greetings!!

[veronica]

Hi,

Let me introduce myself -I am Veronica,  Lisabeth's SO.  Lisabeth has introduced you all to me on New Years Eve.  I would like to think that was a turning point for us towards a fresh start.

The foundation of our relationship was shattered by Lisabeth's web of lies and deciet. I have a range of emotions consisting of anger and sadness,  mostly sadness from the
betrayal of Lisabeth's deceit.  I believe a realtionship is based on honesty and trust.  We need to rebuild our foundation with open truthful communication . Sharing this forum on
New Year's Eve after a heart to heart talk "to start fresh without lies" is our first step towards a new beginning! 

I think a combination of therapy and open communication without deceit is a great place to start. We need to rebuild what was destroyed by betrayal. I am hurting right now but I am hopeful the pain will dissipate each day as we rebuild what is so precious in a realtionship -trust!

I think you all are an AWESOME group!!  What a great support system.  I have just recently joined a support system for so of crossdressers and it has been a positive experience. This has been most enlightening. I am currently researching reading materials to educate me more on the subject,  focusing on the couple as a whole.

My first session with the therapist is tomorrow. I am looking forward to our session and future sessions together. I love my so and I am hopeful this will bring us closer together- if he can remain honest and communicate. We need to come to an understanding that will benefit all of us as a family. It is difficult to trust again... 

happy new year
peace and love to you all

veronica    

[Kate Thomas]

Hi Veronica
Welcome to Susans
I  am sure that you wil find your time here a truly  positive and suporitive experiance.


Best Wishes to both You and Yours

Love
Kate

[Dennis]

Welcome Veronica, we have a lot of wise SO's here and a friendly group.

Dennis

[Kimberly]

Hello Veronica, welcome and pleased to meet you

Trust is hard but doable... just be sure to understand the reasons, I think.

Best wishes for you two

[Peggiann]

Veronica,
I'm glade you came to Susan's and read the posts your Lisabeth wrote. I'm also glad that you love and care for Lisabeth to educate yourself about this other side to Lisabeth. I believe that education will help you understand the deceit and make it to where the trust will be regained in your relationship.

I too am a SO here at Susan's. My partner and best friend is Leah, whom is also my Spouse. I know that hurt and feeling of no trust is left. But when I considered where the deceit stemmed from, I could understand the why it was more desirable to deceive.

I don't think, but then I can only imagine, that any other type of SO on this site in the lives of this unique group of individuals, is much different than yours or mine or any others. We all still feel and all still want the same things in our relationships. Trust, respect, love, and the chance to react and respond to our partners. Not our reactions and responses imagined for us and so they don't trust enough to communicate and share so they hide. I realize all human beings try to avoid what they are afraid of. But the courage to face those fears and allow us to exercise our courage to accept them is only fair to ask.

All relationships have down falls at some point in the trust category. Relationships are like a river. They run smooth not a ripple...then as life and the things in them get filled up with many activities the river runs a bit faster and ripples eventually start to form. Because the pace escalates and lack of time and what ever help contribute to lack of communication and taking the trust and sharing in the relationship for granted, those ripples grow and grow and become rapids. The rapids in life not headed and maneuvered through to smoother waters lead to crashing waterfalls. Churning fierce water below the falls sometimes create an ebby. The swirling waters that just go around and around. The relationship without communication can go through this as well. Where because of hurt and anger and lack of trust to reach for the life raft being thrown can slow the escape from the ebby to safety. That lack of trust to reach for the life raft can be bridged by education and communicating with the other in the relationship. Truth and honesty and not taking for granted the loved ones feelings are the boulders on which you can find rest and peace to digest the newfound knowledge from the education. But don't slip on the boulders thinking your partner fits perfectly to textbooks descriptions of what lies ahead because they are all unique and special and different. That Ebby was hard enough to climb out of. Once the trust in your partners life raft has been restored it calms waters on the other side of the ebby and smooth flowing again.

You have small children I gather from the posts. I want to pose this question to you. What is a Child seeks most? LOVE... right the security to know they are loved no matter what. Also to trust that you will be honest with them. Not ever lie to or deceive them.

Now I pose another question to you. How can you teach them not to lie if you keep things from them? How can you expect them to have trust if you deceive them? Now I want to gently point out. Are you not demanding of your spouse to do to your children and you in cahoots with Lisabeth, doing the same thing that has hurt you so deeply. Why would you want to hurt them, as you have been hurt?

Now I pose another question. How can you be teaching your children to face their fears and not hide from that, which may cause others to question them as a person and think them strange? Your guiding role as a parent is not to shield them and shelter them and cover their eyes with blinders so they might not see something they will eventually see out in the world one day. IT will be seen at a store or gas station or in the mall or at a restaurant. Why not let them experience it with someone they trust and love and that loves them? Sharing there is nothing to fear from them.

If you want complete trust in your children when they are in Junior High and High School when it's very important to have for guiding them through some very rough water in their own life, you have to build that trust now. They will then be able to come to you with anything that arises. HIding things from them will teach them to hide what the social sect thinks not normal or is unacceptable.

I feel for your hurt Veronica I have been there. I feel for you fear that your world is not a storybook romance. I have put you both on my prayer list for wisdom and strength to meet what ever lies ahead.

Just issues to ponder.

Smiles,
Peggiann

[Cassandra]

Hello Veronica,

Welcome to Susans. It is a pleasure to finally meet you. Peggiane makes some very valid points with regard to telling or not telling the children. Too often adults underestimate their childrens ability to understand. I remember many times as a child how the adults in my life would say things like you wouldn't understand. I always thought, how can I hope to understand anything if you don't give me the chance? I remember when the movie Fantastic Voyage came out. I really wanted to see that movie. My aunt and sister went to see it but told me I couldn't go because I wouldn't understand it. When they returned she told me how good it was and that they should have taken me. Duuhhh!

The same apprehensions you have about the children finding out are very similar to the apprehensions Lisabeth had about telling you. To be sure, she should not have gone behind your back after you took her stuff and that will probably take more time to heal then the initial disclosure, but at least when you asked her to be honest she was and that is a good start. It shows she would rather be truthful than deceitful. I think she has learned her lesson and that you now have a foundation for rebuilding that will be stronger than before.

TGism is a very complex thing with many facets and colors. Everyone is different and yet the same in so many ways. There is a lot to digest and there is a lot of information here. I wish you well on your voyage of discovery. You will learn things about Lisabeth and about yourself as well. It is indeed a Fantastic Voyage. So, fix yourself a cup of tea, or other relaxing beverage, sit down, take your shoes off and set a spell.

Good Journey,

Cassie

[molly]

Hi Veronica:  It is wonderful you have joined the group and that you are on a quest to learn and understand what this all means.

You seem like a caring and loving person and I think that LisaBeth is so fortunate to have you as her SO.  I can understand your feelings about having your trust betrayed.  That is an issue many of us struggle with.  I hope to learn from you.  I have not come out to my SO at this time and am afraid to.  I know that I have to.

For me the fear of loss, the possible negative changes on my marriage, etc have paralyzed me.  Before finding support groups like Susans I always felt like a freak or some strange creature on earth.  If I had such negative feelings about myself, how in the world could anyone accept me, love me, especially my SO, family, and friends.  The irony is that often we don't tell our SO because we are afraid of losing them, but then when SO's are informed the loss of trust by not telling them often leads to the outcome we are afraid of to begin with.  I guess my point is it often feels like "I'm dammed if I do, and I'm dammed if I don't."

LisaBeth loves you very much and wants the relationship to survive.  It is a hard life, but with your support it will be easier to move forward.  Please post often because you can provide valuable insights to help others.

Molly

[veronica]

   thank you all for the warm welcome!

   i feel this forum is a wonderful support system for lisabeth as well as myself...

   peggiann and cassandra you have provided some wonderful insight -thank you for

   your input!  i think at some point we will tell the children but that is a long way off for 

   now.    I felt like new year's eve. was a turning point for us towards a new beginning 

   with out deceit ...well the wind was knocked out of my sail in the sea of life so to
   
   speak...lisabeth continues with deception...i cried myself to sleep last night-i was so
   
   distraught by the lies lisabeth continues to weave in the web of deception...i  found out

   about a major purchase ( close to $ 600) on glasses ...mind you no rx is necessary for

   lisabeth but 3 pairs of designer glasses from lenscrafters were purchased !  lisabeth

   insisted that there were not any others secrets to bring forward ...i was devastated

   but i felt we needed to talk about it last evening...well-lisabeth continued to deny of any
   
   other purchases ...the behaviors being exhibited are those of a gambler who has spun out

   control!!  due to lisabeth's past history with addiction this is a major concern to me -we
 
   can barely pay our bills monthy and the excessive charging on credit cards has to stop

   one pair of glasses would have been okay but three is over the edge!!!  if lisabeth

   continues with these impulsive risky purchases we will be without a roof over our heads!! 
 
   i can not trust lisabeth -i thought after putting the cards on the table new years eve.

   we could work towards rebuilding the foundation of our realtionship.  i think  lisabeth

   can not differentiate lies from the truth any longer it comes so naturally!!  i am a very
   
   open person who is very accepting.  i want our relationship to work and i am willing

   to work on it but like any relationship there are compromises... a step at a time!

   lisabeth's behaviors are not reality based -quite grandiose when finances are an

   issue!  the deception needs to stop if we are going to have a future together!

   thank you all for listening!  i am all cried out and needed to get this off my chest and

   vent.

   
   veronica   
     

[veronica]

  molly,

  i hope that some day you can have the courage to share your secret with your

  spouse.  if she loves you she will accept you.  i feel the deceit and betrayal are

  so destructive to a realtionship!  have you thought about therapy?  i have my

  first appt. with the therapist today.  i am hopeful this will give us the insight

  and guidance to rebuild the foundation of our relationship.

  peace and love to you molly on your journey of self discovery ...may you find the

  strength to include your spouse!

  veronica   

[Leah]

Hi Veronica,

I understand the Credit Card dictating ones life whirlwind. Not very many people can use them wisely. Checking accounts can also be a bad thing for those whom can not control urges and impulses to buy whimsically.

The shoes of not having to hide what Lisabeth is doing are new and not quite a perfect fit. Lisabeth 's gratification from CD is probably a very strong urge to purchase and create the perfect femme image as possible. Hense the impulsive buying.

Measures will need to be taken for dealing with damage control.

I sympithize with you. We have goals set that we are working toward and it is hard when one of us stray from the guide lines in budget  we chose.

Oh... I'm sorry I should have told you I'm Peggian's SO.

Leah

[Peggiann]

HI Veronica,

Now it probably feels like your in the river and someone is at the edge skipping stones in your direction just to see if you can dodge them successfully.

Here are a few things that might help.

1) You ask for communication. you have to now fine tune how to read the communication when it comes. You become better at this as you understand the special needs of Lisabeth. From what I can gather the CD get gratification from the putting the whole femme package together. Also from actually seeing the finished result on. Thus the impulsive buying to create the pack.

2) More communication. I don't know for sure but I would imagine that the guilt feelings Lisabeth may have felt in result of they New Years clearing of deceit and new path chosen. Guilt can cause depressions that manifest themselves in many ways. One to buy impulsive and in grandioso style. lots of people that suffer from depression have to learn to have safe guards for against the damage that can be done when things get out of hand. (an issue to address when not upset and angry.)

3.) Old habits die hard. A habit takes 21 times doing something corrected to desired behavior before it is truely a broken habit or pattern. If you mess up on 3 or 17 on the 21 count you start over. The good thing to know is that each time you usually get close and closer to the 21 and eventually reach it and the habit is gone. Probabley where the deceit about glasses fits in.

4.) Patients is not easy when households are effcted by one person's actions. So sorry money issues have to become a part of this all  ready hard to manage situation.

Now for some idea's to address what can keep this issue in check.

Maybe Lisabeth could get a part time job to fund that part of the needs of crossdressing. Hence not using house hold budget. Another positive to this might be if it were a fast food or convenience store type job Lisabeth might even be able to dress and meet another of the desires the CD seeks.

Also have Lisabeth have an account that only is for this side of her expenses. Change things maybe to have Lisabeth not able to get at the monies that are needed to run the family. If it's Credit cards have Lisabeth give them all up for now untill managment of impulsiveness has been met.

In any relationship it must be ballanced for Fair, Firm and Freindly for all. Be sure not to make consessions that will not be ballance equally.

Remember teaching an old dog new tricks can be done through persistance. Please don't think I'm calling Lisabeth a dog. I'm not it's just the best quote I could think of to use to get the point accross. Never loose sight of the end result you want in your relationship. It's not 50/50 give and take. Would you hire someone that only give you 50 percent on the job. I wouldn't. I want the 110 percent in put. I want what I expect to give myself. Everyone should. You deserve that. Never give up on your dreams just change the plan to get the end result if something your doing fails to continue to gain ground.

That Fair Firm and Freindly thing? People tend to get away with what ever we let them. Keep you side equal and be forgiving to be able to let go of past baggage. If you don't it will be like someone is throwing weeds back in the already weed garden row, and when left unattend the root again.

I Hope something I've pointed out maybe of help to you both.

Smiles,

Peggiann

[Peggiann]

HI Molly,

I too hope you can share this side of you with your spouse and have her come here for us to meet. We need her to to help us through as we help her cope through this new side of you. This is how we gain strength in others that we can relate to. I have shared already my thoughts on what not knowing and how devistating that can be. It is far worse that one knowing ever could be.

Molly read over your post here to Veronica. You yourself have said exactly why you must not let more time go by whithout telling her. Take courage in the love she has for you and face this part of your life together. It can possibley be more enjoyable for all concerned. Remebr lack of communication and trust are what erode away the best of marriages.

You to are on my prayer list for your courage to handle what you know you eventually must. Also for you spouse to have openness to accept you... all aspects of you.

Smiles,
Peggiann

[Kendall]

Lisabeth, (talking to Lisabeth)
You shouldnt be making $600 purchases for sunglasses, especially at this major point in your life (or any other just because thats silly). You should try to return it and concentrate on whats important. I read your earlier posts and responded with hopes that you both were trying to improve your understanding of each other and start building a bridge. That move was just plain bad, and I would even be angry at doing so. Its not a CD issue, its just basic common financial sense and relationship communication.

[Kendall]

Hi Veronica welcome,

Hope we help bring some support to you and Lisabeth.

This site has a variety of different people with a wealth of knowledge and empathy, various backgrounds, experiences, and ideas.

I hang out in the fashion and crafts section mostly, but stick my head out from time to time into respond to some posts.

[Lisabeth]

First of all I want to thank everyone for the warm welcome they have given Veronica.  I am very lucky to have a woman like her in my life, yet I continue with deceit and lies.  I know I have a problem with impulse control.  I am out of control lately.  I am trying to build a perfect package, and I have been going overboard lately. 

Maybe Lisabeth could get a part time job to fund that part of the needs of crossdressing. Hence not using house hold budget.

If it's Credit cards have Lisabeth give them all up for now untill managment of impulsiveness has been met.

I am actually working a second part time job at a home improvement store right now.  Also, Veronica asked me to give up the credit cards and I left them for her on the counter this morning.

I don't seem to have control sometimes.  I didn't go to the store to spend $600.  I just wanted to get one pair of glasses with totally clear lenses to give me a feminine look and thought it would be under $100.  I tried on about 15 pairs and had the choices narrowed down to two.  The salesgirl was so patient with me, helping me find the right pair for my face.  I decided on a pair and found out after I decided to buy them that they were $250.  Yikes I thought I can't afford these.  But I had gone that far, and knew I wouldn't have the guts for a long time to do this again.  For some reason at the last minute, in a moment of weakness, I said, "maybe I should get the other pair too".  I don't know why I did it.  I just had no self control.  When I went back to pick them up, a pair of nice sunglasses caught my eye and I said, "might as well get those as well.  They were another $60.  Again, no self control.  For some reason when I get in the Lisabeth mode, my heart pounds faster, and I have little control over myself.  It's like my male side takes a back seat, and she takes charge.  I know this is a problem that I need to work out in therapy. 
  I love my wife and it bothers me deeply that I don't have more self control, even when I know we can't afford it.  I will make this up to her no matter what it takes.  She has every right to be furious with me.  She is making steps to understand, and I turn around and do something like this.  I really messed up and I'm sorry.  Veronica has her appointment today with the therapist, and I hope it gave her a chance to get things off her chest.  Hopefully, we can get through this.  I am sincerely going to give it all I can to not make any more purchases unless she approves.  I will keep you posted.

Thanks again for the warm welcome for Veronica,

Love

Lisabeth

[Leah]

Lisabeth,

It takes a lot of charactor to admit whe you've done something wrong. That a positive. Peggiann says "Build on those positive things to become more and more like whom you want to become. Each time we do something that feels right remember what it was for and how you did it." Then do it some more.

I agree with Kendra. Take them back. Back up your statement of knowing it was wrong and take action on the other statement to make it up to her what ever it take. Take them back and get the money back and lay it with those credit cards.

Leah

[Cassandra]

Lisabeth,

Seems to me you have gamblers disease. What you describe is called chasing your losses. I know it's not quite the same thing but in a sense they are very similar. You realised that you had spent $250 dollars, then you figured I'm going to get in trouble for this so in for a penny in for a pound as the old saying goes. You let the adrenalin high take over. You have to maintain discipline. If you don't you are going to blow it if you haven't already. Get a grip and get your money back on those glasses first thing.

I do a little professional blackjack playing on the side whenever I have a stake. Which lately hasn't happened but that's another story. I say professional because I don't gamble. I play perfect blackjack with very strict betting rules. Before ever entering a casino, I practice, practice practice to make sure that I have each play down pat. I bet only what the betting strategy requires. I double when and only when I am supposed too. I play a specific amount per session and only that amount. I quit when I am supposed to quit no matter what. I have a beggining middle and end game and it works. I win or I break even and when I loose I loose very small. I don't do it a lot because it is very grueling work and I do mean work. It takes patience, concentration and most importantly discipline.

I see people at a table all the time who come into a game and seem to be playing good solid blackjack and then loose it. They start chasing loses. They let adrenaline take over and they are so certain the next hand is going to be the one when they should have quit 4 hands ago. They play with money they can't afford to loose and are hell bent to win it back. That just doesn't happen. They get wiped out because they did not stick to their limits. Sometimes you just have to get up from the table and call it a day.

I play ten sessions. If I loose three I quit and get some food and take in a show. Just not my day. But I don't loose $600. I go in with a $2000 stake and play ten sessions at $200 a piece. I have never lost more than $180 in a days work. I have won far more. The point of all this is that what I do takes great self control. And that my dear is what you are lacking.

I mentioned that I have spent a lot of time practicing. The practice is not just about rather to hit or not depending on the dealers up card it's about developing the discipline to always do the right thing when it is called for no matter what. You have to practice, you have to develop the necessary discipline to do the right thing no matter what.

When you found out the purchase was more than you could afford you should have gotten up from the table. Instead you figured you were going to get them anyway and hey might as well get these others since I can't afford them anyway. What kind of hairbrained logic is that? Then you compound the problem by concealing it and denying that you did it when confronted with the bill. This is not helping your case.

I don't say this lightly but you have a shopping disease and you'd better find a cure fast. $600! For glasses. Heck you can get two pairs of designer glasses at American Lenses for $99 and that's with Rx lenses. I have bought very cool looking sunglasses for $5. Getting a look is no excuse for spending that kind of money when you don't have it.

I've gone on long enough here. I think you get the point. Now take action and get this thing under control. I wish you the best and hope you will work hard at doing better.

Good luck,

Cassie

[Jillieann Rose]

Hi Veronica,
Glad to finally meet you. It's great that you want to find out about this side of your SO.
Lisabeth has told me that she loves you and the kids. She was excited about you join us her at Susan's.
And that she couldn't wait for all of us here to meet you.
I feel some what guilt of her buying the glasses.  :-[
Lisabeth had emailed me that she was planning on buy some glasses
Then in a later email she said that she had.
I'm sorry that she didn't tell you and that she spend all that money.
I know, I know money is tight in our household too.

Hey Lisabeth spending more then $50 dollars in our household, outside of the normal budgeted expenses, requires both SO and my agreement.
Please Sis, don't do anything like that again.
One of the best parts of shopping, besides trying on the stuff, is finding the bargains and than being able to bragging about them. Today I was out looking for new tennis shoes, (the ones I have are getting tattered there over a year old.) and I decide to get some that will work in both the male and female mode. Did find any that fit our budget so will keep looking.
As Cassandra said you can find good looking sunglasses for $5 to $15 bucks.
I know the desire (compulsion) to buy things to make yourself look more feminine.
But you can control it girl. Remember one small step at a time.

Veronica, Lisabeth and I are much alike. She is one of my sisters her at Susan's.
Remember that Lisabeth is still learning about herself. Your SO wants to share this part of self if you will accept her. I know this is hard, especial after what she did, but she needs your support and your guidance.
She is like a teenager, acting before she thinks about how it will effect others; hence the impulse buying. This is not an excuse, just a fact.
I'm sure Lisabeth would love for you to help her to be the best looking female she can.
Hope your session with the therapy was a helpful.

I'm praying for you and your family.

Jillieann

[veronica]

  hello leah, peggiann,wickham kendra, melissa girl, cassandra and jillieann!!

  ( ooh i hope i didn't leave anyone out)..

   thank you all for your wonderful feedback!  it has been insightful!

   i think the deceit and mistrust is the BIG issue that is destroying our relationship

   i can forgive but the pain is so severe -the big question is how do i trust again?

   lisabeth has an addiction history and this is spiraling out of control!!  i wanted

   lisabeth to return the big purchase to lenscrafters -this morning she is refusing to!

   i am open to exploring the cd part of her,  but this makes it very difficult if lisabeth can

   not set limits and compromise for the wellbeing of the family!  hey i don't even have

   prada designer glasses and i need rx glasses for driving!!!  the fact that the credit cards

   were " on the table" doesn't justify the purchase!!  plain and simple we can not afford

   the glasses!!!  if we were wealthy it would not matter but the principle of the matter

   is we CAN NOT afford the purchase!!!!  i am currently driving a vehicle that is over

   ten years old and has over 130,000 miles on it -it barely goes over 55 on the highway

   w/o the front end shaking...i think the priority is a new vehicle for the safety of the 
   
   so and the children!!  lisabeth was out of work for a year and a half and that has set

   us back financially.  the part time job lisabeth has helps get us back on track but with

   the impulsive spending sprees we are furthur and furthur from the track!

   i have always worked and have a career and raise the children...i work as a nurse

   on an adolescent behavioral health unit at a local hosp.  i am familiar with adolescent

   "acting out" and yes-lisabeth is behaving like an irrational teenager!!  the bigger

    issue is the addiction piece and the manipulative deceitful behavior!!!  the

    therapist appt. went well ( perfect timing after another deceitful act of lisabeths!!)

    i am very hurt and can only handle so much i feel like my heart has been ripped out

    and lisabeth is using it as a yo-yo!  i tend to be a nurturer and tend to everyones
   
    needs but my own.  i need to recharge my batteries and stay healthy -i decided to  

    start painting again and going to museums ( i am a nurse but art is my first love)

    i am hoping that lisabeth and i can take the necessary steps to rebuild our relationship.

    i can not be an enabler any longer -limits have to be set and the deceit i can no longer

    tolerate!  we have our first session together with the therapist coming up.  this morning

    when i dicussed limits -the response i received "you are not going to set limits on me"

    " you are so controlling"...that hurt...i am trying to rebuild this relationship!  lisabeth

     has come from a controlling emotionally abusive upbringing ( his mother) so his response

     was defensive.

    jillieann i hope some day you find the strength to include your wife on your journey.

    deceit is what can destroy a relationship.  i also was brought up in christian family

    (catholic). but  i am a very open person with an artisitic adventurous spirit.

     diversity is what makes our world so wonderful.  love and acceptance can make

     a relationship stronger deceit can destroy it!!!!

     love and peace to all,

    veronica
             

[Peggiann]

Veronica,

Hug time. Wrap your arms around yourself and sqeeze hard and say I love me out loud. You need to be kind to yourself now too.

Sorry to hear Lisabeth's words are empty and meaningless. Here in the forum we have to at first, take what someone says at face value, trusting that they are in fact who they profess to be and do what they say they will do.

"I love my wife and it bothers me deeply that I don't have more self control, even when I know we can't afford it.  I will make this up to her no matter what it takes.  She has every right to be furious with me. "

In my eyes if Lisabeth doesn't keep her/his word and  live up to the words from that post then I would have trouble trusting also.

Lisabeth Your Word is the most important thing you have control over in life. It's one of the more important things that is part of your charactor. If your word is no good then neither would a written contract be. It's the person behind the spoken word that keeps a contract. What you wrote in the post is like a contract. You put it in writing and sign your name to it.

Veronica You are right.
i need to recharge my batteries and stay healthy -i decided to 

    start painting again and going to museums ( i am a nurse but art is my first love)

When you pour all there is from the pitcher and then share that from your personal glass too and no one sees that the pitcher stay full you can't keep giving. You'll have nothing left to give.

There are givers and takers in this world and then there are those that do both. It's the latter of the 3 that makes a good marriage. I'm going to share some wise words shared with me once.


Never be angry at the same time.
Never yell at each other unless the house is on fire.
If one has to win an argument let it be your mate.
If you have to criticize, do it lovingly.
Never bring up mistakes of the past.
Neglect the whole world rather than each other.
Never go to sleep with an argument unsettled.
At least once a day say one kind thing to your life's partner.
When you have done something wrong, be ready to admit it and ask for forgiveness.
It takes two to have a quarel and the one in the wrong is the one who does the most talking.
Always Always state the issues TRUTHFULLY!

The one on past mistakes can be challenging. It can be what stands in the way of healing and moving on in life. Hence hard to trust again.

If one does something wrong and are truely sorry and want to be forgiven for it, then they have to be willing to make it right or they have no business asking forgieness of the other.

When arguements settled then they are over done with. Settled means, the confession, the fix to make it right and then the forgiveness rendered. Without the fix the hurt remains. The offence is still offencive and remains a wrongfull act and the offened still remain offended. The confession becomes " rubbing-it-in". The forgiveness rendered and yet still brought up again becomes a whippingstick to punish more and not forgiveness at all.

Leah says, "Your not going win in an arguement everytime, so pick the ones that are important to you and don't back down untill you've accomplished your end result." In other words, it better be worth it to stay up all night and finish and settle. Or nobody sleeps. But "I have to work tomorrow" you say. To bad nothing is more important than harmony in your marriage. I say get started earlier.

What about consessions? Don't ever settle for less than you can live with. It will only leave the issues to reserface.

When you have a marriage, no one gets to have what they want by themselves if the family doesn't have what they need first. When you married that's what you said "I do" to. Your home, your kids and all it takes to keep it a float come first.

If there is a break down in this. Then it needs fixed and got back on course. The impulsive disorder can not be an excuss. That is what it becomes with the glasses when Lisabeth is not willing to take them back. If it was the disorder problem that caused the action then it should be simple and easy to take them back so be honest with yourself. You wanted them on a beer pocket book and champaign tastes don't make sence. So why would you want to keep them now that you know why you bought them in the first place if it weren't for other motives than implusive buying. It wasn't inpulsive acording to Jillieanne's post. The last one of those helpful hints now covered. I'll hush for a while now.

Hope you have a better today and tomorrow. I hope your therapy will solve some of these issues too. Lisabeth has to have help with these issues in the therapy. Know that it isn't going to get fixed over night. Just keep your chins up both of you.

Smiles,
Peggiann