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Non-binary or FtM?

Started by mischief_brew, April 18, 2017, 04:27:26 PM

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mischief_brew

Hi,

I'm pretty new to all this, although have been on and off experimenting with my gender presentation, as it were, for about a year now. I bind whenever I go out or see friends, unless it feels too uncomfortable (still haven't got used to feeling constricted for too long a period) in which case I layer up and wear a sports bra or something that is as flattening as possible. I've also recently changed my name to a gender neutral one and have stopped wearing anything overly feminine, although I still get read as female most of the time.

I can't work out whether I would feel happier if I just decided to go all the way to being male, even though most of the time I don't really identify strongly with either gender, as I lean towards the male side more and definitely do not like being seen as female. I get major dysphoria when showering or changing, and I hate it when people comment on my appearance (when they're seeing me as female). I don't know if it's because I feel like being non-binary or agender isn't recognised as much but I feel like I'm forever going to get called 'she' and referred to as a woman unless I present overwhelmingly male (and go down the hormone/surgery route). I know this is a stupid reason to want to be male and there are times when I genuinely feel more comfortable with that idea for more legitimate reasons, but in the back of my mind I'm still thinking "well, you're not really male either are you?" and I just end up even more confused.

Is this what being non-binary means? Forever being confused? I don't know what I'm supposed to do...I just want to stop people seeing me as female and I don't know how... It's making me really depressed and I have a lot of mental health issues which I think are interrelated.   :-\

Sorry to make such a whiny first post! Hope some one can give me some insight into how they knew they identified non-binary rather than trans. I'm still not sure where I fit.
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FTMax

I'm not non-binary, so take this with a grain of salt.

You're binding, you changed your name to something not feminine, you stopped dressing overly feminine, you do not like being seen as female, you get dysphoria when undressed, and you don't like people seeing you as female or calling you she. These are all taken directly from your post. So it's femininity that you have an issue with. It seems like the real question is, how much masculinity are you comfortable with?

My suggestion would be to present more masculinely and see if that helps you. Everything up until hormones is something that you can stop doing if it isn't to your liking. Maybe try packing. I'd also suggest talking to a therapist about it. They can maybe ask some more questions that would guide you towards an answer or at least some other things to try to test things out.
T: 12/5/2014 | Top: 4/21/2015 | Hysto: 2/6/2016 | Meta: 3/21/2017

I don't come here anymore, so if you need to get in touch send an email: maxdoeswork AT protonmail.com
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Elis

I identify as roughly 90% male and the rest agender. Bcos my brain is wired mostly male I need T to stop the crippling dysphoria. I feel a whole lot better being referred to as male but still feel slightly dysphoric bcos I'm not seen as agender. I don't pack due to it causing more dysphoria as it caused extra focus in that area. I bind and planning top surgery as I have a lot of dysporia in that area and always have done but don't think I'll ever bother with bottom surgery. Growing a penis from T is enough atm.

For me T is the best compromise. There are some physical changes I like and some I don't. Having a fem gender expression but not having an androgynous looking body is hard to deal with sometimes but I'm I also feel a lot more content in a more masculine looking body. Plus I knew after taking T my mental state had hugely improved so I knew for sure I needed to keep taking it. When like a lot of trans people I wasn't 100% positive, more like 99%. I know I don't need to take T forever. Maybe I'll stop years from now but atm I'm content which is what's truly important. If you're unsure take it for 3 months and then stop if you want. You won't have any real permanent effects.
They/them pronouns preferred.



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FTMax

Quote from: Elis on April 18, 2017, 05:53:10 PM
If you're unsure take it for 3 months and then stop if you want. You won't have any real permanent effects.

Plenty of changes from T can occur in the first three months that are permanent. This is not good advice IMO.
T: 12/5/2014 | Top: 4/21/2015 | Hysto: 2/6/2016 | Meta: 3/21/2017

I don't come here anymore, so if you need to get in touch send an email: maxdoeswork AT protonmail.com
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SailorMars1994

Quote from: FTMax on April 18, 2017, 09:48:45 PM
Plenty of changes from T can occur in the first three months that are permanent. This is not good advice IMO.

Hey FTMax. I havent a clue what transmen go through. Could you tell me what happens to they on 3 months of T?? I know of three months of E minimal things happen... 6 months seems to be the golden time and smooth sailings after that xD :laugh:
AMAB Born: March 1994
Gender became on radar: 2007
Admitted to self : 2010
Came out: May 12 2014
Estrogen: October 16 2015
<3
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cinderkaburagi

I've thought about this too, and I have yet to go to therapy. For now it's been better to say I'm genderfluid than FTM because I'm unsure. At the same time I feel there's a fine line between being non-binary and FTM and it's hard to say what that line is exactly. I know I want to get top surgery, but that's it.

Going to therapy doesn't sound like a terrible idea. I'm going next month because that was first available appointment. I don't expect to get any answers in the first session either since it's going to be used to get to know me as a person before we can make a step towards any progress.
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Elis

Quote from: FTMax on April 18, 2017, 09:48:45 PM
Plenty of changes from T can occur in the first three months that are permanent. This is not good advice IMO.

Sorry should have explained further. At 3 months what usually has happened is your voice will become slightly low and raspy but it'll still be within a female range. The clit will be slightly developed but it'll be s hardly noticeable difference. Plus I'm guessing you may grow slightly taller if you're still going through female puberty.
They/them pronouns preferred.



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FTMax

Quote from: SailorMars1994 on April 18, 2017, 09:54:51 PM
Quote from: FTMax on April 18, 2017, 09:48:45 PM
Plenty of changes from T can occur in the first three months that are permanent. This is not good advice IMO.

Hey FTMax. I havent a clue what transmen go through. Could you tell me what happens to they on 3 months of T?? I know of three months of E minimal things happen... 6 months seems to be the golden time and smooth sailings after that xD :laugh:

Permanent changes on T include:

- Voice would stay wherever it has dropped to. At least half the guys I've spoken to have started experiencing a vocal shift within the first month on T, some of which were fairly dramatic. Personally my voice was out of the female range by the end of 3 months.

- Body hair that has filled in will continue to grow but new hair won't appear. How early this starts to happen varies, and may be dependent on genetics.

- Downstairs growth will stay at the size it has grown to. This is also one of the changes that typically start to appear in the first month and as early as the first week for some guys.

- If you lose head hair or your hairline recedes, it will not come back if you stop T. You can stop further loss by stopping T. My hairline changed within the first six months on T and that seems pretty par for the course.

Everything else is not permanent and could be reversed by stopping T. So if this is something OP is considering, I would take some time to look into every possible effect of T and then make a decision. I will also say that I experienced all of these changes on what is considered "low dose HRT". Obviously YMMV, but I would not go into HRT with the idea that if it isn't for you, you can be "back to normal" in three months.

T in general is a harsher hormone than estrogen. While I think it is commonplace for many MTF ladies to start HRT prior to coming out and telling people because it is more easily hidden, FTM guys generally don't have that luxury. I'd say you have 6 months tops before someone notices, 3 to be on the safe side.
T: 12/5/2014 | Top: 4/21/2015 | Hysto: 2/6/2016 | Meta: 3/21/2017

I don't come here anymore, so if you need to get in touch send an email: maxdoeswork AT protonmail.com
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SailorMars1994

Thanks for the info ^^, was always curious about how it goes on the other side

Hugs-Ashley
AMAB Born: March 1994
Gender became on radar: 2007
Admitted to self : 2010
Came out: May 12 2014
Estrogen: October 16 2015
<3
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Rowena_Ellenweorc

Thanks for posting this... this is very similar to the struggle I'm going through...  I'm still doing a lot of internet research on this, and trying to research best gender therapists in my area that are on my insurance.  For me, I'm currently just saying I'm genderfluid while I decide if maybe there is more to it, and maybe I am FTM.  Though I do still use female pronouns, because I'm not entirely 'out' yet.  Online people generally know, but personal life, not so much.

Personally, I agree too with this statement - I am definitely in the future going for top surgery, but I want to lose weight first, and figure out finances, and stuff like that before I do anything.EG
Quote from: cinderkaburagi on April 18, 2017, 10:28:37 PM
I've thought about this too, and I have yet to go to therapy. For now it's been better to say I'm genderfluid than FTM because I'm unsure. At the same time I feel there's a fine line between being non-binary and FTM and it's hard to say what that line is exactly. I know I want to get top surgery, but that's it.

Going to therapy doesn't sound like a terrible idea. I'm going next month because that was first available appointment. I don't expect to get any answers in the first session either since it's going to be used to get to know me as a person before we can make a step towards any progress.
~Ren

Born May 1989 - Assigned Female
October 2016 - Came out to self/online
Feb/March 2017 - Officially came out to husband
April 2017 - Realized I'm Non-Binary
June 2017 - Started Therapy
August 2017 - Came out to parents
October 2017 - modified FB profile
November 26, 2017 - Came out https://www.facebook.com/notes/karen-ren-losee/please-read/10155966104353223/ on FB

"Walking beside the guilty and the innocent
How will you raise your hand when they call your name?"
- Bon Jovi "We weren't Born to follow"

I am done crying over not being feminine.
I am done griping about being too masculine.
I will be me.
And that's a non-binary being.
I am... ME!

....

This... is MY story
The story of a girl trapped in a guy's body.
A boy trapped in a girl's body.
No.  Its the story of a... human being.
- From one of my poems
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TransAm

Yeah, my voice definitely didn't just get 'slightly low' within three months. It dropped hard like an axe to the throat and I had no issues being gendered male over the phone about a month and a half in. By three months, I was on the lower end of the adult male range. I often do the voices of people when I'm telling stories for extra flair and my fiancée joked that I sounded like a man attempting to poorly imitate a woman's voice.
This is a huge hurdle MTF's face (arguably the most difficult) so take that into consideration. If it significantly drops and you plan on presenting as female again at any point, be prepared to do voice training exercises or possible surgery just like an MTF would.

The thing is, HRT is such a mixed bag. Some people get slammed with effects fairly quickly and others see less immediate results. Think back to high school: Some of the guys were super tall, bulky and hairy while some of the others were still baby-faced and slight. You just flat-out don't know what you're going to get out of it until you jump down the rabbit hole  no matter how many stories from other people you read.

My advice to you would be to do some serious soul searching. If your end goal is to be seen and read as male, HRT will absolutely get you there. What do you want from this life?
"I demolish my bridges behind me - then there is no choice but forward." - Fridtjof Nansen
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