure will never accept.

People with an open mind or who can be convinced will. But you need to work at it and I think the best way is to show people you are a good person regardless.

Most of my friends I had before I transitioned are conservative or libertarian. I'm  actually looked upon with a lot of respect by them because of several things including what I do for a living. When I came out the haterade was just flowing like water. I got so many nasty things just slung at me. Some expected some not expected. People said nasty things like, "he looks like a man nobody will <blank> him." One woman warned her kid about me and the kid came up and asked if I was a boy. (She admitted it because I found it strange since kids never clock me.)

I dumped a few of my friends for this and stepped back. One or two friends stood up for me and I just carried on with grace. Now, everyone is pretty much on board with me. I explained to people who I am and that I'm not going away. Standing my ground basically. A good friend also backed me up when I needed it. Women in that circle quietly supported me and included me in their activities. However I did not keep it quiet. I'm loud and proud and not going away. We had a meetup and I really hit it off with the ladies, and I was treated like one of them. I'm making friends and I'm happy.

It was a bit rough but I would say most of my friends either now accept or just don't care either way. People don't hide their kids from me or any of the transphobia nightmares you hear about. In daily life I'm just a woman. The topic of "trans"'never comes up. I suspect at least a few know I'm trans but nobody has brought it up except at work where almost everyone knows.

A few are ignorant in my circle of friends but I just basically put them aside. One of them is psycho it seems so I'm staying away from him. He's begging me to be friends again. I told him he was too nasty and I have to think about it.

[HoneyStrums]

Yeah, My sister actually, (not the one that disowned me)

Only with my sister she has some strong opinions concerning girls with gun. She will see somthing on the telly about a transwoman that doesnt want srs and wants to be allowed to use the woman restroom. She will say things like no they shouldnt, so ill say but you wanted me to keep you company whille you went last week, que the "your different though" i ask how so, "your going for the full change" she says.

it get anoying, because allthough im a pre op transexual, i still dont find the idea of penile proximaty when peeing. which is probably why i find the idea of single stall restrooms more apealing.

anyway back on topic. I have to keep reminding her that she cant understand because she looks at them as men that want to be girls. And that its not about wanting to be a girl, itsabout already being one, and not seeing why they should have to undergo a dangerouse opperation, with a long painfull healing process, with life long maintenenece, just to pee comfatably.

She forgets some times that im trans all together, and some of the time just speaking triggers a oh yeah sorry. But with her forgetting i put it down to a out of sight out of mind. So I think if i was less passable she would be more understanding. or iff i didnt want the op myself. I honestly believe my sister would acomodate me, and everybody like me. (no matter how i was)

now despite my sister fualts, if she actually met and got to know a "none op", (sorry for the descriptions if they offend) she would more then likelly be more understanding. I can only speak for myself though, and in some way have a bit of credibility when speaking for transexuals. but other then that my word means little. about as much as a man speaking for a woman.