Silly, bland and possibly offensive questions from someone who isn't "TG"

[NicholeW.]

I've had my happy pills and a shot today

Lori, I think I may understand that.

People used to literally avoid me when I was between injections. PMS for two or three days.

Happy pills and shots are our friends!!

[EmbraceTheUnknown]

Whoops, I missed replying to your detailed post above, I will do that too in a bit.

By the way, all of the women who have responded on this thread are HOT!!! Holy kee-rap!

But I'm not allowed to view profiles for some reason. Anyway... there it is. Beauty.

I will presume that is supposed to be complementary? Thank you. However, please be aware of that little set of words under my avatar. See that word F-e-m-i-n-i-s-t?

That means, among other things that women are not simply a set of body parts somehow drawn together so a guy can be attracted to her. There are those parts that cannot be subjected to male gaze quite as easily.

Every woman who has replied to your queries is thoughtful, intelligent and worthy of being admired for those traits as well. For her courage and heart, for her compassion and verve and for being willing just to come and answer your questions, pretty openly it looks like.

And in this, I imagine you will find that not all TSes agree. Many would rather have their looks praised than their intelligence. Some, possibly, would simply be fine if they received any praise about anything from a male.

Diff'rent strokes, Embrace.

Nichole

Are you a feminist or person first? I'll take ya either way. haha

Well, I have a feminist friend, and one time she sorta yelled at me for a misunderstanding. I explained to her that simply because she is feminist doesn't automatically make me a sexist.

Yes, you're right, it was noticing the intelligence AND physical beauty of people in this thread who have blossomed. I'm expressing my appreciation for both, and hope you'll accept it.

You also have to understand I'm coming from the "Hm, they WERE men, now they are women, so is it weird for me to find physical beauty in them?" kind of thinking. Now that several people have explained to me that they ARE WOMEN, it is perfectly natural for me to praise that beauty.

Posted on: May 16, 2008, 03:41:25 PMI hear you. You ARE a woman, not "Former boy who realized she's a woman and has to fight her way into being accepted." You always were woman. Male body was just inconvenient.

Thanks.

Well, I'd say, whether by intent or not, you ARE bending the so-called "rules" and I don't consider myself "normal". You ARE challenging the insipid notion that there are only two ways to look at things where gender is concerned. By simply being born into a body that didn't suit you and adjusting to your natural essence

Sure, I know what you mean. I realize that "changing your sex" is a radical idea for most people. But from *my* point of view, I'm actually doing everything I can to CONFORM to the norms of society. I don't want to stand out as a "transssexual," I just want to be known and seen as just another boring, middle-aged woman. My fondest wish is that no one - including myself, insanely enough - ever realize or remember I was originally born male.

Ya gotta realize that aside from those who knew me as a male, people generally have no idea that I wasn't always Kate... which amazes me to no end, but I'm not complaining, lol. But because of that, "being transsexual" just isn't part of my experience of living, NOR part of the experience of anyone meeting me. Sure, I may have bent the accepted standards by transitioning, but no one KNOWS that, or notices it. What I DID may have broken the rules, but how I LIVE doesn't. As far as anyone else is concerned, I'm just this really tall woman named Kate, lol.

My point being that I'm conforming in every way I can. All my documents, IDs and credit cards say Kate. I'm employed as Kate. My body (except for one little part that'll be changed eventually) is generally female. There's nothing incongruent about me, no obvious signs that I was originally born male, no "transsexualness" lol about me. At least I hope not, because if there IS, believe me I'll do whatever it takes to stamp it out, lol.

Rather than struggling to be accepted for being different, my heartbreak and struggle is to be accepted as THE SAME, normal, status quo...

you have embraced a way that you knew would bring resistance, hate, even death

I feared that, but I've only found compassion, support, encouragement, admiration... transitioning was THE most wonderful experience I've ever had... NOT because I changed sexes, but because it renewed my faith and admiration for the beauty and kindness of people. I HATE myself now for ever doubting them, for not giving society the credit it deserved, for thinking everyone was so ugly and hateful inside when they're really pretty darn cool and wonderful.

The joke turns out to be *I* was the one being ugly in thinking those things.

~Kate~

Thoughts create the world.

Posted on: May 16, 2008, 03:46:33 PMOKay, next lil' slough of questions.

Are there any hormones or procedures for making a FTM transgender's voice sound more male? And has anyone done the voice training technique thing where you make your voice sound more feminine - I was blown away when I heard samples of what could be accomplished.

That question "what if you woke up with 40DD's tomorrow and a vagina? How would you feel?" Well, my first answer to that was "I'd infiltrate women's locker rooms with ease!" LOL!

But on a more serious note, it's a great question, cuz I see where you are coming from more solidly. If that were my condition, I would probably see what it was like to be in a woman's body for a few days, and then want to get back to my male body.

[NicholeW.]

I explained to her that simply because she is feminist doesn't automatically make me a sexist.

Yes, you're right, it was noticing the intelligence AND physical beauty of people in this thread who have blossomed. I'm expressing my appreciation for both, and hope you'll accept it.

You are absolutely right. Which is why I did thank you due to what appeared to be the complimentary nature of your statements, at least it's what I hear passes for compliments from some guys!! 

And you are right when you said that to your friend as well. Because I am a feminist does not make you a sexist. I find a lot of guys are unconsciously sexist. They drink deeply of the socio-cultural presumptions they have been raised with and simply seem to imply things, like I saw you do (or thought I did anyway,) that sound a whole lot like 'women are here simply for my pleasure.' With that attitude and the state of today's technology, perhaps the converse is more true than that? But, why would anyone bother to actually believe that we, humans, can or should live without men or relegate them to a position where we presume their only value is to please women? Or to care for us? etc etc? 

You also have to understand I'm coming from the "Hm, they WERE men, now they are women, so is it weird for me to find physical beauty in them?" kind of thinking. Now that several people have explained to me that they ARE WOMEN, it is perfectly natural for me to praise that beauty.

Posted on: May 16, 2008, 03:41:25 PMI hear you. You ARE a woman, not "Former boy who realized she's a woman and has to fight her way into being accepted." You always were woman. Male body was just inconvenient.

And yes, I get that as well. It's a rather common view, that "I'd know if I ever met a transsexual." Well, Embrace, I wouldn't be at all suprised to discover you had at least seen one of us without realizing it. Others you may have seen and realized it. The value of a book, etc is inside the book, not just the cover. Although covers may be helpful in educating and attracting the prosepctive reader to what's inside the book. Yeah?

OKay, next lil' slough of questions.

Are there any hormones or procedures for making a FTM transgender's voice sound more male? And has anyone done the voice training technique thing where you make your voice sound more feminine - I was blown away when I heard samples of what could be accomplished.

There's a lot of, usually, hard work to train the voice. Kinda like those voice-impersonators don't just awaken one morning and talk like Bill Clinton or Hillary or Mahatma Gandhi and what not.

That question "what if you woke up with 40DD's tomorrow and a vagina? How would you feel?" Well, my first answer to that was "I'd infiltrate women's locker rooms with ease!" LOL!

But on a more serious note, it's a great question, cuz I see where you are coming from more solidly. If that were my condition, I would probably see what it was like to be in a woman's body for a few days, and then want to get back to my male body.

Yeah, that question is often a good one to use with cis-gendered people. Provided, of course, they are cis-gendered people like you apparently are: one's who will actually consider their answer after they make the required joke about toilets, bedrooms, showers, etc. 

The thing you need to put into perspective with the answer is what if it isn't just for 'a day or two.' What if it's anywhere between 16 and 80 years? Maybe more? Now, pondering that might help give you some idea of a bit of what we endure and what sometimes, all too often, drives many of us to depression, anxiety, suicide and other generally negative emotional and mental states.

The ones you are meeting here are the fortunate ones. We have the economic status and have found the knowledge and support to actually transition in many cases. We have sisters and brothers who do not have what we have. They work the streets, sometimes abuse drugs and alcohol, often subject their bodies to silicone injections which eventually deform faces, breasts, buttocks, thihgs, arms and the body locations they are injected into. They take rip-off or way overpriced hormones and basically, for many, lead lives of desperation.

Have a heart for all of us, my dear. There but for Mother's grace go I, and her, and her, and him, and him.

Thanks for staying interested. Just try to recall you are dealing here with real live human beings who have struggled a lot and many times would simly wish to have lead the gendered and sexed life that you have, or your sister has.

Best,

Nichole   

[Just Mandy]

1) Is there any way to describe why you wanted to become the opposite sex or want to? I realize that some desires and motivations
simply aren't explainable, they're just THERE, strong and insistent, like a monsoon breaking down a straw door. I have my own desires
as a man that can't be explained logically, so I understand if my question is moot or can't be answered. But it's out there anyhow.

I don't recall seeing any one post this so I'll tell you. Many of us, for many reasons, do not transition until our 30's or 40's (like me) or
even later. I did not read all of the replies(sry late Friday) so this may echo what others have said... it's not a want to for me. 
I've been a female mentally for my entire life although I had gender issues in my teens I lived a male life and I'm married. I think you
will find that no one here wakes up one day and changes mentally and says I feel female now... we've always been there mentally...
the outside body is what is wrong. And when I say mentally... I don't mean how we act or come across... for the most part I looked
and acted male with a few feminine things like facial expressions and my walk that have just always been with me. But those things
have also been censored and I have never acted gay or effeminate. I'm just me. Just like you KNOW your a male. I KNOW I'm female.
Just becuase my body does not match does not make me ANY less female. But I do have female emotions and I always see things
from a female view point. Everything about my every thought process screams female. So I KNOW my brain is female and has
been from birth. Realizing that fact... that my brain could be (and was) female, yet my body be male, really helped me
deal with my situation.

3) Is "transsexual" a taboo word, and is "transgendered" better? Kind of like "negro" is a bad word in some contexts -
African American is more acceptable.

I hate that word becuase of the negative implications that have been built around it. Some here don't mind it. I'm in the camp
that I'm a transsexual for a period of time... then I'm just female.

4) This is a loaded question somewhat... actually had to re-write this several times in order to ask it in a way I wanted. Let's say
you are MTF TGered. How do you react to someone who sees you as 98% woman, but has that lingering "resistance" to the 2%
"historic man"? Meaning, he knows you were once a man and might have reservations about being with you because, well... you
were a guy once and he may think he's "gay" if he is with you?

I don't react at all... I think I'm gay... that is I only like other women. But that changes daily. LOL. I'll let you know how I feel a
year from now. Seriously... he is either going to be attracted or not based on what he sees... from what I've seen most men can
get over that 2% hurdle. You know guys... it's 98% looks and then testosterone takes over... a pretty face and a nice body is all
it takes.

There are so many pretty girls here and I feel intimidated by many of them. A lot of us do not see what others (and what men) see,
myself included. Since all my friends here tell me I should share good things... I posted picture of myself on hotornot to guage where
I was and I rated 9.2 after 500+ guys voted. I suspect that more than a few of those 500 would put that 2% difference behind us
if I were interested and was post-op. Don't you think?

OMG... I've turned into Melissa90210 LOL

Amanda

[tinkerbell]

1) Is there any way to describe why you wanted to become the opposite sex or want to?

I was always female gender.  What I changed was my physical sex to match my female soul/brain (if you will).  Why did I do it? To be whole.  In my mind, I couldn't be a complete woman with a body and mind mismatch.

2) What is the difference between transgendered, transsexual, transvestite

Transsexual: a person who is mentally one gender, but has the body of the other. They desire to live and be accepted as a member of the mental gender, this is generally accompanied by the strong desire to make their body as congruent as possible with the preferred sex through surgery and hormone treatments.

Transgender: an inclusive umbrella term which covers anyone who transcends their birth gender for any reason. This includes but is not limited to Androgynes, Crossdressers, Drag kings, Drag queens, Intersexuals, Transsexuals, and Transvestites.

Transvestite: a person who wears the clothing of the opposite gender, and has no desire to permanently change their sex. There is generally a strong sexual motivation for the cross-dressing.

Quoted text extracted from this link:

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,14714.0.html

3) Is "transsexual" a taboo word, and is "transgendered" better? Kind of like "negro" is a bad word in some contexts - African American is more acceptable.

I don't think that "transsexual" is a taboo word at all.  Some people like to label themselves as transsexual; others as transgendered.  I, myself, love to be labeled as what I am, a woman.  My transition is over, so there's no need to use the transsexual label anymore.  But again, that is me; others may be perfectly fine with the trans pre-fix, and that is alright too.

4) This is a loaded question somewhat... actually had to re-write this several times in order to ask it in a way I wanted. Let's say you are MTF TGered. How do you react to someone who sees you as 98% woman, but has that lingering "resistance" to the 2% "historic man"? Meaning, he knows you were once a man and might have reservations about being with you because, well... you were a guy once and he may think he's "gay" if he is with you?

My boyfriend is also transsexual (FTM)  ).  He knows about my transsexual history and sees me as what I am, a woman.  Needless to say I see him as what he is as well, 100% manl, and our relationship is heterosexual. 

5) Are there any MTFs in a relationship with FTMs??  This is starting to confuse me the more I think about it, LOL!

I just answered this question   And incidentally, transsexualism is NOT a life style!

6) What about the word "Hermaphrodite"? I heard a while back that that word isn't used anymore, or that "unisex" was more appropriate. I guess they are the lucky ones, hehehe.

The correct term is intersex.  The term hermaphrodite is regarded as offensive in some circles of the intersexed community.  I am not sure what you mean by "lucky ones".  Most intersexed people suffer greatly because they are butchered without their consent whey they are born; then when they are older, they find out that their gender identity doesn't coincide with their "corrected" anatomy.  There are exceptions, of course, but mostly this seems to be the case.  For more information, please visit this website:

http://www.isna.org/

7) If you were male and attracted to men before you "switched", did you consider yourself gay then, and do you now consider yourself hetero?

To the rest of the world, I was a gay man, I suppose.  That's not what I felt inside though.  I never felt comfortable as "a gay man".  I wanted my partner to see me as the woman I knew I was, but he always thought I was "insane". 

tink

[Yvonne]

6) What about the word "Hermaphrodite"? I heard a while back that that word isn't used anymore, or that "unisex" was more appropriate. I guess they are the lucky ones, hehehe.

I'm quite sensitive about this issue. I'm intersex. I was born with gonadal mosaicism, the rarest form of an intersex condition.  Because of the tripe & pressure we've got to face since we're born, I was assigned male & given a life that wasn't mine.  I wasn't lucky in any way, shape or form.  I was dreadfully pathetic & wanted to die all the time.

The word "hermaphrodite" is misleading because it implies we've got both "male" and "female" sets of reproductive organs & in humans there are no actual "hermaphrodites".  Hermaphrodite is a disparaging word no doubt.  Also, please avoid using the word "intersexual" as a noun; we prefer "intersex people" or "people with intersex conditions"

[Lori]

Lori, I think I may understand that.

Happy pills and shots are our friends!!

Oh yes indeed

[Seshatneferw]

Androgynes live somewhere in the middle, generally neither female or male but usually keeping the genitalia they were born with. They dress how they feel often in a mixture of culturally accepted binary styles. Some of them decide to transition, some started thinking they were Ts and changed their minds at some point in transition. Usually they tend to be the easiest-going of us all. 

I suppose this is my cue. 

With regard to gender as a social construct I consider myself an androgyne: being male has always been something of an act -- but I've also come to realise that being female would be just another role to play. I don't mind being seen as either, although I do mind very much when people expect me to behave certain ways just because they see me as a man. Neither of the extremes is me, I'm somewhere in the middle and much happier now that I've understood that I don't need to choose either side.

On the other hand, with regard to sex I'm pretty much convinced that I'm transsexual: I've wished for a female body since way before puberty started. I also agree with the hypothesis that this has something to do with how my brain grew up before I was born (but unlike Kate suggests, I don't see this as justification for feeling this way but rather the most plausible explanation).

I don't plan to transition, but I think that's at least partly because my ideal gender is different from my ideal sex. There is no real need for me to have a body that others would accept as female, but instead it's sufficient to get a body that feels close enough to what I think it should while also looking unremarkable enough for some gender. Happily, the 38A breasts I have because of gynaecomastia don't raise any eyebrows in a men's locker room; likewise, it's possible to choose my clothing so that I can mostly ignore what's in my crotch. Besides, lots of people cope with much worse body deformities than healthy but wrong genitalia.

There are people (here, too) who'd say that my ability to make these compromises means that I'm not really transsexual. The diagnostic criteria can be interpreted that way, too. On the other hand, I'm able to make these compromises just because I've given up caring too much about how people label me. So there. 

  Nfr

[NicholeW.]

There are people (here, too) who'd say that my ability to make these compromises means that I'm not really transsexual. The diagnostic criteria can be interpreted that way, too. On the other hand, I'm able to make these compromises just because I've given up caring too much about how people label me. So there. 

  Nfr

And maybe, Embrace, you are getting the idea that we are far from some monolithically describable mass of human beings who all fit within some very narrow typology. And, if you are discovering that, then you are on the right track.

I think there may be some wide-ranging descriptive that would be inclusive of pretty much all of us. But the narrow ones seldom fit all if the people who feel they are included under one or another label.

That is one of the things I find in my work, which has a lot of emphasis on labelling -- it's a precarious undertaking to simply label this this and that this without limiting that labelling with a lot of very cautious caveats.

Maybe the best description for all of us and all of you (cisgendered/cissexual people) is 'human being.' That encompasses a richness and diversity that seems most likely to get to the inclusion of everyone.

Nichole

[Kate]

Maybe the best description for all of us and all of you (cisgendered/cissexual people) is 'human being.'...

You haven't met the Otherkin community yet, have you?

~Kate~

[Natasha]

are chimeras part of that subculture too?

[NicholeW.]

This kind of chimera? Or This kind?

N~

[Just Mandy]

There is no real need for me to have a body that others would accept as female, but instead it's sufficient to get a body that feels close enough to what I think it should while also looking unremarkable enough for some gender. Happily, the 38A breasts I have because of gynaecomastia don't raise any eyebrows in a men's locker room; likewise, it's possible to choose my clothing so that I can mostly ignore what's in my crotch. Besides, lots of people cope with much worse body deformities than healthy but wrong genitalia.

There are people (here, too) who'd say that my ability to make these compromises means that I'm not really transsexual. The diagnostic criteria can be interpreted that way, too.

There are some days that I feel like I could live like that... close enough to female. Although my 36 nearly B breasts on
my 155 pound body would never pass as gyno anymore. Of course the total lack of body hair does not help LOL... but I
totally get what you are saying. I feel SO much better with the changes I have had so far. And I wonder HOW I
could possibly not do SRS.  But I might be able to do just that. I think a lot of it for me is mental. I stopped focusing on
what is between my legs long ago and have been able to put it totally out of my mind. I never look at it, never touch it...
it's just there. Since starting HRT the ONLY time I know it's there is after direct stimulation so it's even a smaller problem.
(pun intended)

Amanda

[Hazumu]

I hate 'lifestyle'.  It's a propaganda word.

1) Is there any way to describe why you wanted to become the opposite sex or want to?

What is the opposite of light?  What is the opposite of cold?  What is the opposite of monkey?  What is the opposite of Brazil?  Now, what is the opposite of Girl?  Why?  Why does our society have the concept that male and female are somehow 'opposites'?  Julia Serano coined the term 'Oppositional Sexism' to describe this idea that male and female are 'opposite', and the assigning of behaviors, modes of dress, 'suitable' job categories, and other activities to one grouping or the other and then enforcing these assignments through societal sanctions, up to and including violence, on the transgressors.

My body is male, certainly.  My brain was feminized in utero when my mom took DES.  It's like putting Mac guts inside a PC case and then trying to run PC software  -- the Mac's PC emulator routine does it, but at reduced performance and with lots of errors.  Now if you ignore the case and start running Mac software, it runs better, faster, more efficiently, and with greatly reduced errors.

3) Is "transsexual" a taboo word, and is "transgendered" better?

I'd be happy to use transsexual.  Problem is, there's this word 'sexual' in it, and that sets off parts of the Religious Reich.  They can't help it, they find out I transitioned and they start thinking we do it 25 hours a day when in fact the levels and patterns of sexual activity among transsexuals are at or, more likely, below 'normal' people.

5) Are there any MTFs in a relationship with FTMs??

I know a married couple.  They hadn't yet changed their birth certificates, so she legally changed her last name to his last name a couple of months before the wedding.  On the wedding certificate, she was the groom and he was the bride.  The marriage is totally legal.

7) If you were male and attracted to men before you "switched", did you consider yourself gay then, and do you now consider yourself hetero?

Orientation is the least of our worries, don't you think?  For MtFs, some are drawn to guys before and after, some are drawn to women before and after, some are drawn to women and then surprise themselves when they suddenly find boys, and I'm sure there are a few that go into transition liking guys and then switch to women after transition.

Karen

[Shana A]

Welcome to Susan's Embracetheunknown, and thanks for your thought provoking questions. I don't have time to answer point by point, but here's a bit. I identify as androgyne, or something else close enough to that term to use it. I have a transsexual history, I transitioned M2f in 1993 and after a year or so, realized that while I'm not male, I'm not really female either. I didn't proceed further, have lived in between ever since, although sometimes I think about transitioning again. It's a struggle for each of us to figure out the best path for our situations.

I found Calpernia's video humorous, and more of an inside joke for members of the T community. Yes, it's also harsh in some places, but as a public person, she's been asked these questions too many times and is probably sick of hearing them. I don't mind answering questions, as a person walking a unique path, I can sometimes help educate about these issues. And to reiterate others here, no, it isn't a "lifestyle".

I'd recommend a couple of books if you'd like to know more about transgender issues, Julia Serano's Whipping Girl, and Kate Bornstein's Gender Outlaw. There's plenty of others worth reading, but these two would be a good start.

Zythyra

[EmbraceTheUnknown]

What is the opposite of light?

Dark.

What is the opposite of cold?

Hot.

What is the opposite of monkey?

Nun-ny.

What is the opposite of Brazil?

Myanmar.

Now, what is the opposite of Girl? 

I have no idea.


Posted on: May 19, 2008, 01:20:00 PM

This kind of chimera? Or This kind?

N~

Argh. Now I'm confused... 

[Seshatneferw]

What is the opposite of light?  What is the opposite of cold?  What is the opposite of monkey?  What is the opposite of Brazil?  Now, what is the opposite of Girl?

More to the point, what is 'opposite'? The whole idea of opposition requires a choice of some sort of conceptual axis: the opposite of 'light' could be 'heavy' or 'dark', and the opposite of 'girl' could be 'woman', 'boy', 'filly' or a variety of others depending on the context.

Why does our society have the concept that male and female are somehow 'opposites'?

Because they are, if you choose to frame the question in such a way that they are. 
Most of the time it even makes sense to see gender that way. But only most of the time.

  Nfr

[jenny_]

7) If you were male and attracted to men before you "switched", did you consider yourself gay then, and do you now consider yourself hetero?

I've never considered myself gay ever.  But my sexuality has always been complicated.  To other people it would appear that I had a relationship with a woman, transitioned and then 'changed' orientation to being a straight woman.
But it was confusing growing up, especially during puberty.  Cos I felt attracted to men but i knew i was NOT a "gay man".  And dated women cos i was trying to be "normal", and it made some sort of sense since i knew i wasn't a "gay man".

It does seem strange when transsexuals apparently change orientation, but to me it makes some sort of sense - you can't be a "gay man" without being a man!
I'm sure other people have other explanations though! 

[Dennis]

Are there any hormones or procedures for making a FTM transgender's voice sound more male? And has anyone done the voice training technique thing where you make your voice sound more feminine - I was blown away when I heard samples of what could be accomplished.

I won't answer the first set of questions because the women who did answer did a fine job. As for the male voice, we go through a normal male puberty on testosterone, so our voice changes just like any other guy's (although much later in life in some cases). We also grow facial hair and have a chance, depending on genetics, of going bald. You've probably seen lots of FtM's and had no clue. That's the plus about testosterone (from the FtM point of view). The changes it causes are irreversible and significant.

Dennis

[jenny_]

That's the plus about testosterone (from the FtM point of view). The changes it causes are irreversible and significant.

And why we hate it so much! (from the vicy versy point of view)