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An introduction and a question

Started by Kir, February 15, 2008, 03:17:07 PM

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Kir

Good afternoon to all of you! Due to the prodding of a new-found friend I have decided to check out this place. And as such, I've decided I better give an introduction to myself (which is of course one of my favorite topics).

I was born a boy. I had rather feminine tastes throughout my childhood though. I like animals and plants and flowers and pretty colors and shopping and chocolate and such. I disliked organized sports (although I do enjoy being physically active). I'm rather small frame for a guy. I always liked having long hair, although my dad didn't really approve of it, so usually it was more of a shaggy mop of a hairdo. I grew a full beard somewhere around 13.

Sexuality was a tad confusing for me at first. I liked girls, always did, many of my friends were girls. So when I became old enough to be interested in sex, I definitely liked girls. But then again, guys weren't too bad either. For a while I figured if I found guys attractive then that must mean I'm gay! But then I thought about it long and hard, and no, I definitely like girls too. That boggled me for a while. So I just dated girls, because really things are simpler when dating someone of the opposite gender. I've kissed a few guys, but it's my finding that generally women are better kissers (although I admit my selection of people I kissed was rather limited).

I ended up marrying a wonderful woman, who has pretty much the same sexuality as me. We both are very flirty, and enjoy checking people out, of either gender. It's great, it's like having a boyfriend and a girlfriend at the same time in the same person! She's the only one I've ever had sex with (besides oral) and I'm the only one she's had sex with (besides oral). Honestly I don't really have much interest in having sex with people other than her, and she's the same way. I mean, we find other people attractive and fun to look at sure, but we generally aren't actually sexually attracted to other folks. We joke about how our sexuality is "us" or "each other". If she were a male, or I a female, or any other combo of genders, we would still be pretty much the exact same couple. I guess that would be labeled pansexuality?

But the idea of what gender I might be, that's a bit more of a recent pondering. Once I got into online gaming I was kind of confused. I usually made my characters to be girls. I mean, I live my real life as a guy, so why wouldn't I want to try being a girl in a game? I mean, it's a game. It's more weird for me to be playing twi'lek or an ogre than it is for me to be playing a girl, right? Well, that's when I realized that apparently most people are pretty sure you are supposed to always portray yourself as your born gender. Hrmph, how boring.

But in the end it's still generally easier for me to be a girl online. There are some pretty strong stereotypes out there involving gender. And it's usually more convenient to be confused for being a girl than confused for being a guy. (girls have a certain comradere to each other, and of course guys like chicks. But girls don't really want to talk to guys online because they figure all guys on the net want cybersex (unless of course they want cybersex themselves), and guys tend to view other guys as competition). So generally I am portrayed as a girl online. And if someone asks me about my gender I usually answer "either" or "both". If that doesn't scare them off (which it often times does) then they sometimes ask for clarification, and that is a total pain to try and explain. Usually I just say gender doesn't really matter, but if they get pushy I tell them I'm technically a guy, but I like chocolate and I don't like sports. Then usually comes all the questions about sexuality, cross-dressing, blah blah blah, at which point I'm usually thinking "Hey, so, were we gonna go kill those orcs or are we gonna talk about genitals?" Unless I'm underslept, in which case they usually get an earful about my views on gender (in case you can't guess, I'm currently underslept).

I never really cared if people thought I was a guy or a girl. From behind I could easily pass as a girl (my hair is now very long, and my dad has finally decided that long hair is pretty darn cool). My wife and I always find it fun whenever someone says "Can I help you ladies?" when we are shopping. Plus it's fun to wear fingernail polish, braid each other's hair, and run around town terrorizing people that think inside a narrow box.

I often times referred to myself as androgynous. I would sometimes joke "David Bowie, with a goatee". I wouldn't say I am a boy in mind or a girl, and I'm certainly not a neither. Maybe a bit of both? Although it's not like I am both, all the time. I am just whatever is most convenient or fun at the time. I would love to be able to actually shift my physical body to being whatever gender I am feeling at the time, but obviously that doesn't really work (I played Second Life for a while and I made two looks that were so similar looking, except for gender, and would just flip flop between the two at will, which was lots of fun). I wouldn't want to permanently change my gender, it's too much work and would still just pigeon hole me into that gender.

I used to live in South Dakota though. That place is a hole. And they are extremely judgemental when it comes to gender or sexuality. I had fun breaking the rules whenever possible, but I narrowly escaped getting beat up many times. Now I live near-ish Seattle, which is quite open to pretty much anything. There are less people to tease around here which is a bummer, but the fact that they accept me way outweighs that and makes this a great place to be.

Pronouns never really mattered to me. I never really cared if someone called me a him or a her, and I never am careful about what I use for other people. I usually call everyone "they" or "you". Although I would like to get in the habit of using hir and sie and those, but I always forget them. Although, I have a habit of calling everyone "dude" regardless of gender (which seems to sometimes offend MTF, but never offends regular F), I pretty much view "dude" as saying "friend". A good friend of my also uses the term "hippie" for everyone, and I sometimes use that too.




But now here comes the big questions portions. I've never actually thought too seriously that there was actually a GROUP of people that had this view, or that there would actually be a name for it. I've also not really stressed about it much. I hadn't figured there had been a group because groups are for people that are stressed about it, and I'm not stressed about it, so figured no one else was too. I've never really freaked out about sexuality or gender, but now it looks like maybe I'm supposed to be freaking out? I mean, is that the healthy thing to do? I've never talked to a therapist, never really figured I had much to talk about. I pretty much felt like I had it figured out and that was cool. But what if I don't figure it out? What if in 10 years I realize I was supposed to be a girl? Or what if I figure out I'm supposed to be gay? Or what if... blah! And now I see that other people do worry and feel bad and stress, and I don't, and that makes me feel guilty.

And then again, I don't want to use my real name, nor my typical net-names on here, because I don't want people that know me on the net to see me posting here. But that's goofy! Why if I'm so comfortable with it am I uncomfortable with it at the same time? I sometimes claim that names have power and I'm not willing to share my name so easily with people, but I think it might be more than that.

Anyways, that's my long intro. Sorry about the novel length, but I'm underslept and it's boring today at work.

So, hi. You can call me Kir.

Posted on: February 15, 2008, 03:06:30 PM
Ah ha! I have figured out how to reword my post to make it shorter and easier to understand! (I know it's not usually polite to post a response to yourself on forums, but I think I'll take that risk anyways).

To sum it up: What am I?
And more importantly: Does it matter?
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sd

Welcome Kir,

You could be an androgyne, or fluid gendered or bigendered, only you can figure out exactly how you fit. Just go with it and know there are others like you. Read, research, enjoy. You are pretty much the only one who can ultimately determine what exactly you are.

Should you be worried, no, you are doing better than many of us it seems. You are comfortable, why get freaked out now. I would say suggest hanging out here a bit, you may discover more about yourself that you did not know, or even open yourself up for new ideas. Some of us here get freaked out a bit because for some people breaking through that wall of rules and perceptions can be intimidating. You seem rather care free about it for the most part, it is too bad the rest of the world is not the same. Many of us would love to be able to be so carefree about it.

As for your being TS, well, if so, you will figure it out in time. Is it possible, yes, but more than few androgynes have thought that, started down that path and found it was wrong for them. Just take it as it comes.


As you said, does it matter?
Only if you want it to.

Welcome.
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RebeccaFog


You don't have to be anything but yourself.  Sometimes I think a person defies their own senses or logic.  I think I do that.   No problem except what we make for ourselves.


I like the relationship you describe that you have with your wife.



Rebis
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Jordan

Hi Kir,

I think you are doing wonderful, happy to see someone that is cool, with feeling the way you do.

I am not going to judge you or say you are a xxxx

but i'm gonna hint that my feeling and vibe i get is a andro.

take care Kir, and good luck
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buttercup

Hi Kir and welcome,

I love your big intro and envy the great relationship you have with your wife.  You know how to live and enjoy life and by your description you do sound andro to me as well.  But who knows down the track....

cheers again,

buttercup   :)
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Nero

Another unicorn has made hir way to Nero's enchanted forest.
<offers hand>

But um... since when is a taste for chocolate a female thing?
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Pica Pica

Question One: Who knows yet, let's find out...If you are an androgyne, you are lucky, many seem to be a-crawling out of the woodwork and we seem to be discovering proper peers at last and it is fun.

Question Two: Yes it does matter. Giving yourself labels is like giving yourself structure, giving yourself a place, giving yourself a proper legitimacy inside to be the person you are. Makes it important see.
'For the circle may be squared with rising and swelling.' Kit Smart
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Jaimey

Welcome!

We have pretty similar views towards gender.  When I write stories, I always write from a male point of view.  I've written one story in my entire life from a female point of view and it just worked better that way (it was about religious bigotry...).  I don't game, but I know a lot of people who do and most of the ones I know play characters of both genders...even if for no other reason than the guys wouldn't feel right having a male character using "color spray".  hehe.

Whether you are andro or not, I think you'll fit in well with us!  I can see a lot of similarities just from your intro.  Your feelings about sexual attraction, wanting to switch genders according to how you feel, etc (my brain is too tired to remember the rest...).  Not everyone needs a label, but it's good to know that there are people who feel the same.  I never really freaked out about it either.  I just knew I was different and I wanted to understand why...I stumbled upon 'androgyne' and there it was.  I hope that one day I can meet someone as cool as your wife!  (now if only I liked people more...)

...just to add, I think labels only matter if they mean something to you.  I'm not much on labels.  Androgyne is about the only one I use and that's just because it helps people understand me a little better.

We're pretty fun, so stick around!  It's a good place to meet awesome people!
If curiosity really killed the cat, I'd already be dead. :laugh:

"How far you go in life depends on you being tender with the young, compassionate with the aged, sympathetic with the striving and tolerant of the weak and the strong. Because someday in life you will have been all of these." GWC
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Kir

Yeah I admit, liking chocolate isn't a feminine thing, but when you give a guy a piece of chocolate he says "yum" and when you give a girl chocolate she squeels. Perhaps just different reactions to the same level of enjoyment of chocolate, but definitely displayed differently, and I'm much more the squeely type when it comes to chocolate. I dunno. Perhaps it was a bad analogy, but I have chocolate on the brain a lot since I got WAY too much for valentines day (and pretty flowers and a cute bear).

It's great to meet all of you.
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Louise

Culturally a liking for chocolates is associated with feminine tastes.  I will bet that more men give women chocolates for valentines than vice versa.  (I gave my wife both flowers and chocolates; she fixed dinner.)  Personally I love chocolate.
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Seshatneferw

Since others have already given you long answers, I'll take the summary. ;)

Quote from: Kir on February 15, 2008, 03:17:07 PM
To sum it up: What am I?
And more importantly: Does it matter?

You are you. And yes, it matters; but not too much else does, unless you want it to.

Also, welcome!

  Nfr
Whoopee! Man, that may have been a small one for Neil, but it's a long one for me.
-- Pete Conrad, Apollo XII
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Simone Louise

I've a package of chocolate-covered GS cookies on my desk (and must ration myself to one per day--sometimes two).

Having teen-aged children complicates some of the marital ease of gender. My wife has forbidden me to speak to my daughter about gender issues. On the other hand, my wife, herself, told ours it would be alright with her if the daughter discovered herself gay.

Simone
Choose life.
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Shana A

Welcome Kir! It sounds like you're on a wonderful process of exploration, whatever gender you might be, enjoy the journey!

And... please pass the chocolate  ;D

Zythyra
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde


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Jaimey

I made a chocolate cake.  From scratch.  I feel all domestic.  :P
If curiosity really killed the cat, I'd already be dead. :laugh:

"How far you go in life depends on you being tender with the young, compassionate with the aged, sympathetic with the striving and tolerant of the weak and the strong. Because someday in life you will have been all of these." GWC
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Pica Pica

nice. i had a friend who made chocolate cakes in times of stress. The rest of us looked forward to exam times.
'For the circle may be squared with rising and swelling.' Kit Smart
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Jaimey

I made this one for a pizza party that got canceled because of snow/ice.  So I've been eating it.  By myself.  For some reason, my roommates won't eat what I fix and I'm actually a really good cook!  Liz raves about Cait's cooking, but frankly, it's not very good, so I can't figure out why they won't eat what I cook.  *sigh*

I would totally make a cake for you all.  I'd even make it all pretty...
If curiosity really killed the cat, I'd already be dead. :laugh:

"How far you go in life depends on you being tender with the young, compassionate with the aged, sympathetic with the striving and tolerant of the weak and the strong. Because someday in life you will have been all of these." GWC
  •  

Pica Pica

'For the circle may be squared with rising and swelling.' Kit Smart
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Kir

Let them eat cake.

Quote from: Simone Louise on February 17, 2008, 04:10:40 PM
(snip)
Having teen-aged children complicates some of the marital ease of gender. My wife has forbidden me to speak to my daughter about gender issues. On the other hand, my wife, herself, told ours it would be alright with her if the daughter discovered herself gay.
(snip)

I hear ya there. We actually have no plans on having children. Couple reasons behind it actually... Primarily, we are us, and we want to continue being us without having to expand. Perhaps it's just us being selfish, but I'm okay with that. Also, my family has some pretty serious genetic issues with a very high risk of severe depression (and sometimes suicide) and quite a grab basket of other weird issues. Before I learned to deal with things I was very angry at my parents for having me, I couldn't see how someone would willingly have a child that would likely have all sorts of problems. So I can't do that to a kid.

I know things were hard for my parents at times. My dad was ultra conservative uber-christian alcoholic. My mom was liberal open minded witch hippie artist. They are a perfect counter balance to each other (especially now that my dad gave up the drink). But it was hard for them to raise kids because their views were so drastically different on how a kid should be raised. In the end I became something that neither of them expected, but both of them like. They are the best parents ever, but I have no idea how they managed to raise me and not go insane.
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