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Passing in the eyes of others but not yourself

Started by Amoré, July 09, 2017, 09:44:10 AM

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Amoré

I have had issue with myself for a while that transitioning feels like a never ending pit. In the eyes of others I pass as a woman and I leave them in awe when I tell them I am trans but the moment I look at myself I just see all these reasons why I don't pass. I can make a list of things I want to change and they can bother me when interacting with people and I end up making excuses for my voice bigger hands. I am still struggling to shake of bulk from when I was body building although my body feminized a lot with hrt I still carry so much unnecessary bulk. People tell me my voice is passable and husky I just sound totally fake to myself.

I end up telling a person I am transgender because my child calls me papa. Because of my voice and because I want to tell them before they guess something is up with this woman standing in front of them. I get bad social anxiety because of this and tend to steer away from social events because of it.  :embarrassed:


Excuse me for living
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tgirlamg

#1
Quote from: Amoré on July 09, 2017, 09:44:10 AM
I have had issue with myself for a while that transitioning feels like a never ending pit. In the eyes of others I pass as a woman and I leave them in awe when I tell them I am trans but the moment I look at myself I just see all these reasons why I don't pass. I can make a list of things I want to change and they can bother me when interacting with people and I end up making excuses for my voice bigger hands. I am still struggling to shake of bulk from when I was body building although my body feminized a lot with hrt I still carry so much unnecessary bulk. People tell me my voice is passable and husky I just sound totally fake to myself.

I end up telling a person I am transgender because my child calls me papa. Because of my voice and because I want to tell them before they guess something is up with this woman standing in front of them. I get bad social anxiety because of this and tend to steer away from social events because of it.  :embarrassed:


Hi Amore!!!

I totally understand because I have the same feelings all the time but I think I have done enough battle with the feelings to get them under control to a much more manageable degree... I am a detail oriented person by nature so the details that aren't 100% where I want them to be can scream at me with increasing intensity if I allow them to....in the last year I have made huge strides towards keeping a good perspective on things... Accepting the things that can't be changed and setting them aside off my list of worries because worrying about things that cannot be changed gets us absolutely nothing... My hands are the size they are...My shoulders are wider than I would like etc etc....

I guess when wrestling with this stuff, I came to a point where I viewed these as obstacles to my complete happiness that had to be dealt with by a new perspective because I had come so far towards being happy... I wasn't going to let a few final obstacles stand in my way!!!! Being constantly self critical is a trap that can be difficult to escape and had become a recipe for misery.

Getting a new mindset will get you far sister!!!! My New Years resolution for 2016 was to be more gentle with myself and putting it into a promise to myself really helped!!! I hope you find a way that works for you sister and don't let this stuff keep you from engaging with people, the world and life itself.... That's what we are here for!!!! :)!!!!!!


Onward we go brave sister!!!!

Ashley :)
"To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment" ... Ralph Waldo Emerson 🌸

"The individual has always had to struggle from being overwhelmed by the tribe... But, no price is too high for the privilege of owning yourself" ... Rudyard Kipling 🌸

Let go of the things that no longer serve you... Let go of the pretense of the false persona, it is not you... Let go of the armor that you have worn for a lifetime, to serve the expectations of others and, to protect the woman inside... She needs protection no longer.... She is tired of hiding and more courageous than you know... Let her prove that to you....Let her step out of the dark and feel the light upon her face.... amg🌸

Ashley's Corner: https://www.susans.org/index.php/topic,247549.0.html 🌻
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Lynne

I can totally relate to what you described Amoré, the social anxiety is all too familiar as well. Lots of the times, being trans feels like we have to fight a hopeless battle to just be ourselves, which seems to be a given for most of the "normal" people.
Lot of cis women have an endless list of things that they want to change on their body, that is not unusual.

As we usually have to work a lot more to have the desired body, we are even more critical about our own appearance and we can set the bar of our self-acceptance so high that we can never feel secure.

Some of the things we worry about can be corrected with surgeries, hormones and time but not all of them. As many wrote here, women come in all shapes and sizes. There isn't a day when I don't see women in the city who have many features that are not considered feminine, some of them have worse voice than me but nobody thinks that they are trans and they seem to be happily living their lives.
If everybody seems to accept you as a woman you have to learn to accept yourself as a woman with all of your flaws as well and I think your trans history is not anyone else's business until there is a very good reason to reveal it.


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jentay1367

I feel you, Amore. I get the whole thing that women have things they can't change. I get that we all have issues. But women don't have the same issues in the sense that although they may have big hands, they aren't mans hands, big arms may be large but not a man's arms. Broad shoulders...but not a man's shoulders. So I fight with that too. I'm not sure where the answer lies. Self acceptance I suppose. Easier to say than internalize. I think, although I don't know, that some of that hump of self acceptance will come with GCS. I suspect seeing yourself in the mirror sans "that" may very well go a long way towards self acceptance. I'm certainly hoping it will. Because I get told I look fine and pass as well....but one look in the mirror has me focusing on "his" attributes that stubbornly will not die and not  giving myself props for my attributes that I'm fine or even overjoyed with. I look forward to being through with this process to the degree that I've done all I can. I hope at that point I can walk away from his ghost and can say, I've done what I can, it's time to accept where I am and allow my mind the freedom to simply be pleased with the woman I've become.
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JoanneB

Seems like you cannot accept the fact that others accept the fact you are You. Yes, you are pro-active in being upfront about yourself. Rightfully so. You are doing all the right things as I see it.

Still, your old friends of Shame & Guilt, just as mine, try to convince you otherwise. I'll spare us both the long litany of reasons to justify your, as well my own, pain.

They both controlled your life for way too long and now see they are loosing their grip. They grasp at anything they know that will affect you. Anything to drag you down to where they feel you belong.

Even without the dangly bits you still are you. The you of yesterday is what, in some ways, enabled you to take the chances you did. You are the totality of you. You were always the person you are today, just still in her shell.

I cannot be ashamed of much of the past "Me". Without him I couldn't be the real person I am today.
.          (Pile Driver)  
                    |
                    |
                    ^
(ROCK) ---> ME <--- (HARD PLACE)
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Lady Sarah

That is what we mean when we say "I am my own worst critic". I seem to pass perfectly wherever I go. I don't want to make a scene, and know how to act like a lady wherever I go. Yet, in the back of my mind, I know my own flaws, whether or not others see them.
It is possible to live a normal life with flaws only you seem to notice. I have done it for decades.
started HRT: July 13, 1991
orchi: December 23, 1994
trach shave: November, 1998
married: August 16, 2015
Back surgery: October 20, 2016
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itsApril

Quote from: Amoré on July 09, 2017, 09:44:10 AM
. . . I can make a list of things I want to change and they can bother me when interacting with people and I end up making excuses for my voice bigger hands. I am still struggling to shake of bulk from when I was body building although my body feminized a lot with hrt I still carry so much unnecessary bulk. People tell me my voice is passable and husky I just sound totally fake to myself. . . . I get bad social anxiety because of this and tend to steer away from social events because of it.  :embarrassed:

Welcome to the world of womanhood.  Cis women can tell you all about this.  Here's an exercise for you to try: Go to google and type in the phrase "I hate my breasts."  I just did this search a minute ago and google returned 2,390,000 hits in 0.38 seconds.  The huge majority of the hits are cis women stressing over their appearance.  I have no doubt you would get comparable search results if you asked about hips, hands, voice, or anything else you might plug in.

Lady Sarah put her finger on it.  We are our own harshest critics.  This is true for most people, but it hits with special impact and cruelty on trans people, because of our history of gender identity issues.

We are deeply aware of our own flaws.  But most people (trust me on this!) are pretty oblivious to all the specific features of others they meet.  There's no such thing as purely male or purely female figures or features or characteristics.  All of us fall somewhere on a continuum with respect to build, height, weight, speaking range, masculinity/femininity, breast size, muscle development, fat distribution, hair and skin texture, etc.  For each characteristic you worry about in yourself, you can find a cis woman who falls farther on the "male" side of the spectrum than you do.  But she is still recognized by everyone as being a woman.

When we meet a new person, we tend to make an initial conclusion in a fraction of a second whether this new person is male or female.  We don't go through a conscious process of rating this person on a male to female scale on dozens of specific characteristics.  We don't think "I think this is a woman, but why does she have a raspy voice?"  Because in this big world, lots of women DO have raspy voices.  Or big shoulders.  Or whatever.  In practice, once we have made our initial assessment ("male or female"), we tend to ignore those specific features that seem to be at odds with our initial judgment.

As you describe it, most people you meet make that initial split-second decision to identify you as a woman.  That's SO great!

Lots of cis women go through life worrying all the time about their weight or breasts or hair texture or whatever.  Regrettably, it's part of the socialization of women.  It's reinforced by advertising and marketing messages that constantly bombard women to undermine their self-esteem in order to get women to buy products and services to ease their anxiety.

You might want to talk to a therapist about the anxiety you feel over whether you conform to specific social standards of appearance.  Lots of cis women have done that, and therapy can help get you to a point of changing what you want to and can and not worrying about the rest.  But please understand that what I'm talking about here is not really a transgender issue.  It's just garden-variety social and appearance anxiety.

Here's what you need to keep uppermost in your mind as far as gender is concerned: most people meet a woman when they meet you.  Lucky them!  Lucky you!
-April
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JB_Girl

Quote from: Amoré on July 09, 2017, 09:44:10 AM
I have had issue with myself for a while that transitioning feels like a never ending pit. In the eyes of others I pass as a woman and I leave them in awe when I tell them I am trans but the moment I look at myself I just see all these reasons why I don't pass. ...

I end up telling a person I am transgender because my child calls me papa. Because of my voice and because I want to tell them before they guess something is up with this woman standing in front of them. I get bad social anxiety because of this and tend to steer away from social events because of it.  :embarrassed:

Hi Amore,
There isn't much point in my adding to what has already been said.  (They have covered pretty much everything that ought to be said)But let's try to slay this dragon anyway with a case in point.

My avitar is a picture taken of me with an IPhone late on Saturday afternoon by a woman I was shooting (photographing) the wedding of a friend with.  What do you see?  This snapshot has not been modified at all, I only cropped it to size.  I was a bit sweaty, a bit tired and really did not feel particularly pretty at all.

So man or woman?  Old or young? Fit or fat?

Does it help to know I am post op and have been on HRT for almost six years?  Now what do you see?
Does it help to know that I am only a few months away from my sixty-fifth birthday?
Does it help to know that I was a trriathlon competitor years ago and still jog 5 km most days?
Does it help to know that I was wearing a white flowing blouse, purple skinny jeans and red sandles?

What do you see in this portrait?

I see a person who is and has always been a woman.  She is flawed, could lose ten pounds, her hairline is a little sparse, her jawline just a touch saggy, her eye makeup left town hours ago, but she has a nice smile.  She tries to be kind to everyone, she tries to be of service, and she loves to sing.  If that is not what you see, that is your issue not mine.  The same goes for all who look on you.  You are perfect just as you are.  If you don't like your voice sing scales and practice talking, yelling, whispering all around A below middle C.  I pushed my conversational voice up three notes over the years and while it is now a bit low for a girl perhaps, but it is most certainly not a man's voice.

Moisturize and take care of your skin.  I makes a difference, notice I'm wearing a sun hat.  I always am outside during the summer.  It makes a difference.  The key to acceptance is believing how you are treated as much or more as what you tell yourself about how you present.  If you are treated with courtesy and your femininity assumed, believe that this is so and that you are real - because it is and you are.

I wish you well.  The only thing you need to do is believe.  That is the magic fairy dust of passing and you have plenty.

Peace,
Julie

I began this journey when I began to think, but it took what it took for me to truly understand the what and the why of authenticity.  I'm grateful to have found a path that works and to live as I have always dreamed.

The dates are unimportant and are quite stale now.  The journey to truth is fresh and never ends.
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Sophia Sage

We are often the last person to stop clocking ourselves.
What you look forward to has already come, but you do not recognize it.
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Amoré

Quote from: JB_Girl on July 10, 2017, 03:07:13 PM
Hi Amore,
There isn't much point in my adding to what has already been said.  (They have covered pretty much everything that ought to be said)But let's try to slay this dragon anyway with a case in point.

My avitar is a picture taken of me with an IPhone late on Saturday afternoon by a woman I was shooting (photographing) the wedding of a friend with.  What do you see?  This snapshot has not been modified at all, I only cropped it to size.  I was a bit sweaty, a bit tired and really did not feel particularly pretty at all.

So man or woman?  Old or young? Fit or fat?

Does it help to know I am post op and have been on HRT for almost six years?  Now what do you see?
Does it help to know that I am only a few months away from my sixty-fifth birthday?
Does it help to know that I was a trriathlon competitor years ago and still jog 5 km most days?
Does it help to know that I was wearing a white flowing blouse, purple skinny jeans and red sandles?

What do you see in this portrait?

I see a person who is and has always been a woman.  She is flawed, could lose ten pounds, her hairline is a little sparse, her jawline just a touch saggy, her eye makeup left town hours ago, but she has a nice smile.  She tries to be kind to everyone, she tries to be of service, and she loves to sing.  If that is not what you see, that is your issue not mine.  The same goes for all who look on you.  You are perfect just as you are.  If you don't like your voice sing scales and practice talking, yelling, whispering all around A below middle C.  I pushed my conversational voice up three notes over the years and while it is now a bit low for a girl perhaps, but it is most certainly not a man's voice.

Moisturize and take care of your skin.  I makes a difference, notice I'm wearing a sun hat.  I always am outside during the summer.  It makes a difference.  The key to acceptance is believing how you are treated as much or more as what you tell yourself about how you present.  If you are treated with courtesy and your femininity assumed, believe that this is so and that you are real - because it is and you are.

I wish you well.  The only thing you need to do is believe.  That is the magic fairy dust of passing and you have plenty.

Peace,
Julie

Hi true I didn't know about or think about all those things I just saw a normal woman in your picture. Thanx for the advice.


Excuse me for living
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