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What was it like to lose male privilege?

Started by MisterQueer, May 27, 2016, 10:25:50 PM

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Sarah leah

I am just happy in live in a generation that does not feel concerned with the antiquated social experiment that was feminism. We spent 20 mins on it in Psychology looking at second wave and maybe 30 mins in Social work looking at third wave then it was ignored.

I think personally privilege is not a concern for most people now a days as it is an assumption based on a desire to achieve or not. My boss is female, my mother is one of the leading Psychologists in the world doing research and policy making for the government currently. I was born intersex and lived for 5 years in my late teens as a woman and I was not treated any different apart from a few drunk guys who I told to grow up, otherwise I was treated like everyone else.

This is my perception so I can only talk for mine and the women I know as I am sure in other countries it might be different.


A straight line may be the shortest distance between two points, but it is by no means the most interesting
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RobynD

To me feminism is simply advocacy for equal rights and i am definitely a feminist. That equality is still not here for us and requires continued work. I see nothing obsolete about it all. Indeed when women have reach parity in pay, executive management, and political representation, there will still be work to do.

We still need an ERA and we need to make sure that equal rights are written into the constitution for sexual orientation and gender identify/expression. Leaving such things to state governments is always unwise.


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April_TO

It was night and day. I have noticed the social dynamic changing slowly as I have integrated myself deeper into my transition. Men can either be respectful or treat you like a second class human being no joke. With women, they would either ignore you coz they don't see you as a competition or they will just be plain nasty.

Nothing ventured nothing gained
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Soli

Quote from: RobynD on May 28, 2016, 09:42:12 PM
To me feminism is simply advocacy for equal rights and i am definitely a feminist. That equality is still not here for us and requires continued work. I see nothing obsolete about it all. Indeed when women have reach parity in pay, executive management, and political representation, there will still be work to do.

so am I, a feminist
Yes!!! !!  lots of work to do still but,

Quote from: Sarah leah on May 28, 2016, 09:29:14 PM
I am just happy in live in a generation that does not feel concerned with the antiquated social experiment that was feminism. We spent 20 mins on it in Psychology looking at second wave and maybe 30 mins in Social work looking at third wave then it was ignored.

I think personally privilege is not a concern for most people now a days as it is an assumption based on a desire to achieve or not. My boss is female, my mother is one of the leading Psychologists in the world doing research and policy making for the government currently. I was born intersex and lived for 5 years in my late teens as a woman and I was not treated any different apart from a few drunk guys who I told to grow up, otherwise I was treated like everyone else.

This is my perception so I can only talk for mine and the women I know as I am sure in other countries it might be different.

I agree that the new generation is very much less affected by the male dominance system that ruled us for tooooo long  >:(

and yes, it's very much a matter of perceptions... all of what we are (I mean humans)
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.Christy

I don't think I had much to begin with other than safety and invisibility; i felt like an average person. HOWEVER, I definitely gained more than what I lost when i started to transition and i do have to say i miss being left alone. I'm still not used to all the ogling, catcalls, and attention. Nowadays guys are opening doors and stopping the elevator doors for me, and generally treating me like im some fragile thing (even though i am small as heck). Overall, I feel like I've unlocked more privileges now as a female. People come up and talk to me more, are more touchy-feely and socializing seems to be more smooth.
My life doesn't exist in this lifetime.


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Lynne

In the last few years I mostly present as a woman and I can clearly see how people's expectations change when they see a woman. People are generally nicer to me but they expect less of me in typically male dominated fields.

It can be quite funny(and sometimes annoying) when I dress feminine and go into a DIY store or filling station everybody offers me help because they don't expect me to know technical stuff. When I go to similar places dressed as a man(usually after work) people treat my like they believe I know what I'm doing.

My girlfriend experiences the same thing in airsoft gun shops recently. She was looking for an exact model but none of the shops had it and all of the shops tried to sell her a clearly inferior model instead, believing she wouldn't know the difference. That never happened before her transition.

And I could go on and on as I know a lot of MTF girls here and every one of them experienced similar things.

A lot of men here still think that women can't be as smart as men. I heard them say that when I was presenting as male.
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Soli

Quote from: Lynne on May 29, 2016, 07:03:54 AM
A lot of men here still think that women can't be as smart as men. I heard them say that when I was presenting as male.

you say here... it's  Everywhere!   :icon_blah:

I realized recently so many men think that. I thought we had gone forward... we did a step, maybe. They talk to me as if I'm one of them haha... whaaaat? Then I argue and try to find out why they think that...

...lots of work to do
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Eva Marie

As a "beta" somewhat effeminate male I never experienced the full benefits of male privilege.

Now that I've transitioned I've noticed now that men will just talk over me in meetings, men don't listen to me even though I'm the SME on the project, misogyny is happening, and women seem to be more critical of me. I also notice that I'm assumed incompetent until proven otherwise.

On the plus side of the ledger men are much nicer, doors are held for me, men offer to lift and move heavy things for me, and women are far more friendly and chatty. Conversations with women even veer off into 100% female areas like periods and pregnancies.

It also seems like I must work a lot harder and I must produce better work to stay at my current position whereas before it was almost a given.
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RobynD

Quote from: Soli on May 29, 2016, 08:58:08 AM
you say here... it's  Everywhere!   :icon_blah:

I realized recently so many men think that. I thought we had gone forward... we did a step, maybe. They talk to me as if I'm one of them haha... whaaaat? Then I argue and try to find out why they think that...

...lots of work to do

...meanwhile women are exceeding men in educational performance and in many metrics relating to education.


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sparrow

There's two sides to privilege; internal and external. External privilege is in how people deal with you.  Internal privilege is how you interpret and react to the actions of others.  When somebody says "It's all in your head," they're failing to understand the mechanisms behind internal privilege.  We hear stories about women, for example, being taken less seriously, and see it happen with our own eyes.  So, when we see evidence of that, we react to it.  Sometimes it is purely up in our heads, but it's completely irrational to just accept that as a justification for every bit of evidence we see.

When our lived experience is denied to our faces, it makes is question our experiences.  It's beyond frustrating, and makes it even harder to trust that people care, or that they're willing to listen.  It makes us feel more alone, more invalidated, less worthy... and entirely reinforces the cultural norm.  And then, we react -- we go along to get along, because it's just not worth a fight some days, especially when the evidence from yesterday shows that we won't be taken seriously in that fight.

However... one blindly act as though they have privilege.  It can work.  This is a superpower that transwomen can hone -- you were raised as a man... if you continue to act as though you have the privilege of a man, people might surprise you.  Of course some of those surprises will be bad.  But if you continue to act as though you have privilege, you're setting an example.  Others will see that, and hopefully we can help establish a new norm.
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Lyric

"Male privilege"? What an awful concept. People who discriminate because of gender have no place in my life if I can in any way remove them.

You remind me of times in my life when I (regrettably) had a very "normal" Caucasian male appearance, though. I would sometimes find myself around guys who would discuss women and ethnic minorities in a derogatory way. I suppose this served as a signal to me that I was doing something wrong. Growing long hair and dressing in a more androgynous manner seemed to eliminate such experiences. I suspect I now am the subject of such persons' mutterings from time to time, but that's fine with me. I'd rather be the brunt of their bigoted disdain than to be incorrectly considered one of their ilk.
"Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life." - Steve Jobs
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Michelle69Elizabeth

I have been thinking about this since seeing the thread.

I can't see that I ever had male privilege. I was seperate from everyone but not excluded. The closest I can come to something that would describe my interactions with people; I had to be accounted for. I had no intention in joining in and no one ever made an effort to include me. Could have been my fault. Even with the few friends I had I was not part of the hierarchy. I personally have never been picked on, made fun of or harassed but all of my friends were. By the time I hit puberty I was so messed up that I felt uncomfortable with everyone. I was so very different than everyone else, I knew that even if no one else did. A friend once said after getting to know me, that he thought that I was a snob when I first came there. After getting to know me he knew that nothing could be further from the truth. I think that it was my fear of people finding out what I was really like that kept me on my island. So I don't think that male privilege was something that I ever experienced.

That being said, things have definitely changed. I have never had anyone pay attention to me or maybe be attentive would be the right word. Girls tried when I was younger but wow did that make me uncomfortable. I was so worried about hurting their feelings but more worried that it would get worse if I didn't do something. So I would distance myself from them and by the time I was sixteen I stopped being friends with girls completely. That was thirty years ago. :) But guys, oh my god! Even the ones at work and they KNOW that I was not born a girl, they have been watching me transition after all :) , make an effort to get my attention. I find that I don't mind in the least. ;)

Privilege I am not so sure of but yes things have changed. For the better really even if it can be too much at times. Of course things were going to change. That was the whole point right? If it is in ways that I didn't expect, well that's okay, it doesn't define me and can't chain me to their rules unless I let it.

We, as a species, have outgrown our evolution. Our society doesn't need the outdated programs inside of us that were once a biological imperative. So we have the 'male privilege' that probably most people think is bogus anyway. But... I LIKE the way men and women treat me now. Women accepting me as one of them and men pursuing me seems right. If I've lost anything at all, I have gained soooo much more.  :)
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Katiebelle

I don't care about male privilege. Women have privileges too and this woman never got to grow up the way she should have. I'm happy with my female privilege today

Sent from my BLU STUDIO X using Tapatalk

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Sarah leah

Female privilege is everywhere in society and is a indisputable fact that I am slowly starting to embrace daily. I have not even started hrt yet and I get it over the phone or through everyday interactions due to people being uncertain "is it a boy, is it a girl." I see it at work a dozen times a day when males enter the building and are set upon as perpetrators of rape and violence, even when statically men get raped more, assaulted more and segregated in social setting more due to notions of gender bias. I might only have one PhD currently to my name but I gained it for a reason and it was not because of the benefits of third wave misandry, it was because I had to fight to gain it in a educational system designed to gate keep those perceived as a threat to change. (I like a challenge just like my mum :) ) Of course I identify as female and have the extra X's to keep the TERF at bay meaning as a consequence that I do indeed get to see the issues some of our gender face. I often feel upset when some older males' in there late 40s treat the women I work with like dirt by saying rude comments from "hey love =insert creepy comments about bums or breasts= to straight-out whispers of sexually explicit terms.

That said they are few and far between often being relegated to the front bars of some dingy bar in Fremantle or Hackham West along with the other greasy 1970s born perverts and degenerates that somehow have coerced others into breeding the next batch of Darwin award winners.

Some people might read this and state I know nothing about patriarchy or feminism but trust me when I say that having Julie Bindel as your blood relative helps to define a lot about you More so when you are used as an example to satisfy the nepotism of others within a subgroup.

She is mean by the way in real life and not just in newspaper articles or at rallies. In 2015 for example she told my mother on the phone that she had failed as a woman by allowing that "->-bleeped-<- male" to pretend -it- is a woman when it is just a male freak looking to rape women.")

However, as an ideology it has done some fantastic things in its infancy which should never be forgotten or overshadowed by the eugeni-centric views of a select few hate mongers.

/waits to be yelled at or down voted for being a fourth waver :(



A straight line may be the shortest distance between two points, but it is by no means the most interesting
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FrancisAnn

For me I never cared at all about any male privilege.......Being a nice woman is a so much nicer way of life, softer, more kind, more caring......., more love. As a nice woman men always treated me nice, some where a little rough but not too bad. I would not want life any other way than to be female.......
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving
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warlockmaker

I'm an Alpha female and have more financial power that 99.99 pct of men and they know it.  I demand respect and get it. It's just how you come across. .I'm also one mean fighter and will not take any of their crap.

Men who look down on me soon regret it and I enjoy watching their balls shrivel up ....lol
When we first start our journey the perception and moral values all dramatically change in wonderment. As we evolve further it all becomes normal again but the journey has changed us forever.

SRS January 21st,  2558 (Buddhist calander), 2015
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Sarah leah

Quote from: warlockmaker on May 30, 2016, 08:50:42 AM
I'm an Alpha female and have more financial power that 99.99 pct of men and they know it.  I demand respect and get it. It's just how you come across. .I'm also one mean fighter and will not take any of their crap.

Men who look down on me soon regret it and I enjoy watching their balls shrivel up ....lol

You are what I aspire to be when I become the office alpha because at 5 foot 9 I do not mind looking most people in the eye and saying, "You need to rethink that my dear."

:icon_geekdance:


A straight line may be the shortest distance between two points, but it is by no means the most interesting
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barbie

Quote from: Soli on May 29, 2016, 08:58:08 AM
you say here... it's  Everywhere!   :icon_blah:

Yes. Here it is, too.

Fatal stabbing fuels concern over gender violence in S. Korea

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/afp/article-3600484/Fatal-stabbing-fuels-concern-gender-violence-S-Korea.html

But, I like to add that a young woman can walk safely alone at mid-night in any street of Seoul. I also sometimes walk alone at mid-night on high heels here, and have never met any threatening moment.

barbie~~
Just do it.
  • skype:barbie?call
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FrancisAnn

Quote from: warlockmaker on May 30, 2016, 08:50:42 AM
I'm an Alpha female and have more financial power that 99.99 pct of men and they know it.  I demand respect and get it. It's just how you come across. .I'm also one mean fighter and will not take any of their crap.

Men who look down on me soon regret it and I enjoy watching their balls shrivel up ....lol
Good for you Ms. War Lock. I like a man that is confident in his manhood, a well endowed man but that does not brag about it. A man that can go play golf while I go shopping, do my nails....cook a nice dinner then enjoy a romantic evening together......A man that will take charge in the bedroom so I can just enjoy being myself, a woman. Being desired to me in one of the nicest things about being female. Most men rarely even give me a hard time or express any "crap" toward me. But I tell them up early to treat me nice or I'm not the right woman or person for them, no rough play, just nice sex together..... Oh well my $.02 worth.
mtF, mid 50's, always a girl since childhood, HRT (Spiro, E & Fin.) since 8-13. Hormone levels are t at 12 & estrogen at 186. Face lift & eye lid surgery in 2014. Abdominoplasty/tummy tuck & some facial surgery May, 2015. Life is good for me. Love long nails & handsome men! Hopeful for my GRS & a nice normal depth vagina maybe by late summer. 5' 8", 180 pounds, 14 dress size, size 9.5 shoes. I'm kind of an elegant woman & like everything pink, nice & neet. Love my nails & classic Revlon Red. Moving back to Florida, so excited but so much work moving
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