Spironolactone is a 17B estradiol inhibitor?

[Harley Quinn]

I need a clarification.   If you say that spiro blocks T at the receptors rather than inhibits T production then if T has been reduced to minimum levels in the bloodstream it follows that it is independent of spiro.  So, at that point one could discontinue spiro entirely with no rise in T levels. 

Is that correct?  If so, my Dr. doesn't know that.


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It binds to the androgen receptor and through negative feedback, your body believes it has enough testosterone. It is a reversible causation. If you quit taking spironolactone, without another actor in the scenario to suppress testosterone then your levels will rise again once the Spiro has ceased to be available to bind to the androgen receptor.

[Deborah]

No. Spiro both BLOCKS and REDUCES T. In some, even at high doses, it may not reduce T at all but will usually block androgens to a certain degree from binding to receptors.

Then my experiment to continue to find out how far I can reduce my spiro continues.


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[KayXo]

It binds to the androgen receptor and through negative feedback, your body believes it has enough testosterone. It is a reversible causation.

Incorrect, Harley. By blocking androgen receptors and activating them to a lesser degree, there is actually LESS NEGATIVE FEEDBACK. As a result, the hypothalamus and pituitary gland will increase their output of LH and FSH that signal the testes to produce more T and trigger spermatogenesis.

That's ok though because spironolactone blocks androgen receptors and also (usually, typically at higher doses) inhibits an enzyme involved in T production in the body.

[Harley Quinn]

Sure Kay, whatever. Since the normal terminology for this revolves around T blockers, that's the language I used and I don't think it's inaccurate to say that it's blocking the production of testosterone. Agreed, it's not binding to receptors / blocking the endpoint effectiveness.

HQ:
Over the course of a year as we titrated dosage my E/T levels ran as follows, pg/ng per ml respectively:

702/12
353/12
225/17
210/20

And then post op

263/13

All those measurements were made at 3.5-4 days into a 7 day schedule. My most recent test was on day 6 and my numbers were 180/<8.

I should note that my only measurement of T prior to HRT had been done 17 years ago and came out at 350 which is quite low for a natal male, 5th percentile, so blocking my T may be inherently easier in my body than in most people's.

Well, that sounds promising, if 210 to 225 pg/ml was continuing to suppress testosterone pre SRS. My doctor dismisses the theory of estrogen only suppression as she doesn't wish to raise my levels past 200 pgml. I have no clue what my pre-hrt testosterone levels were... the doctor didn't feel the need to check. 🙄

[Chloe]

I personally (I am not a doctor and I am not condoning anything) prefer the anti-androgens bicalutamide and LhRh agonists such as Lupron. Or just taking estrogen and this alone bringing T levels down, over time.

Yea Casodex woohoo   


( sorry couldn't resist!! )

[josie76]

Back in the beginning there was a question on breast tissue growth and spiro. Here my correlation. Breast tissue development specifically is slowed or halted by sufficient androgen receptor activation. There is at least some reports indicating spiro usage slows breast tissue growth in at least some people. This is very likely dosage dependent.

Harley, last spring my potassium was just above the "safe" reference range on my blood test. My sodium was at the bottom. As I was working outside, I was experiencing a number of instances of dizziness, weakness, and nausea. What I found out was sodium levels act as a regulator of potassium levels. I began consuming a much greater amount of salt. In mid summer heat, as soon as I would feel the weakness coming on, I would open several packets of salt from my last fast food or gas station stop on my tongue and wash it down with water. In 15 minutes I would be feeling normal again. My mid summer blood test had my potassium back in the normal range as was my sodium levels.


Kay, I need to post screenshots of my spreadsheet. It's on my laptop. I have a simplified medication effects with some of the gene specific functions, some of the processing information, and some medical study references. Mostly instead of looking at studies for side effects I looked into the chemistry and gene expression. I wish I had the time to turn some of it into an interactive power point or a simple html linked set of pages. Maybe I will at some point. It would be great to combine all of the information with active links on each enzyme activity that a medication can interfere with, and the differing processes affected.