Pre-T anger

[November Fox]

I was wondering if any of you deal with this.

I'm pre-T, and I have a massive amount of dysphoria (both bottom and top). The fact that it's all so soft and jiggly, and moves around all the time, puts me off.

I just feel pretty emasculated by my body and it gives me this sense of weakness, of powerlessness, which in turn makes me incredibly angry.

Now I've had a traumatic childhood so it is possible that the anger is related to that (in some amount), and I am working through the childhood with a therapist. But I notice that it always gets worse when the dysphoria is really bad.

I was wondering if other FTMs can relate to this.
I've never really heard this being discussed before.

[FTMax]

Perhaps anger turned inward. I felt plenty of weakness and powerlessness, but I was and still am very introverted in my response to heavier emotions. If anything I was angry at myself, even though I couldn't do anything to change it and it wasn't my fault that I was this way.

Self loathing, self destructive, etc. Coupled with periods of denial.

Pre-everything is tough. The best advice I can give is to talk to someone.

[jlaframboise]

Pre-T I definitely felt all of the things you mentioned in this post. I was angry at something I couldn't control and needed something to let all of it out so I started running small amounts on my treadmill and it led to working out on the regular to stop the anxiety and depression. That's about the only advice I can give, put some of that dysphoria anger into something that benefits you mentally OR physically. Good luck


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[DriftingCrow]

I think it's something everyone can relate to.  Everyone can feel angry when things aren't right with their bodies and/or life. 

I do agree with jlaframboise though, try to find a positive way to channel it.  I used to like boxing, and now I lift weights. 

[November Fox]

Thanks for replying

I'm familiar with anger turned inward towards the point of self-loathing and even self-harm. Same thing for me. Sometimes I take it out on furniture but luckily it doesn't get that bad very often.

I used to run weekly (though I've slacked...) and lift weights/bodyweight and that helps, I do notice that when I stop working out I tend to sink into a depressed feeling and the anger comes back... I should definitely just start doing all that again.

I mainly was curious if others felt like this because I have been on a binge watching spree (youtube) of others in the same situation, and not a single one mentioned pre-T rage, mainly there was mention of rage by some people while on T.

[Clever]

YES.

I found relief in contact sports, where I could channel my anger into strength and still have the discipline of learning to contact legally in gameplay.

Maybe give that a try?

[November Fox]

Clever, I was doing KravMaga (israeli contact combat) up til now, I went to the classes as a "chick" and they didn't know about the transgender situation.

They're all pretty cool guys, but being among them as female made me feel observed (since I was the only one) and not in a good way. I know trans guys who go to the gym can have a pretty hard time, and this would be the same situation except more intense because there's only like six of us, small group.

I'm not sure how they'd react to me going as a guy, but I have a slight feeling that they might not be that open to it. They're frequently military types, they might probably not like people being gay, and yeah transgender seems like one step further.

I am curious about what kind of contact sports you do though, and how you deal with above considerations I'd be happy to read more about it, if you feel like it.

[Saison Marguerite]

My boyfriend felt this way a lot when he was pre-transition and I have noticed a huge difference in the temperaments from when I knew him before. I knew him for 4 years before he began hormones and it has been over 3 years on hormones now and the difference astonishes me. It is as though I am talking to a different person entirely. His anger had two levels because he is transsexual but he also was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder, which was something that made his rage much worse too.

The only thing that helped him in the end was beginning his physical transition. It was as though he could not treat his borderline until he was comfortable enough in his body as a man. Are you close to getting on hormones or any other steps in the process? In the meantime you might want to look up DBT which is dialectical behaviour therapy, it has some good techniques for managing distress. It isn't a solution to the dysphoria. Only transitioning would fix that if you are transsexual I think, but it will help you if transitioning is not within your control at this time.

[Jameson]

I've had quite a bit of trouble with rage, most noticeably the last couple of years. I'm not on T so I can't say if it would help. I have gotten to the point of figuring out that it has a lot to do with gender issues in my own mind and fairly serious dysphoria. I'm pre-everything so I'm hoping that top surgery will help alleviate some of it.

I've heard others say that T mellowed them out though.

[November Fox]

Yeah I hear from a lot of people that going on T actually helps with the rage I know that it's not a guarantee but it would definitely be awesome. Saison Marguerite, I was actually also diagnosed with BPD about eight years ago due to dysfunctional childhood, so at first I thought the rage issues I had were only related to the past.

I'm pre-everything at this moment but I'm thinking of calling my doc tomorrow so they can give me a referral to a gender team in Amsterdam  At the moment I'm in "regular" therapy with a really awesome woman who helps me a lot and I do have "techniques" for when it totally spins out of control.

The distress has definitely gotten better though, since I cut my hair, and use an STP, and finally figured out how to wear my binder so that it doesn't cause my back to ache too much. I find that I feel much calmer when I can just feel relaxed instead of being hyper-aware of all the body parts...

[Kylo]

I'm not that angry about that body any more (I was very angry in childhood), it's more like someone I'm forced to live with that I don't like and decided to blank as often as possible.   

I'm due to go to a GIC soon for the first time and I've thought about more than I usually do and yeah, I'm getting a little angry. It is possible to blank everything when you think there's no hope of changing it and then suddenly you realize maybe you can do something about it... and then it's like that person in your cell you've been blanking for years enters your thoughts again and how much you hate 'em plays on your mind again. I think it's a kind of impatience rearing its head, but in context of just how long you've had to be patient - i.e. all your life. And how much longer you're going to have to practice patience. I also worry about the GIC closing down before I receive the proper treatment - I can't afford to have it privately so there's a practical dimension to this impatience as well.

My childhood sucked too and I have issues but there's always been a strong need to control myself regards anger and other things. I just can't see a path where giving free rein to that stuff works out and doesn't ruin me (I've seen it ruin others). Living for so many years in despair about my body without any hope has made it an easier job for me to ignore it, and the recent hope has kind of messed up that continuity. I know as long as I can get through the treatment successfully I will be able to practice more patience... but false hope does worry me. I don't like the idea I may think I can do this thing and something might happen before or halfway that cuts me off and says "no, sorry, you can't transition" for whatever reason. If that happened I think I'd experience some serious rage.

[Cindy]

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[November Fox]

T.K.G.W, I'm happy that you realize giving free reign to anger isn't the answer It ruined my life for a good while, I hit rock bottom because of it actually. I couldn't go through life anymore without some sort of sedating medications. So developing techniques to deal with that anger in a healthy way is always a good idea.

It's probably best (for the ones who suffer from transition-related anger) to try and get your mind off of thoughts like "this is unfair" (even if it is), or "I've been waiting forever" or "what if they won't let me start my transition", and instead be physical through sports like the others said. I know it's hard to do. But working through your anger in a physical way is better than letting it be an ill advisor...

[Kylo]

I agree exercise and not brooding in a room etc. is far healthier than taking pills and shutting yourself off from potential outlets. But you aren't always in the mood to face the world either.

I'm lucky enough to live in an area where I can go out and do a lot of physical activity, running, climbing, walking, swimming etc. without difficulty and without too many other people around. I've been recovering from a temp year long illness and slowly starting to go out more and more and take up more physical activities. I know that if I am approved for transition I will have to become more active and fit anyways as it's advisable if you start taking T to start taking care of your body and cardiovascular system. It's going to happen one way or another that I force myself to become more active and hopefully a side effect will be a calmer disposition. But, up until this point it has been difficult for me to go outside or be active... the illness sapped all of my energy and I find that going outside I still feel it to be unrelaxing because I still don't feel confident running or swimming if I have to wear stuff that reveals the body. It's turned out to be a much bigger mental issue than I ever thought it was, lurking behind the scenes. There's no way I'd join a gym or go to a public swimming baths these days. Indoor setups are kind of out too, given how small my place is.

I do empathize with those people whose dysphoria/anger is so bad they find it difficult to enjoy normal outdoors/fitness stuff.

[Jameson]

I'm not that angry about that body any more (I was very angry in childhood), it's more like someone I'm forced to live with that I don't like and decided to blank as often as possible.   

I'm due to go to a GIC soon for the first time and I've thought about more than I usually do and yeah, I'm getting a little angry. It is possible to blank everything when you think there's no hope of changing it and then suddenly you realize maybe you can do something about it... and then it's like that person in your cell you've been blanking for years enters your thoughts again and how much you hate 'em plays on your mind again. I think it's a kind of impatience rearing its head, but in context of just how long you've had to be patient - i.e. all your life. And how much longer you're going to have to practice patience. I also worry about the GIC closing down before I receive the proper treatment - I can't afford to have it privately so there's a practical dimension to this impatience as well.

My childhood sucked too and I have issues but there's always been a strong need to control myself regards anger and other things. I just can't see a path where giving free rein to that stuff works out and doesn't ruin me (I've seen it ruin others). Living for so many years in despair about my body without any hope has made it an easier job for me to ignore it, and the recent hope has kind of messed up that continuity. I know as long as I can get through the treatment successfully I will be able to practice more patience... but false hope does worry me. I don't like the idea I may think I can do this thing and something might happen before or halfway that cuts me off and says "no, sorry, you can't transition" for whatever reason. If that happened I think I'd experience some serious rage.

This. So very exactly this, especially the parts I bolded, thank you for putting this into words!

I am fortunate that I can now go ahead on my own without being challenged by a program, but I still have some resentment going on. In the US insurance companies are finally starting to get on board but I know it will be too long for me to wait, I'm running out of time due to age and waiting a few years to be 'granted' medical care is not an option. I will have to go out of pocket and I do resent it, at least the options are available within my lifetime, I need to focus on being grateful for that.

[Fids]

I'm pre-T right now as well, and I can relate to this so, so incredibly much. I will say that I'm notttt the most curvaceous afab person in the world; I don't have much of a big chest or hips. My hormone doctor will also be my primary care doc, and since I fudged an appointment with them this month I will have to wait until next month to see them.

This also means that I will (and have been) "rationing" my anxiety and depression meds; and surprisingly what I thought would just be plain depression and unwillingness to participate in daily life; has actually turned into raging anger half the time.

I'm angry that I feel like the universe screwed me over for no good reason, that somehow it didn't see me as "deserving" of the body I should have had. I'm angry that my childhood never will be what it should have been, angry that so many people have and take for granted what I will never get.

I'm never gonna get taller. So yeah. Stunted growth. I'm short, even for an afab person.

I can relate to the dysphoria. I don't pass very well; my voice is so obviously afab that I'm afraid to talk. If one more person refers to me as "she, her, ladies, ma'am, gals, etc" or any variation of combination of related phrases, I'm gonna punch someone.

So yeah. Surprising anger issues.

[November Fox]

The rage has gotten a little bit better I think, although I say that now in a state of calm - and sometimes I can be a bit unpredictable (female hormones... the upsides and the downsides).

I just got a referral to a gender therapist on Monday, there's a one-and-a-half month waiting list for that and then after that I'll have to go to the whole screening and at least three months of therapy (I think), so it'll be a while until I can take some actual "action" in the form of T...

@Fids I also feel a lot of times that the universe screwed me over for no good reason, although personally it encompasses more than just the dysphoria - it's also my messed up childhood and psychotic parents that I regret having. Not trying to compare. I mean to say that I'm familiar with the feeling.

I can really support the advice given by other guys before - work the anger constructively, let it out in a good way because it can really eat you up and get you nowhere good. In some ways anger can actually work for us because it makes you more decisive (when you chose to use it that way), and more resolute on calming down. It can be a real good ally.

[sam1234]

I never felt angry pre-T. If anything, I felt that I needed to always prove that I was as tough as the guys and as strong.
Having said that, I knew a few other F to Ms while I was going through transition and a couple of them were extremely angry.

My childhood had some violence in it thanks to my older brother, and a lot of mockery, but never felt that it made me angry. Each person deals with their gender dysphoria differently, so don't feel as though you are alone.

sam1234