Name and gender change prior to SRS

[Hypatia]

They won't change the gender in SS records without proof of surgery.

They aren't supposed to, but it seems a few people here managed it somehow.

Yeah, I was astonished when a nice lady at SSA made me female just on my own say-so. This is why it's a good idea to always ask for the F that you want. All they can do is say no. And you might get lucky.

[seldom]

I am not sure it is worth the hassle right now as i plan on my OP in a few months.  It would save me from having to backtrack on legal documents but oh well.

Audrey

Audrey, you are getting your GRS quite quickly and easily considering your age, wht kind of paperwork or referrals (from whom) do you need in the U.S for GRS? I am envious as I have been fighting the NHS for a referral for about 4 years now in the U.K..

You need a letter from two therapist, one which must be a Ph.D or M.D. (psychiatrist).

It is VERY easy to get GRS quickly in the US.  One year full time.  I am doing FFS first, but I will have GRS after two years full time.  Yeah thats it. 

One has the bear the cost burden in the US, but actually getting the surgeries is not to difficult.  One year RLE for SRS...that is really it.  HRT is even easier, its 3 months of therapy under the SoC, but there are more and more doctors who do not even require a therapist letter for it.

[gothique11]

That sux that you have to go to court in the States and actually put your name change in the local paper.

Here, we just go to a registry office (fees vary, cause they are now privately owned -- but processed somewhere else in a government owned mystery factory... Alberta is weird for their public-private deals). I think it's published in some little, unknown legal paper that no one looks at or reads. It's in small print and squished in there among a zillion other things, like divorces, court case dates, etc, etc. I don't even know where you can pick up a copy of this paper!

Other provinces, I believe, are a bit different. And they handle ID changes differently.

--natalie

Posted on: January 14, 2008, 09:25:30 PMAs for the NHS -- it sux. I'm glad I'm not in the U.K. Alberta has something like the NHS (other provinces have similar stuff, some don't have any coverage, it all depends on what the provincial health care decides to cover).

My stuff has been delayed -- again! So, who knows when I'll get GRS/SRS. Although, we aren't as bad at the UK. Our system is good. It used to be longer, and then they made it shorter, so people were going through like mad, and now they've decided to make it longer and more strict. There's only one guy in the province that you can see who can "approve" GRS for the government, and his wait list is a year and growing more and more (some word has gotten out that it's indefinite). And then, you have to see him for a year before they approve you, no matter how long you've been living full time or how many letters you have, etc.

But, people have been fast tracked, etc, and blah, blah, blah, word is that someone got through who shouldn't have. I know who, although very few ppl in the trans community know this person. This person got the surgery, but is also a drug addict. Wants to sue Montreal. Has mega life issues. Didn't take care of herself at all -- so she actually recently ended up going to Montreal to see if they can fix what she didn't take care of, etc, etc. So yeah, long story short -- all of a sudden they start taking on time and delaying files. Mine was supposed to be sent in Oct/Nov. Then that didn't happen. Then they said Jan/Feb. Well, I just learned it's not happening until May/June. It pisses me off because I don't like that the dangle it before me and then take it away.

If I had the money, I'd go and cover it myself in a heart beat. I tried going the loan route already, but I already owe too much to the bank, and I have to pay more of my debt to qualify for even a penny. It sux. So, I'm working my butt off to pay back things, etc.

--natalie

[Berliegh]

In the U.K we have to change all our documentation over and live RLE for at least 2 years before we are even considered for GRS.   

I'm into my 10th year of transition and still I can't get a referral from a psychiatrists for GRS. I have done 5 years of RLE. I was turned down by Charing Cross GIC in London yet I comply with all the clinic protocols and the HBSOC, yet they refused a referral without any explanation. I sent letters, phone calls but they wouldn't give me a reason...

[joannatsf]

One night in Bangkok and the world's your oyster....

[tinkerbell]

In California, it is possible to change your name and gender marker on your driver license or ID card even if you are pre-op.  I was able to change my gender marker with the SSA prior to having SRS in the early 90's too.  I guess I was one of the lucky ones before the 9/11 nightmare.

Since 2002, the SSA requires proof of SRS to change gender marker on their records.  After SRS, I was also able to change my birth certificate; they issued me a new BC (not an amended one) with the correct gender and name this time. 


tink

[Berliegh]

In California, it is possible to change your name and gender marker on your driver license or ID card even if you are pre-op.  I was able to change my gender marker with the SSA prior to having SRS in the early 90's too.  I guess I was one of the lucky ones before the 9/11 nightmare.

Since 2002, the SSA requires proof of SRS to change gender marker on their records.  After SRS, I was also able to change my birth certificate; they issued me a new BC (not an amended one) with the correct gender and name this time. 


tink

The criteria and the HBSOC criteria is that you live at least 1 year in your new role. In the U.K it is expected that you will change all ID at least a year minimum before you are considered for GRS. The idea being to see if you can hack it for over a year with a female ID , so there are no ways of opting out or only living part time. It is a proper Real life test. Why the Americans do it back to front and have surgery first is a mystery? what if they ccouldn't hack it as a female and want to revert back to being a male?, the damage is done and that seems dangerous to me..

[Keira]

While you only get the M out after SRS,
if you live with an unmistakeably female name, and most are,
you get essentially the same result since not many instances
depend on that M. Plenty of TS have lived female stealth
lives for many years pre-op with just a name change.

[Kate]

if you live with an unmistakeably female name, and most are,
you get essentially the same result since not many instances
depend on that M.

Exactly. I can't think of any way that my "M" is invalidating of my RLT. Very few people... if anyone really... ever see it. They DO see and hear my name, however. Still though, before my name change, the only places that needed to know my male name were doctors and dentists (for insurance). I was Kate at work and in every other aspect of my life long before it became my legal name on my ID.

~Kate~

[tinkerbell]

In California, it is possible to change your name and gender marker on your driver license or ID card even if you are pre-op.  I was able to change my gender marker with the SSA prior to having SRS in the early 90's too.  I guess I was one of the lucky ones before the 9/11 nightmare.

Since 2002, the SSA requires proof of SRS to change gender marker on their records.  After SRS, I was also able to change my birth certificate; they issued me a new BC (not an amended one) with the correct gender and name this time. 


tink

The criteria and the HBSOC criteria is that you live at least 1 year in your new role. In the U.K it is expected that you will change all ID at least a year minimum before you are considered for GRS. The idea being to see if you can hack it for over a year with a female ID , so there are no ways of opting out or only living part time. It is a proper Real life test. Why the Americans do it back to front and have surgery first is a mystery? what if they ccouldn't hack it as a female and want to revert back to being a male?, the damage is done and that seems dangerous to me..

Usually in order to change your gender maker in California, you have to have a therapist's authorization which you take to the DMV office.  Without this letter/authorization (which specifies the diagnosis, type of HRT and the time you have been living as your target gender), you can't change your gender marker at all.  The therapist who issues this letter to the DMV (Department of Motor Vehicles) is supposed to follow the SOC.  Normally this letter/authorization can't be issued until the patient has completed at least 12 months of RLT (living and working as their target gender).  Hence, Berliegh, the US doesn't do anything backwards as you stated, for everything falls under the guidelines of the SOC.

tink

P.S.  Also, are you familiar with U.S. laws?  Each state has its own law, so what is doable in California may not be so in...let's say...Oregon, for instance.

[Schala]

Here in Quebec, it is hell. Though I heard, and saw for myself (in person) that a friend changed her gender on her medicare card while pre-op (which normally isn't authorized).

In Quebec, reasons to change your name must be 'serious', and unless it is, it is usually denied.

Unpronounceable, defamed, common usage, proof of trans-related therapy and diagnosis.

Common usage relies on 5 years of using the name, though I don't know how you can provide proof of using it since you can't use it legally. Maybe someone's testimony to it is accepted?

The proof of therapy requires a diagnosis of GID, and proof of HRT-taking by whoever is giving you HRT. Then you send a form, it's all paperwork, no court. It takes 6-ish months to receive an answer, costs 300$, and that doesn't guarantee it being accepted.

Gender on ID depends on SRS - and I mean on all IDs: driver's license, medicare card, passport, social security card if they got anything about it, birth certificate. Fortunately, you only need a testimony from someone in the province that surgery was performed (it doesn't need to be performed here, or even in Canada at all). Unfortunately, Quebec's plan doesn't pay for SRS. It's possible to get a friendly person when renewing medicare card and changing name (and get a F pre-op)...but I wouldn't count on it - officially they require proof of documentation to allow it. The only way to have it pass unnoticed is 'as a mistake' (that they correct by putting a F...I guess passing helps).

[Keira]

Schala, I'm from Quebec, and got my name changed last year. The whole process,
about 8 month, but it could have been 6 months if I'd been a bit more on the ball.
Its very long and the more proof of how seriously you need the name change,
the quicker you get a decision. I got a paper from my psychologist who's associated
with Mcgill, send photos that showed I couldn't pass as male even if I wanted, and
send a FFS doc from Brassard (the fact that brassard's also involved in SRS helped me
cause they trust him). Had to post in a local paper 2 weeks and in the official gazette of the province two more week. Was delayed by needing to get some supporting docs during the summer when my FFS surgeon and psychologist where absent. Got the decision in about 4 month and 1 month later got the name change certificate.

I got a quick decision. Someone in my group who send the docs in June still has not had a decision.

If your not a TS, have little supporting docs and don't have a psychologically traumatising name,
forget about changing your name in the province of Quebec.

[Schala]

Schala, I'm from Quebec, and got my name changed last year. The whole process,
about 8 month, but it could have been 6 months if I'd been a bit more on the ball.
Its very long and the more proof of how seriously you need the name change,
the quicker you get a decision. I got a paper from my psychologist who's associated
with Mcgill, send photos that showed I couldn't pass as male even if I wanted, and
send a FFS doc from Brassard (the fact that brassard's also involved in SRS helped me
cause they trust him). Had to post in a local paper 2 weeks and in the official gazette of the province two more week. Was delayed by needing to get some supporting docs during the summer when my FFS surgeon and psychologist where absent. Got the decision in about 4 month and 1 month later got the name change certificate.

I got a quick decision. Someone in my group who send the docs in June still has not had a decision.

If your not a TS, have little supporting docs and don't have a psychologically traumatising name,
forget about changing your name in the province of Quebec.

That sounds absurd for requirements...

Technically they can't deny a male from bearing a female name (because of Micheline Montreuil: On November 1, 1999, the provincial court of appeal [of Quebec province] ruled that nothing in the law prevented a person who was legally male from legally adopting a woman's name. (from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_change ). And a GID diagnosis plus mention of taking HRT should be proof enough - that's all that should be needed for name change, even here.

Proof or even affirmation of FFS, SRS, or a degree of passability shouldn't even matter. Unless they're not holding true to that decision.

Since I'm on welfare, if I get the GID diagnosis, and it gets refused over some BS like that, I will take advantage of government court aid and challenge them on that.

[cindybc]

Hi Audrey
I am happy for you. You are truly very passable hon. I never used any lawyers or anything else, I didn't have the money at the time for that. I filled out all the papers myself and I first sent out for my new birth certificate, after I got that everything else fell into place and all my documents show an F on them now, God speed on the surgery.

Cindy 

[cindybc]

Hi Keira hon
I feel sorry that you had to go through all that BS to get your documents changed. Paper work drives me up the wall, I am not much of a paper person, but I did managed to do all the paper work done myself and had all the documents changed and back to me within a couple of months. I don't think I would want to live in Quebec. I liked Ontario, but it was getting to the point I couldn't handle the cold anymore and since they don't cover SRS Wing Walker and I moved to BC so that she could have the surgery covered. I love BC but still miss the familiarity of Ontario.

Cindy

[Schala]

The whole process, about 8 month, but it could have been 6 months if I'd been a bit more on the ball.

That's an absurd system.  Here in WV it took two weeks and would have cost me $200, but I was too poor.

"Common usage" was the reason I gave.  A few people for a couple of weeks had addressed me by that name.
Anybody can change theiir name to anything as long as it isn't obscene or has numbers in it.
Transgender had absolutely nothing to do with my name change.

And as far as gender goes, I don't really lose all that much sleep about M's floating around.
One day it will get fixed.

Renate

Here common usage has to be 'proven' for 2 or 5 years (I was told both at different times). I don't know what constitues proof. I can't register a phone bill to my new name before it's legal, I can't get a rent under that name before then either, I can't change IDs, I can't at the bank, I can't for HR department if I work...so what proof?

So far I've used the name "Sara" exclusively (unless forced to use my legal name/ID) for 22 months.

[Hypatia]

That's an absurd system.  Here in WV it took two weeks and would have cost me $200, but I was too poor.

Here in VA it took 10 days and cost $34 to file. You don't need a lawyer, the county courthouse provides the documents at its web site you can DIY.

[Keira]

If your a TS, especially followed by one of the gender clinics and ,
and have more proof of having had concretely transitioned
and can prove the distress that your name causes you, then the
5 year common usage is waved.

Micheline Montreuil would probably have never have had this accelerated
waiver because she didn't really qualify. The battle was over giving a female
name to a male no matter how long you have been using it;
this interdiction was arbitrary and rightly eliminated. ITs only later, I think 2004,
that some TS group in quebec where able to convince the name change
agency in Quebec of waving the usual 5 years for transitioning TS.

Again DIY doesn't help unless it shows clearly in your face and body (that's why I
used the photos and FFS letters). I had DIY, so
I knew I wouldn't have a paper from a doctor about hormones,
so I needed to get some other proof of action, FFS papers are not usually used).
But, like I said, someone in the same clinic gave her paper at around the same time, and
she's already 2.5 months later without a decision. I think I was able to
force them to decide in my favor by piling the evidence.

Its a bit crazy that you have to work so hard for this. But, Quebec's bureaucratie is
one of the least effective on this continent.

[Purple Pimp]

Yeah, the name change has been a bit of a bureaucratic hassle, but I'm just happy that in this post 9/11 world that it's still possible without too much fuss.  In the US, we're pretty lucky in this matter, since other countries seem to have more restrictions.  IIRC, in Germany, one can't change one's last name (though the records are impounded, leaving less of a trace of the name change than in the US).

Lia

[Schala]

If your a TS, especially followed by one of the gender clinics and ,
and have more proof of having had concretely transitioned
and can prove the distress that your name causes you, then the
5 year common usage is waved.

You mean the General Montreal Hospital's GIC? It's almost a joke, accepting 10% of applicants, and making them follow CAMH-like requirements... I got refused entry, after being 6 months on HRT and 7 months full-time, because I was 'not emotionally stable enough' according to the head shrink there, Dr Assalian. He mentioned believing in reincarnation as being pointing to some mental problem...yeah he really lives with his time...