christians? why is that the christian god has no female identity?

[Natasha]

the christian god is supposed to be nurturing yet has no female side which is in contrast to humanity where females are for the most part far more nurturing than men. does this not bother the female christians that your/their gender is not presented as part of god?

i have heard the explanation that god has no gender before but i have trouble accepting that because the reference used in the bible and standard prayers is most definitely masculine and refers to god over and over again as "father" and never mother. i also agree that men can be nurturing but i think if we asked who was the most nurturing gender, the answer would be female.  i find it interesting that the pattern of gender is different from that of human life.

[tekla]

I thought that Christianity was invented to replace the goddess more or less.

[IsabelleStPierre]

I think the committee that consisted of only men that created Christianity didn't even think about it...when creating a god people tend to create them in their own image...

Peace and love,
Isabelle St-Pierre

[tekla]

There is a lot of evidence that most western B.C.E. religions other than the Jewish one, were goddess based.

[NicholeW.]

"God" has been defined for millenia by theologians and philosophers as "One-With-No-Second." He has been ameliorated somewhat by others, but for Chritians with a Credo, I believe you will find that language above to still be in-place.

That means, that God is beholden to nothing else for his existence. He came from Nothing. And if you read Freudian (and others as well) ego-psychology you will discover that the entire "differentiated self/ego" is described the same way. If you read the sources for such evaluations you will find that those studied by those who came to these views were invariably upper-class, socially dominant males.

That women have other standards of develoment within the context of our lives was given no weight at all in those ego-psychologies.

There have been newer psychologies during & after the 1980s that have changed those definitions in terms of human development, although they (the newer ideas) remain largely unaccepted by the 'mainstream:' differentiated-self with a human face?

Some of the more recent theorists have begun to incorporate a more thorugh view of human selves. Take the edge off so to speak.

IMO, God is the pattern for human, especially male, growth and development. As I said in another thread I think that the biggest problem with patriarchy is that it not only allows but positively encourages us to be 'isolated and isolative.' Little Ones-With-No-Seconds.

For me the entire ball was probably begun rolling by a male-priest way back in the dim mists of prehistory who felt his contributions were not as recognized as those of the priestesses. He won followers and eventually overthrew the prehistoric status-quo that revered goddess/es and people-in-relationship. The movement spread, as much due to physical strength and inferiority-complexes as anything else and resulted in Gods who procreate without the benefit of a feminine principle.

Over time the religious powers have found that people also yearn for a feminine presence in deity. Thus, Cults of the Virgin and such that eventually gained the acceptance of the male heirarchy so the rulers may keep their power-over.

Of course, this is just my guess. Hardly factual in some respects, especially the prehistoric ones. And I suppose the ego-psychology ones are just my view of what I have studied.

So, take this for what it's worth: my opinion.

N~

[Lisbeth]

In the Old Testament, the Shekhinah or "Presence of God" is feminine.  In the New Testament, the Pneuma or "Holy Spirit" is feminine.  In both parts of the Bible, the Sophia or "Wisdom of God" is feminine.  Translators have chosen to use masculine words for them.  There are many other feminine images of god in the Bible.  See:

The Divine Feminine: The Biblical Imagery of God as Female, by Virginia Mollenkott.
http://www.amazon.com/Divine-Feminine-Biblical-Imagery-Female/dp/0824506693/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1199298207&sr=8-1

Actually, there are lots of books on this now:
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/103-2110712-7242223?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=The+Divine+Feminine&x=16&y=23

[BriannaKatherine]

my own knowledge supports that fully, the gnostic branches of christianity if i recall correctly still observes pistis sophia 'holy wisdom' is feminine

[Lisbeth]

my own knowledge supports that fully, the gnostic branches of christianity if i recall correctly still observes pistis sophia 'holy wisdom' is feminine

As yes.  The "feminist" branch of early Christianity.

[Dorothy]

In Judeo-Christian theology, God is without gender, or rather includes both genders, as expressed in the creation story where God "made humanity in his own image, male and female he made them...."
The masculine pronoun does not necessarily imply a male antecedent; it is a generic pronoun. In many languages there is no neuter gender in nouns or pronouns, and objects such as "table" and "floor" have grammatical gender, but no sex.
Jesus is a man, but only his human body is male, since he has to be one or the other.
There are many passages in the Hebrew scriptures and the New Testament in which God is imagined as feminine. These are often ignored by people, though.

[Wing Walker]

I am not a Bible scholar.  I haven't read all of the concordances and commentaries, the translations and versions.

Concerning the feminine nature of the Creator and Wisdom as a feminine entity, I have found this in Chapter 8 of the Book of Proverbs in the King James Version.  I have provided the emphasis.  Wisdom is feminine.  That's a hard sell in a patriarchal society.

Please tell me if I have violated a copyright in doing this and I will remove it from this board immediately.

1: Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice?
2: She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths.
3: She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors.
4: Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice is to the sons of man.
5: O ye simple, understand wisdom: and, ye fools, be ye of an understanding heart.
6: Hear; for I will speak of excellent things; and the opening of my lips shall be right things.
7: For my mouth shall speak truth; and wickedness is an abomination to my lips.
8: All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.
9: They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.
10: Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold.
11: For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.
12: I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.
13: The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.
14: Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength.
15: By me kings reign, and princes decree justice.
16: By me princes rule, and nobles, even all the judges of the earth.
17: I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.
18: Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.
19: My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver.
20: I lead in the way of righteousness, in the midst of the paths of judgment:
21: That I may cause those that love me to inherit substance; and I will fill their treasures.
22: The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
23: I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
24: When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.
25: Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
26: While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world.
27: When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
28: When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep:
29: When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
30: Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him;
31: Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
32: Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for blessed are they that keep my ways.
33: Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.
34: Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.
35: For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.
36: But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

Wing Walker

[lisagurl]

Da Vinci Code 

[Rachael]

God is a man because he is... get back on your knees and finish washing your husbands feet like a good wife woman!
(thats a joke just incase someone releases a herd of drama llamas)
R

[BriannaKatherine]

if you go by certain christian theology eve wasnt the first woman, lilith was  and she was thrown from the garden for refusing to submit to adam..course if you look into it you can actually draw a line between her and Ishtar as well so just depends on what you believe.

[bethzerosix]

god the father, son and holy spirit... amen

easy

Posted on: January 04, 2008, 01:19:37 AMbesides... if god lives in christians in the form of the holy spirit then not only does god understand the feminine but also the human condition.

[Hazumu]

why is that the christian god has no female identity?

The guys pulled a fast one.

Same reason as some words are mistranslated from the ancient texts (Greek or Hebrew or Aramaic)  To solidify patriarchial bigotry.  Here's a good example of biblical mistranslation.

This page at Whosoever looks at the mistranslations that have led to the anti-homosexual 'clobber' passages, and provides some refutation to the interpretations currently in vobue with the FundeVangelist community.

Karen

[cindianna_jones]

Thanks for those references Karen.  It just goes to show you that religion is what you make of it.  I believe that for most fervent observers, they have gone overboard.  Christ's message was simple:  "love one another"  Why does it have to be so difficult?

In terms of the male god....   It is what the collective "we" have made.  It is man who typically wields the sword and governs.  Therefore, god, the ultimate soldier and governor must be male.

Cindi

[Terri Gene]

have heard the explanation that god has no gender before but i have trouble accepting that because the reference used in the bible and standard prayers is most definitely masculine and refers to god over and over again as "father" and never mother.

Well, I've not been the religious one for quite the last few years, but I've been around enough to understand that religion here in this country is ran by men.

Ever stop and think that perhaps the male perception of God is founded purely in the perception of these men and little else??

Terri >

[Lisbeth]

have heard the explanation that god has no gender before but i have trouble accepting that because the reference used in the bible and standard prayers is most definitely masculine and refers to god over and over again as "father" and never mother.

If god has no gender, doesn't that mean that god is incomplete?  Wouldn't it be better to say that god encompasses all genders?

[bethzerosix]

i agree that god encompasses all genders. the concept of god the father was a relatively new idea brought about by his son. before that he was known as the god of abraham ,issac  and jacob. christ was the son and heir. rules of the the first born son and all  that stuff. before christ, god was GOD, through christ we are allowed into the family, where now we cry father, father. we have god the father, god the son and god the holy spirit.... also known as the comforter.  make of it what you want, but i can see a family arch type in the trinity. also... even though the bibles main lesson is  love god and love everyone else, those 100,000+ extra words are to give us a glimpse into the heart and mind of god.